|
Blind Rasputin posted:This is a funny and creative detail but I always wondered about if a destroyer or something was going 30 knots and dropped all their anchors and they hit pay dirt if they just would slam to a stop and it's be badass. In the Fitzgerald case I think they should've fired on the incoming vessel to soften it up and decrease the damage they were about to take. On average, if a BURKE class destroyer going "all ahead flank 2" slams to "all back flank" they will be dead in the water in around 2 ship lengths (a little over 1000 ft). That may not sound like much, but that's the equivalent of stopping on a dime for a ship. Dropping the anchor won't do poo poo unless you're in very shallow water and even then the moment it hits the bottom in that scenario you're basically out of control.
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 00:49
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 17, 2024 09:33 |
|
|
ManMythLegend posted:On average, if a BURKE class destroyer going "all ahead flank 2" slams to "all back flank" they will be dead in the water in around 2 ship lengths (a little over 1000 ft). That may not sound like much, but that's the equivalent of stopping on a dime for a ship.  that's loving insane for anyone not familiar with shipping.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 00:53
|
|
|
I was the conn through an INSURV cycle and got to drive that motherfucker like I stole it a couple of times a week for a month. It's loving sick. Not only is it a very short distance, it does it very loving fast. DDGs handle loving beautifully if you drive em right.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 00:55
|
|
|
Two Finger posted:
I assume it's the naval equivalent of this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiFDemyVTM0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm42sikiW3Y
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 01:05
|
|
|
Mr. Nice! posted:Also this. There's a huge loving bolt holding the chain on, but if the chain gets running it's loving gone. Was this done intentionally?
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 01:08
|
|
|
Mr. Nice! posted:Here's the Tarawa dropping their anchor. Ahaha, those giant clouds of rust. I imagine that must ruin uniforms.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 01:26
|
|
|
tastefully arranged labia posted:Was this done intentionally? No and this was very bad and costly. One of the brakemen was a foot away from the shackle smacking him in the noggin. IIRC, the dumbass in khakis there kept telling the brakemen to take turns off an already open brake and they jammed it open as a result. They weren't helped at all by poor chain tension readings from the pilothouse.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 01:28
|
|
|
Dead Reckoning posted:Ahaha, those giant clouds of rust. I imagine that must ruin uniforms. I think the poo poo in their pants probably took care of that first.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 01:29
|
|
Mr. Nice! posted:No and this was very bad and costly. One of the brakemen was a foot away from the shackle smacking him in the noggin. IIRC, the dumbass in khakis there kept telling the brakemen to take turns off an already open brake and they jammed it open as a result. They weren't helped at all by poor chain tension readings from the pilothouse. Looks like someone who was actually there made a comment on Youtube: quote:I have not viewed this video in over a decade. The good news was no one was killed in this incident. This took place in an extremely busy Hong Kong Harbor. I was on the bridge giving the orders during this evolution. The anchor is lowered to the bottom, chain is let out, the brake holds while the flukes are set. Once you are holding, chain is let out. It is the weight of the chain that holds a ship in position. The chain link in this incident gets wedged on the lip of the chain pipe. The brake men released too much brake to get the chain moving. When it finally broke free there was no friction and once the momentum built there was no stopping the chain. Everyone cleared the area quickly and injuries were prevented. The team shifted to the alternate anchor and we anchored quickly and safely. The anchors today are the same as they were in WW II and a replacement came from a mothballed WW II ship. This was a final port visit following a 7 month deployment with operations in East Timor, Somalia, and Kuwait where the crew and embarked Marines performed flawlessly. The guy in khakis with his hands in his pockets was a fresh minted knucklehead baby ensign onboard less than a month. Thanks for posting Haze Gray - That is all!
