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That is just the type of poo poo that's being argued as part of the problem. Just like women being steered into low paying jobs (which are low paying because women do them.)
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Jul 23, 2017 16:32
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I finally watched some of the Sargon/Destiny debate and holy gently caress is Sargon an idiot, but also Destiny is pretty bad at arguments for someone who claims to be a debater. Like, Destiny brought up that black names get discriminated against when on resumes as an example of racial discrimination, but rather than actually take a minute to look up the study and point to it and make Sargon confront the issue he's just like "I'm pretty sure there's been a study on this!" which is just the laziest loving thing to do and lets Sargon off the hook.
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Jul 23, 2017 16:37
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yeah destiny is weird that he'll know these people are wrong but doesn't have the information recall or citations ready to dunk on them. the jontron debate is a good example, jt would keep spouting obviously incorrect things like rich black youths committing four times as much crime as poor whites. destiny knows that's wrong but doesn't know off the top of his head that they're convicted of crimes at four times the rate but that poor white youths commit crime at three times the rate thus jon used a point that disproves himself and shows how obviously racist the criminal justice system is. i wanna be fair to destiny because i don't think he expected jonny tronny to go full on kkk and for a lot of the debate he seems beside himself but it takes five seconds of googling to find that out. not that it matters, these people will say wrong thing after wrong thing and then the second you say something that's true they need to see a study despite not supporting anything they said (and then ignore your study due them not liking the source or something).
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Jul 23, 2017 16:44
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Yea, you nailed it. It's frustrating as hell, I want to like, be Destiny's debate coach or something, he could be way loving better at this with just the most basic amount of effort put into it rather than going on what his brain thinks is a good idea.
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Jul 23, 2017 16:48
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Isn't Destiny a vidya streamer who decided to debate these morons for some reason?
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Jul 23, 2017 16:52
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Armored Skeptic just released a video about how Francesca Ramsey was pretending to want a discussion with him, but was actually lying about their whole "friendship": https://youtu.be/UJanCTIhDJ0
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Jul 23, 2017 16:54
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Archer666 posted:Devils advocate time. That death stat could imply the possibility of danger pay. Considering less women choose to work in dangerous occupations, they miss out on the chance of earning more by their own choice. So the general idea here is true (it's also true that men are more likely to be the victims of workplace accidents than women), but its important to ask what kinds of occupations are more dangerous and why women aren't in them. Most of these occupations are blue-collar in nature (construction, factory work) and some EMS/Fire/Police work. Until recently (and in times of crisis, like WWII) these jobs were all but closed to women. Women simply weren't welcome in the trades or any other physical/dangerous labor and you still get the occasional story like this: https://www.vice.com/en_ca/article/...foundland-town. This is changing very slowly, but the concept of gender roles isn't going away any time soon. If you include the military, women in North America were not allowed to participate in front-line combat roles at all until recently (and therefore couldn't get the associated danger pay). Compare this to a country like China, which historically has had a higher proportion of women serving in construction, military and police roles. As China becomes more affluent, a lot of the capitalist/western gender roles actually begin to diffuse into the culture, and women are also starting to be considered ineligible for blue-collar labor, management and other positions traditionally viewed as "masculine" in the west. This has lead to an increasing pay gap between men and women, unlike in the west: http://econpapers.repec.org/paper/pramprapa/42132.htm
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Jul 23, 2017 16:55
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Mokbek posted:Armored Skeptic just released a video about how Francesca Ramsey was pretending to want a discussion with him, but was actually lying about their whole "friendship": I love how the most popular comment is something to the effect of 'Trolls are nice people who pretend to be assholes online! lololol' No. There's no meaningful distinction between being a prick and pretending to be a prick. Especially when it's not immediately obvious that you're being fascetious.
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Jul 23, 2017 17:11
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Pembroke Fuse posted:So the general idea here is true (it's also true that men are more likely to be the victims of workplace accidents than women), but its important to ask what kinds of occupations are more dangerous and why women aren't in them. Which I think leads right in to the biggest problem of not just these dorks but also the 'White Feminists' who want qualified upper-middle class women to be equal to qualified upper-middle class men and don't worry too much about anyone else, or any number of other groups, a lack of working knowledge about intersectionality. Yeah manual labor in a world of weakened unions and loose regulations sucks. It's not women's fault that's the case though. Attacking feminism won't make OSHA or the building owners give more of a poo poo about you.
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Jul 23, 2017 17:36
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JVNO posted:I love how the most popular comment is something to the effect of 'Trolls are nice people who pretend to be assholes online! lololol' That comment was referring to what Francesca was saying in the video and I'm paraphrasing a bit: "[The trolls] are just like normal people when you meet them in real life but act like assholes on the internet".
