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JBP posted:Also it's a shorter campaign because gently caress chaos, we quest and laugh. Basically sums up Norsca too, you just roll out and krump Archaon and then the squishy lands below.
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Nov 24, 2017 13:27
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Could anyone give me a couple of pointers for Chaos? just started as Kholek and some guides advise building a second stack early but when I do that all these idiot marauders start killing each other. Also these awakened tribes are morons. opting to pick a fight with Kislev immediately instead of colonising the nice trail of ruins I left for them.
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Nov 24, 2017 13:43
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Brasseye posted:Could anyone give me a couple of pointers for Chaos? just started as Kholek and some guides advise building a second stack early but when I do that all these idiot marauders start killing each other. The cost of your buildings is based on how many buildings you have constructed in that horde. Thus a very good starting strategy is to demolish the marauder building and replace it with the chaos warrior building. This let's you skip that boring start phase where you are forced to use lovely marauders as line infantry.
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Nov 24, 2017 14:00
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Kainser posted:Buy Warhammer 1 if you really like the idea of one of the races. Otherwise there isn't much point. In that case, how do the greenskins and vampires play? They kinda intrigue me. LupusAter fucked around with this message at 14:28 on Nov 24, 2017 |
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Nov 24, 2017 14:01
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LupusAter posted:In that case, how do the greenskins play? They kinda intrigue me. Despite appearances, Greenskins are one of the most tactically flexible armies in the game, with units able to fit in any role. Your main strength is in your numerous and hard-hitting Orc melee core, and your main problem in most battles is getting into charge range without getting shot up or disrupted too much. To this effect, you have a diverse range of cavalry that can chase down/distract ranged units (Goblin Wolf (speed)/Spider (poison and stealth) Riders and Archers), cavalry that can charge into particularly tough blocks of infantry (Boar Boyz, Orc Boar Chariots, Feral Squigs*, Squig Riders*), and cavalry that can counter enemy cavalry and monsters (Boar Big 'Uns). You also have decent access to ranged firepower thanks to some archers (Arrer Boyz for damage, Night Goblin Archers for poison), as well as some surprisingly effective artillery. You also have other melee infantry units that can catch arrows/cavalry charges for your Orcs as they advance (standard Goblins), or sneak near enemies and ambush them (Night Goblins for poison and Fanatics, Stabbers* for armour-piercing and slow). Finally, if you need some big monsters for disruption and taking down enemy characters, you can either take Trolls or Giants to add some more punch to your melee core. If you get the DLC (the units with * above are DLC units), you can also unlock a new start position and Legendary Lord: Skarsnik, who specializes in turning the normally weak Goblin units into insanely damaging but no less fragile monsters. You also get Night Goblin Warbosses, Lord choices that share Skarsnik's Goblin-boosting skill line, in case you don't want to run Orcish armies too. In terms of magic, you have two schools: Big Waaagh! and Little Waaagh! The former specializes in big damage spells and melee buffs, the latter is more flexible and lets you cover weaknesses of your melee-centric armies through buffs and debuffs. Finally, you can also use Savage Orc units; basically Orcish infantry and cavalry variants that sacrifice all of their armor and a lot of melee defense for ludicrous charge bonuses and weapon damage. Wurrzag, the Savage Orc Legendary Lord who has his own separate start from the two main Greenskin Lords, also boosts these units into probably the most powerful charge infantry and cavalry in the game, narrowly edging out Bretonnian cavalry due to sheer numbers. Unfortunately, only Wurrzag gets the Savage Orc tree, so you won't be able to run an all-Savage Orc faction like Skarsnik can run an all-Goblin faction.