|
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 01:30
|
|
|
Two Finger posted:
Hooray for variable pitch propellors.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 01:38
|
|
|
Stultus Maximus posted:Hooray for variable pitch propellors. They could have done all sorts if they knew where the freighter was where it was, but they appeared not to. The destroyer was sub 10000 tons, the freighter was pushing 30k (I can't find a good reference online, dunno if that's for it being heavily loaded or not). They're pretty lucky they got away with that little damage, if that'd been a full on perpendicular hit, well, I'd put my money on the freighter. E: Ugh yeh, looking stuff up it was about a 4:1 battle in mass terms, the freighter would have simply sunk the destroyer if it'd run into the side of it. Hexyflexy fucked around with this message at 02:07 on Jun 18, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 01:53
|
|
|
Stultus Maximus posted:Hooray for variable pitch propellors. Destroyers are CPP??? I would have thought fixed but I guess you need the flexibility
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 02:10
|
|
|
Random civvie posting but I remembered something relevant wrt ships braking; the Iowa class battleships could flip their rudders 90 degree inward to create a gigantic underwater airbrake. According to the source, this did deform the rudders by 2-3cm the one time it was used but it stopped the ship in less than it's own length.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 02:10
|
|
|
Asehujiko posted:Random civvie posting but I remembered something relevant wrt ships braking; the Iowa class battleships could flip their rudders 90 degree inward to create a gigantic underwater airbrake. According to the source, this did deform the rudders by 2-3cm the one time it was used but it stopped the ship in less than it's own length. I don't know if that's true (another non-military person here), but it sounds about right. Stopping motion is a very different proposition to carefully changing course. In option 1, you kill all momentum, bam, dead in the water, stopped, hire some welders. In option 2 you have to carefully note where you are, where everything else is, and try to steer around with minimal energy expenditure. They hosed that up.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 02:18
|
|
|
Two Finger posted:Destroyers are CPP??? I would have thought fixed but I guess you need the flexibility CPP owns. Hexyflexy posted:They could have done all sorts if they knew where the freighter was where it was, but they appeared not to. The destroyer was sub 10000 tons, the freighter was pushing 30k (I can't find a good reference online, dunno if that's for it being heavily loaded or not). They're pretty lucky they got away with that little damage, if that'd been a full on perpendicular hit, well, I'd put my money on the freighter. From my understanding it almost did.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 02:19
|
|
|
suboptimal posted:Hey, here's some good news- Sheriff Shithead David Clarke is withdrawing from that DHS position that was offered to him. 
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 02:19
|
|
|
Mr. Nice! posted:CPP owns. Ouch.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 02:24
|
|
|
milk milk lemonade posted:Looks like someone who was actually there made a comment on Youtube: Possible in the all-time top 10 of actually worthwhile youtube comments.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 02:31
|
|
|
WSJ is reporting that they found the seven sailors. No surprise really. https://twitter.com/WSJ/status/876255612669177856 Edited post, confirmed RIP: https://twitter.com/COMNAVFORJAPAN/status/876258988249063424 facialimpediment fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Jun 18, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 02:57
|
|
|
so uh, NK returned that American prisoner--that stole the propaganda sign--brain dead? What I miss? The dude made some extremely poor choices: even against the advice of most. He's the embodiment of the white bro that would disregard warnings and do such a thing, but he didn't deserve that 
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 03:12
|
|
|
Last I heard was it looked like brain damage from oxygen starvation. Oh, and a Navy destroyer collided with a cargo ship, killing seven sailors and injuring a bunch more and probably would've gone to the bottom if not for some heroic damage control.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 03:22
|
|
|
Caro did it better.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 03:22
|
|
|
Godholio posted:Last I heard was it looked like brain damage from oxygen starvation. Yeah, been following the latter via fb, somehow just saw the first one
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 03:23
|
|
|
Nostalgia4Dogges posted:so uh, NK returned that American prisoner--that stole the propaganda sign--brain dead? What I miss? nah, gently caress 'em. there are plenty of people in hosed up situations not of their own choosing that deserve sympathy and help but going to north korea and stealing ain't one.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 03:27
|
|
|
Nostalgia4Dogges posted:so uh, NK returned that American prisoner--that stole the propaganda sign--brain dead? What I miss? wtf is a white bro?
