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tsob posted:Horrible seems like an over-reaction for G-Savior. It's not good, but it's not bad either; it's just there. Boring is about it's worst offense rather than being actively terrible. My least favorites would be either AGE or Try, and I can't honestly decide which is worse. Both of them are mostly kind of dull to watch despite the preponderance of things the staff obviously want you to think are cool, but unlike G-Savior they both get more insulting the more you think about them. Yeah, G-Savior's not good at all, but it's basically just an above-average Sci-Fi original movie (not much of a compliment considering how bad the average is there) that happens to be Gundam themed instead of Mongolian death worms or something. I'd never recommend it, barring some pretty absurd circumstances, but if someone insisted on watching it, they'd only be out an hour and a half of forgettable nothing. If I'm allowed Hot Takes, I'd even say I was less disappointed with it than I was with what I watched of 08th, if only because everyone warned me G-Savior sucks.
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Jan 6, 2018 03:53
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Yeah 08th MS Team is the one that really puzzles me.
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Jan 6, 2018 03:55
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I thought the Angel Halo was a creepy-cool idea, at least. It’s the weaponisation of humanity’s potential taken to its ultimate extreme, and a scary bit of foreshadowing of how humanity’s Newtype awakening could be its damnation as well as its salvation.
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Jan 6, 2018 03:57
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I really like Victory, warts and all. Also the soundtrack is really good. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hecBFtWDWk
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Jan 6, 2018 04:47
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6XgSujILtyQ Bennett the Sage from Anime Abandon takes a look at War in the Pocket. Just thought I'd drop this in here. He also did two reviews on Endless Waltz and F91, though I felt they weren't as good as his analysis of 0080. Mainly because he's not a hardcore Gundam fan, and therefore isn't as forgiving of space magic minovsky particles, and he dips more into his "laugh at bad/weird anime" routine for those episodes.
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Jan 6, 2018 05:12
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I just finished watching F91 and after all the talk of of how incoherent it was I think I was expecting that I was not going to be able to follow it. But it actually makes sense in strict terms of "this happens then this happens" it's just got an odd tone and has sections that are clearly super condensed versions of the events depicted. All in all I was pleasantly surprised by it and I actually think the first act (escaping the colony) is straight up great. It's really weird that when it ends the conflict has not really been resolved at all and Cosmo Babylonia and it's leadership is entirely intact but I assume that's what the manga wraps up. You can definitely tell that Seabrook's dad's death is an episode of a TV show condensed into like two and a half minutes. Also there are like a million loving characters who don't matter that didn't get cut when they decided this was a movie and not a TV show. I liked it. It's definitely odd though. Sam Sanskrit fucked around with this message at 06:00 on Jan 6, 2018 |
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Jan 6, 2018 05:57
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We set up a projector in my apartment and I look forward to watching CCA and F-91 with my girlfriend as her intro to Gundam. I saw CCA yeeears ago but I've never seen F-91 so I am excited for giant insane robot action projected on all available wall space.
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Jan 6, 2018 06:57
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Those are... Not the best introductions to Gundam.
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Jan 6, 2018 08:55
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Tulalip Tulips posted:We set up a projector in my apartment and I look forward to watching CCA and F-91 with my girlfriend as her intro to Gundam. I saw CCA yeeears ago but I've never seen F-91 so I am excited for giant insane robot action projected on all available wall space. F91 is reputedly terrible, and Char's Counter Attack is the endpoint of the major arc of the UC timeline. It'd be like getting your girlfriend into Star Wars by showing her Return of the Jedi before Empire Strike Back or A New Hope.
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Jan 6, 2018 09:01
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Darkman Fanpage posted:Those are... Not the best introductions to Gundam. this. they're both beautiful pieces of animation, but if you want her to have a connection to the story or characters try the original series or turn-A
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Jan 6, 2018 09:04
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Start her with Wing like a real American.
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Jan 6, 2018 09:06
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those are such obviously bad choices that i thought there must be some other reason for choosing them question though: what are the good options for getting someone into gundam? a lot of the "main" gundam series have pacing and/or animation problems that make them seem like they'd be better choices for someone already invested. thunderbolt is pretty and self contained and good so it'd be my first choice, but i'm not sure what my second or third choices would be
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Jan 6, 2018 09:30
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Gundam 00 is a pretty good choice. I mean there's SEED as well, but I might be one of the few people here who genuinely liked it.
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Jan 6, 2018 11:04
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ninjewtsu posted:those are such obviously bad choices that i thought there must be some other reason for choosing them War in the Pocket, maybe? It’s short and pretty. IBO is also one of the better introductory full-length series, by virtue of being a decent self-contained AU that hits a lot of the franchise’s main themes.
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Jan 6, 2018 11:13
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Logicblade posted:Gundam 00 is a pretty good choice. I mean there's SEED as well, but I might be one of the few people here who genuinely liked it. Yes. I've found 00 and IBO to be the best introductory series so far. Both are self-contained and mostly good looking with some fine worldbuilding and action all around. Also helps that they're recent series - if people aren't REALLY into anime watching something that's 4:3 or from the 70s proves to be quite a hurdle. Your mileage may vary but at least my friends are more of the "wow cool robot" than the "war is bad" demographic. Edit: Also Thunderbolt PS1 Hagrid fucked around with this message at 13:22 on Jan 6, 2018 |
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Jan 6, 2018 13:19
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The real test comes from introducing them to Build Fighters after a series or two. Then finding out their favourite Gundam mecha and giving them an HG kit of it  .
