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Dr. Arbitrary
Mar 15, 2006

Bleak Gremlin

The Sausages posted:

This guy must be fun at parties.

Flat-Earthers are what I compare holocaust deniers to, to give them an idea of how retarded they sound (not that there's any getting through the layers of delusion), incidentally the Nazis had all sorts of batshit crazy ideas about cosmology to the point that they diverted men and radar equipment from the war effort to try and prove the Hollow Earth hypothesis.

But think if they'd have been right. We'd still be dealing with dinosaur riding Nazis here and there.

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Instant Sunrise
Apr 12, 2007


The manger babies don't have feelings. You said it yourself.

The Sausages posted:

This guy must be fun at parties.

Flat-Earthers are what I compare holocaust deniers to, to give them an idea of how retarded they sound (not that there's any getting through the layers of delusion), incidentally the Nazis had all sorts of batshit crazy ideas about cosmology to the point that they diverted men and radar equipment from the war effort to try and prove the Hollow Earth hypothesis.

The Theory of Relativity was considered "jewish science" and so it was rejected by the Nazis. According to officially approved Nazi science, everything in outer space was made out of ice and the Sun's gravity abruptly stopped at 3x the orbit of Neptune.

The Sausages
Sep 30, 2012

What do you want to do? Who do you want to be?

Instant Sunrise posted:

The Theory of Relativity was considered "jewish science" and so it was rejected by the Nazis. According to officially approved Nazi science, everything in outer space was made out of ice and the Sun's gravity abruptly stopped at 3x the orbit of Neptune.

That's a better description of Nazi cosmology, though there were definitely Hollow Earth adherents, hence the experiment:

quote:

The island of Rugen in the Baltic was the site of one of the most bizarre and misguided strategies of the Second World War. In April 1942, an expedition under the leadership of the infra-red ray specialist Dr Heinz Fisher and equipped with state-of-the-art radar sets landed on Rugen and began to make a series of observations.

Fisher ordered the radar sets to be pointed at an angle of 45° into the sky, a position they maintained for several days. The reason for this peculiar experiment was to prove that the Earth is not a sphere floating in space but is actually a bubble set in an infinity of rock. With the radar pointed upwards at a 45° angle, it was hoped that the beams would be reflected back from objects at some distance along the internal surface of the bubble.

It was also hoped that the radar would provide Fisher's team with an image of the British Fleet at Scapa Flow.

According to Professor Gerard S. Kuiper of the Mount Palomar Observatory, who wrote several articles on the Hollow Earth Theory: 'High officials in the German Admiralty and Air Force believed in the theory of a hollow Earth. They thought this would be useful for locating the whereabouts of the British Fleet, because the concave curvature of the Earth would facilitate long-distance observation by means of infra-red rays, which are less curved than visible rays.'

The origin of this idea, as applied in Nazi Germany, can be traced to 1918 and a young German aviator, Peter Bender, who came upon some old copies of Cyrus Teed's periodical, The Sword of Fire. Bender developed and 'refined' the theory (if such a term can be used) into what he called the Hohlweltlehre (Hollow World Theory), also enlisting the strange ideas of Marshall B. Gardner who had claimed that the Sun is actually inside the Earth on whose surface we are kept not by gravity but by the pressure of sunlight.

Bender claimed that the hollow bubble of the Earth was the same size as we believe our spherical Earth to be, with solar radiation keeping everything pressed to the concave surface. Beneath our feet is an infinite mass of rock; above our heads the atmosphere stretches to 45 miles, beyond which there is a hard vacuum. At the centre of this vacuum there are three objects: the Sun, the Moon and the Phantom Universe, which is a globe of blue gas containing the shining points of light astronomers mistake for stars.

It is night over a part of this concave Earth when the blue mass passes in front of the Sun, and the shadow of this mass on the Moon produces eclipses ... This theory of Bender's became popular round about the 1930s. The rulers of Germany and officers of the Admiralty and Air Force High Command believed that the Earth is hollow.

The Rugen experiment was, of course, a miserable failure. The Nazi hierarchy turned their backs on the Hohlweltlehre and on Peter Bender himself, who was sent to his death in a concentration camp.