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Jul 23, 2017 17:42
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Jesus chirst that guy is a moron. I just watched his video on "postmodernism" where he claims that no definition of postmodernism is possible because of the diversity of perspectives involved, but also that postmodernism is bad because it encourages the questioning of absolute truths like the scientific method and suggests that social construction is real. He doesn't name a single title or philosopher, or summarize a single specific argument. Even an undergraduate student would figure out that maybe he was in a little over his head at that point.
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Jul 23, 2017 17:52
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https://twitter.com/Millennial_Matt/status/888490251668213760 found this lovely idiot on the alt right mock thread. jesus gently caress, these people are sad but make me irrationally angry. he is just repeating bullshit he heard on /pol/. its loving sad. also he legit thinks he wouldnt get his brains blown out in the first purge. Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 17:59 on Jul 23, 2017 |
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Jul 23, 2017 17:56
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Dapper_Swindler posted:https://twitter.com/Millennial_Matt/status/888490251668213760 I sincerely doubt that guy isn't just a troll trying just get a rise out of people. Either way, he is pretty bad.
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Jul 23, 2017 18:05
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Guavanaut posted:Which I think leads right in to the biggest problem of not just these dorks but also the 'White Feminists' who want qualified upper-middle class women to be equal to qualified upper-middle class men and don't worry too much about anyone else, or any number of other groups, a lack of working knowledge about intersectionality. Yeah manual labor in a world of weakened unions and loose regulations sucks. It's not women's fault that's the case though. Attacking feminism won't make OSHA or the building owners give more of a poo poo about you. Probably the best criticism I've heard of liberal feminism from a leftist perspective is that some liberal feminists are only interested in providing better representation in existing hierarchies rather subverting or upending them. This kind of argument usually ignores the Marxist roots of lots of 3rd wave, but probably applies to lots of pop or superficial feminism.
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Jul 23, 2017 18:35
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edit: wrong thread
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Jul 23, 2017 18:37
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Pembroke Fuse posted:Probably the best criticism I've heard of liberal feminism from a leftist perspective is that some liberal feminists are only interested in providing better representation in existing hierarchies rather subverting or upending them. This kind of argument usually ignores the Marxist roots of lots of 3rd wave, but probably applies to lots of pop or superficial feminism. 2nd wave had marxist roots too. Capitalism is really good at eating any movement that threatens it.
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Jul 23, 2017 18:40
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Pembroke Fuse posted:Probably the best criticism I've heard of liberal feminism from a leftist perspective is that some liberal feminists are only interested in providing better representation in existing hierarchies rather subverting or upending them. This kind of argument usually ignores the Marxist roots of lots of 3rd wave, but probably applies to lots of pop or superficial feminism. Basically this: https://twitter.com/historyinflicks/status/839732795706593281
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Jul 23, 2017 18:41
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Mokbek posted:Armored Skeptic just released a video about how Francesca Ramsey was pretending to want a discussion with him, but was actually lying about their whole "friendship": Here's what set them off: Around 36min of this podcast. https://soundcloud.com/lastnamebasis/the-troll-hunter I wonder if she's actually being two-faced about being friends.
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Jul 23, 2017 18:45
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There is a brand of feminism that's really popular with the well to do that is really bad on intersectionality.
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Jul 23, 2017 18:48
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Mokbek posted:That comment was referring to what Francesca was saying in the video and I'm paraphrasing a bit: "[The trolls] are just like normal people when you meet them in real life but act like assholes on the internet". This doesn't really change the point I'm making? Francesca is wrong too I guess? There is no such thing as a 'nice person' who 'puts on a troll costume' on the internet. There's no difference between pretending to be a prick and actually being one. And people in that very comment chain were defending the whole 'I'm just a troll on the internet for lulz because meme culture'.
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Jul 23, 2017 19:50
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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:There is a brand of feminism that's really popular with the well to do that is really bad on intersectionality. "white feminism"
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Jul 23, 2017 19:58
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JVNO posted:This doesn't really change the point I'm making? Francesca is wrong too I guess? There is no such thing as a 'nice person' who 'puts on a troll costume' on the internet. There's no difference between pretending to be a prick and actually being one. And people in that very comment chain were defending the whole 'I'm just a troll on the internet for lulz because meme culture'. Do you think the "internet persona is not real life personality" belief will ever change? I think more and more people are having their real names be attached to their profiles, but that's mostly for social media.There are still websites that are not about those in which anonymity is still used. On one hand, anonymity is important for free speech and security, but on the other hand it allows a safe veil for abusers and abusive behaviours towards minorities.