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Jan 6, 2018 13:33
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Thunderbolt, 0080, IBO, 00, and Unicorn RE:0096 are all good introductions, I think.
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Jan 6, 2018 13:36
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Guy Goodbody posted:Thunderbolt, 0080, IBO, 00, and Unicorn RE:0096 are all good introductions, I think. Unicorn OVA, surely? The TV re-edit is just a chopped-up mess. It’s pretty continuity-heavy, too, as a look back on the Universal Century.
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Jan 6, 2018 13:41
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Darth Walrus posted:Unicorn OVA, surely? The TV re-edit is just a chopped-up mess. I've talked to a couple people who watched RE:0096 as their first Gundam and they liked it and weren't confused. The show does a pretty good job explaining the backstory that you need to know, and it's pretty much just broad strokes "there was a space war, there's some space psychics, there was a guy named Char who died" You don't need to know anything about Puru to understand Marida's story, for example.
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Jan 6, 2018 13:44
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Guy Goodbody posted:I've talked to a couple people who watched RE:0096 as their first Gundam and they liked it and weren't confused. The show does a pretty good job explaining the backstory that you need to know, and it's pretty much just broad strokes "there was a space war, there's some space psychics, there was a guy named Char who died" You don't need to know anything about Puru to understand Marida's story, for example. Fair enough, but the OVA is still straight-up better. Same footage, and it’s paced like it’s supposed to be. Just like there’s no point in watching the Thunderbolt OVAs when December Sky and Bandit Flower exist.
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Jan 6, 2018 13:47
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Darth Walrus posted:Fair enough, but the OVA is still straight-up better. Same footage, and it’s paced like it’s supposed to be. What you're forgetting is that the seven minute long "Previously, on..." segments give RE:0096 a pacing more like DragonBall Z, which casual anime fans will already be familiar and comfortable with. RE:0096 also has a great themes song and, most importantly, is on Youtube. When you want somebody to watch something a Youtube link is always better than, "hang on let me find you a torrent..."
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Jan 6, 2018 13:59
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Darth Walrus posted:War in the Pocket, maybe? It’s short and pretty. IBO is also one of the better introductory full-length series, by virtue of being a decent self-contained AU that hits a lot of the franchise’s main themes. Yeah, War in the Pocket would be my choice too. It's older, but it still looks pretty good. (OVA budget helps). Really, though, for a longer series, I'd probably say it's something you'd best decide case by case. There's enough of a style gap between, say, IBO and Turn A that knowing what someone likes would be an important part of making the recommendation.
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Jan 6, 2018 14:12
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chiasaur11 posted:Yeah, War in the Pocket would be my choice too. It's older, but it still looks pretty good. (OVA budget helps). I'd say Gundam 00 is the "safe bet" entry series, because it has giant robots clowning grunt MS's and some political intrigue, and its fancy nigh-magical particles are actually explained in enough detail to understand what they are and what they do.
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Jan 6, 2018 14:22
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Neddy Seagoon posted:I'd say Gundam 00 is the "safe bet" entry series, because it has giant robots clowning grunt MS's and some political intrigue, and its fancy nigh-magical particles are actually explained in enough detail to understand what they are and what they do. I’d say IBO is safer. At least then you aren’t introducing them to the franchise with a show that goes sharply downhill in its second season.
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Jan 6, 2018 14:23
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Darth Walrus posted:I’d say IBO is safer. At least then you aren’t introducing them to the franchise with a show that goes sharply downhill in its second season. 00's first season is reasonably self-contained enough to be enjoyed by its own merits, and IBO is absolutely not safer by any measure. It deals with some pretty hard themes like enslaved child soldiers right from the get-go, nevermind just being dark in general (eg; Mikazuki executing the adults and taking over). It is a brutal series compared to any other in the entire franchise.
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Jan 6, 2018 14:31
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Neddy Seagoon posted:00's first season is reasonably self-contained enough to be enjoyed by its own merits, and IBO is absolutely not safer by any measure. It deals with some pretty hard themes like enslaved child soldiers right from the get-go, nevermind just being dark in general (eg; Mikazuki executing the adults and taking over). It is a brutal series compared to any other in the entire franchise. Eh, Victory, SEED, and Zeta exist. Seriously, you can miss it past the artstyle, but SEED gets gory and hosed-up as hell, and Stargazer is a straight-up nightmare fever-dream. Even Turn A had ‘I think the arms are all that’s left of him’, and Unicorn, another rec, had a first-person journey through the life of a child sex slave. The severity of IBO’s brutality relative to the rest of the franchise is considerably exaggerated.
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Jan 6, 2018 14:52
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Find out what interests them more (tragedy of war or the dehumanization aspect) and either apply War in the Pocket or December Sky. Tailor their tastes from there.