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Nov 24, 2017 14:44
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Zudgemud posted:The cost of your buildings is based on how many buildings you have constructed in that horde. Thus a very good starting strategy is to demolish the marauder building and replace it with the chaos warrior building. This let's you skip that boring start phase where you are forced to use lovely marauders as line infantry. Awesome, going to start again later and do this immediately. The marauder units are worthless
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Nov 24, 2017 14:54
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LupusAter posted:In that case, how do the greenskins and vampires play? They kinda intrigue me. vampires are interesting, though suffer from only having one possible starting position (more or less) their basic infantry is sub-skaven tier trash but nothing runs away, it takes quite a long time for VC units' morale to break and once it does the unit takes ramping up damage over time until its gone, also afaik your whole army scares living armies so the enemy routs faster to back up this melee line of already-dead people with the combat skills you'd expect from corpses they have their own magic school which is based around buffing and healing undead units as well as having Wind of Death, a super powerful damage spell that travels in a long straight line, so if you can hit an engaged enemy line down the flank it can wipe out half a melee line pretty easily these powers are generally wielded by vampires (don't use necromancers) who are combat monsters as well as strong-rear end wizards, lords have access to vampire or death magic, heroes have access to shadow or death additionally they have a whole load of monstrous units, ghouls and ghosts as well as vampire cavalry, these units are all pretty expensive and niche but excel in their roles VC totally lack skirmishers and ranged units, but make up for it with the strongest (still?) airforce in the game with bats, bigger bats and the biggest bat. they also get access to "raise dead" which is very strong, basically letting you instantly raise troops on the same turn based on how many people have died, every zone at base will give you roughly 2 skellies and 3 zombies, but if a huge battle just took place you can start rezzing actually good units. Lords: Manfred: OP as heck but starts on his own, gets access to death and vampire magic and gets a dragon mount, making him one of the strongest lords in the game, also begins the game with a capital city and gold mine Vlad: Combat monster who gives his whole army vanguard and at level 4 unlocks a skill that gives every army you own loooooads of exp a turn Isabella: Spell monster who makes vampire heroes very cheap and buffs monstrous units. Boring human lords: Why bother Best start IMO is Isabella because you gain access to Vlad on turn 2 and the two buff eachother if they're in the same fight, my favourite thing to do is load isabellas stack with cheap vampire heroes and vargheists and load Vlad's with redline-buffed wolves and bats so you get Izzys army as an elite core and Vlad runs in with a swarm of angry animals. one last thing to mention is corruption, VC armies take damage when passing through healthy lands unless you're raiding, so you need to amp up corrupton in an area if you want to move around in it and take things, this can lead to a slower game although it's also useful, if you pump corruption up in an area everything around you will start to die and rebel without you having to do anything. In an early VC game I make friends with the dwarves to the south, went on a big campaign in the empire and when I came back all the dwarf holds were empty and all their lands were deserted.... oops! Communist Thoughts fucked around with this message at 15:18 on Nov 24, 2017 |
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Nov 24, 2017 15:13
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Got paid just in time for the sales and picked up TWW1 again to unlock Mortal Empires, starting a campaign as Beastmen and it's weird. Horde armies are neat, and I'm doing decently thanks to Brayherds and eiffel/triple towering most enemies, but so far I'm worse off actually playing compared to relying on autoresolve - my dudes seem super fragile and not super fast or killy to make up for it, or with enough chaff to blunt it like Skaven. Do I need to run a few units of ungor just to have expendable meat for the blender? I swapped most of my army to Gor and Minotaurs because it seemed a straight upgrade. What's the trick to playing Beastmen? I've had much more luck with Skaven, finishing the vortex campaign with Queek, though I'm still unsure what the best use of Menace Below is once you've taken out enemy artillery - go after archers, or sneak them into the rear of your main lines fight? Or is it totally situational?
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Nov 24, 2017 15:23
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I was under the impression that Empire's start was changing so they had Reikland under their control from the beginning?
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Nov 24, 2017 15:46
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nopantsjack posted:vampires are interesting, though suffer from only having one possible starting position (more or less) So I decided to try a VC game after my first attempt at a TWW1 campaign sputtered as Karl Frank after I inadvertently allowed Skarsnik to burn down half my towns. I managed to conquer Eastern and Western Sylvania by about turn 12, which is feel is pretty swift for an extreme newbie, playing as Mannfred. I got a random Necromancer as a quest reward for killing some Imperials but I’m not sure how exactly to use him. He doesn’t seem to be able to lead an army himself, and I can evidently “deploy” him to a province to, uh, reduce construction cost I guess? Sadly this doesn’t seem to gain him any XP so I would like to bring him along with Mannfred’s army for magical support but I can’t figure out how to attach him to an army. I suppose at this point I should probably concentrate on digesting my holdings for awhile (since these two regions seem to be the entire “native” vampire territory in the game) and build balefire whateves to spread corruption and then just sort of follow the corruption, conquering where it spreads? I can’t actually conquer dwarf and orc towns right, just loot or torch them? How do I use these second string hero s that can’t actually lead armies? Are these basically the spies or priests of early TW titles where they are just used strategically? The skill tree seems to suggest they can be used in actual battles.