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Jul 23, 2017 23:34
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toanoradian posted:Do you think the "internet persona is not real life personality" belief will ever change? I think more and more people are having their real names be attached to their profiles, but that's mostly for social media.There are still websites that are not about those in which anonymity is still used. On one hand, anonymity is important for free speech and security, but on the other hand it allows a safe veil for abusers and abusive behaviours towards minorities. It's probably only a matter of time before things like 4chan are regulated away and our online identities are streamlined into accounts shared across platforms. It drove me crazy when the google-owned sites started auto-logging me in under the same account over all of them a few years ago. I had to have a dedicated browser for each email account, and one for youtube. I'm basing this on the direction the FCC is headed under Trump, where the telecoms seem able to do whatever they want without getting challenged on it. They are no friends to freedom of speech or action.
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Jul 24, 2017 00:45
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So here's the latest from Sargon- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYzQG91gmjo&t=1206s It's from The Thinkery, and I'm not sure if under the current rules of operation that's where he posts his more or less offensive content. He's discussing this weekend's bullshit from Coxcon were some douchebag decided that asking "Are traps gay?" was an acceptable thing to do when you have a panel with at least one transgender person on it. Didn't catch the name of the Romanian fellow he's talking with, but the conversations is pretty horrific. Highlights: * Calling this the Transphobic Question, as a direct similar appeal to the Jewish Question. The getting amused that people (even shitbirds like TB) are annoyed at someone asking it. * Complaining that transgendered people are similar to religious people, in that they ask other people to ignore "reality". * Suggest that there are no passing transgender people in Romania. * Comparisons of transgendered people to transracialism, as if the latter actually exists. * All the standard complaints about trans people, because of course Carl is a shitlord. I'm sure that there's more stupid on the back end of the video, but I could only stomach it up to a bit past the 20 minute mark. EDIT: Also look like Kevin Logan's channel got taken down due to mass flagging. Wonder how long that will last for. rkajdi fucked around with this message at 02:23 on Jul 24, 2017 |
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Jul 24, 2017 01:58
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The worst part of that is the trans woman on the panel in question was Laura Kate Dale. She has been a target of this kind of poo poo before because god forbid a trans woman make a name for herself in games journalism. Or be a woman in games journalism and actually try and do her job for that matter. Edit: Speaking of which. Did anyone see Contra's new video? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ayuqizp4fyY&t=615s It's more of an art piece about how gender dysphoria affects them. It's super loving good and hits me in a few places. BigRed0427 fucked around with this message at 03:12 on Jul 24, 2017 |
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Jul 24, 2017 02:56
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All these idiots think they're geniuses because they cut their teeth ripping on creationists. They can't let go of the irrationality of religion as their signature tool.
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Jul 24, 2017 03:02
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BigRed0427 posted:The worst part of that is the trans woman on the panel in question was Laura Kate Dale. She has been a target of this kind of poo poo before because god forbid a trans woman make a name for herself in games journalism. I thought there was someone else there too, but people making GBS threads on Laura is awful. Even worse is that she's gotten a name for herself actually doing real reporting in games instead of just doing press release reprints. It's hyper telling that these assholes are going after her. I think the high/low point was some idiot kid on youtube doing a video about her where he attempted to misgender her about 10 times a minute, and just couldn't keep it straight for the entire video-- all because she was claiming there was some Rabbids/Mario crossover game coming to the Switch. Which of course was a crazy person lie up until it was announced during E3 this year.
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Jul 24, 2017 03:21
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It wasn't just that rabbids game. She was one of the few people willing to put an actual PS4 Slim on youtube before Sony even announced it and she was called a lire up and down the street for it.
BigRed0427 fucked around with this message at 03:35 on Jul 24, 2017 |
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Jul 24, 2017 03:29
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BigRed0427 posted:It wasn't just that rabbids game. She was one of the few people willing to put an actual PS4 Slim on youtube before Sony even announced it and she was called a lire up and down the street for it. Agreed, but the video I was talking about was the Rabbids thing specifically. Laura is incredible at getting and keeping sources inside the industry to tell her things-- I think the PS4 Slim was her biggest leak, but there have been plenty of others before and after. Only thing about her legit journalism that makes me sad is how she doesn't do nearly as much with "Laura-bait" indie games like any of the Robert Yang stuff now. But I could imagine the latter would keep her site in business.
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Jul 24, 2017 03:44
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rkajdi posted:So here's the latest from Sargon- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYzQG91gmjo&t=1206s It's from The Thinkery, and I'm not sure if under the current rules of operation that's where he posts his more or less offensive content. TB does something right for once and his fanbase turns on him. The price of making gamers your consumer base i guess.
