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orange juche posted:High performance USDM as well as cheap sports cars have H pattern shifters. Almost all the middle of the road poo poo is either traditional automatic or DCT. (Dont ever buy a car with DCT, the transmissions are 10k+ to repair) I don't like the sound of any of this. Is that the current state of affairs? Is car tech regressing? In that American sportcars are now going back to stick and pedal, or did they never really deviate?
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Sep 25, 2017 21:54
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It's mostly European weirdness that you can only get with expensive DCTs. American and Japanese sports cars are usually six speed standards, and sometimes offer an at-worst okay five or six speed automatic. The automatics in things like the Toyota 86 and the new MX-5s are actually pretty decent.
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Sep 25, 2017 22:01
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American sports cars such as they are have always had an H pattern option. Econoboxes havent in a while though. I know my MX5 has standard manual, but I cant think of really any asian cars sold in the US that dont cost a shitpot of money that are available in manual from the showroom floor. Might be able to special order one from the manufacturers web site? I dont really buy new cars though so that probably colors my experience.
orange juche fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Sep 25, 2017 |
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Sep 25, 2017 22:03
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thankfully I'll be driving old lovely 90s cars until my death so I should be ok
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Sep 25, 2017 22:11
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orange juche posted:American sports cars such as they are have always had an H pattern option. Econoboxes havent in a while though. I know my MX5 has standard manual, but I cant think of really any asian cars sold in the US that dont cost a shitpot of money that are available in manual from the showroom floor. Might be able to special order one from the manufacturers web site? I dont really buy new cars though so that probably colors my experience. that isn't true. you can get a 5 or 6 speed in pretty much any of the low end cars(golf, cruze, sonic, focus, civic, impreza, mazda 3, etc). they probably just aren't as common as they were 20-30 years ago.
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Sep 25, 2017 22:19
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This was a long time ago but I remember automatics always being $2,000 or so more than manual, for non-econo boxes
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Sep 25, 2017 22:21
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For my challenger it was an extra 2500 if I wanted it. 2-3k is pretty standard across the board for a standard auto.
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Sep 25, 2017 22:25
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Nostalgia4Dogges posted:This was a long time ago but I remember automatics always being $2,000 or so more than manual, for non-econo boxes I remember when the GTO was out, the manual was a $2000 option. Manuals aren't always better. The 6-speed E60 M5 was a steaming pile of shoehorned poo poo. The 7-speed SMG was much better, because it was designed along with the engine.
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Sep 25, 2017 22:45
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I don't think anyone is saying manuals are better with current tech. I mean 10+ years ago manual was marketed as having better MPG. It's mostly nostalgia and what we're used to. I just like having the control, especially through canyons and such, and it makes driving slow poo poo econoboxes kind of fun
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Sep 25, 2017 22:52
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Well, manuals are still better for a lot of things. Control being the big one. Cost, repair simplicity (versus auto), sheer fun just a few more. If you require your driving appliance to make your forward conveyance as sterile as possible, go for the cheap auto option. Apparently the Porsche PDK and the new alfa romeo transmissions are barely disguised sequentials which I could get behind that. I drove a lancer once with a sequential and that was just loving balls to the walls amazing.
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Sep 25, 2017 23:00
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I assume it's still the standard....everywhere else in the world. Control, hills, snow...though I assume auto tech has caught up
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Sep 25, 2017 23:06
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not caring here posted:Well, manuals are still better for a lot of things. Control being the big one. Cost, repair simplicity (versus auto), sheer fun just a few more. If you require your driving appliance to make your forward conveyance as sterile as possible, go for the cheap auto option. The Porsche PDK is hardly a sequential manual, it has two shafts with even and odd gears for one, it's basically a slightly less stupid DCT. If you want a reason to hate a dual clutch box, do something it doesn't expect and watch it freak as it tries to compensate. If you are cruising along in normal driving mode and then decide to jump 2 gears and put the pedal to the floor, you can't do that, because it isn't designed to jump gears, so it will hang for a second or 2 while it tries to figure out what to do. True manuals are the only thing that can do that.
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Sep 25, 2017 23:16
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Nostalgia4Dogges posted:Can you still find traditional stick and pedal cars? I assume all high performance ones have some fancy paddle shifting etc. My Focus ST has one, as does the RS. Mercedes moved to automatics for their US market entirely a few years ago, but most mid-range sports cars and performance cars in the US still come with one, at least as an option. Also Mazdas, for some reason.
