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Khisanth Magus posted:Agreed. The logical conclusion to all of this is that all classes should only have 2 buttons to press. Or maybe even 1. I was going to say a "combo" button and a "buff" button, but might as well make that buff automatically happen when available. Save people the trouble of pressing a second button. haha yeah dude that's exactly it, you nailed it great job 
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Aug 14, 2017 19:44
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Khisanth Magus posted:Agreed. The logical conclusion to all of this is that all classes should only have 2 buttons to press. Or maybe even 1. I was going to say a "combo" button and a "buff" button, but might as well make that buff automatically happen when available. Save people the trouble of pressing a second button. There's a massive difference between timing when to hit Rampart and the grand tactical decision of, after hitting Fast Blade, pressing Savage Blade instead of Fast Blade again. One of these is a meaningful gameplay decision. The other is busywork. Or, if you want it put another way, consider that consolidating buttons PvP style frees up 2-4 buttons for adding new moves later without cutting stuff like Stormblood did.
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Aug 14, 2017 19:47
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Red Red Blue posted:haha yeah dude that's exactly it, you nailed it great job Obviously Stones 1 through 4 should never have been consolidated, Scholars should seriously puzzle over whether to cast Ruin or Broil, and weaponskill classes should just have like twenty extra "deliver an attack with 100 potency. no combo bonus." skills littering their bars in order to increase choice and lower the skill floor.
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Aug 14, 2017 19:49
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Red Red Blue posted:How boring of a life must you lead that pressing 123 instead of 111 is somehow an exciting prospect Do me a solid and go load up Rift, a game that lets you macro your full rotation into 1 button. Go do that for a couple hours and then get back to me about how much fun you were having.
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Aug 14, 2017 19:50
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Also while we're at it, here's a steaming hot take for you guys: the restriction on role abilities is dumb and should be removed entirely. Having to swap out abilities depending on the encounter is tedious and adds nothing to the game.
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Aug 14, 2017 19:51
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Fister Roboto posted:Also while we're at it, here's a steaming hot take for you guys: the restriction on role abilities is dumb and should be removed entirely. Having to swap out abilities depending on the encounter is tedious and adds nothing to the game. There's way too many of them for that, I don't need 5 more buttons on my bar
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Aug 14, 2017 19:53
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ruta posted:As someone with arthritis issues, I'd really love if they gave the option to combine my combos so I could reclaim some keybinds and reach less. Playing melee is pretty hard on my hands compared to, say, BLM. But I honestly like playing DRG the most. It's a shame I can't play the job I like the most because some people seem to think that combining the melee combo somehow distracts from what makes the job fun. Serious response: I don't know much about arthritis but maybe a controller would help. It might produce additional issues I haven't thought of but it absolutely has zero reaching always
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Aug 14, 2017 19:55
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If you pruned and tuned the role abilities I'd be perfectly fine with just always having all six or whatever. Like it'd be pretty cool if Drain actually constituted a sizable self-heal such that it was somehow the correct move to use it in order to take pressure off your healers in an emergency.
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Aug 14, 2017 19:56
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Fister Roboto posted:Also while we're at it, here's a steaming hot take for you guys: the restriction on role abilities is dumb and should be removed entirely. Having to swap out abilities depending on the encounter is tedious and adds nothing to the game.
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Aug 14, 2017 19:57
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Khisanth Magus posted:Agreed. The logical conclusion to all of this is that all classes should only have 2 buttons to press. Or maybe even 1. I was going to say a "combo" button and a "buff" button, but might as well make that buff automatically happen when available. Save people the trouble of pressing a second button. That is not the logical conclusion at all and is a really dumb and reductive argument. Combo buttons are three buttons that are pretty much always pressed in sequential order one after another. This is not the same as "ALL BUTTONS ARE IDENTICAL!!" or automating an entire rotation or whatever. It is a feature that already exists in the game in fact and would exist already in single player optimally if macros didn't have the weird delay.
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Aug 14, 2017 19:57
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There are also combos in the game you just can't consolidate, such as the Dark Knight's damage combo. You'd NORMALLY use it in sequence every time, but you'd still want to retain the hypothetical ability to go Hard Slash -> Souleater -> Hard Slash - Souleater if for some reason you absolutely needed the most mp you could possibly get right now. Although, you COULD boil it down into two buttons: 1) Hard Slash -> Spinning Slash -> Power Slash 2) Syphon Strike -> Soul Eater So a DRK either presses 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 2 or spams 1 based on what they need. Similarly, you could consolidate a monk's basic combo buttons down from 9 to like... 6, or 4, I think?