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Jul 24, 2017 06:46
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BigRed0427 posted:Edit: Speaking of which. Did anyone see Contra's new video? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ayuqizp4fyY&t=615s It's more of an art piece about how gender dysphoria affects them. It's super loving good and hits me in a few places. ZenMasterBullshit posted:New Contra is out and hits so close to home I wanna curl up in a ball and not exist. Yeah no it's....accurate at least.
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Jul 24, 2017 09:39
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Did Richard Dawkins actually know Rebecca Watson when he decided to chime in on the sexual harassment thing, or did he just feel the need to comment? I always thought it was weird the way he chimed in on the subject for seemingly no reason, given his focus on religious matters. I also recall that he seemed to suggest dating underage girls should also be okay...
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Jul 24, 2017 09:49
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SpaceViking posted:TB does something right for once and his fanbase turns on him. The price of making gamers your consumer base i guess. He's in a situation where he's pissed a lot of decent people off by siding with the gators, and now has pissed the gators off by not being the biggest filth monster possible. Jumping sides might be something that could play to an audience if he could play the long game, but that's unfortunately not an option for him with the terminal cancer diagnosis.
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Jul 24, 2017 10:01
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What limited exposure to TB I've had gave me the impression that he has Strong Opinions on basically every subject known to man and very limited ability to filter his expression of them. So it's quite possible he actually just genuinely thinks that GG had a point and also being a dick to trans people is bad and gently caress what everyone else thinks.
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Jul 24, 2017 11:45
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 wew lads
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Jul 24, 2017 12:09
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Mr Interweb posted:Did Richard Dawkins actually know Rebecca Watson when he decided to chime in on the sexual harassment thing, or did he just feel the need to comment? I always thought it was weird the way he chimed in on the subject for seemingly no reason, given his focus on religious matters. Possibly he had been on the Skeptic's Guide to the Universe once or twice, but no they hadn't really ever even met. She actually thought he was cool before he started in with that poo poo.
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Jul 24, 2017 12:16
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business hammocks posted:All these idiots think they're geniuses because they cut their teeth ripping on creationists. They can't let go of the irrationality of religion as their signature tool. Oh man. That made some things finally click for me. They're literally trying to make their new targets fit into the peg hole they made for Evangelicals. Except now, instead of the Bible/church teachings being hand over fist thrown away for being "fictional", they're treating actual science and statistics as religious material that can be thrown out. It's because they never learned to actually engage with opposing sources, so "Studies show that women do in fact earn less overall and are paid less inside..." or "Statistics looking at racial disparity of..." or anything with actual rigor behind it are seen the same as "Well the bible says...". And they're confused as to why there is such a large backlash against them in a lot of these areas because before you'd only have the odd Evangelical going against them, who could also be ignored without engaging them because "you're just part of a cult". Hell even the SJW label makes more sense now since they never had to deal with a large population that just agrees with each other about not being an rear end in a top hat to people, and the Evangelicals who pushed back before would legit call themselves "Holy Warriors".
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Jul 24, 2017 12:47
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OwlFancier posted:What limited exposure to TB I've had gave me the impression that he has Strong Opinions on basically every subject known to man and very limited ability to filter his expression of them. I agree GG had a point, it's just that the systematic harassment of women and trying to make enthusiast media kneel to some chuds from the internet is a stupid point. There's people who do genuine consumer advocacy with video games (Jim Sterling and Laura Kate/Buzz/Dale are the two ones that come to mind first) but they aren't marching for boob sliders and panty shots being kept in games because they are functional humans and not pervs living in a basement "apartment". GG is mad because they pseudo/actual porn toys and murder sims are getting taken away from them, and no real person cares except to mock them. Also, they are aging out of being the target demo for games, and don't have the real spending power to push anything because of chronic un(der)employment. I could also see feeling sorry for them if what they wanted was something of actual value, instead of fighting to beat virtual hookers and create moe waifu fantasies in their precious games.
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Jul 24, 2017 13:13
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Total amount of man hours spent arguing about gaming and gender: More than the rest of human history combined Total sum of gaming influenced by gender issues: A handful of RPG characters, The Sims which is for girls so none of them cared, Spelunky maiden options Carecat fucked around with this message at 14:29 on Jul 24, 2017 |
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Jul 24, 2017 14:27
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They couldn't even put the effort for sheer time into it, they don't even have the lack of dedication to do that. They put no effort in their arguments, their cause, the time for their cause. They just were angry that "THE WOMZ" are also interested in video games and good god we might have to stop being creepos! Tbh I'm just waiting for rkaj to regress back to "hill filth/ Playstation 4 fucked around with this message at 14:38 on Jul 24, 2017 |
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Jul 24, 2017 14:34
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