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Sep 25, 2017 23:26
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psydude posted:My Focus ST has one, as does the RS. Mercedes moved to automatics for their US market entirely a few years ago, but most mid-range sports cars and performance cars in the US still come with one. Also Mazdas, for some reason. I know they exist, but I've never once seen a manual Mercedes. Would trip me out Same goes for bigger trucks outside of semis and such obv
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Sep 25, 2017 23:27
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A guy at my last company had a C63 with a manual, but I think it was the last model year where they offered it. e: I think the current M3 comes with one, also. Not sure about the M5. BMW's been better about keeping it alive on their coupes and smaller sedans.
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Sep 25, 2017 23:28
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orange juche posted:The Porsche PDK is hardly a sequential manual, it has two shafts with even and odd gears for one, it's basically a slightly less stupid DCT. If you want a reason to hate a dual clutch box, do something it doesn't expect and watch it freak as it tries to compensate. If you are cruising along in normal driving mode and then decide to jump 2 gears and put the pedal to the floor, you can't do that, because it isn't designed to jump gears, so it will hang for a second or 2 while it tries to figure out what to do. True manuals are the only thing that can do that. I'd only read that about the PDK, but a quick google gave a cross section of the box and that is nothing at all like a sequential. Like, not even close. It'd be a cold day in hell that I'd pay 8k+ for a thing that does a worse job at shifting gears than I can. Well, it'd probably be better than me in a straight line dash, but I don't live my life a quarter mile at a time.
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Sep 25, 2017 23:30
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It's also nice to be the only person among my group of North American coworkers who doesn't destroy the clutch in the rental car every time we go to Europe.
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Sep 25, 2017 23:33
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yeah but being the only manual driver seems to backfire more than anything lol @ you dudes stationed or deployed abroad that got voluntold duty driver and such because you were the only one that drove manual
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Sep 25, 2017 23:34
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I honestly don't mind it, since I usually take public transit every time I go out drinking overseas. When I was deployed, I was one of a handful of people in the unit who could drive a manual, which meant while I was on BAF I was usually able to sequester one of the pickups at my construction site for the entire day without waiting for a driver. It pissed off the battalion since they couldn't ferry people over to Disney to go shopping or to salsa class.
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Sep 25, 2017 23:38
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There was this old heap of poo poo truck in our motor pool at benning, that they assumed was wrecked because no one could get it to move. Turns out it was some old manual, so someone who could drive a manual went, still couldn't do it. It was really, REALLY old and it either had a constant mesh gearbox, or the synchros had all been stripped. She was a rough ride, but we got her there, double clutching and all. No one knew where the fucker had come from, no one knew who it belonged to or how long it had been there. Just went to the central motorpool where I assumed it got auctioned off for scrap. I used to get tagged for driving in Korea a lot, and it sure as poo poo beat sitting out in the freezing loving cold in the field yet again for no good reason.
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Sep 25, 2017 23:45
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I always think I was in some cold situations, braved some elements, then I remember dudes are training in Korea Double clutching was the standard up until a certain point yeah? When did we get synchros
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Sep 25, 2017 23:47
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQ1pxgeKwVc
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Sep 25, 2017 23:50
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part of the problem is that dealers just do not carry any variety. high end/low end trim of a car in white, silver and black. you might find a colorful version of a sporty car but otherwise if you want something different youre probably going to be ordering from the factory and waiting a month or two. when i bought my Fusion a few years ago there was precisely 1 in the United States in stock that matched what I wanted.
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Sep 25, 2017 23:59
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Nostalgia4Dogges posted:I always think I was in some cold situations, braved some elements, then I remember dudes are training in Korea Yeah, until synchromesh came along, which I think it turned up in the 40s. You can probably wiki it, but basically its these rings helps the gears spinning at different speeds mesh much easier. Constant mesh gearboxes stayed around for quite a while though, because they are absurdly strong. Synchros tend to be a bit delicate if you're a scrub. In Australia they still use them in heavy haulage, they call them crash boxes. My dad taught my how to drive an old tractor of his, it was a sixteen speed constant mesh that had 2 gear levers, and to add insult to injury was a duel fuel kerosene/gasoline. It was an absolute prick of a thing to drive and to even warm up properly, but it was basically my tractor as he didn't give a gently caress if it blew up it was that old and lovely. Even with my crashing of gears an ungodly amount of times it was still alive when he sold the farm.
