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Shogeton posted:If a person himself took part in that active colonization? Then he deserves consequences not because he's a different culture, but because he took part in violent colonization. But that is not a taint you can just keep transferring across the generation. At some point, you gotta say 'yeah,, the reason they are here because lovely people did lovely things, but they never took part in this, they were born here, their life is here, and their culture is what it is, and they should be respected same as any other culture, ' Agree 100%, the problem was the Northern Irish government was still oppressing minority Catholics in the 20th century.
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Jun 25, 2017 23:17
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part of the reason the right of return is so controversial: a full right of return means displacing a healthy chunk of the israeli jewish population; which while arguably justified if they were european settlers runs into the problem that you'd create an internally displaced population of sephardi jews who were displaced into israel from arab countries which have no interest in reabsorbing several hundred thousand israelis into their territories. not that they'd want to go back to baghdad, cairo, etc. anyways but poo poo's complicated. Jeb! Repetition posted:Agree 100%, the problem was the Northern Irish government was still oppressing minority Catholics in the 20th century. BrutalistMcDonalds has issued a correction as of 23:19 on Jun 25, 2017 |
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Jun 25, 2017 23:17
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when i see two extremely violent groups bash each others heads in rather than debate the finer points of which side is on an infinitesimal higher moral ground i turn around and run away but that might be just me
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Jun 25, 2017 23:18
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Ekster posted:when i see two extremely violent groups bash each others heads in rather than debate the finer points of which side is on an infinitesimal higher moral ground i turn around and run away but that might be just me we can unite and stand up and chant NO MORE crowd chants "NO MORE" NoooOoooo MoooaaAAArrrr no more! no more! nooo mooooaar. *edge guitar solo*
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Jun 25, 2017 23:22
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What the world really needs is a one world government, right now. That makes you all filthy secessionists/rebels btw.
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Jun 25, 2017 23:34
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one world government is the most horrific possible thing, scares the poo poo outta me.
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Jun 25, 2017 23:49
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One world government would be fine if it was America running it.
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Jun 25, 2017 23:51
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imagine how poo poo everything would be if there was only microsoft smartphones
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Jun 25, 2017 23:52
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Apple iphones are from America. Imagine how good the world would be if it was just only iPhones.
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Jun 25, 2017 23:54
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Baloogan posted:one world government is the most horrific possible thing, scares the poo poo outta me. Simply one of its many features
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Jun 25, 2017 23:55
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Iphones are from China, it even says so on the box
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Jun 25, 2017 23:56
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Jeb! Repetition posted:Agree 100%, the problem was the Northern Irish government was still oppressing minority Catholics in the 20th century. And that is a terrible, disgusting thing. And I wouldn't be surprised if there are still some traces of that. But that doesn't mean the descendants of colonizers are suddenly 'not native'. It just means that the government of that region was oppressing one culture that is part of their nation in favor of another culture that is part of their nation. And should NI ever become part of the ROI, then they will still very much be a culture that is part of that nation, to be treated with respect and inclusion.
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Jun 25, 2017 23:59
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Jeb! Repetition posted:Wait a second is hakimashou pro-Israel? That would explain everything. hakimashou posted:Won't be long now.
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Jun 26, 2017 00:05
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Oh Jesus 
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Jun 26, 2017 00:06
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Me earlier: "Why is this guy trying to do a bunch of Socratic jiu jitsu to prove being against colonialism is racist" Me now: *Face frozen in the stonk emoticon*
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Jun 26, 2017 00:10
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I don't think being against colonialism is racist.
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Jun 26, 2017 00:37
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hakimashou posted:I don't think being against colonialism is racist. And yet everybody thinks that a territorial enclave carved out by a foreign power, which excessively favors its own settlers at the expense of the natives isn't the textbook definition of settler colonialism because... The only reason the British government even pretends to be impartial in NI is because of decades of low intensity intersectional warfare. The Troubles kicked off because the Irish civil rights movement was met with reactionary violence. These are all living memories, they're not just legacies of a "lil ole thing" that happened 300 years ago. Part of being "native" to a land means engaging in a shared culture with its inhabitants, which is something Ulstermen explicitly reject. Neighborhoods in NI are more segregated than ever, yet some posters are still pretending that this isn't a settler-colonialist dynamic. Agnosticnixie hit the nail on the head when he likened this all to Rhodesian nostalgia. I feel it's a lot like white Americans asking why they should ever pay reparations, since they're not personally responsible for centuries of deprivation that keeps everyone else way poorer than us even today.
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Jun 26, 2017 01:00
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Also what was with this post?hakimashou posted:I always lol at Europeans being against Israel. Sentiment toward Israel in western Europe started off gung ho and fully supportive and gradually got tepid and skeptical up to present day. So it absolutely changed.
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Jun 26, 2017 01:01
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Jeb! Repetition posted:Also what was with this post? Reversion to the mean.
