The democrats are a waste

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B	77	25.50%
K	160	52.98%
M	65	21.52%
Total:	229 votes

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Calibanibal: Aug 25, 2015

personally i agree with sneakster that nazis are good, and i agree with peachfart that leftists are racist. jut my 2 $

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:35

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 23:41

Son of Thunderbeast: Sep 21, 2002

Medicare for all (who pass the one-drop test)

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:37

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Son of Thunderbeast posted:

Looking at their post history, I just can't help but wonder whose parachute account Sneakster is. All their posts stink of attempts to try and get leftists (as they imagine them) to admit to something or slip up and say something stupid or heinous that they're convinced we truly believe, but it just comes off as totally disconnected from reality and logically unhinged. I also get the impression that they're very self-assured in their own cleverness, which is why my best guess is JC (but also maybe MIGF)

My money's on MiGF. Not pedantic enough for fishmech, not clever enough for amergin.

WampaLord posted:

Yes, shocking, there are idiots in this thread, there are idiots in every thread. We try to ignore them.

Don't Doxx me brocialist.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:40

Matt Zerella: Oct 7, 2002; Norris'es are back baby. It's good again. Awoouu (fox Howl)

Sneakster posted:

What is "the left" in any organizational sense? Serious question. If you look at a lot of people's problem with "the left" its taking the blatant corruption and contradictions of the Democratic party at face value.

If you accept the Democratic party as "the left" in any meaningful sense then you have to accept living in reality that dismantling welfare, ramping up the drug war, 3 strikes, etc, are facets of "the left". What racial justice has the Democratic party facilitated since the 90s? Cause besides not dropping slurs publicly, the Democratic party has certainly been willing to do attack minorities in every feasible sense outside of public use of slurs. Not banning Menthol cigarettes and not being Republican is about as much as they've done.

I don't think the Dems do, but:

Hmm.

The Democrats aren't "the left" and you are incredibly dumb. Why don't you gently caress off?

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:40

Sneakster: Jul 13, 2017; by R. Guyovich

WampaLord posted:

Yes, shocking, there are idiots in this thread, there are idiots in every thread. We try to ignore them.

loving how can you miss the point harder?

They're a center-right party at best.

You know that. I know that. Stupid, desperate people in a shambling economy willing to join up with the only assholes reaching out to them don't know that.

NewForumSoftware posted:

the left in America literally doesn't exist

90% of the people in this thread are registered Democrats who gladly voted for Hillary against the evil Donald Trump because they've deluded themselves into thinking either party represents anything but the interests of the ultrawealthy

To be fair, congress is far more conservative than the public, also its full of rich octogenarians who grew up in the cold war.

Son of Thunderbeast posted:

Looking at their post history, I just can't help but wonder whose parachute account Sneakster is. All their posts stink of attempts to try and get leftists (as they imagine them) to admit to something or slip up and say something stupid or heinous that they're convinced we truly believe, but it just comes off as totally disconnected from reality and logically unhinged. I also get the impression that they're very self-assured in their own cleverness, which is why my best guess is JC (but also maybe MIGF)

Not quite that cynical or clever. It's not about getting people to slip up and admit something. It's about the internal feeling of revulsion and ugliness for having considered the thought.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:42

WampaLord: Jan 14, 2010

Sneakster posted:

You know that. I know that. Stupid, desperate people in a shambling economy willing to join up with the only assholes reaching out to them don't know that.

But you and I (and the rest of the thread) are the only people here! We're not talking to anyone but each other in here! So drop the act or gimmick and just talk like normal people.

Do you think anything you post here is making a difference or something? We're all just discussing poo poo, I use it as practice to refine my arguments, I don't give myself a pat on the back for accomplishing anything.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:44

BadOptics: Sep 11, 2012

Son of Thunderbeast posted:

Looking at their post history, I just can't help but wonder whose parachute account Sneakster is. All their posts stink of attempts to try and get leftists (as they imagine them) to admit to something or slip up and say something stupid or heinous that they're convinced we truly believe, but it just comes off as totally disconnected from reality and logically unhinged. I also get the impression that they're very self-assured in their own cleverness, which is why my best guess is JC (but also maybe MIGF)

Brainiac 5

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:45

Calibanibal: Aug 25, 2015

braniac 5/efectronica is like 1 million times more insane than this sneaker guy

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:45

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

WampaLord posted:

But you and I (and the rest of the thread) are the only people here! We're not talking to anyone but each other in here! So drop the act or gimmick and just talk like normal people.

