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Tom Perez B/K/M? This poll is closed. |
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77 | 25.50% |
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160 | 52.98% |
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65 | 21.52% |
| Total: | 229 votes | ||
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Matt Zerella posted:Their donors won't allow it. And yet unions are some of the largest contributors of financial and physical resources to the party from the county party on up. I would also point out that, amidst the grinding of teeth about how to reach out to blue collar workers, unions have had to organize blue collar workers continually since their birth. I'm sure union organizers could have some tips over how to phrase something to resonate with a high school-educated machinist.
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Jul 25, 2017 17:28
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ask Definitely Not Running For President Man Mark Zuckerberg what he thinks about unions you will learn why the Democratic Party has no interest in supporting them.
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Jul 25, 2017 17:33
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Democrazy posted:And yet unions are some of the largest contributors of financial and physical resources to the party from the county party on up. I would also point out that, amidst the grinding of teeth about how to reach out to blue collar workers, unions have had to organize blue collar workers continually since their birth. I'm sure union organizers could have some tips over how to phrase something to resonate with a high school-educated machinist. They've shifted to wall st since Carter. If you want more democrats that listen to unions, support DSA/WFP endorsed candidates in your local govt and start rebuilding the party. Until then you're just going to get Clintonite centrists who just say "cut it out" to corporations infringing on workers rights while simultaneously taking their money. You just have to look at the previous NY primary for a perfect example. Bernie stood with Verizon union workers while Abuela was up in Westchester at a Wall St fundraiser.
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Jul 25, 2017 17:40
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Why would Democrats listen to unions when unions have no power and are dying all across the country? No one likes unions anymore. Not even the rank and file dem voters. It's a losing arguement these days whether the left like to accept that or not. For Unions to even be relevant to national politics you actually have to convince the people who gain most to support and want to unionize and you have no been able to. You've just gotten loss after loss after loss.
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Jul 25, 2017 17:48
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Zerella has it right; the Democratic party only gives lip service to unions and appeases Wall Street to keep money flowing. Nobody likes unions anymore because they don't have any champions besides outliers like Sanders.
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Jul 25, 2017 17:51
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ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:For Unions to even be relevant to national politics you actually have to convince the people who gain most to support and want to unionize and you have no been able to. You've just gotten loss after loss after loss. The DSA is doing exactly this, but they're working on a local level, and surprise, they're helping to win elections for pro union socialists! This isn't something that happens overnight, especially in a party that has been rotting for 8 years.
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Jul 25, 2017 17:54
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Matt Zerella posted:The DSA is doing exactly this, but they're working on a local level, and surprise, they're helping to win elections for pro union socialists! This isn't something that happens overnight, especially in a party that has been rotting for 8 years. it's... been a bit longer than 8 years my man
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Jul 25, 2017 17:57
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:it's... been a bit longer than 8 years my man also true. there's a shitload of work to do and it's not going to happen overnight. the DSA is pretty much my only source of political hope these days.
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Jul 25, 2017 17:58
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Hey don't worry man, no matter what DSA does we're going to descend into catastrophe when the seas start subsuming southern Florida and the worst people in the US all head northward homeless, jobless, and hungry
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Jul 25, 2017 18:04
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call to action posted:Hey don't worry man, no matter what DSA does we're going to descend into catastrophe when the seas start subsuming southern Florida and the worst people in the US all head northward homeless, jobless, and hungry id be happy about the same thing happening to wall st in southern Manhattan but all their trading happens in jersey now so 
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Jul 25, 2017 18:07
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call to action posted:Hey don't worry man, no matter what DSA does we're going to descend into catastrophe when the seas start subsuming southern Florida and the worst people in the US all head northward homeless, jobless, and hungry That'd probably reverse all the progress in Virginia and North Carolina (the trend where they become slightly bluer while Wisconsin becomes redder) while Florida stays the same and, while underwater, keeps its two senators. During recess, they will fly home and campaign for remaining constituents, mostly oil rig workers, NOAA bureaucrats that are there to assess how dead the coral reefs are, and mermaids
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Jul 25, 2017 18:11
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call to action posted:Hey don't worry man, no matter what DSA does we're going to descend into catastrophe when the seas start subsuming southern Florida and the worst people in the US all head northward homeless, jobless, and hungry Ever heard of holland?