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Aug 14, 2017 20:00
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Ffxiv's combat is not its strong point but I have a solution Sandwichmancer 1 is bread, 2 is pizza dough 3 is ham 4 is pepperoni 5 is cheese and you can change what kind of cheese using a ninja mudra style system where you combine fungus strains, temperature, and time together 6 is pineapple 7 is chicken 8 is tomato, or Tomato sauce if you use an ogcd buff on 9 called crush 0 is lettuce The best rotation starts with 2 9 8 5(mozz style) 6. Make sure to use distraction before casting pineapple because it causes a lot of aggro. E: thats the best rotation but all sandwiches are valid of course. A lot of people will do less than optimal rotations by choice depending on their taste Jinh fucked around with this message at 20:13 on Aug 14, 2017 |
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Aug 14, 2017 20:02
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Failboattootoot posted:Do me a solid and go load up Rift, a game that lets you macro your full rotation into 1 button. Go do that for a couple hours and then get back to me about how much fun you were having. I think that's more on Rift being kind of a lousy game more than the ability to macro my full rotation into 1 button
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Aug 14, 2017 20:05
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Jinh posted:change what kind of cheese using a ninja mudra style system where you combine yeast strains, temperature, and time together 
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Aug 14, 2017 20:05
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Samael posted:I don't really care if you hit 1-1-1 or 1-2-3 because I just click my skills anyway. 
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Aug 14, 2017 20:06
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He endorsed pineapple on pizza, it's clear he has no idea about anything.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:07
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hot take: pineapple on pizza is good, but only when the sweetness and acidity are used to cut an extremely fatty and savory topping like bacon. a cheese-and-pineapple pizza is gross, yes.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:08
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I actually started that post out as beermancer but latched onto the sandwich thing later, oops
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Aug 14, 2017 20:08
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Fister Roboto posted:Also while we're at it, here's a steaming hot take for you guys: the restriction on role abilities is dumb and should be removed entirely. Having to swap out abilities depending on the encounter is tedious and adds nothing to the game. This, I feel, is a result of the foolish decision to make niche/situational/'fun'/utility abilities (Think crutch, drain, rescue, even things like reprisal) compete with mandatory abilities that were simply Kit Pruned like Rampart, Provoke, Protect, Esuna, etc.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:09
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Reiterpallasch posted:hot take: pineapple on pizza is good, but only when the sweetness and acidity are used to cut an extremely fatty and savory topping like bacon. a cheese-and-pineapple pizza is gross, yes. Spicy takes are ok, I forgot to mention the various other OGCDs like oregano, mayonnaise and cayenne. And it's your sandwich man, do what you want with it.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:11
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Fister Roboto posted:Also while we're at it, here's a steaming hot take for you guys: the restriction on role abilities is dumb and should be removed entirely. Having to swap out abilities depending on the encounter is tedious and adds nothing to the game. Unironically agreed. They should trim the list to keep the best or most essential abilities, give you them at all times, and remove the rest. Role skills are either dumb poo poo like break, or 100% mandatory like lucid dreaming, or pass/fail buttons like esuna.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:15
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I already hate mashing one button on both mch and smn, so consolidated combos sound bad to me. Also I like the tactile memory of knowing when to weave what - easier to go 1 > Q + E > 2 > R + F > 3, than 1 > Q + E > 1 > oops I hit q+e again on instinct because the boss shot a laser and I got distracted
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Aug 14, 2017 20:18
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Sandwichmancer will definitely work with the pvp macro style system too where you can just hit Italian seasoning and it applies all the right spices to make it.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:19
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Jinh posted:Sandwichmancer will definitely work with the pvp macro style system too where you can just hit Italian seasoning and it applies all the right spices to make it. The next healer better be delicatessen. Weave your lettuce and tomato between breads to maximize your healing and buffing output. Herbs and seasonings will enhance the flavour of any basic healing sandwich, but you can delve into the forbidden arts of cold cuts to bring forth the ultimate flavour in your darkest hour.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:22
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You don't have to end your combos with bread if you start with bread, open faced sandwiches to just as much damage as closed-face ones The crush ogcd works on all toppings and if you just crush chicken a bunch you can make pink slime and just start busting out chicken nuggets, it's OK man we've all had the 2 am craving we know how it is
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Aug 14, 2017 20:23