Do you think anything you post here is making a difference or something? We're all just discussing poo poo, I use it as practice to refine my arguments, I don't give myself a pat on the back for accomplishing anything.

Speak for yourself buddy, covok personally halted an execution with a single letter.

Calibanibal posted:

braniac 5/efectronica is like 1 million times more insane than this sneaker guy

There really needs to be a bad poster database that lays out each gimmick.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:51

WampaLord: Jan 14, 2010

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

Speak for yourself buddy, covok personally halted an execution with a single letter.

He's a good kid with his heart in the right place, I can't hate him for not being a full on D&D nihilist yet.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:51

Sneakster: Jul 13, 2017; by R. Guyovich

Matt Zerella posted:

The Democrats aren't "the left" and you are incredibly dumb. Why don't you gently caress off?

I specifically said they aren't in the post you quoted, at least twice explicitly. People that don't identify with the left might actually make the mistake of assuming the Democrats represent the left. I'm not on the right, and I assume the Republicans represent the right.

WampaLord posted:

But you and I (and the rest of the thread) are the only people here! We're not talking to anyone but each other in here! So drop the act or gimmick and just talk like normal people.

Do you think anything you post here is making a difference or something? We're all just discussing poo poo, I use it as practice to refine my arguments, I don't give myself a pat on the back for accomplishing anything.

Thats the point I'm making: what organizational outreach is there to people who would be amenable to the left, because the Democrats aren't cutting it, but they're still the face of the left for a lot of people.

moths posted:

I hate that Hillary calling them "deplorable" gave them a permission slip to act deplorably.

I assume it wasn't a calculated move, but its probably a bad idea to tell people who complain about political correctness to embrace being an rear end in a top hat.

Calibanibal posted:

braniac 5/efectronica is like 1 million times more insane than this sneaker guy

Who were those guys? I missed a lot of forums history since the end of LF and only remember a few.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:55

WampaLord: Jan 14, 2010

Sneakster posted:

Thats the point I'm making: what organizational outreach is there to people who would be amenable to the left, because the Democrats aren't cutting it, but they're still the face of the left for a lot of people.

The DSA or other local leftist groups who are trying to run leftist candidates. Try to push the Dems as hard left as possible by primarying their asses.

My goal is for the Dems to not be a waste anymore.

E: VVV That's kind of the other purpose of this thread, shitheads like JC stop me from falling down that path by exposing the terrible "logic" of the centrist neoliberal mindset.

WampaLord fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Aug 22, 2017

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:56

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

WampaLord posted:

He's a good kid with his heart in the right place, I can't hate him for not being a full on D&D nihilist yet.

It takes an election cycle or two for this place to turn you into one, but it is inevitable. I was an idealistic leftist in 2004 when I could first vote. I had become a dirty incrementalist centrist by the end of Obama's terms. Beware the slippery slope!

# ? Aug 22, 2017 20:59

ugh its Troika: May 2, 2009; by FactsAreUseless

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

Speak for yourself buddy, covok personally halted an execution with a single letter.

There really needs to be a bad poster database that lays out each gimmick.

Effectronica's behaviour isn't a gimmick though, he is genuinely that unpleasent a person

# ? Aug 22, 2017 21:03

Sneakster: Jul 13, 2017; by R. Guyovich

WampaLord posted:

E: VVV That's kind of the other purpose of this thread, shitheads like JC stop me from falling down that path by exposing the terrible "logic" of the centrist neoliberal mindset.

Is JC actually fake or real? Cause he's consistently dedicated to being an amoral sociopath, but seems a little too composed to real.

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

It takes an election cycle or two for this place to turn you into one, but it is inevitable. I was an idealistic leftist in 2004 when I could first vote. I had become a dirty incrementalist centrist by the end of Obama's terms. Beware the slippery slope!

How did you come to the conclusion that less needs to be done rather than more?

Because seriously, Sanders primary after the Obama primary I really think has significantly changed what is tolerated in a candidate as far as them being allowed to use subtlety or ambiguity in terms of policy goals.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 21:13

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Sneakster posted:

How did you come to the conclusion that less needs to be done rather than more?

Because all improvements are incremental, and aren't created in full form. :ssh:

Also, incremental improvements doesn't mean Less. it means small improvements that add up in time. How is this even arguable.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 21:30

Sneakster: Jul 13, 2017; by R. Guyovich

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

Because all improvements are incremental, and aren't created in full form.

Also, incremental improvements doesn't mean Less. it means small improvements that add up in time. How is this even arguable.

