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The complaints here just confirm that nobody wants to see an actually good Star Wars movie and when they do, it’s too much
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Dec 16, 2017 02:34
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The only ideologically acceptable ending to the trilogy lies in the moral redemption of not only Kylo, but Hux and the whole First Order through the power of love.
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Dec 16, 2017 02:34
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Darth Walrus posted:Heroes are important, but only insofar as they create and preserve more heroes. You beat the bad guys by shrinking them into relative irrelevance, and for that, you need numbers. This is some of the most nihilistic stuff I've read.
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Dec 16, 2017 02:35
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After witnessing firsthand the death of Christ and thinking “glad that’s over with”, Luke attempts murder and then spends thirty years contemplating a blade of grass before coming to the epiphany that it is okay to be unhappy sometimes like in the movie Inside Out.
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Dec 16, 2017 02:43
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Zeris posted:The complaints here just confirm that nobody wants to see an actually good Star Wars movie and when they do, it’s too much Good doesn't mean perfect. I already said this is the best Star Wars movie in three decades but that doesn't mean it doesn't have flaws that are cathartic to talk about.
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Dec 16, 2017 02:45
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Jesus Christ wasn't as much of a worthless gently caress up as Anakin Skywalker
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Dec 16, 2017 02:45
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You beat the bad guys by shrinking them into relative irrelevance, and for that, you need warm bodies.
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Dec 16, 2017 02:46
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:If you don’t care about the God, why are you watching Star Wars movies? 
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Dec 16, 2017 02:50
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s.i.r.e. posted:Luke wasn't a crybaby bitch about his parents, 
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Dec 16, 2017 02:50
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I want a fan of Leia suddenly mattering the force with no training. The rest of the movie was pretty good. I was shocked by Lukes failure, and understand kylo's feelings of betrayl and anger. My favourite part was Luke telling R2 off for his language.
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Dec 16, 2017 02:59
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lol when looking back at https://pastebin.com/UPYz7n2P
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Dec 16, 2017 03:00
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I said it before but I'm peeved at this complete insult to every effort the heroes put forth in the original trilogy. Literally everything that they fought and suffered for meant nothing so some board of directors could make "Rebels vs. Empire" last forever. The entire original trilogy might as well not have happened because the villains effortlessly took back over to zero pushback with their infinite armada's and super-weapons (Which they can apparently just replicate infinitely).
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Dec 16, 2017 03:05
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galagazombie posted:Literally everything that they fought and suffered for meant nothing so some board of directors could make "Rebels vs. Empire" last forever. Luke and co. are not real people.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:08
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Is it any surprise that a bunch of people idolizing failed institutions fail again?
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Dec 16, 2017 03:10
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I’m very curious about the involvement of Snoke in Ben’s training, since Leia and Luke have both referred to it at length now. But aside from that, I’m quite happy to accept the message that the past is the past and there’s nothing to be gained from examining it; what matters is facing things as they are now.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:11
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https://twitter.com/agentbizzle/status/941691022777532416
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Dec 16, 2017 03:12
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Zeris posted:I’m very curious about the involvement of Snoke in Ben’s training, since Leia and Luke have both referred to it at length now. But aside from that, I’m quite happy to accept the message that the past is the past and there’s nothing to be gained from examining it; what matters is facing things as they are now. Sounds like a rationalization for their own failure. Luke couldn't have failed because he is Wise and Good. Ben couldn't have been bad because he's the son of Good people.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:14
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KaptainKrunk posted:Is it any surprise that a bunch of people idolizing failed institutions fail again? What a world we live in that now "representative government" is called a failed institution.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:15
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galagazombie posted:I said it before but I'm peeved at this complete insult to every effort the heroes put forth in the original trilogy. Literally everything that they fought and suffered for meant nothing so some board of directors could make "Rebels vs. Empire" last forever. The entire original trilogy might as well not have happened because the villains effortlessly took back over to zero pushback with their infinite armada's and super-weapons (Which they can apparently just replicate infinitely). I thought it was clear that the Republic had a weak and underfunded central government whose military and leadership were decimated by Starkiller. They're France in 1940 if the Nazis had nuked Paris and the majority of the French armed forces before invading.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:16
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KaptainKrunk posted:Sounds like a rationalization for their own failure. Luke couldn't have failed because he is Wise and Good. Ben couldn't have been bad because he's the son of Good people. Sounds like a rationalization for "We made a mysterious character who actually had no mystery like hacks."
