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MGs are less "Melt" and more "Erode." They're not a fast process.
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Aug 2, 2017 04:35
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aniviron posted:MGs are less "Melt" and more "Erode." They're not a fast process. To clarify, machine guns would be something I can fire while waiting to cool off. The lasers do the melting.
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Aug 2, 2017 05:34
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Tank Boy Ken posted:That Operation Caw caw caw This is amazing.
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Aug 2, 2017 06:05
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Delacroix posted:To clarify, machine guns would be something I can fire while waiting to cool off. The lasers do the melting. It's just way more important to spend your cooling-off time not losing your center torso. Staring in one direction only works with dakka...
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Aug 2, 2017 06:28
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Sigh, I knew I wasn't crazy about the MKII being p2w... it's sickens me every time I run across one more than seeing gold mechs...
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Aug 2, 2017 07:23
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KaoliniteMilkshake posted:This is amazing. A Youtube Commenter posted:I am confused what are you guys doing We didn't know, youtube guy. We didn't know. That loving Death Knell remains the dumbest thing ever.
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Aug 2, 2017 08:44
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Slayerjerman posted:Sigh, I knew I wasn't crazy about the MKII being p2w... it's sickens me every time I run across one more than seeing gold mechs... The p2w status of the MkII is vastly exaggerated in my experience. It's certainly a good mech but it's not leaps and bounds better than the other good mechs available.
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Aug 2, 2017 08:55
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Mr Wikstroem posted:The p2w status of the MkII is vastly exaggerated in my experience. It's certainly a good mech but it's not leaps and bounds better than the other good mechs available. The guy thinks PGI has secret code for the mechs that cost money that makes them take less damage.
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Aug 2, 2017 09:17
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I seem to recall there being a bug for a few mechs that kept arm hitboxes around after they were destroyed, transferring their damage to torso at half rate. Supposing it's purposeful would be less plausible if a leading dev hadn't implied he was ok with the perception of his game being 'pay2win' 
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Aug 2, 2017 09:29
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vorebane posted:I seem to recall there being a bug for a few mechs that kept arm hitboxes around after they were destroyed, transferring their damage to torso at half rate. Supposing it's purposeful would be less plausible if a leading dev hadn't implied he was ok with the perception of his game being 'pay2win' Wasn't that only for the Centurion? It was the thing that made it into an absolute tank and actually fun to play.
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Aug 2, 2017 09:37
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Fil5000 posted:Wasn't that only for the Centurion? It was the thing that made it into an absolute tank and actually fun to play. I think that was also the Marauder too. I seem to remember it being able to tank an ungodly amount of damage before those retarded resizings.
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Aug 2, 2017 09:46
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Skoll posted:I think that was also the Marauder too. I seem to remember it being able to tank an ungodly amount of damage before those retarded resizings. Geometry is king.
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Aug 2, 2017 10:07
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Delacroix posted:To my mind the idea is that they'd be a button I can hold down after melting chest armour in CQC, to keep damage up in the intervening cooling period. I had a match where I suicided from a meltdown wishing I had a heat less weapon on hand. I broke 900 damage but I think it emphasises my tendency of ending up in close quarters during the course of matches. Your cool down period should be spent huddled behind cover. As a Laser Boat, your job is vomiting high damage alphas at mid-range while using cover to mitigate or avoid any return fire. If you're finding yourself in CQC before the match has decisively swung toward one team, then you likely made a positional error. The solution to this isn't Machine Guns, it's positioning better so you don't get caught out. Mr Wikstroem posted:The p2w status of the MkII is vastly exaggerated in my experience. It's certainly a good mech but it's not leaps and bounds better than the other good mechs available. I mean, he's wrong about the MCII having some kind of magical damage reduction or hit-reg scrambler, but he's not wrong about why he feels that way. If you sat down and made an itemized list of everything you could want on an assault mech and then compared that list to the MCII, it would tick off every single box. Sure, it's not fabulously overpowered in any particular niche, but it has zero weakness to exploit which is... fairly unique among the assault class and makes it an unrivaled monster in QM games. Skippy McPants fucked around with this message at 10:13 on Aug 2, 2017 |
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Aug 2, 2017 10:10
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DancingShade posted:Geometry is king. Nah, Mounts are king, but Geometry is his queen.
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Aug 2, 2017 10:12
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Skippy McPants posted:Nah, Mounts are king, but Geometry is his queen. Your mounts end up where the geometry dictates  But yeah I get what you mean. One without the other is just a hollow shell.