Horbiger's Welteislehre, with its equally ridiculous doctrine of the eternal conflict between ice and fire in an infinite Universe, won the day.
- source

"Wow the Earth isn't hollow, guess that proves the universe is made of ice, off to the camps for you!"

Also, from World Ice Theory

quote:

Hörbiger had various responses to the criticism that he received. If it was pointed out to him that his assertions did not work mathematically, he responded: "Calculation can only lead you astray." If it was pointed out that there existed photographic evidence that the Milky Way was composed of millions of stars, he responded that the pictures had been faked by "reactionary" astronomers. He responded in a similar way when it was pointed out that the surface temperature of the Moon had been measured in excess of 100 °C in the daytime, writing to rocket expert Willy Ley: "Either you believe in me and learn, or you will be treated as the enemy."

Sums up the mindset pretty well.

Ashcans
Jan 2, 2006

Let's do the space-time warp again!

Do flat earthers ever explain the point of this multi-decade global conspiracy? If the world is flat, what does tricking everyone actually do?

RagnarokAngel
Oct 5, 2006

Black Magic Extraordinaire

Ashcans posted:

Do flat earthers ever explain the point of this multi-decade global conspiracy? If the world is flat, what does tricking everyone actually do?

That's the question isnt it!

Alternative answer: Big Globe.

Dr. Arbitrary
Mar 15, 2006

Bleak Gremlin

Ashcans posted:

Do flat earthers ever explain the point of this multi-decade global conspiracy? If the world is flat, what does tricking everyone actually do?

There's good stuff outside the border of the surrounding poles.

Shbobdb
Dec 16, 2010

by Reene

Ashcans posted:

Do flat earthers ever explain the point of this multi-decade global conspiracy? If the world is flat, what does tricking everyone actually do?

One of the more interesting developments in CT-thought is that Russian is closest to the ancient Aryan language. Evidence for the flat earth are hidden in certain similar sounding words (possibly homophones -- I don't speak Russian) as well as rhyming logic. If you accept that, then similar tools provide evidence for other things. Things "they" want obscured can be revealed in this way.

An example of this that got a lot of airtime recently was the "There are no trees" component of Flat Earth which has a long segment involving this kind of proof.

Another popular one is controlling the migrations of peoples as part of the NWO. If you can't reliably predict where you are because all of your maps are wrong, you can't escape their clutches.

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014


did all the jfk conspiracy mongers apologize for making america dumber for 50 years?

Keeshhound
Jan 14, 2010

Mad Duck Swagger

Groovelord Neato posted:

did all the jfk conspiracy mongers apologize for making america dumber for 50 years?

Why would they? The release of documents was obviously just a smokescreen to pacify the rest of you sheeple.

Alterian
Jan 28, 2003

Ashcans posted:

Do flat earthers ever explain the point of this multi-decade global conspiracy? If the world is flat, what does tricking everyone actually do?

My mom thinks satan is behind everything.

Data Graham
Dec 28, 2009

📈📊🍪😋



Well of course he is, but why?

Just likes trolling people?

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames
Salad Prong

Ashcans posted:

Do flat earthers ever explain the point of this multi-decade global conspiracy? If the world is flat, what does tricking everyone actually do?

The point of any of those levels of conspiracy is always just "control" or "to show their power". Plus since such really amjor conspiracies require vast sections of science to be faked to even be possible, it allows the conspiracy theorist to say anything else factually true they don't like must be faked just like the round earth is faked!

Some of them will then go into specifics like "they lie to us that we can go to space so they steal money for fake space programs" or whatever. But for most of them its just "to control us maaaaan"

maskenfreiheit
Dec 30, 2004

Ashcans posted:

Do flat earthers ever explain the point of this multi-decade global conspiracy? If the world is flat, what does tricking everyone actually do?

why do i convince impressionable women in hostels i'm karl pilkington?

some men just want to watch the world flatten

Ashcans
Jan 2, 2006

Let's do the space-time warp again!

At least the chemtrail people have some sort of motive figured out, I have to give them that!

Shbobdb posted:

An example of this that got a lot of airtime recently was the "There are no trees" component of Flat Earth which has a long segment involving this kind of proof.
Wait what? There aren't trees? :psyduck:

MasterSlowPoke
Oct 9, 2005

Our courage will pull us through
I liked mountains are just big trees theory.

Alterian
Jan 28, 2003

Data Graham posted:

Well of course he is, but why?