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Jul 25, 2017 18:12
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The Dutch are fake news
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Jul 25, 2017 18:14
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ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:Ever heard of holland? America, much less Florida, could never get its poo poo together long enough to build dikes and levies around the coasts. 1.) They'd complain about the use of the word "Dyke". 2.) They'd rather all drown than hear Stephen Colbert ever refer to it as "America's condom" even once. 
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Jul 25, 2017 18:28
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ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:Why would Democrats listen to unions when unions have no power and are dying all across the country? Unions have an overall positive approval rating from Americans, and working people and young people approve unions by even larger numbers. While union membership has declined, there still are successful union organizing drives. I hear from people every day who desperately want a union at their jobs because they know it means better wages, more stability, better benefits and dignity in the workplace. A union accomplishes most of the goals of the Democratic Party and serves as a valuable tool for Party building and campaigning. Though I agree that unions need reform and adaptation, any criticism that I have would be in the spirit of strengthening their ability to represent workers. The Left needs to stand behind unions in the face of greater intimidation and anti-worker schemes by businesses. Unions face real problems, and those with the power to strengthen unions through policy haven't done an adequate job in ensuring that the right to be represented isn't lost. Unions can't wait for the perfect candidate to come along, and the Democrats can't regain their position without the help of organized labor. The only way forward is with a strong commitment against Right To Work and for comprehensive bills like EFCA.
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Jul 25, 2017 19:21
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Appropos union chat and Florida, this morning on ABC in Tampa they did a short piece on trade jobs that don't require a college degree yet pay a living wage. Literally every single one was a union job, but unions weren't mentioned even once. The right has done a hell of a job poisoning the well.
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Jul 25, 2017 19:26
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https://twitter.com/kfrydl/status/889923267481546753
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Jul 25, 2017 20:03
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBYQaDYXlv0
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Jul 25, 2017 20:04
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To be fair, that's part of the game. You can't sit there and not clap, it's pure attack fodder for the next election. None of them were actually happy to see him.
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Jul 25, 2017 20:04
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WampaLord posted:To be fair, that's part of the game. You can't sit there and not clap, it's pure attack fodder for the next election. lmao
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Jul 25, 2017 20:05
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WampaLord posted:To be fair, that's part of the game. You can't sit there and not clap, it's pure attack fodder for the next election. Oh god not attack ads!
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Jul 25, 2017 20:05
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Democrazy posted:Unions have an overall positive approval rating from Americans, and working people and young people approve unions by even larger numbers. While union membership has declined, there still are successful union organizing drives. I hear from people every day who desperately want a union at their jobs because they know it means better wages, more stability, better benefits and dignity in the workplace. I don't know nor have met a single person who thinks positively of unions in the states of Arkansas, Oklahoma, Missouri, or Texas.
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Jul 25, 2017 20:06
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NewForumSoftware posted:Oh god not attack ads! Look, I get it, but there's literally no gain for them doing some sort of "no clap" protest or whatever you're thinking of, it's just stupid for stupid's sake.
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Jul 25, 2017 20:07
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ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:I don't know nor have met a single person who thinks positively of unions in the states of Arkansas, Oklahoma, Missouri, or Texas. what a shock that forums poster ThisIsWhyTrumpWon exclusively spends time with garbage people WampaLord posted:Look, I get it, but there's literally no gain for them doing some sort of "no clap" protest or whatever you're thinking of, it's just stupid for stupid's sake. don't sign your posts
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Jul 25, 2017 20:07
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WampaLord posted:Look, I get it, but there's literally no gain for them doing some sort of "no clap" protest or whatever you're thinking of, it's just stupid for stupid's sake. The gain is you show some loving backbone and recognize the hypocrisy of applauding a man who receives socialized healthcare voting to take it away from millions and slashing medicaid which treats almost 2 million veterans.
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Jul 25, 2017 20:10
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ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:I don't know nor have met a single person who thinks positively of unions in the states of Arkansas, Oklahoma, Missouri, or Texas. you also believe a raise in the minimum wage would destroy the American economy let's just say your working class bonafides are debatable and leave it at that
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Jul 25, 2017 20:10
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ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:Ever heard of holland? ever heard of limestone?