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Aug 2, 2017 10:58
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Delacroix posted:To clarify, machine guns would be something I can fire while waiting to cool off. The lasers do the melting. In addition to what Skippy said, machine guns aren't made to be alternated with other weapons - they're heatless and have lots of ammo per ton, so you should be firing them constantly whenever you're looking at an enemy in range. Bind them to a thumb button and hold it down, or even macro them into a toggle like TAG. Of course when you fight in MG range, "keep staring at your enemy" isn't a great strategy compared to alpha-and-twist. That's the fundamental problem of MGs, and it's why they can only really be mixed with other low-cooldown weapons like the smaller sizes of autocannons, pulses, and SRMs - weapons where you can't do much twisting to begin with and so aren't losing much.
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Aug 2, 2017 11:10
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MGs are also good panic weapons, in that they instill completely unreasonable panic in a lot of people when combined with other harder hitting weapons. The psychological effect of hammering away constantly with your 2000 rounds is not to be underestimated. Especially useful in medium mech duels because the other person becomes a lot more likely to overheat and shut down at a bad time in a desperate attempt to get you to stop.
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Aug 2, 2017 11:18
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I'm out the loop. Are MGs still legit on lights to melt down unarmoured hulls?
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Aug 2, 2017 11:34
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Probably now more than ever. The new LMGs added in the last patch are easily the best iteration of the weapon system thanks to the 250m optimal range and reduced spread. They deal less damage, but you don't need to stand on top of your target for them to be effective. They're a good option for fast lights and mediums with a lot of ballistic hardpoints like the Viper or Phonix Hawk.
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Aug 2, 2017 11:50
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Skippy McPants posted:Probably now more than ever. The new LMGs added in the last patch are easily the best iteration of the weapon system thanks to the 250m optimal range and reduced spread. They deal less damage, but you don't need to stand on top of your target for them to be effective. SOUNDS LIKE FUN. CAN'T WAIT TO SHOOT SOME ROBOTS
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Aug 2, 2017 11:59
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Tank Boy Ken posted:That Operation Caw caw caw I forgot thermals looked good once. why did  get stoopid and take that away again?
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Aug 2, 2017 12:32
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Rysithusiku posted:I forgot thermals looked good once. why did You could see mechs across the map with the old Predator vision.
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Aug 2, 2017 12:37
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oh that's right. it was useful and couldn't figure out variable few distances. still can't really.
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Aug 2, 2017 12:42
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Fil5000 posted:We didn't know, youtube guy. We didn't know. That loving Death Knell remains the dumbest thing ever. I remember running around murdering all metal babies before that thing came out, and when it, the Yellow Wang, Illest Marmoset, and those terrible Dragons were the only premium robots. I don't miss old thermals being mandatory all the time, and after playing a bunch of PUBG, spotting robots in a game which mostly draws giant boxes on targets and also largely has giant neon colored robots. Of course, I also keep my graphics on suboptimal pretty settings in this game, because I still enjoy how it works. Has the dust cleared on post tech update refits? I've got a Top Dog and a whole mess of other assorted robots to refit, though I suppose I only really need a few to enjoy myself and get back in a groove.
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Aug 2, 2017 12:56
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Rysithusiku posted:oh that's right. it was useful and It wasn't just useful, you could use SweetFX or something similar to enhance it further and give yourself a huge advantage. They did kind of work out variable view distances because that's why the current thermal mode is basically pointless.
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Aug 2, 2017 12:59
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Fil5000 posted:It wasn't just useful, you could use SweetFX or something similar to enhance it further and give yourself a huge advantage. They did kind of work out variable view distances because that's why the current thermal mode is basically pointless. Daytime Forest Colony and Caustic Valley sometimes have horrible pea soup fog weather, and when that happens thermal is the only vision mode that doesn't make me strain my eyes to the point of getting an actual headache.
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Aug 2, 2017 16:34
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It's also great on maps that have a generally more limited sight line anyways (Mining Collective for example) as knowing your opponents heat level is really loving useful. A glowing white hot battlemaster is a perfect candidate to bum rush in a way that a cool one just isn't.
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Aug 2, 2017 17:27
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What's the skill tree for dummies guide?
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Aug 2, 2017 23:02
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Azuth0667 posted:What's the skill tree for dummies guide? I had no idea your "no ranting about Ish" thing would turn into a full on self imposed exile. I believe part of the skill tree meta is structure if sub 80 tons, armour if above. I plan on making out structure and armour in my Death Strike to take full advantage of the secret p2w code they put in it.
