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turn left hillary!! noo posted:Trip report: DS9 season 2, episodes 20-21, "The Maquis" Right, but did you look at her?
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Jun 28, 2017 18:16
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Baronjutter posted:Voyager The writers just turned them all to mush.
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Jun 28, 2017 18:16
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You're forgetting Chakotay 
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Jun 28, 2017 18:26
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vermin posted:You're forgetting Chakotay FilthyImp posted:AKooChiMooyYah Actually I forgot biracial SPICY HOT BLOODED Klingon chica.
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Jun 28, 2017 18:31
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FilthyImp posted:Actually I forgot biracial SPICY HOT BLOODED Klingon chica. did the spiciness come from being klingon or Latina?
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Jun 28, 2017 18:41
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FilthyImp posted:rape survivor/transhumanist (7) I first read that as there being seven rape surviving transhumans on Voyager, which might also be true in some way. Don't forget Race-based slavery (holopeople in the miiiines)
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Jun 28, 2017 18:47
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vermin posted:You're forgetting Chakotay Does Memory Alpha still list "Native American" as a "species"?
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Jun 28, 2017 19:01
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Wheat Loaf posted:Does Memory Alpha still list "Native American" as a "species"? I like my species the way it is.
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Jun 28, 2017 19:07
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:I mean can you imagine if, for example, Spock or Sarek had coldly, logically decided to start killing people? They'd be terrifying. There's a 7th season DS9 episode that you're going to either really like, or really hate
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Jun 28, 2017 19:19
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Voyager was multicultural in very white suburban way, where it's ok to have people of different backgrounds so long as they 100% assimilate into suburban white culture and defer to their betters. The "others" were all "one of the good ones" and grappled with their racial shortcomings while janeway was the prototypical white upper middle class suburban mom of the whole crew. She was so nice and patient while these lesser races slowly learned that the federation way is the best way, and whitebread human culture is the standard all need to accept and follow. DS9 was a truly multi-cultural cast and crew, it followed a more urban and cosmopolitan view of multiculturalism that isn't about the other desperately trying to fit in or "act white" in order to earn a place in society, but rather very different people coming together and being able to work professionally with each other without expectations of assimilation or being melted down into some sort of horrible pot. We don't see Odo or Kira or Garak or Quark constantly trying to earn federation approval to become "one of the good ones", in fact they're often outright critical or in opposition of the federation and its culture. On DS9 people simply tolerate or ignore each other's differences in order to get the job done and have a respectful workplace because there's no assumption of a single correct dominant culture that everyone else should aspire to. On voyager the doctor and 7 were by far the most interesting characters because they were the only ones to ever really criticize or have an opposing view, they were the only ones who pushed back against the melting pot.
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Jun 28, 2017 19:28
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Baronjutter posted:A Good Post For some reason we've been less accepting of people after, say, 2001 and VOY's depiction is just so sterile and antiquated.
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Jun 28, 2017 20:05
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Baronjutter posted:...without expectations of assimilation or being melted down into some sort of horrible pot. We don't see Odo... Nice solid-supremacist dogwhistle there, bro.
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Jun 28, 2017 20:05
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In both Voyager and DS9 the characters constantly casually refer to stereotypes of alien species, but in DS9 they're usually shown to be wrong or at least lacking proper nuance whereas in Voyager its just normal and accepted that Klingons must constantly be angry, and so on. Also its funny how in Voyager they always insists on referring to Seven as Borg as if its her race.
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Jun 28, 2017 20:06
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Sir Lemming posted:Nice solid-supremacist dogwhistle there, bro. Odo used a bucket, not a pot.
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Jun 28, 2017 20:20
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I love reading Memory Alpha articles on mundane things that shouldn't be in a wiki in the first placeOn Toilets posted:The toilet, also referred to by the Ferengi as a waste extraction fixture, was a device used for the disposal of bodily wastes. The waste extraction system was the system used to manage and process that and all other related wastes.
