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What is the best flav... you all know what this question is: This poll is closed. |
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| Labour |
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907 | 49.92% |
| Theresa May Team (Conservative) |
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48 | 2.64% |
| Liberal Democrats |
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31 | 1.71% |
| UKIP |
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13 | 0.72% |
| Plaid Cymru |
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25 | 1.38% |
| Green |
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22 | 1.21% |
| Scottish Socialist Party |
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12 | 0.66% |
| Scottish Conservative Party |
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1 | 0.06% |
| Scottish National Party |
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59 | 3.25% |
| Some Kind of Irish Unionist |
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4 | 0.22% |
| Alliance / Irish Nonsectarian |
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3 | 0.17% |
| Some Kind of Irish Nationalist |
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36 | 1.98% |
| Misc. Far Left Trots |
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35 | 1.93% |
| Misc. Far Right Fash |
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8 | 0.44% |
| Monster Raving Loony |
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49 | 2.70% |
| Space Navies Party |
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39 | 2.15% |
| Independent / Single Issue |
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2 | 0.11% |
| Can't Vote |
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188 | 10.35% |
| Won't Vote |
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8 | 0.44% |
| Spoiled Ballot |
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15 | 0.83% |
| Pissflaps |
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312 | 17.17% |
| Total: | 1817 votes | ||
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Junior G-man posted:Do they really think that this whole 'Corbyn = Venezuelan catastrophe' line is sticking? I've seen it everywhere and so far I don't know anybody who's impressed except for thumb people. Get ready for a lot of 'Leftism leads straight to Venezuela!' in the future, because Venezuela is a tire fire right now. Corbyn is nothing like Maduro, though, given he isn't a gibbering idiot.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:14
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| # ? May 14, 2024 00:29 |
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Jeremy Corbyn's glasto speech has been viewed nearly 5 million times on his facebook page
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Jun 28, 2017 13:24
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Night10194 posted:Get ready for a lot of 'Leftism leads straight to Venezuela!' in the future, because Venezuela is a tire fire right now. Capitalism has ruined more countries than socialism tbh
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Jun 28, 2017 13:27
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spectralent posted:lol what how That is basically what Major did from 92-97
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Jun 28, 2017 13:28
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The next trick poo poo politicians will pull when their poo poo policies that gently caress people over don't resonate on social media is going to be playing the "everyone who hates me and my policies is a crybaby cyberbully" card. They've spent so long suppressing dissent thanks to a paid off old media that they won't be able to cope with direct public interface where everything ever is always on the record.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:30
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Damming stuff on Grenfell on Radio 4. All about how the official death toll is likely much too low, and that no list of tower residents or of survivors has been produced by the government. Unofficial lists of the dead range from 200 to over 300. There's a strong feeling on the ground that this is a deliberate cover up to try and prevent civil unrest.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:32
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spectralent posted:So basically because our entire government is based around people making it up as they go along this government can just plough on for five more years stoically claiming that JC is against the national interest therefore they just have to stay? loving hell. That's the great fear I've had creeping up on me since Grenfell Tower basically. Jeremy Corbyn is doing so good, and is absolutely looking like a man who would make a very good PM with ideas which are worth trying & appeal to a majority of people that basically the Tories & DUP will be genuinely terrified of him which should keep them in line when it counts. They'll rebel on some issues, and the government will lose votes which is the way of tiny majorities and minorities. But the votes that count, your issues of confidence & supply? At the very least they will limp on until Brexit happens in 2 years. Sadly the one thing that might bring them down is Brexit, with there being just a handful of loud Tory remainers who could cause problems for the government, like Soubry & Clarke, but that's not an issue Corbyn will attack them on, at least not until more details of how the deal is shaping up come out. On most other issues the divide between potential Tory rebels & Labour is just too big now. Which is fine & good & how I want it, but because their platform basically involves shaking up the Thatcherite consensus to a large degree there's little chance you'll see Tory MPs willing to risk bringing down the government to let that in. Incidentally, gently caress the Lib Dems so very much for the FTPA which makes it possible. What a shower of cunts they were, are & always will be.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:37
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was that wato? will listen later it hasn't moved in a week+ has it
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Jun 28, 2017 13:38
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28 loving years. Hope isn't a lie it just takes a while.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:39
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So how did 'The Boy, Absolute' get on at PMQS?
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Jun 28, 2017 13:40
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forkboy84 posted:Incidentally, gently caress the Lib Dems so very much for the FTPA which makes it possible. What a shower of cunts they were, are & always will be. What difference would it make if somehow the FTPA wasn't law?