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Aug 2, 2017 23:12
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Azuth0667 posted:What's the skill tree for dummies guide? Here's one from Metamechs that I use.
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Aug 2, 2017 23:13
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Hexenritter posted:I had no idea your "no ranting about Ish" thing would turn into a full on self imposed exile. Other way around. Armor if lighter, structure if heavier.
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Aug 2, 2017 23:33
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E: ^^ Oh alright.Hexenritter posted:I had no idea your "no ranting about Ish" thing would turn into a full on self imposed exile. I lost that one, GM decided to take the side of the pro-ish faction. I'll be back to that thread after I finish catching up. Guns and structure then for my mediums and guns and armor for my awesomes. That looks idiot proof, its perfect. E: I take it the other trees are completely useless? Azuth0667 fucked around with this message at 23:37 on Aug 2, 2017 |
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Aug 2, 2017 23:33
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Rysithusiku posted:Other way around. Armor if lighter, structure if heavier. Oops
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Aug 2, 2017 23:38
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Azuth0667 posted:E: ^^ Oh alright. Just use the tree that works for the playe style you're going for. Lights do well packing on some extra arty strikes for example. Just about everyone does good getting radar derp. Armor and structure can be worthwhile if you are running a tanky build, have the points to spare, or have existing quirks that get boosted as well. Operations is good if you have a ton of heat sinks, otherwise firepower is better for reducing heat. Firepower is over all really good for helping with recycle time, range, etc. Jump jets seems kinda useless. Mobility is worthwhile if the mech has enough native acceleration to help out - a dire wolf with full mobility still isa loving semi-mobile brick. Some think that it's worth dumping the points in to make mechs with bad accel/decel a little better, some think it's not worth the minor bump.
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Aug 2, 2017 23:54
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NihilCredo's shortlist is something i've been using. NihilCredo posted:Quick and dirty guide to the skill tree, will be good enough for 90% of all mechs: I did want to ask why the 12/20 guideline on heatsinks? is that just math/return on investment for impact?
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Aug 3, 2017 08:28
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Cool Run is +2% dissipation per node, and it scales with your heatsinks, so more DHS means more heat dissipation means more value from Cool Run. I disagree with his advice on the tree, though. In my opinion, the Ops tree has three options depending on your needs. 0 Points: only for mechs that never run close to their heat-cap. 13 Points: standard on most mechs. 17 Points: if you're running something blazing hot. It's a steep price because the unlock ratio on that last Cool Run is awful, requiring three junk nodes (Heat Containment is poo poo), but sometimes you need every scrap of heat management you can get.
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Aug 3, 2017 09:28
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Just lol if you aren't maxing out armor and structure on every mech.
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Aug 3, 2017 11:25
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DancingShade posted:Just lol if you aren't maxing out armor and structure on every mech. Is it really worth to max out armor on mechs that don't have pre-existing armor quirks? Don't you get like only 6 extra armor on a 90 ton mech?
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Aug 3, 2017 14:30
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TjyvTompa posted:Is it really worth to max out armor on mechs that don't have pre-existing armor quirks? Don't you get like only 6 extra armor on a 90 ton mech? It's a little more than that - a bare minimum investment (13 nodes) will give you around +7 CT armor, completing the left side is +9, a full tree will give you +11 (and +25% structure). You will survive a couple of lasers more, which is far from inconsequential - and that's if they perfectly core your CT; if some other component goes first, that's extra armor bonuses you benefit from. Like I said, my general guideline is that I only skip armor entirely if the plan is to move around and hide and not get hit at all - which is basically restricted to reasonably mobile hill-humpers like Blackjacks or Ravens, or medium PPC / LRM supports. Not coincidentally, those are the same mechs where I intend to keep using XLs. As to 'is it really worth it', that question applies to pretty much every skill tree choice: what else would you spend those nodes on otherwise? E.g. a mixed ballistics/missiles loadout could see major benefits from the entire Firepower tree, while a PPC boat only really needs the heat gen nodes and the rest is extremely situational. Some pilots have no problem burning through consumables, so they only have like 75-80 nodes to play with, meaning they need to stick with the best return on investments. If you want to really sperg out over the optimal tree distribution, you should tackle it as a type of knapsack problem. Start with the cheapest picks that give the best returns (something like this, assuming you value Torso Speed highly, which is usually the case), then gradually add more 'expensive' nodes until you run out of points.
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Aug 3, 2017 16:38
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The relevent graph re: survivability. Having the effective HP of a mech 15-20 tons heavier seems pretty good to me!
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Aug 3, 2017 17:25
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