Just likes trolling people?

Duh. If you fall off the edge you end up in hell.

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames
Salad Prong

Ashcans posted:


Wait what? There aren't trees? :psyduck:

The "trees" we see now are the merest saplings, even the mighty supposedly full grown redwoods.

Real trees were miles across at the base of the trunk and their remnants are called mesas and rock formations by evil scientists trying to trick us.

Shbobdb
Dec 16, 2010

by Reene
I did some digging because I was curious and the old anti-war unlimited oil people's ideas on how oil forms have found a home in some Flat Earther places. So, that's probably another reason. You could probably fold in some Nazi-era unlimited mineral wealth there too.

pop fly to McGillicutty
Feb 2, 2004

A peckish little mouse!

Data Graham posted:

Well of course he is, but why?

Just likes trolling people?

I mostly do it for trolling, yes.

Ashcans
Jan 2, 2006

Let's do the space-time warp again!

fishmech posted:

The "trees" we see now are the merest saplings, even the mighty supposedly full grown redwoods.

Real trees were miles across at the base of the trunk and their remnants are called mesas and rock formations by evil scientists trying to trick us.

I just spent some time on google with this, it manages to be pretty staggering even by flat earth standards. :stare:

Scherloch
Oct 28, 2010

Yeah!
Lately, I've been seeing a lot of Cultural Marxism. Well, claims of its existence, at least.

I'll be having a fairly normal discussion with someone, and after a while they start to trot out the idea that the upper echelons of government and educational institutions has been infiltrated by Marxists. At which point, naturally, I roll my eyes and tell them I'm done.

It's sad to see that some people are so opposed to the idea of tolerance and equality that they have to chalk it up to a conspiracy, because to them it's unthinkable that people in general are becoming more tolerant towards minorities, sexual or otherwise. Nope, has to be Jews and Marxists pushing their agenda.

Also, Jordan Peterson. People who believe in Cultural Marxism really like linking to videos of him talking instead of typing out a counter-argument. You know, since he's got a PhD and is tenured, which means he can't be wrong. What's that? Plenty of tenured professors and other scientists disagree with him? Well, they're obviously Marxists.

Shbobdb
Dec 16, 2010

by Reene
TBF, the Birchers created a lot of the modern conspiracies we have so it makes sense that the Red Menace is still lurking behind every corner.

But Judmas CTs are making a comeback in a big way, especially in Russia, so expect a lot more Judeo-Marxist dog whistles. Obviously, in Russia it's Judeo-Freemasons. But same idea.

yaffle
Sep 15, 2002

Flapdoodle
How do flat earthers explain air travel? I mean, there should be some very long and expensive flights on a flat earth, depending on which map you believe in.

yaffle fucked around with this message at 13:27 on Nov 8, 2017

Helen Highwater
Feb 19, 2014

And furthermore
Grimey Drawer
When you ask the question, "How do Flat-Earthers explain...", you've already put more thought into the topic than a Flat-Earther has.

Warbadger
Jun 17, 2006

yaffle posted:

How do flat earthers explain air travel? I mean, there should be some very long and expensive flights on a flat earth, depending on which map you believe in.

I've heard the one where planes all fly faster or slower to simulate the round earth distance/flight times.

RagnarokAngel
Oct 5, 2006

Black Magic Extraordinaire
The answer to all questions about "How do flat earthers explain X?" is just "(((they))) manipulate society to keep up the illusion". That's absolutely it.

MasterSlowPoke
Oct 9, 2005

Our courage will pull us through

yaffle posted:

How do flat earthers explain air travel? I mean, there should be some very long and expensive flights on a flat earth, depending on which map you believe in.

The world is a circular disc, using some sort of distortion free projection that THEY don't want you to know about.

pop fly to McGillicutty
Feb 2, 2004

A peckish little mouse!

Scherloch posted:

Lately, I've been seeing a lot of Cultural Marxism. Well, claims of its existence, at least.

I'll be having a fairly normal discussion with someone, and after a while they start to trot out the idea that the upper echelons of government and educational institutions has been infiltrated by Marxists. At which point, naturally, I roll my eyes and tell them I'm done.