I don't think think you're supposed to compromise your interests before the start of negotiating.

Edit: considering all the important legislation that's one significant bill that stands for years to decades at a time... no... you're dumb.

Sneakster fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Aug 22, 2017

# ? Aug 22, 2017 21:37

C. Everett Koop: Aug 18, 2008

NewForumSoftware posted:

this but about liberals

there's no redeeming liberals. find everyone who voted for abuela/hussein and drown them in their own blood.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 21:43

Sneakster: Jul 13, 2017; by R. Guyovich

C. Everett Koop posted:

there's no redeeming liberals. find everyone who voted for abuela/hussein and drown them in their own blood.

See? This guy gets it.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 21:45

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Sneakster posted:

I don't think think you're supposed to compromise your interests before the start of negotiating.

Edit: considering all the important legislation that's one significant bill that stands for years to decades at a time... no... you're dumb.

Name one piece of legislation that has lasted decades to generations that started fully formed, and didn't require incremental improvements,

On my side of the argument is :

medicare
medicaid
social security
workplace safety
LGBTQ equality
Tile IX
the list is quite long.

Sure, there may be legislation out there that is a one off, but over time it usually gets expanded, or killed. the ones that get expanded are the ones that are taken for granted as always having been a fully formed idea instead of having to be improved and fought for.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 21:49

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

C. Everett Koop posted:

there's no redeeming liberals. find everyone who voted for abuela/hussein and drown them in their own blood.

I would likely die to to blood loss before you were able to properly drown me with it. You're better off using ethically sourced animal blood and mass drowning pools. Have fun with the Nazi's when we're gone.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 21:55

Sneakster: Jul 13, 2017; by R. Guyovich

Incremental improvements to a program are not the same thing as encouraging the expectation that a politician should start from the position of trying to do the least possible.

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

Have fun with the Nazi's when we're gone.

It was real swell of you to destroy society to the point that they propped up and did everything possible to prevent reforms that could have prevented mass violence though.

Sneakster fucked around with this message at 21:58 on Aug 22, 2017

# ? Aug 22, 2017 21:55

Cerebral Bore: Apr 21, 2010; Fun Shoe

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

Name one piece of legislation that has lasted decades to generations that started fully formed, and didn't require incremental improvements,

The National Health Service Act of 1946, which incidentally also created a healthcare system that you yanks can only dream of.

But that's kinda besides the point because incrementalism as it works today isn't about taking small steps towards a final, defined goal, it's about stopping social programs from going any further than the bourg find acceptable.

EDIT: Which is also kinda besides the point in a way, because the only legitimate reason for ever adopting an incrementalist approach is if you can't reach your goal right now, and hence it can't be a political strategy in its own right.

Cerebral Bore fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Aug 22, 2017

# ? Aug 22, 2017 21:57

NewForumSoftware: Oct 8, 2016; by Lowtax

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

It takes an election cycle or two for this place to turn you into one, but it is inevitable. I was an idealistic leftist in 2004 when I could first vote. I had become a dirty incrementalist centrist by the end of Obama's terms. Beware the slippery slope!

just lol if you've been paying attention to American politics for a decade and have come to any conclusion that isn't rooted deeply in cynicism and hopelessness

double lol at unironically identifying as an "incrementalist centrist" as if that's something that's laudable

maybe if you're completely ignorant of resource depletion, climate change and wealth inequality this sort of stuff would be understandable. as is it's just purestrain idiocy

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:01

WampaLord: Jan 14, 2010

Cerebral Bore posted:

But that's kinda besides the point because incrementalism as it works today isn't about taking small steps towards a final, defined goal, it's about stopping social programs from going any further than the bourg find acceptable.

EDIT: Which is also kinda besides the point in a way, because the only legitimate reason for ever adopting an incrementalist approach is if you can't reach your goal right now, and hence it can't be a political strategy in its own right.

Exactly correct.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:03

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Cerebral Bore posted:

The National Health Service Act of 1946, which incidentally also created a healthcare system that you yanks can only dream of.

But that's kinda besides the point because incrementalism as it works today isn't about taking small steps towards a final, defined goal, it's about stopping social programs from going any further than the bourg find acceptable.

EDIT: Which is also kinda besides the point in a way, because the only legitimate reason for ever adopting an incrementalist approach is if you can't reach your goal right now, and hence it can't be a political strategy in its own right.

Wow, you couldn't even find a piece of American legislation.

I'll take that as admission of how obviously stupid you are.