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Nov 24, 2017 15:50
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Mod question: Where are the character traits (and their effects) tables? Like the starting "vigilant", "bladelord", "pigeon-chested" ones, not the ones that are earned by doing stuff. I know I've seen them but I'm completely blanking on where they were. edit: They're in character_skill under _innate I'm blind. sassassin fucked around with this message at 16:27 on Nov 24, 2017 |
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Nov 24, 2017 15:51
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prussian advisor posted:So I decided to try a VC game after my first attempt at a TWW1 campaign sputtered as Karl Frank after I inadvertently allowed Skarsnik to burn down half my towns. I managed to conquer Eastern and Western Sylvania by about turn 12, which is feel is pretty swift for an extreme newbie, playing as Mannfred. I got a random Necromancer as a quest reward for killing some Imperials but I’m not sure how exactly to use him. He doesn’t seem to be able to lead an army himself, and I can evidently “deploy” him to a province to, uh, reduce construction cost I guess? Sadly this doesn’t seem to gain him any XP so I would like to bring him along with Mannfred’s army for magical support but I can’t figure out how to attach him to an army. If an army isn't full with 20 units you can add heroes to them, and then they work like a sub-lord in battles. You're doing pretty well, and it's a good idea to consolidate a bit to spread corruption before moving forward, it's highly recommended to get the bottom right research line done and get the passive corruption increases. If you can't get a non aggression pact with your mountain neighbors it is not a bad idea to burn down the neighboring settlements to stop them from bothering you. If Averland or Stirland don't have allies it is not a bad idea to invade them ASAP, as you can conquer them pretty quickly and you can train your lords on rebel stacks that come from lack of corruption. Ostermark too, but I personally prefer to avoid them because they're a decent buffer against the Chaos invasion.
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Nov 24, 2017 15:59
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The Bramble posted:I was under the impression that Empire's start was changing so they had Reikland under their control from the beginning? Only if you're not playing as Empire.
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Nov 24, 2017 16:09
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If you select the hero and right click on mannfred (and mannfred’s army isn’t full) you should see an option to “embed hero” which puts him in the army
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Nov 24, 2017 16:20
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Scrub-Niggurath posted:If you select the hero and right click on mannfred (and mannfred’s army isn’t full) you should see an option to “embed hero” which puts him in the army Yup, his army being full turned out to be the problem. I’ll attach the necromancer, he can’t be less useful than a unit of zombies. Speaking of which, what skills would you recommend investing in for a support nexromancer? Still pretty new to the use of magic in TW games, although I have already figured out that Invocation of Nehek is real real good. Do necromancers get any “nukes” I should work toward, since evidently VC has literally no ranged units? Also, does the neveomancer gain experience from just being in the victorious army like Mannfred does, or does he need to actually get blood on his hands to progress?
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Nov 24, 2017 16:23
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Heroes are mini-Lords who can function on the campaign map independently instead leading an army, so they'll gain xp by sitting in an army just like Mannfred. They also do gain xp for being deployed, btw, just slowly. I usually kept necromancers out of my army because they can reduce building cost of buildings so much and I'd rather get my spellcasters from spamming Vampires as much as possible. Until then, though, all of their spells are fairly decent, and you can't really go wrong with overcast Nehek as you saw. (Overcast a spell by double-clicking it when you select it. It makes the spells more powerful in various ways in return for an increased cost and a chance to hurt the caster on cast. In Nehek's case, overcasting turns it into an AoE)
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Nov 24, 2017 16:34
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Are Teclis and Mazdamundi powerful enough as spellcasters that they can easily kill half an enemy stack through magic? I've been using this mod for Gelt that elevates him to a level worthy of the most powerful human spellcaster, and I get the feeling it might be a liiiiiiiiittle overpowered. For example: - A fully upgraded Final Transmutation will kill cavalry and monster squads while reducing characters to half health. - A fully upgraded Searing Rain will destroy clusters of light/medium infantry that can't get away in time. I didn't have the skill points for Golden Hounds but I imagine it instantly kills anything it touches. My best record was 700~ kills on 4 Norscan stacks attacking Gelt's army. Surely neither Teclis nor Mazdamundi are that powerful?