It's sad to see that some people are so opposed to the idea of tolerance and equality that they have to chalk it up to a conspiracy, because to them it's unthinkable that people in general are becoming more tolerant towards minorities, sexual or otherwise. Nope, has to be Jews and Marxists pushing their agenda.

Also, Jordan Peterson. People who believe in Cultural Marxism really like linking to videos of him talking instead of typing out a counter-argument. You know, since he's got a PhD and is tenured, which means he can't be wrong. What's that? Plenty of tenured professors and other scientists disagree with him? Well, they're obviously Marxists.

A guy just tried this on an SNL YouTube video of all places. He criticized SNL for making fun of Trump by saying "it's liberal indoctrination just like Marxist use in college to brainwash the youth."

I can't even imagine being so dissociative with reality.

Elias_Maluco
Aug 23, 2007
I need to sleep

yaffle posted:

How do flat earthers explain air travel? I mean, there should be some very long and expensive flights on a flat earth, depending on which map you believe in.

Something about density, I think

Helen Highwater posted:

When you ask the question, "How do Flat-Earthers explain...", you've already put more thought into the topic than a Flat-Earther has.

Not necessarily. Some of those guys put quite an effort on explaining their crap with bogus mathematical/physics

For stuff they really cant explain, like satellites, space travel etc, then comes the ubiquitous masonic/iluminati/satanist/globalist conspiracy

Baka-nin
Jan 25, 2015

Scherloch posted:

Lately, I've been seeing a lot of Cultural Marxism. Well, claims of its existence, at least.

I'll be having a fairly normal discussion with someone, and after a while they start to trot out the idea that the upper echelons of government and educational institutions has been infiltrated by Marxists. At which point, naturally, I roll my eyes and tell them I'm done.

It's sad to see that some people are so opposed to the idea of tolerance and equality that they have to chalk it up to a conspiracy, because to them it's unthinkable that people in general are becoming more tolerant towards minorities, sexual or otherwise. Nope, has to be Jews and Marxists pushing their agenda.

Also, Jordan Peterson. People who believe in Cultural Marxism really like linking to videos of him talking instead of typing out a counter-argument. You know, since he's got a PhD and is tenured, which means he can't be wrong. What's that? Plenty of tenured professors and other scientists disagree with him? Well, they're obviously Marxists.

Oooh, that ones been bubbling away for years, my first time encountering that was in 2008. I remember it because I had actually learnt a bit about the Frankfurt School in well my school the year before. I was amazed a random fellow seemed so concerned about a small group of dissident marxists (there's actually a very long and very boring debate about whether they were still Marxist) who were somewhat obscure and frankly subjected to quite a bit of criticism from even the left wing types. My introduction to them was largely negative.

Unfortunately a lot of it is just old fashioned anti-Semitism the few cultural marxists that get name dropped are always the Jewish ones. I've yet to see a supporter of this idea know what the Frankfurt School is even about. Adorno had some very ugly things to say about Jazz and other predominantly black american cultural trends, which right away should nip the whole thing about them pushing PC culture in the bud, but that requires reading up on the stuff they wrote.

Touchdown Boy
Apr 1, 2007

I saw my friend there out on the field today, I asked him where he's going, he said "All the way."
Unfortunately Jordan Peterson is absolutely untrustworthy on most things when it comes to anything other than his field (and I say that only because I am not an expert in his field). As I said I am by no means an expert but after listening to him a few times I can see the gaping holes in his arguments about Socialism or practically anything else. It makes me sad because I want to respect him. I put him in the same category as Dawkins to be honest.

Cultural Marxism has become a beacon for people that dont know an awful lot except what they can glean from terrible youtube videos. There is a signifcant overlap in people who use phrases like this one and those who dont understand the difference between Communism and Socialism (or Marxism). Conservatives who do know better may very well have stolen that idea from the Nazis who liked to talk about Cultural Bolshevism, but I am not 100% sure on that one. All I know is it sure makes stupid people look smart (to each other).

Death Ray
Jan 20, 2010

by VideoGames

(and can't post for 6 years!)

Scherloch posted:

Lately, I've been seeing a lot of Cultural Marxism. Well, claims of its existence, at least.

Cultural Marxism ranks right up their with "libtard" as a well thought-out right wing argument. They need some frame for their hostile attitudes, and rather than admit that they are simply reactionary they put lipstick on that old pig of "Marxism" so they can resurrect their favorite enemy.