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Jul 25, 2017 20:12
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I don't know if you can criticize the Democrats for not being substantive and then criticize them for a non-substantive reason.ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:I don't know nor have met a single person who thinks positively of unions in the states of Arkansas, Oklahoma, Missouri, or Texas. I dunno, Pew has some pretty compelling numbers on the subject: http://www.people-press.org/2015/04/27/mixed-views-of-impact-of-long-term-decline-in-union-membership Those cross tabs are interesting. Most support in the Midwest, among low income people, young people and people of color, aka the groups Democrats failed to mobilize most in 2016. Democrazy fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Jul 25, 2017 |
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Jul 25, 2017 20:19
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WampaLord posted:To be fair, that's part of the game. You can't sit there and not clap, it's pure attack fodder for the next election. No one actually cares whether you clapped for another senator three years ago. That's just one of the Washington Consensus myths, like "you'll lose the election if you talk poo poo about dead veterans" and "you'll lose the election if you get caught on tape admitting to sexual assault". The fact of the matter is that they clapped because they see McCain as a co-worker, not an enemy. To them, politics is a job, and although McCain is on the other team, at the end of the day they're all just playing their roles and furthering their careers. No one wants to get frozen out of committee assignments and leadership positions because they once got caught being disrespectful to their fellow senators - even if they were senators from the other party.
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Jul 25, 2017 20:28
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Only a complete sociopath would not applaud another a senators fight with cancer, on the senate floor. Giving it more than 2 seconds consideration is a strong sign of being completely out of touch with humanity
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Jul 25, 2017 20:50
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Shuka posted:Only a complete sociopath would not applaud another a senators fight with cancer, on the senate floor. By this logic, senators aren't sociopaths, which we know for a fact isn't true
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Jul 25, 2017 20:51
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Shuka posted:Only a complete sociopath would not applaud another a senators fight with cancer, on the senate floor. What does it mean when you give less than 2 seconds consideration to a health care repeal?
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Jul 25, 2017 20:53
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A reminder that, much like only Nixon could go to China, democrats have been pretty effective at curtailing union power. Bill Clinton went all out to prevent the Labor Reform Bill on 1978: https://www.lawcha.org/2016/11/23/bill-clinton-remade-democratic-party-abandoning-unions-working-class-whites/ As governor Tim Kaine was in favor of right to work laws. Booker, Rahm Emanuel, etc. all are doing everything they can to support efforts to kill the remaining power that teacher unions have.
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Jul 25, 2017 20:57
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Shuka posted:Only a complete sociopath would not applaud another a senators fight with cancer, on the senate floor. You say that like pretty much every senator isn't a six foot tall pile of poo poo shaped like a human being.
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Jul 25, 2017 21:00
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WampaLord posted:To be fair, that's part of the game. You can't sit there and not clap, it's pure attack fodder for the next election.
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Jul 25, 2017 21:02
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people who think congress is some holy decorum of civility is lol af because this is an entirely recent development
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Jul 25, 2017 21:04
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Shuka posted:Only a complete sociopath would not applaud another a senators fight with cancer, on the senate floor. If they weren't completely out of touch with humanity, they'd show sympathy for cancer patients who aren't senators, instead of voting to revoke sick people's medical care.
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Jul 25, 2017 21:04
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None of them booed when they found out Ted Kennedy was dead. It's the equivalent of sports fans clapping for any injured player, no matter which team he was on. It's just something you do if you're a human. They all went on to vote against him, so why focus on the stupid symbolic politeness that society enforces on us? What will Dems gain from sitting there and not clapping? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWxX1qj2128 WampaLord fucked around with this message at 21:09 on Jul 25, 2017 |
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Jul 25, 2017 21:07
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WampaLord posted:None of them booed when they found out Ted Kennedy was dead. Maybe signaling that the time for civility is passed when you’re trying to kill millions of people.
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Jul 25, 2017 21:17
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WampaLord posted:None of them booed when they found out Ted Kennedy was dead. Well, if they hadn't clapped, then they wouldn't have been caught on camera clapping for a guy who came all the way from a hospital in Arizona to be the deciding vote in favor of advancing a bill for taking away healthcare for tens of millions of people. I don't think anyone should be wishing McCain was dead or anything, but there's no reason to cheer for what he did today either. Politics isn't sports; if McCain's team wins it's going to hurt a lot more people than just unlucky gamblers and disappointed fans.
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Jul 25, 2017 21:19
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