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Jun 28, 2017 20:25
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vermin posted:I love reading Memory Alpha articles on mundane things that shouldn't be in a wiki in the first place http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Toilet Even after all of that, it's still not obvious how Star Trek toilets work since the one in the screenshot does not appear to have a hole and the ensign is sitting on it while wearing pants Maybe someday an officially licensed VR game will clear this up
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Jun 28, 2017 20:32
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TV IV > Star Trek: Toilet Apocrypha
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Jun 28, 2017 20:37
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Wheat Loaf posted:Does Memory Alpha still list "Native American" as a "species"? A few years ago I tried making an edit, but they got pissy with me and reverted it.  galenanorth posted:http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Toilet So, uh... 1: There's very clearly a lid that hasn't been raised. 2: That's not an ensign. That's Kirk. McNally fucked around with this message at 20:48 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 20:46
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Spock, designer of fine art deco toilets.
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Jun 28, 2017 20:50
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Baronjutter posted:Right, but did you look at her? Well yes, and I totally get where Quark is coming from. FuturePastNow posted:There's a 7th season DS9 episode that you're going to either really like, or really hate Is that the baseball episode? I vaguely recall liking it.
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Jun 28, 2017 21:32
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:Well yes, and I totally get where Quark is coming from. That too, but no.
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Jun 28, 2017 21:34
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Timby posted:If you want to see some truly impressive wailing and gnashing of teeth, commenters on Ars are freaking the gently caress out over the news that Discovery will have actual interpersonal conflict. In a way, you and the Ars posters both have good points. It is turning into a dysfunctional production of show about dysfunctional people. "Gene's Vision" is over hyped. But Star Trek has always been based on a crew of do-gooders confronting the unknown. That is the concept. "Realistic" or not, it is what it is.
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Jun 28, 2017 22:26
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Timby posted:If you want to see some truly impressive wailing and gnashing of teeth, commenters on Ars are freaking the gently caress out over the news that Discovery will have actual interpersonal conflict. It's Ars. As a long-ago expat from there, I am not at all surprised. God I hate that place. The front page articles (and the comments) are (usually) alright, but their forums are insufferable. Even reading my own post history there makes me cringe. Hipster_Doofus fucked around with this message at 22:36 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 22:33
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I barely read that site now but I remember it wasn't full of trash articles like that one or the other recent one about an adult Harry Potter fan. Did these people only watch Season 1 of TNG?
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Jun 28, 2017 22:39
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I don't care what some nerds think about Star Trek goddamnit, I only care what goons think
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Jun 28, 2017 22:44
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Tighclops posted:I don't care what some nerds think about Star Trek goddamnit, I only care what goons think Star Trek is dumb and bad, and I own 17 seasons and 13 movies. That's my Goon Opinion ™.
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Jun 28, 2017 22:46
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I can't even reply to that the hell's wrong with you man New show will probably suck in the way most modern genre TV/movie fiction sucks, by being aggressively mediocre, which won't quite be the same way the old shows really sucked so it'll throw people
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Jun 28, 2017 22:50
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Beowulfs_Ghost posted:In a way, you and the Ars posters both have good points. Corbomit Maneuver, Balance of Terror, Galieo 7, and a bunch of other classic Trek episodes have subplots about junior officers cracking under pressure and the commanders struggling to deal with it. We also had many instances of the Spock/McCoy tension boiling over into outright insubordination. Plus Kirk works himself to the bone and starts loving up/snapping at people on many occasions. I really like the TOS approach. It can veer into melodrama a lot of the time, but it really does a great job of showing when the crew is in a tense or dangerous situation and was fairly realistic about showing how lovely people can be to each other when they're having a bad day. TNG had Mean Riker and Picard being a total bastard at times, but it mostly shied away from any sort of protracted conflict and people usually worked our their minor differences by the next scene, so it usually just felt like cheap drama. As long as it's not BSG "everyone's a cylon" levels of paranoid infighting, I think having some conflict will be a very good thing.
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Jun 28, 2017 22:58
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Duckbag posted:Picard being a total bastard at times Yeah, for all that Roddenberry decided on no interpersonal conflict, Picard sure did vocally hate children at the start of the series.
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Jun 28, 2017 23:16
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Timby posted:If you want to see some truly impressive wailing and gnashing of teeth, commenters on Ars are freaking the gently caress out over the news that Discovery will have actual interpersonal conflict. Man, it really makes me irrationally angry when people confuse "optimism" and "idealism" with "nothing bad ever happens and everybody is always perfect and things always work out in the end." 