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Dec 16, 2017 03:17
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I thought the whole point of the finn subplot was "some risks dont pay off."
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Dec 16, 2017 03:20
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galagazombie posted:Sounds like a rationalization for "We made a mysterious character who actually had no mystery like hacks." I expect Snoke will be at least be mentioned in 9. Maybe? Who knows, I'm excited for 9.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:21
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Star Wars fans want a Star Wars movie and when they get Star Wars movie then it's bad for being too much like Star Wars so lets give them something different but still Star Wars oh I guess it wasn't Star Wars enough.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:22
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https://twitter.com/agentbizzle/status/941812377430794240
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Dec 16, 2017 03:22
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:An actual twist would require upending some basic, fundamental truth of the story. Darth Vader being Luke's heroic father completely tore the premise apart, because it was no longer clear who was good and who was evil. "[Character from previous movies] dies" in itself is not a twist - now Rey dying in the middle of the movie would be. Since I saw Episode VII I wanted the twist with Rey's parents to be that Luke had killed them, thus inverting the twist in Empire Strikes Back, and for a brief moment in the movie it looked like that might actually happen! I was sad when it did not.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:24
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Pook Good Mook posted:I thought it was clear that the Republic had a weak and underfunded central government whose military and leadership were decimated by Starkiller. They're France in 1940 if the Nazis had nuked Paris and the majority of the French armed forces before invading. Thats kind of my point. RotJ (especially when informed by the prequels) insinuates that the reborn republic will have learned from the mistakes of the past. The prequels even show that in essence the Empire WAS the rot and corruption in the Old Republic taken form and things like the proto-rebellion subplot were to show how the true values of the republic became the Rebellion and the OT was a kind of redemption for them just as it was for Anakin. But nope, have to have the Not!Rebellion fight the Not!Empire because that's what marketing says to do!
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Dec 16, 2017 03:26
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Darth Walrus posted:Man, this movie cut real deep on some real modern anxieties. I’ve seen people talking about how the villains felt lame and unthreatening, but I’d say they tapped into a very particular horror. The new trilogy has been a story of malicious, mercurial children gifted, through no effort of their own, with so much power that their actual competence is utterly irrelevant, and of a system where the greatest profit to be found for the actual smart people is in indulging their limitless appetite for vengeance and sadism until there are no smart people any more, just overprivileged sybarites immersed in an economy of suffering. I like this post, and this movie. Out of curiosity, when did they show the Jedi texts being saved? I'm sick as a dog so i guess I just faded out whenever that happened
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Dec 16, 2017 03:34
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oh also, Tracy from Chewing Gum showing up was an awesome 1-second cameo
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Dec 16, 2017 03:35
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:There are only bad guys, some of whom offer false democracy and some of whom offer authoritarianism. The First Order blew up six planets and killed presumably trillions of people? They kidnap children and train them to be mindless, obedient footsoldiers. And that's AFTER the Empire blew up one planet with billions and murdered and oppressed countless more.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:37
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:You beat the bad guys by shrinking them into relative irrelevance, and for that, you need warm bodies. How do you think democracy works? Political victories aren’t won by individual fates, but by convincing the public of the viability and righteousness of your cause. The entire purpose of the system is to diminish the damage any one bad actor can do by empowering and inspiring the many (and making their lives better in the process). On a semi-related note, one bit of the film’s collectivist attitude that really stood out to me was its depiction of the dark side. It’s undoubtedly powerful, but as philosophically deep as a puddle - it offers no insight into others, only endless reflections of yourself.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:42
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Zeris posted:The complaints here just confirm that nobody wants to see an actually good Star Wars movie and when they do, it’s too much
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Dec 16, 2017 03:45
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Its not some modern anxiety when you build up a chatacter, off them like its nothing and then tell the audience to move on
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Dec 16, 2017 03:45
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Despera posted:Its not some modern anxiety when you build up a chatacter, off them like its nothing and then tell the audience to move on The figurehead of a brutally regressive government is actually a pathetic buffoon, and even without him the social dynamics that gave him power still exist and need to be dealt with.....and this is *not* topical or relevant to today?