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Jun 28, 2017 13:40
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jabby posted:Damming stuff on Grenfell on Radio 4. All about how the official death toll is likely much too low, and that no list of tower residents or of survivors has been produced by the government. Unofficial lists of the dead range from 200 to over 300. There's a strong feeling on the ground that this is a deliberate cover up to try and prevent civil unrest. Remember that there was general ridicule of this idea in this very thread not two weeks ago, and the lack of lists of missing persons and casualty estimates was put down to government ineptitude, bureaucracy, and the famously respectful restraint of our press lmao.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:40
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ShaneMacGowansTeeth posted:So how did 'The Boy, Absolute' get on at PMQS? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-w5XW9TaHhE
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Jun 28, 2017 13:44
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Pissflaps posted:What difference would it make if somehow the FTPA wasn't law? A no confidence vote used to need 50%+1 support & now it needs 2/3rds support, that's quite a big difference. Article linked is by a Professor of Government from University of Manchester & talks about how minority governments are a lot less likely to fall. Written about the 2015 election but still applies.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:45
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jabby posted:Damming stuff on Grenfell on Radio 4. All about how the official death toll is likely much too low, and that no list of tower residents or of survivors has been produced by the government. Unofficial lists of the dead range from 200 to over 300. There's a strong feeling on the ground that this is a deliberate cover up to try and prevent civil unrest. Almost certainly correct. I'm sorry you good folks don't live in a free society. *thinks* Actually I don't either. I guess there is solidarity in that.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:47
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forkboy84 posted:A no confidence vote used to need 50%+1 support & now it needs 2/3rds support, that's quite a big difference. Article linked is by a Professor of Government from University of Manchester & talks about how minority governments are a lot less likely to fall. Written about the 2015 election but still applies. What needs two thirds support is a resolution to call an early general election - this (supposedly) replaces the ability of the prime minister to call one whenever they like. The 50%+1 for a vote of no confidence still stands.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:49
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DancingShade posted:Almost certainly correct.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:50
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Ewan posted:I'm still going for cock-up & incompetence (and no real incentive to get their act together) rather than deliberate malicious cover up. ¿Por que no los dos?
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Jun 28, 2017 13:57
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Ewan posted:I'm still going for cock-up & incompetence (and no real incentive to get their act together) rather than deliberate malicious cover up. In my experience every time I thought there was a conspiracy in an organisation to achieve X it always ended up being a combination of simple incompetence, shortsightedness and malicious selfishness. Kind of ruined the X-files retrospectively to be honest. It's also pretty disappointing when you realize the people in charge are just that loving stupid and most large organisations are only limping along due to the goodwill and dogged determination of the lower echelons. But we're only talking a cover up in the mainstream (old) media which are basically bought and paid for and that's an established fact. Social (new) media is not remotely covering this up and that's where the future lies. Also: hence May and people like her disliking the information age because the old power structures are crumbling. DancingShade fucked around with this message at 14:01 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 13:58
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Pissflaps posted:What difference would it make if somehow the FTPA wasn't law? If the government loses a vote of no confidence they now have 2 weeks to bribe everyone to help them pass a vote of confidence to stay in power. It's a potentially endless merry-go-round of corruption.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:59
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Pissflaps posted:What needs two thirds support is a resolution to call an early general election - this (supposedly) replaces the ability of the prime minister to call one whenever they like. Oh loving hell you tedious pedantic oval office. Yes, great. The point is the government doesn't instantly fall on a vote of confidence any more. Jesus wept. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 28, 2017 14:01
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQrYV6LpYa0
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Jun 28, 2017 14:12
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forkboy84 posted:Oh loving hell you tedious pedantic oval office. Yes, great. The point is the government doesn't instantly fall on a vote of confidence any more. Jesus wept. I don't think pointing out the difference between a majority (unlikely but possible for opposition parties to achieve) and a 2/3 supermajority (basically impossible) makes Pissflaps pedantic. This is an area with a lot of uncertainty and technical detail and using correct definitions is important.
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Jun 28, 2017 14:13
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Braggart posted:If the government loses a vote of no confidence they now have 2 weeks to bribe everyone to help them pass a vote of confidence to stay in power. It's a potentially endless merry-go-round of corruption. This was already the case, though. The first Labour government came about without an election by MacDonald being able to command the confidence of the House when Baldwin couldn't.
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Jun 28, 2017 14:18
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Party Boat posted:I don't think pointing out the difference between a majority (unlikely but possible for opposition parties to achieve) and a 2/3 supermajority (basically impossible) makes Pissflaps pedantic. This is an area with a lot of uncertainty and technical detail and using correct definitions is important. It also might be a good point to make seeing as how well bribing votes has gone over with the people. Even if it doesn't lead to a government collapse it still undermines the message of Austerity, further sinks their support, and forces them to reinvest in said-bribed officials' community (I mean even if you hate the DUP, the idea of investing in NI in of itself isn't objectionable). It's absolutely still a viable and compelling option. Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 14:22 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 14:19
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forkboy84 posted:Oh loving hell you tedious pedantic oval office. Yes, great. The point is the government doesn't instantly fall on a vote of confidence any more. Jesus wept. No the point is that you thought the FTPA said something it doesn't. Calling me names doesn't mitigate for your fundamental misunderstanding of the Act.