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Nov 24, 2017 16:40
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prussian advisor posted:Speaking of which, what skills would you recommend investing in for a support nexromancer? Still pretty new to the use of magic in TW games, although I have already figured out that Invocation of Nehek is real real good. Do necromancers get any “nukes” I should work toward, since evidently VC has literally no ranged units? Also, does the neveomancer gain experience from just being in the victorious army like Mannfred does, or does he need to actually get blood on his hands to progress? I'd also recommend Master of the Dead and Curse of Undeath. Master of the Dead gives a passive heal around the necromancer and Curse of Undeath is a passive that applies a mini invocation of nehek to your whole army every time your necromancer casts a spell. If you wanted ranged/nukes, necromancers can get Wind of Death which is a very deadly but expensive spell. You want to try to cast it horizontally on a line of enemy infantry once they engage with your line. If you cast it on the AI when they're not fighting they'll probably dodge it. But when you overcast it while they're engaged their whole line of infantry will burst into a giant wall of blood. I haven't tested out Gaze of Nagash recently but it's a missile spell meant for big targets or lords. It's much more effective if you fire it from a hero or lord on a flying mount so I'm not sure how good it would be on a necromancer. Vanhel's Danse Macabre isn't a bad spell either for certain situations, like before the cav engagement starts. Pretty much all the lore of vampire skills are good in one way or the other so you can't go wrong. Necromancers are good for boosting your economy, but until you have tier 5 vampire crypts and necromancer towers they won't make much of a difference.
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Nov 24, 2017 16:42
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The Vampire Count economy is based on getting as many Magnanimous necromancers and banshees as possible, leveling them up until they get the skill that increases building income by 15%, and then sticking them in Drakenhoff forever.
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Nov 24, 2017 16:43
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prussian advisor posted:Yup, his army being full turned out to be the problem. I’ll attach the necromancer, he can’t be less useful than a unit of zombies. As mentioned, Necromancers are often best used for their blue skills that reduce building costs and increase income, but they have a viable combat role as basically aura/summon guys. Necromancers have a unique skill called Master of the Dead that gives them a healing aura that only procs when the necromancer himself isn't engaged in melee. It also gives them lowered cost/additional uses of Raise Dead, which means basically their job is just to stand around right behind the front line and summon a bunch of zombies/skeletons for you while passively healing your dudes. Once they earn enough levels, Necromancers can also take a Corpse Cart mount, which basically gives them additional support auras-extra healing, attack/defense bonuses, or draining enemy magic, depending on the type of Cart. Also a quick note for generic Necromancer Lords. On top of the buffed Master of the Dead skill, they also share two new unique skills with Kemmler: Lord of the Scourge: +6 LD, -10% Attrition, +10% Replenishment. (3 Points, Lords Army) Thrall Master: +4 XP for all Skeleton and Zombie Recruits, -15% Recruitment Cost, -15% Raise Dead Cost. (3 Points, Lords Army) Which does give them a small niche at being really good at quickly raising armies of cheap chaff, which is fitting enough. I'm tempted to do a full bore Necromancer run with Vampire Counts one of these days but I think I'll wait and see what comes of the new starting positions first. madmac fucked around with this message at 17:00 on Nov 24, 2017 |
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Nov 24, 2017 16:46
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prussian advisor posted:Speaking of which, what skills would you recommend investing in for a support nexromancer? Still pretty new to the use of magic in TW games, although I have already figured out that Invocation of Nehek is real real good. Do necromancers get any “nukes” I should work toward, since evidently VC has literally no ranged units? Also, does the neveomancer gain experience from just being in the victorious army like Mannfred does, or does he need to actually get blood on his hands to progress? VCs are probably my least played faction, but the necromancer iirc has two skill lines, red and blue. Blue is all the campaign map stuff, and what you want to invest in if you want to use him as an agent, rather than in battles as magical support. The red line is your magic spells, and your bread and butter that every vampire army should have are Invocation of Nehek and Raise Dead. Gaze of Nagash is your magic missile nuke, and Wind of Death is your aoe in a line spell. Heroes and lords get exp from the victory, not from how many kills they get (decisive and heroic victories give more than close or pyrrhic)
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Nov 24, 2017 16:50
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toasterwarrior posted:Are Teclis and Mazdamundi powerful enough as spellcasters that they can easily kill half an enemy stack through magic? I've been using this mod for Gelt that elevates him to a level worthy of the most powerful human spellcaster, and I get the feeling it might be a liiiiiiiiittle overpowered. For example: Unmodded, I got 1400 kills with Malekith's spells alone in one battle against Skaven. I've had 800 kills with Teclis and similar with Mazdamundi. But that's mostly from vortex spells and wind spells on big clumps of enemies, which unmodded Gelt is capable of too without buffing his other (still really good) spells to that extent. For reference: a single cast of unmodded, basic Gehenna's Golden Hounds got 323 kills for me against goblins yesterday.