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Dec 16, 2017 03:49
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"They subverted expectations" is true, but subverting expectations doesn't inherently make something good. I don't think Snoke being a randomly mooked rear end in a top hat was inherently against the film's themes and ideas and I think it actually fit pretty well, but not everyone is all-in on the idea and that isn't inherently a wrong thing. When you aim to leave the audience intentionally unsatisfied then you end up people audience members who are unsatisfied. That's the risk of doing it. It may not pay off for everyone or even the majority, and TLJ delighted in leaving the audience unsatisfied. It set the tone for that the moment Luke Skywalker chucked his lightsaber away and started milking space tits the moment he appeared onscreen. Not everyone is obligated to find that satisfying, especially in a movie that is disjointed as hell.
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Dec 16, 2017 03:51
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Luke chuggin' up that space cum will be an instant reaction gif classic
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Dec 16, 2017 03:53
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Fuligin posted:I like this post, and this movie. at the end of the movie finn walks into a room in the millenium falcon and opens a drawer to pull out a blanket. next to the blanket are the books. finn doesnt notice them
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Dec 16, 2017 03:58
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Mulva posted:The figurehead of a brutally regressive government is actually a pathetic buffoon, and even without him the social dynamics that gave him power still exist and need to be dealt with.....and this is *not* topical or relevant to today? Lol Trump = Snoke is almost as much pretentious bullshit as starting your post with "tapping into modern anxietys."
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Dec 16, 2017 03:59
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Despera posted:Lol Trump = Snoke is almost as much pretentious bullshit as starting your post with "tapping into modern anxietys." Again, gold lamé bathrobe. The folks behind the new trilogy haven’t exactly been subtle in tying it to the modern resurgence of far-right politics - you saw people picking up on it all the way back with Hux’s speech and the reveal of Kylo’s true nature in TFA.
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Dec 16, 2017 04:07
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Darth Walrus posted:Man, this movie cut real deep on some real modern anxieties. I’ve seen people talking about how the villains felt lame and unthreatening, but I’d say they tapped into a very particular horror. The new trilogy has been a story of malicious, mercurial children gifted, through no effort of their own, with so much power that their actual competence is utterly irrelevant, and of a system where the greatest profit to be found for the actual smart people is in indulging their limitless appetite for vengeance and sadism until there are no smart people any more, just overprivileged sybarites immersed in an economy of suffering. I like this. I'd be more inclined to be persuaded by it though if it held up outside of the context of just TLJ. As it stands though, the rest of the series explored this. For instance, TLJ when read in this way would have us understand that the popular uprisings and statue-topplings that occurred after the second Death Star was destroyed were not the beginnings of a political revolution The broom kid at the end has already happened in the series, and it happened on an even wider, galactic scale. From Coruscant to Naboo to Tatooine--all the way to the outer rim! ...and it didn't work. Apparently. In the Post-Lucas Star Wars there is apparently no limit to the bodies required to throw into the grinder to win Darth Walrus posted:Again, gold lamé bathrobe. The folks behind the new trilogy haven’t exactly been subtle in tying it to the modern resurgence of far-right politics - you saw people picking up on it all the way back with Hux’s speech and the reveal of Kylo’s true nature in TFA. It doesn't really track though, does it? If you were to boil down the essences of Trump into a science fiction character it would not be the Wizard of Oz crossed with Palpatine. It would be Mojo from X-Men. Snoke doesn't amass power because of an appeal to racism and "rural values" like Trump did. Snoke isn't talking about the War on Christmas. In fact, we don't know how Snoke amassed power. Money...I guess? Trump didn't buy the presidency. And Trump certainly didn't train the Alt-Right like Snoke trained Kylo. He was a byproduct of it, a creation of it. I just don't see clear textual support for the whole shebang. It's fun to go on about, but upon close inspection it doesn't really work I don't think. Waffles Inc. fucked around with this message at 04:16 on Dec 16, 2017 |
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Dec 16, 2017 04:09
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The Resistance allies hiding in the outer rim are gonna show up in IX, right? RIGHT?
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Dec 16, 2017 04:11
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