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Jun 28, 2017 14:20
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communism bitch posted:Remember that there was general ridicule of this idea in this very thread not two weeks ago, and the lack of lists of missing persons and casualty estimates was put down to government ineptitude, bureaucracy, and the famously respectful restraint of our press lmao. Remember how yesterday or monday (I forget) half the press were mocking Diane Abbot for being Bad At Maths because she guesstimated "hundreds" might have died.
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Jun 28, 2017 14:31
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spectralent posted:Remember how yesterday or monday (I forget) half the press were mocking Diane Abbot for being Bad At Maths because she guesstimated "hundreds" might have died. Do you have some links for this?
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Jun 28, 2017 14:33
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poo poo people here (myself included) were expecting casualties in the hundreds just based on the time of fire being peak sleeping time in a place with poo poo alarms.
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Jun 28, 2017 14:35
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JFairfax posted:Jeremy Corbyn's glasto speech has been viewed nearly 5 million times on his facebook page apparently facebook counts 3 seconds as a view tho so who knows how many people actually watched it
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Jun 28, 2017 14:39
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I think it's really important that the full number of people who died is found and made public, but it feels sometimes like the speculation that the number of deaths is well over 100 kind of somehow makes it seem like the 'official' estimate of 79 isn't shocking and terrible enough. That's such a massive number and if it turns out to be accurate then it shouldn't be diminished compared to how large it could have been.
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Jun 28, 2017 14:40
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TinTower posted:This was already the case, though. The first Labour government came about without an election by MacDonald being able to command the confidence of the House when Baldwin couldn't. No, this is a change brought about specifically by the FTPA. Losing a vote of no confidence no longer immediately brings down a government as long as they can win a new vote of confidence within 14 days. Under the FTPA, Baldwin would have had a chance to get the bribes out just like Theresa will. Job done, the government remains in power until the next vote of no confidence, when they have to shake the magic money tree again. I reckon even the British public would eventually see through it though, so in reality it won't be infinitely repeatable. Could do some real damage to the Tories' inexplicable reputation for fiscal competence too, which would be good. Braggart fucked around with this message at 14:51 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 14:49
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Braggart posted:No, this is a change brought about specifically by the FTPA. Losing a vote of no confidence no longer immediately brings down a government as long as they can win a new vote of confidence within 14 days. Under the FTPA, Baldwin would have had a chance to get the bribes out just like Theresa will. Job done, the government remains in power until the next vote of no confidence, when they have to shake the magic money tree again. Baldwin did have that chance. The problem was that the Tory policy of tariff reform was unacceptable to the Liberals, so they backed MacDonald instead. A vote of no confidence has never instantly brought down a government. To that matter, neither has an election loss. They are typical precursors, but that's historically a matter of convention. Gladstone lost the confidence of the House in 1873, but as Disraeli refused to form a minority government, Gladstone was able to regain the confidence of the House eight days later. Likewise, the Brown government lasted for five days after their election loss in 2010, until the point where it was clear to Brown that he could not command a majority.
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Jun 28, 2017 14:58
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Spooning out sweeteners to entice votes during a minority government is pretty standard fare - Callaghan was pretty good at it after the lib/lab pact collapsed (for example giving NI 7 extra MPs to placate Enoch Powell and co) The price tags just got a bit too high though
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Jun 28, 2017 15:00
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There's no way less than 200 people died in the fire. I stake my reputation on it.
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Jun 28, 2017 15:04
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sassassin posted:There's no way less than 200 people died in the fire. but do you stake your  on it
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Jun 28, 2017 15:06
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sassassin posted:There's no way less than 200 people died in the fire. What the gently caress did you do
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Jun 28, 2017 15:09
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communism bitch posted:Remember that there was general ridicule of this idea in this very thread not two weeks ago, and the lack of lists of missing persons and casualty estimates was put down to government ineptitude, bureaucracy, and the famously respectful restraint of our press lmao. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/28/grenfell-tower-death-toll-may-not-be-known-until-end-of-year-say-police quote:The Met’s DS Fiona McCormack said a list of tenants provided to police by the Kensington and Chelsea Tenants Management Organisation, which managed the building, was “not accurate”.
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Jun 28, 2017 15:13
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Jose posted:https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/28/grenfell-tower-death-toll-may-not-be-known-until-end-of-year-say-police Long after the survivors have been quietly silenced and the other towers demolished to make way for condos to sell for Russian & Saudi investors. Everyone will be resettled in *checks map* Aberdeen. There may be a slight commute to their places of work.
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Jun 28, 2017 15:15
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| # ? May 14, 2024 00:29 |
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communism bitch posted:Remember that there was general ridicule of this idea in this very thread not two weeks ago, and the lack of lists of missing persons and casualty estimates was put down to government ineptitude, bureaucracy, and the famously respectful restraint of our press lmao.
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Jun 28, 2017 15:21
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