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 03:31
|
|
|
Hexyflexy posted:They could have done all sorts if they knew where the freighter was where it was, but they appeared not to. Thats the thing I really don't understand. Sure the freighter might have been doing some spinning circles waiting for a harbor pilot and tug but you don't just miss a radar return off a GIANT transport. The track might not have made sense to a casual glance, but there is a big loving object there worth maybe avoiding. Literally everyone had to be passed out.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 03:34
|
|
|
Two Finger posted:Destroyers are CPP??? I would have thought fixed but I guess you need the flexibility All CRUDES ships are CPP. Edit: Or water jet if you want to call LCS a CRUDES ship.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 03:45
|
|
|
Poppyseed Poundcake posted:wtf is a white bro? The bad guys in Revenge of the Nerds.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 03:46
|
|
|
Laranzu posted:Thats the thing I really don't understand. Sure the freighter might have been doing some spinning circles waiting for a harbor pilot and tug but you don't just miss a radar return off a GIANT transport. The track might not have made sense to a casual glance, but there is a big loving object there worth maybe avoiding. The cargo ship was not actually doing circles. AIS is not reliable for tracking what a ship is doing without another source. Likewise it wasn't doing just shy of 19 knots.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 05:18
|
|
|
Mr. Nice! posted:The cargo ship was not actually doing circles. AIS is not reliable for tracking what a ship is doing without another source. Likewise it wasn't doing just shy of 19 knots. What would a cargo ship doing 19kts in circles even look like? Capsized, i'd imagine.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 05:28
|
|
|
orange juche posted:What would a cargo ship doing 19kts in circles even look like? Capsized, i'd imagine. dunno, but I do know what the ship it hits would look like :v
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 05:31
|
|
|
orange juche posted:What would a cargo ship doing 19kts in circles even look like? Capsized, i'd imagine. probably have a decent heel on but i doubt it'd be past 15 degrees or so
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 05:48
|
|
|
Mr. Nice! posted:The cargo ship was not actually doing circles. AIS is not reliable for tracking what a ship is doing without another source. Likewise it wasn't doing just shy of 19 knots. While I'm going to claim that AIS tracks are infallible I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss that it was doing close to 18kts. I've seen ships that size pulling over 20 and 15 to 18 is the transit speed I normally see out here.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 05:59
|
|
|
ManMythLegend posted:While I'm going to claim that AIS tracks are infallible I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss that it was doing close to 18kts. I've seen ships that size pulling over 20 and 15 to 18 is the transit speed I normally see out here. The report i saw said close to 19kt. That's what seemed out of the ordinary for me. Anytime i saw a tanker or merchant going over 16 knots it was smooth ocean and they were hauling rear end.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 06:19
|
|
|
Mr. Nice! posted:The cargo ship was not actually doing circles. AIS is not reliable for tracking what a ship is doing without another source. Likewise it wasn't doing just shy of 19 knots. Thats basically what I was saying. If the AIS reported track doesn't make sense, but you have a huge no poo poo radar return you are closing on then there is something out there you should think about avoiding. Or waking up the lookout to see if there are running lights. Edit: Yeah most cargo I've tracked was doing 15-16kt or so and that was open ocean.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 06:21
|
|
|
Ya even years ago regular merchant traffic went at around 10-16kts. They want fuel efficiency. Some of the newer (late 90s) ships were getting 5 bladed screws and would hit around 18kts at most. In that busy area I doubt they would be at a high transit speed. edit : I tracked a LOT of merchant ships. We would even do ranging on them in sonar for practice by using sliderule wheels and simple formulas using bearing rate. ded fucked around with this message at 06:44 on Jun 18, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 06:40
|
|
|
I'm telling you guys, a lot of the traffic out here is going faster then you think it is, especially the newer ones that aren't fully laden. I've watched big container ships pulling over 15 knots right up to the sea buoys of some of the entrance channels of these ports. It's crazy
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 06:45
|
|
|
Maybe the skippers are under more pressure now or something. Thats dangerous poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 06:51
|
|
|
It's not uncommon at all. From a merchant perspective, 18 might be on the high side but it's absolutely not unheard of.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 07:03
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 17, 2024 09:33 |
|
|
Mr. Nice! posted:AIS is not reliable for tracking what a ship is doing without another source. Why is this still the case?
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2017 07:10
|
|