If you are ever debating a fan of Peterson, just ask them to skip ahead to the the part where they invoke the "Gulag Archipelago", just to save time.

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames
Salad Prong
Yelling about "cultural marxism" is literally just quoting Hitler and Nazi propaganda.

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

but enough about my favorite hobbies

Touchdown Boy
Apr 1, 2007

I saw my friend there out on the field today, I asked him where he's going, he said "All the way."

Death Ray posted:


If you are ever debating a fan of Peterson, just ask them to skip ahead to the the part where they invoke the "Gulag Archipelago", just to save time.

Yeah I dont understand how the reading of one book can seemingly make you have all kinds of dodgy opinions about an entire topic (and a bunch of other semi unrelated ones to boot).

duck monster
Dec 15, 2004

smoke sumthin bitch posted:

They like to say that but every signatory country at earth summit 92 in Rio was expected to write all this poo poo into law (which bill Clinton did via executive order). They keep repeating its non-binding so it sounds non-threatening but in practice it is binding. Remember when Trump was about to pull out of the Paris agreement, globalists world wide condemned him and said he wasn’t legally allowed to do it and ever since he pulled out, all these cities are coming out proclaiming they’ll implement it over their jurisdiction anyway, completely disregarding democracy and the will of the citizens.

See that’s the key thing about the agenda for the 21st century, their aim is to implement it at a local level. People don’t pay attention to municipal politics and anyways 90% of the time elements of the agenda are passed without a referendum. The International Council for Local Environmental Initiatives aka ICLEI was founded with that goal in mind, to bypass the democratic process.

To really understand the agenda 21 one must have knowledge of it`s creator, the founder of the sustainable development mafia, Maurice Strong. I highly recommend you take 5 minutes to read his Wikipedia entry to get an idea just how corrupt this man is. I know a lot of people are confused as to what a true globalist is. Maurice strong is the quintessential one.

Jesus christ, an Agenda 21 conspiracy theorist that isn't on alzheimers drugs. Thats a new one.

Please tell me the millenial alt-right wingnuts havent adopted this insane piece of ancient whack.

Can we at least decide if HAARP or FEMA are in control of the deathray sattelites before introducing even newer lizard factions

duck monster fucked around with this message at 03:00 on Nov 19, 2017

boner confessor
Apr 25, 2013

by R. Guyovich

duck monster posted:

Jesus christ, an Agenda 21 conspiracy theorist that isn't on alzheimers drugs. Thats a new one.

check his long history of opiate and research chemical abuse in TCC if you want to see why young people end up with broken brains

duck monster
Dec 15, 2004

boner confessor posted:

check his long history of opiate and research chemical abuse in TCC if you want to see why young people end up with broken brains

Well as an old person who abused some fairly savage pharmacuticals in the 80s and 90s, I'm not entirely convinced thats all it takes. Though spend enough time with meth and anythings possible braindamage wise.

duck monster
Dec 15, 2004

Death Ray posted:

Cultural Marxism ranks right up their with "libtard" as a well thought-out right wing argument. They need some frame for their hostile attitudes, and rather than admit that they are simply reactionary they put lipstick on that old pig of "Marxism" so they can resurrect their favorite enemy.

If you are ever debating a fan of Peterson, just ask them to skip ahead to the the part where they invoke the "Gulag Archipelago", just to save time.

I think they usually mean , uh, Frankfurt School or one of those groups. Ironically the Frankfurt school probably shares precisely zero of the traits associated with it by the right. Other than "Started by jews". But I think secretly thats the only bit that matters to them.

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twistedmentat
Nov 21, 2003

Its my party
and I'll die if
I want to
Why would you want to respect Peterson? He's planning on doxxing every professor who teaches "cultural Marxism" at UoT and any other prof his shithead followers don't like so people can harass then, because FREE SPEECH! gently caress that guy and anyone who thinks he has anything worthwhile to say.

Respecting him is like respecting Sargon of Akkad or that guy from Vice to started the Proud Boys.

Funny thing about Cyrus Teed is he claimed to have proved the world was flat with some device he invented, but they later examined the device and found it had a flaw in it that matched exactly the curvature of the earth. He also thought he was Jesus reborn and renamed himself Koresh.

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