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Jun 28, 2017 23:32
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Lord Krangdar posted:Also its funny how in Voyager they always insists on referring to Seven as Borg as if its her race. I was under the impression that Borgification actually introduced some genetic changes, which would make her not pure-strain human any more.
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Jun 28, 2017 23:39
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Baronjutter posted:I appreciate gene's vision that he thought that technology would solve a lot of our problems, but he also acknowledged that we'd need equally fantastic advances in the social sciences and our culture in general. I don't think it's insane or crazy to think that some post-scarcity humans could develop a society like he envisioned. We find cures for mental illness, we break the cycle of lovely parents that gently caress up their kids who produce more hosed up kids, we reform the justice system into something much more like the medical/mental health system where it's about both prevention and cure, not punishment (not that there is much crime anymore with the economic causes removed). 
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Jun 28, 2017 23:45
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McNally posted:A few years ago I tried making an edit, but they got pissy with me and reverted it. This character is now listed as human FWIW
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Jun 28, 2017 23:52
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Baronjutter posted:I appreciate gene's vision that he thought that technology would solve a lot of our problems, but he also acknowledged that we'd need equally fantastic advances in the social sciences and our culture in general. I don't think it's insane or crazy to think that some post-scarcity humans could develop a society like he envisioned. We find cures for mental illness, we break the cycle of lovely parents that gently caress up their kids who produce more hosed up kids, we reform the justice system into something much more like the medical/mental health system where it's about both prevention and cure, not punishment (not that there is much crime anymore with the economic causes removed). One read-through of The People's History of the United States is all it takes to realize we've come a long way in this nation alone, which is not an old one. Star Trek writing at its most naive supports the idea that humanity has arrived at a status quo agreeable to everyone, however, and the only ones who are upset are moron backward aliens and the odd psychopath here and there. The idea that literally everyone agrees all the time is the stupidest loving poo poo and it also happens to be a thing that Star Trek departed from by the end of TNG. Anyone who objects to its rejection now is an unread faux Internet intellectual, buoyed by CBS' total inability to properly market what should be an extremely important property. I can see why they are working on their own streaming service--the alternative is to become a total subsidiary of Netflix, if not on paper then in deed--but few people know anything about this show that they haven't learned from well-placed spies.
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Jun 29, 2017 00:07
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My streaming service was electronically determined for one purpose alone...to sense the death of network tv.
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Jun 29, 2017 00:28
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Platonicsolid posted:To borrow a phrase, "Someone should have labeled the future 'some assembly required'" I've started watching Babylon 5 for the first time recently... halfway through season 2 already. I'm kicking myself for not watching it sooner, so drat good.
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Jun 29, 2017 00:44
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Yeah, it seems like All Asses, Hobogo, and the rest are largely just hedges for when all broadcasting is done over the internet. They got in too late for ground floor, but drat it, they're not going to let a bunch of Tesla driving, latte sipping, silicon valley assholes steal their industry.* *yes they will.
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Jun 29, 2017 00:46
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thexerox123 posted:I've started watching Babylon 5 for the first time recently... halfway through season 2 already. I'm kicking myself for not watching it sooner, so drat good. Same. I really enjoy how cohesive it feels. The fact one person wrote the vast majority of the scripts really shows. It helps that Straczynski's dialogue is really snappy.
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Jun 29, 2017 00:55
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Baronjutter posted:I appreciate gene's vision that he thought that technology would solve a lot of our problems, but he also acknowledged that we'd need equally fantastic advances in the social sciences and our culture in general.  It's been remarked that cramming a thousand people into a starship and keeping them all happy and productive for years on end would be almost as big a miracle as warp drive. The difference is that warp drive (like most of the other technological miracles) shows a plausible amount of infrastructure and effort to keep it going. Engineering takes up half the ship, and a big chunk of the crew specializes in keeping it all humming along. Things need active repair and maintenance. It makes sense. And maintaining all the social harmony is... Troi, I guess? Even if she sees ten people a day, it'd take her months to get around to everyone on the ship one time. And she seems to spend most of her time hanging around the bridge, not talking to people. There's nothing behind the sociological miracle, and so it doesn't really ring true.
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Jun 29, 2017 01:09
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Powered Descent posted:
Holodecks solve everything.
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Jun 29, 2017 01:19
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