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Nov 24, 2017 17:00
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toasterwarrior posted:Are Teclis and Mazdamundi powerful enough as spellcasters that they can easily kill half an enemy stack through magic? Teclis' strength is in dishing out map-wide buffs every time he casts. The big damage spells aren't as useful imo, even if net + chain lightning can do a lot of damage.
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Nov 24, 2017 17:05
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Yeah vanilla magic is really strong now, and even generic Caster Lords pull their weight more with the changes to magic skill trees. I've mentioned it before, but CA went and stealth buffed most of the quest items for old Caster Lords in Mortal Empires. Gelt for example, his Cloak of Liquid Metal now gives reduced cost for Glittering Robe, it also snuck in a small buff to phy resist and fire resist on top of it's old bonuses. Amulet of Sea Gold has an extra speed bonus, Staff of Volans adds +10 Winds and -15% miscast. Honestly, Gelt is a beast now in general now with all the buffs he's gotten over several patches. There's a lot of other ones, including Kemmler, Ghorst ect but I don't have time right now. Also Loremaster got buffed for all Lords that have it, giving some pretty huge casting bonuses. sassassin posted:Teclis' strength is in dishing out map-wide buffs every time he casts. The big damage spells aren't as useful imo, even if net + chain lightning can do a lot of damage. This is true, but Teclis also ends up being able to cast Chain Lightning for like 8 winds, IIRC. That actually is one of his cheap spells. Being able to cast absolutely anything and set off like 8 global buffs is definitely the best part of playing Teclis though. That and starting the game with a bound spell and +30 winds, so you can fight a larger stack of Lizardmen turn one and wreck them with magic even at his weakest point. madmac fucked around with this message at 17:15 on Nov 24, 2017 |
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Nov 24, 2017 17:12
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Does it usually make sense to wait until you unlock another named special lord (like Kemmler or Ghorst) before starting another army relatively early, or does it make sense to go for a generic vampire lord or master necro as a stopgap? With Sylvania under my control and a full stack under Mannfred, I still have like 2800/turn in income.
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Nov 24, 2017 17:17
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prussian advisor posted:Does it usually make sense to wait until you unlock another named special lord (like Kemmler or Ghorst) before starting another army relatively early, or does it make sense to go for a generic vampire lord or master necro as a stopgap? With Sylvania under my control and a full stack under Mannfred, I still have like 2800/turn in income. It's never a bad plan to start leveling up a generic Lord. Even if you dismiss them in 20 turns to replace them with a named Lord, they'll still be around for you to hire again later and keep all their levels and stuff.