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Countblanc posted:There's way too many of them for that, I don't need 5 more buttons on my bar Yeah but I just wind up having most of them on my hotbar anyway, it's just that not all of them are active at a time. I'll swap out voke/shirk/reprisal for ultimatum/anticipation/awareness depending on whether I'm doing 8-person or 4-person content. vOv fucked around with this message at 20:27 on Aug 14, 2017 |
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Aug 14, 2017 20:24
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Having to swap role actions is tedious as hell and I can't help but resent the game taking away 4 of my abilities and holding them hostage against essential poo poo
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Aug 14, 2017 20:29
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Fister Roboto posted:I also really like abilities transforming into others in pvp, like how DWT trance becomes Deathflare. You literally can't use Deathflare without using DWT first, and you can't use DWT again while Deathflare is available, so why should they be two separate buttons? it's bullshit that a wanderer's minuet button doesn't turn into pitch perfect while WM is up and it's bullshit that i can't figure out a macro to do that
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Aug 14, 2017 20:30
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Sandwichmancer is already in the game you idiots, it's called arcanist. Their weapon is literally a word sandwich.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:31
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Ok now I'm hungry from reading this thread
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Aug 14, 2017 20:32
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Fister Roboto posted:Sandwichmancer is already in the game you idiots, it's called arcanist. Their weapon is literally a word sandwich. A black mage's rotation is a sandwich because it has astral 'meat' between umbral 'bread'.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:32
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there's also an move to cut off the crust if you're gonna be a big baby about it, but it gives you a big marker above your head that everyone can see 
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Aug 14, 2017 20:34
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My ideal dragoon rotation takes the hardest parts of the ARR, HW, and SB rotations and mashes them together into an unplayable nightmare with a massive skill ceiling and still worse dps than samurai
cheetah7071 fucked around with this message at 20:48 on Aug 14, 2017 |
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Aug 14, 2017 20:38
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cheetah7071 posted:My ideal dragoon rotations takes the hardest parts of the ARR, HW, and SB rotations and mashes them together into an unplayable nightmare with a massive skill ceiling and still worse dps than samurai Not only does SE read this thread, but they have a time machine too!
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Aug 14, 2017 20:42
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cheetah7071 posted:My ideal dragoon rotations takes the hardest parts of the ARR, HW, and SB rotations and mashes them together into an unplayable nightmare with a massive skill ceiling and still worse dps than samurai SMN and DRG ramp time is way, WAY too long when every major boss has some kind of disengage/knock the entire party down/mechanics dance horsecrap.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:47
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Rainuwastaken posted:Not only does SE read this thread, but they have a time machine too! drg isn't an unplayable nightmare after 4.05 and I'm not convinced anybody complaining about it has played it in anything other than dungeons since the changes
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Aug 14, 2017 20:48
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The important thing is that if you toast your sandwich, a million current and former Subway employees show up and drag you to the seven hells.
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Aug 14, 2017 20:51
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Samael posted:I don't really care if you hit 1-1-1 or 1-2-3 because I just click my skills anyway. look man we're all having fun here but some things are just too much just beyond the pale
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Aug 14, 2017 20:51
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For the record, this is my ideal drg nightmare: Remove Fang & Claw and Wheeling Thrust Bring back Phlebotomize Restore Heavy Thrust, Disembowel, Chaos Thrust, and Phlebotomize to their ARR rotations Full Thrust now has a randomized positional when done as a combo while BotD is up (work it into the job gauge somehow) Full Thrust and Chaos Thrust extend BotD by 15 seconds (15 might be too generous for my nightmare tbh. 12-13 is about as low as it can go without ruining everything though) Geirskogul has a 10s CD and consumes 10 points of BotD meter, just like in HW Geirskogul now gives dragon eyes. Using Geirskogul four times without dropping BotD puts you into LotD LotD always has a 25 second duration regardless of the BotD timer. During LotD, Geirskogul turns into Nastrond and the boost to Jump and Spineshatter Dive becomes +100% instead of +30% Maybe eliminate Mirage Dive. Or keep it, idc Dragon Sight now lasts until broken (with a 1-2 second grace period). The CD is shortened (to 30s?) to compensate I would be the only one playing this class, but I would love every second of it
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Aug 14, 2017 20:55
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cheetah7071 posted:For the record, this is my ideal drg nightmare: Can you put this in sandwich terms? We're on a (toasted) roll here
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