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Sep 26, 2017 00:00
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my scion xb had a 5 speed with a short shifter poo poo was incredibly fun on backroads
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Sep 26, 2017 00:39
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Slim Pickens posted:Looking for a new car for the wife, which morphed from 'hatchback under 9k' to 'car seats need to fit in the back nicely, also it doesn't have to be a hatchback, also maybe we should get a volt' The Volt is a good car, albeit pricey. Some goon in AI just picked up a 17.5 Leaf for like $16k somehow. Check the last page or two of the EV thread for details. IIRC there was some massive rebate from his power company.
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Sep 26, 2017 01:26
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Just get a Bolt. It's a normal-looking electric car that gets 200 miles range.
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Sep 26, 2017 01:29
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psydude posted:A guy at my last company had a C63 with a manual, but I think it was the last model year where they offered it. 1, 2, 3 and 4 series has a manual option. 5, 6 and 7 do not.
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Sep 26, 2017 01:38
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psydude posted:Just get a Bolt. It's a normal-looking electric car that gets 200 miles range. Yeah that's cool and good, but it's also 35k after a tax rebate
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Sep 26, 2017 01:46
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Ford forced an upgrade to get manual on the Fusion, I believe. It cost about $1700. I have no real interest in learning manual at this point. I guess I'm curious but I enjoy the comforts of a car that's fun as hell when I want it to be and also not a pain in the rear end in traffic as a daily driver. Adaptive cruise control owns.
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Sep 26, 2017 01:49
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Slim Pickens posted:Yeah that's cool and good, but it's also 35k after a tax rebate Then get a first generation Nissan Leaf. Your kids will be mercilessly made fun of every time you pick them up, but it's cheap.
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Sep 26, 2017 01:49
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R&M chat: I'm thinking Beth definitely took the clone option. I also think the story arc for this season is going to some how end up with her and Jerry at the citadel fighting against Evil Morty.
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Sep 26, 2017 01:52
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Nostalgia4Butts posted:my scion xb had a 5 speed with a short shifter The Soul is pretty fun for what it is. Mine has the 160hp 2.0L, and about as much torque. I've literally stuffed a 12" king size memory foam mattress (expanded) into the car, and it was tight, but every door closed. It's also lugged about 1500 pounds of river rock, multiple times, when I was redoing the flower beds when I owned a house. One of my few complaints is the lack of a spare tire. They give you a can of tire goop and a lovely air compressor. I carry a plug kit. Would probably cost me about $150 to get a matching full size spare.
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Sep 26, 2017 01:54
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psydude posted:R&M chat: I'm thinking they're going to leave that plot thread for next season. They sat on Evil Morty long enough to surprise the audience when he came back.
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Sep 26, 2017 02:05
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Either choice could have (conceivably) yielded that exact same ending. That said, knowing the sorts of things the show is known for and what the writers have done in the past, I'm willing to bet that she took the clone option. However, I wouldn't be at all surprised if the writers just didn't even revisit that storyline... as a storyline. I expect that they'll hang onto it as some sort of pocket ace, "here's Beth out of nowhere" plot element. And yeah, Evil Morty is a good example of that sort of thing. I have a feeling that Evil Morty's return is just a teaser that won't be expanded upon until next season. There's only one more episode to go in this one, so it seems fair to suppose that they'll either use that to create a cliffhanger or just ignore it entirely.
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Sep 26, 2017 02:45
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Naked Bear posted:Either choice could have (conceivably) yielded that exact same ending. That said, knowing the sorts of things the show is known for and what the writers have done in the past, I'm willing to bet that she took the clone option. However, I wouldn't be at all surprised if the writers just didn't even revisit that storyline... as a storyline. I expect that they'll hang onto it as some sort of pocket ace, "here's Beth out of nowhere" plot element. With how much it took to wring some kind of hypothetical "I love you" out of Rick, and how they drove home that Beth is exactly like her father, there's no loving way both of them just spontaneously say it at the end of the episode.
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Sep 26, 2017 03:46
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Diarrhea Elemental posted:With how much it took to wring some kind of hypothetical "I love you" out of Rick, and how they drove home that Beth is exactly like her father, there's no loving way both of them just spontaneously say it at the end of the episode. Maybe they're both clones now.
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Sep 26, 2017 04:08
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tastefully arranged labia posted:Maybe they're both clones now. I could see that. "gently caress it, let's clone ourselves and go to the dimension where you can be as drunk as you want and you never have to sleep or be hungover." *portal gun noise*
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Sep 26, 2017 04:09
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tastefully arranged labia posted:Maybe they're both clones now. Yeah, that's what I figured.
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Sep 26, 2017 04:19
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Sep 26, 2017 04:39
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