Also, now that we have figured out that I am personally responsibility for the existebce of Nazis, maybe you can pass a fully formed bill that will fix the problem forever.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:06

NewForumSoftware: Oct 8, 2016; by Lowtax

still laughing at the idea that you identify as a "centrist incrementalist" and don't understand that you're unironically defending the status quo in a country with legalized slavery and children forced to eat rats

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:08

Sneakster: Jul 13, 2017; by R. Guyovich

Slavery would have ended on its own. Makes U think.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:08

NewForumSoftware: Oct 8, 2016; by Lowtax

Also laughing at "it's inevitable that you ends up like this... as an idealist from 2004" like the people you're talking to weren't of voting age then and you're the only one older than 30 on this internet forum

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:10

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Sir, why are you yelling at thescarecrow you just finished constructing.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:12

NewForumSoftware: Oct 8, 2016; by Lowtax

My name is Heck Yes! Loam! and I enjoy posting about how incrementalist centrism is the logical conclusion of a person's political development.

If you disagree with this you're a literal child

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:13

Sneakster: Jul 13, 2017; by R. Guyovich

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

Sir, why are you yelling at thescarecrow you just finished constructing.

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

Also, now that we have figured out that I am personally responsibility for the existebce of Nazis, maybe you can pass a fully formed bill that will fix the problem forever.

We've got a growing fascist movement with people who dream of their big break to make it into Wal-Mart. Centrist incrementalism isn't going to solve this poo poo.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:15

NewForumSoftware: Oct 8, 2016; by Lowtax

Sneakster posted:

Centrist incrementalism isn't going to solve this poo poo.

spoiler alert: centrists don't actually want to solve poo poo, thats why they call themselves centrists

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:16

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

NewForumSoftware posted:

Also laughing at "it's inevitable that you ends up like this... as an idealist from 2004" like the people you're talking to weren't of voting age then and you're the only one older than 30 on this internet forum

Ehh, I said you end up being a nihilist. Not a centrist. I'm not wrong.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:21

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Sneakster posted:

We've got a growing fascist movement with people who dream of their big break to make it into Wal-Mart. Centrist incrementalism isn't going to solve this poo poo.

Maybe you can scare them away with some of the extra blood you have after drowning me in it. That will surely fix it.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:23

Cerebral Bore: Apr 21, 2010; Fun Shoe

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

Wow, you couldn't even find a piece of American legislation.

I'll take that as admission of how obviously stupid you are.

Also, now that we have figured out that I am personally responsibility for the existebce of Nazis, maybe you can pass a fully formed bill that will fix the problem forever.

Well, at least you're smart enough to realize that the jig's up when somebody points out how hollow your bad excuse for a political strategy actually is, but your insults need some work.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:23

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Cerebral Bore posted:

Well, at least you're smart enough to realize that the jig's up when somebody points out how hollow your bad excuse for a political strategy actually is, but your insults need some work.

I've never been very good with insults. Too centrist.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:24

NewForumSoftware: Oct 8, 2016; by Lowtax

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

Ehh, I said you end up being a nihilist. Not a centrist. I'm not wrong.

Yes everyone over the age of 30 who pays attentions to politics is a nihilist, which is why you identify as a centrist incrementalist

really putting together some barn burner ideas here, got any hot takes to enlighten us with today? preferable without turning into a "you'll miss me when the nazis are here" gigantic baby like you'd do anything other than collect a paycheck from one

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:25

Sneakster: Jul 13, 2017; by R. Guyovich

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

Maybe you can scare them away with some of the extra blood you have after drowning me in it. That will surely fix it.

Maybe if they drown you instead it'll achieve incremental satiation for bloodlust over a collapsing status quo.

NewForumSoftware posted:

Yes everyone over the age of 30 who pays attentions to politics is a nihilist, which is why you identify as a centrist incrementalist

"George Orwell� posted:

Here you come upon the important fact that every revolutionary opinion draws part of its strength from a secret conviction that nothing can be changed

NewForumSoftware posted:

preferable without turning into a "you'll miss me when the nazis are here" gigantic baby like you'd do anything other than collect a paycheck from one

He'll be a responsible adult unlike antifa and Berniebros and tell them to cut it out.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:28

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 23:41

Cerebral Bore: Apr 21, 2010; Fun Shoe

Heck Yes! Loam! posted:

I've never been very good with insults. Too centrist.

Smooth brains lead to slow wit, yes.

# ? Aug 22, 2017 22:30

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