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Jun 26, 2017 01:08
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:
The British government really is impartial. They're indifferent to both communities in NI and have been for a long time. They attempted to set up an assembly with proportional representation and a power sharing executive with Sunningdale and overhaul policing with the Hunt reforms, all in the earliest years of the Troubles. They were opposed at every turn by unionists.
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Jun 26, 2017 01:14
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hakimashou posted:Reversion to the mean. Western Europe and Britain in particular obviously, were extremely cool with Palestine from its formation to a few decades ago when they started violating international law, and even after that it's taken a long time for opinion to shift. There's no reversion to the mean there, it's just been a steady decline.
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Jun 26, 2017 01:50
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So this guy is walking down the street late one night in Belfast, and all of a sudden, he feels a knife at his throat. A voice whispers in his ear, "Tell me laddie, be you Protestant or Catholic?" The man thinks quickly and says, "actually, I'm Jewish." The voice in his ear says, "Faith and Begorrah, laddie. I must be the luckiest Palestinian in all of Ireland!" Well, that's my contribution, thanks for listening, god bless.
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Jun 26, 2017 02:11
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hakimashou posted:Palestinian nationalism even? that's like nationalism for unicorns
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Jun 26, 2017 04:06
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The Lords should have just gone through with their plan to move the entire population of Hong Kong to Northern Ireland. That would have brought the IRA and UDF together.
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Jun 26, 2017 04:24
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Jeb! Repetition posted:Western Europe and Britain in particular obviously, were extremely cool with Palestine from its formation to a few decades ago when they started violating international law, and even after that it's taken a long time for opinion to shift. There's no reversion to the mean there, it's just been a steady decline. The broader historical mean.
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Jun 26, 2017 04:41
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Here's my Irish story, my friend almost got his rear end kicked when he was in Dublin cause he was in a bar and ordered an Irish car bomb
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Jun 26, 2017 04:58
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Terror Sweat posted:Here's my Irish story, my friend almost got his rear end kicked when he was in Dublin cause he was in a bar and ordered an Irish car bomb Your friend is an idiot.
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Jun 26, 2017 05:00
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when my family visited britain we stayed in a hotel with a small pub on the main floor and went there for dinner one night, and my mother ordered a "small milk" and the waiter brought out a literal thimble filled with milk. that's my u.k. pub story
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Jun 26, 2017 05:03
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Jeb! Repetition posted:Tibetan nationalism isn't. that's arguably more "china could you please move this boot off of my neck" than nationalism
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Jun 26, 2017 05:08
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Agnosticnixie posted:There is an extremely strong difference between people who are there because of active, violent colonization and people who are there because of immigration and this is the kind of stupid equivocation that ends up carrying water for zionist expansion and rhodesian nostalgia as though they were value neutral immigrants. wow it's like d&d europol delivered straight to c-spam
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Jun 26, 2017 05:09
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"value neutral immigrants" hahahahaha that's the good stuff
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Jun 26, 2017 05:09
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Yinlock posted:that's arguably more "china could you please move this boot off of my neck" than nationalism That's what a lot of nationalism is. The drive for self-determination is rarely abstract. It's pretty funny to think of the similarity between the Irish and the Tibetans, in that they are both naturally backwards and superstitious peoples in thrall to some so-called spiritual authority who were only brought into the modern world through the benevolent overlordship and colonization of a neighboring power. At least, that's what the 19th century English and modern tankies tell me.
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Jun 26, 2017 05:18
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Jeb! Repetition posted:Western Europe and Britain in particular obviously, were extremely cool with Palestine from its formation to a few decades ago when they started violating international law, and even after that it's taken a long time for opinion to shift. There's no reversion to the mean there, it's just been a steady decline. He's saying that beimg against Israeli Apartheid means your antisemite and Europe hates Jews. You will not covince him otherwise
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Jun 26, 2017 05:21
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Vincent Van Goatse posted:Your friend is an idiot. Not gonna hear any arguments from me about that
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Jun 26, 2017 05:22
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Baron Corbyn posted:The Lords should have just gone through with their plan to move the entire population of Hong Kong to Northern Ireland. That would have brought the IRA and UDF together. Was that really an idea that got floated? Why?
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Jun 26, 2017 05:23
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Tacky-rear end Rococco posted:That's what a lot of nationalism is. The drive for self-determination is rarely abstract. no most nationalism is just seeing yourself as Better because you're from Place, and being from Place is an innate measure of worth it's a disease
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Jun 26, 2017 05:24
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KomradeX posted:Was that really an idea that got floated? Why? Yes, but I was wrong about the provenance of the idea. It was the civil service and not the Lords. as for why, just people joking around while trying to come up with solutions for what to do with millions of people who might not want to become residents of a totalitarian state once the handover happened.
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Jun 26, 2017 05:29
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Top City Homo posted:that's like nationalism for unicorns gently caress you
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Jun 26, 2017 05:36
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whomupclicklike posted:gently caress you you sound spooked my lad
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Jun 26, 2017 07:01
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Top City Homo posted:you sound spooked my lad the ego pill is also a spook 
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Jun 26, 2017 07:02
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