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Nov 24, 2017 17:20
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John Charity Spring posted:Unmodded, I got 1400 kills with Malekith's spells alone in one battle against Skaven. I've had 800 kills with Teclis and similar with Mazdamundi. But that's mostly from vortex spells and wind spells on big clumps of enemies, which unmodded Gelt is capable of too without buffing his other (still really good) spells to that extent. For reference: a single cast of unmodded, basic Gehenna's Golden Hounds got 323 kills for me against goblins yesterday. Well poo poo, maybe the mod isn't as badly balanced as I thought it was after all. sassassin posted:Teclis' strength is in dishing out map-wide buffs every time he casts. The big damage spells aren't as useful imo, even if net + chain lightning can do a lot of damage. This mod also overcharges Gelt's buffs and debuffs: they all last a minute when overcasted and all have a big AoE. Doubling up on damage spells and buffs/debuffs is probably where I feel the mod crosses the line. Fun fact: the dude also made mods for Teclis and Mazdamundi. If Gelt is this powerful and utilitarian, I imagine Mazdamundi just blinks and sets the entire enemy army on fire with his mod.
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Nov 24, 2017 17:20
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 How have I played this game since release and not noticed the icon to the left of the units numbers show if a unit is large or small 
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Nov 24, 2017 17:23
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Another small, dumb question—I notice that you don’t choose at the outset whether to go for a short or long victory. I assume when you reach the short victory conditions you get a screen that basically says “You win! Do you want to keep going and try to win more? Y/N.” Is that basically it? Is there a generally accepted “basic” race recommended for first times in TW1 by the way? I ask only because I assumed this was the Empire but playing as VCs actually seems much, much simpler. prussian advisor fucked around with this message at 17:37 on Nov 24, 2017 |
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Nov 24, 2017 17:30
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prussian advisor posted:Another small, dumb question—I notice that you don’t choose at the outset whether to go for a short or long victory. I assume when you reach the short victory conditions you get a screen that basically says “You win! Do you want to keep going and try to win more? Y/N.” Is that basically it? That is it.
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Nov 24, 2017 17:30
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I’m really falling in love with Night Goblin Fanatics. They just completely own. Just had a match where my night gobbos killed more white lions than my black Orcs did. Also Grimgor is a loving powerhouse. Finally, a pair of Goblins stretched out in front of your lines will eat so much ranged fire, they rule
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Nov 24, 2017 17:54
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Does anybody use the lore of beasts for lizardmen?
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Nov 24, 2017 17:59
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sassassin posted:Never ever EVER let the random armies build up a head of steam. They will always come at you at the worst possible time and they'll have 9 hellstorm batteries or 12 hydras or something equally unfun to fight when they do. Unless they're Skaven. You can auto-resolve a settlement with just the first level of garrison defenses against an elite Skaven army. And if you're Dwarves you probably don't even need that much.
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Nov 24, 2017 18:04
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nessin posted:Unless they're Skaven. You can auto-resolve a settlement with just the first level of garrison defenses against an elite Skaven army. And if you're Dwarves you probably don't even need that much. One day you'll see a stack of doomwheels, rat ogres and feral carnosaurs knocking on your door and remember my warning.
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Nov 24, 2017 18:08
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sassassin posted:One day you'll see a stack of doomwheels, rat ogres and feral carnosaurs knocking on your door and remember my warning. I thought you were talking about armies from public order rebellions, because they're the ones that grow. The new random mixed armies that pop up just come fully built when they spawn, you can't attack them when they're just 4 or 5 units. Unless maybe that's a difficulty thing, but at hard and up I've never seen one not spawn fully built.
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Nov 24, 2017 18:11
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sassassin posted:One day you'll see a stack of doomwheels, rat ogres and feral carnosaurs knocking on your door and remember my warning. Skaven get feral carnosaurs? That's hosed up.
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Nov 24, 2017 18:13
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They are talking about the rogue armies with weird gimmicks, like the all gun all the time army, or the chaos/dark elf best of both worlds army or mid/high end monsters only armies.
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Nov 24, 2017 18:26
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I’m a big fan of the Saurus/Kroxigor/Dragon-Ogre rogue army.
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Nov 24, 2017 19:46
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Is there a way to see what perks the Blessed Spawnings get for Lizardmen? Some, like Perfect Vigour, are easy, while others are a bit trickier to figure out if you can't recruit non-vetted versions of the troops in general. I got that Blessed Carnosaurs are fast as hell and have better attack/worse defense, but I can't quite figure out what Blessed Temple Guard get since I can only recruit vet 8 Temple Guard at the moment. Better charge and more armor, it looks like?
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Nov 24, 2017 19:46
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:
oh gently caress
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Nov 24, 2017 19:57
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