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Jan 6, 2018 15:01
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I just finished the first season of 00 and it left a bad taste in my mouth. The idea is really cool and there are some neat moments (like unarmed Exia just shrugging off artillery shots while escorting the old guy during that peace ceremony) but I couldn't tell the orange and purple Meisters apart and Lockon/Setsuna were the only characters with a clear motivation or anything resembling an arc. Everything else felt like the plot pushing things forward to the inevitable logical conclusion of the nation-states catching up to GN tech somehow, and when they finally do its kinda out of nowhere. Also way too many scenes where Gundams lock swords and yell their intentions at each other and go YYEEEAAARRGGGHHH edit I don't hate it just think it fumbled the pass near the end Marx Headroom fucked around with this message at 16:00 on Jan 6, 2018 |
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Jan 6, 2018 15:40
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Darth Walrus posted:The severity of IBO’s brutality relative to the rest of the franchise is considerably exaggerated. I think the on-screen deliberate execution by an adolescent with a handgun of a bound and helpless captive puts IBO a notch above anything else in Gundam.
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Jan 6, 2018 16:51
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Midjack posted:I think the on-screen deliberate execution by an adolescent with a handgun of a bound and helpless captive puts IBO a notch above anything else in Gundam. And doing the exact same thing as small kids to survive on the streets. And the AV system in general. Or the sheer brutality of the combat. Most grunt suits in other shows just explode or power down, they don't cop an oversized mace to the chest that crushes the cockpit in gruesome bloody detail.
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Jan 6, 2018 17:05
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CCA and F91 are monumentally terrible choices to introduce someone to Gundam. I really like CCA, but I know a few people that even after watching the MSG movies, Zeta and ZZ don't get why things are happening, I can't imagine the confusion of just being dropped in it.
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Jan 6, 2018 17:25
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Neddy Seagoon posted:The real test comes from introducing them to Build Fighters after a series or two. Not counting watching Wing on Toonami back in the day, I actually started with Build Fighters and worked my way from there. But then I got into Gundam mostly for the models.
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Jan 6, 2018 17:26
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Darth Walrus posted:I’d say IBO is safer. At least then you aren’t introducing them to the franchise with a show that goes sharply downhill in its second season. Some would argue that's because it goes downhill during season one and never goes very far back up the hill. Or that the show never had any kind of hill to traverse in the first place, and was just a flat crawl the whole way. I wouldn't go quite that far, even having only seen the first season but I also wouldn't recommend the show since I thought it was mostly just kind of boring. I can't say as I found the characters, plot or action entertaining or intriguing. The setting itself is, but it's not enough to save the show on it's own and I don't recall it being expanded in ways I found interesting past the first few episodes either. Midjack posted:I think the on-screen deliberate execution by an adolescent with a handgun of a bound and helpless captive puts IBO a notch above anything else in Gundam. Some of the deaths in Victory are pretty horrific, as are the reactions. Uso carrying his mother's dismembered head around in a helmet, the bikini bazooka squad and so on.
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Jan 6, 2018 17:36
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Neddy Seagoon posted:And doing the exact same thing as small kids to survive on the streets. SEED had microwave superweapons that made people explode like balloons (plus lots of footage of child soldiers doing horrible poo poo and having horrible poo poo done to them in Stargazer), while Victory had a child watch his mother get decapitated by a giant motorbike and later had him get forced to use his giant robot to crush his way through an army of bikini models. Also, there were multiple cockpit-crushings. There’s also 00, where no less than two major characters (Setsuna and Allelujah) killed their families (and in Allelujah’s case, was implied to cannibalise them) as children.
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Jan 6, 2018 17:45
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I'm not saying the things you've listed aren't brutal, I'm saying that IBO is more brutal. An abused child choosing to restrain and kill an unarmed captive at close range, and the producers' decision to show that action in explicit detail, is at a different level than a character reacting to the aftermath of an impersonal at distance killing or death in combat, defensive or otherwise.
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Jan 6, 2018 17:59
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Setsuna kills his parents with a handgun in their home as his mother pleads to know why he's just killed her husband and is pointing a gun at her. Which isn't just implied or spoken of, it's shown. Setsuna's father is bloody corpse behind his mother as she trembles in fear and asks an emotionless kid Setsuna why he's doing this. Followed by a gunshot. Followed by an almost zombie like Setsuna walking out his house to join a couple of dozen kids, some of whom can be heard doing the same thing in their own homes before being congratulated by a war monger for doing Gods' bidding and becoming part of a holy war. IBO might be up there in brutality, but it is not a lone, singular experience and there are other things in Gundam of a similarly horrific nature.
tsob fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Jan 6, 2018 |
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Jan 6, 2018 18:10
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Marx Headroom posted:I just finished the first season of 00 and it left a bad taste in my mouth. The idea is really cool and there are some neat moments (like unarmed Exia just shrugging off artillery shots while escorting the old guy during that peace ceremony) but I couldn't tell the orange and purple Meisters apart and Lockon/Setsuna were the only characters with a clear motivation or anything resembling an arc. Everything else felt like the plot pushing things forward to the inevitable logical conclusion of the nation-states catching up to GN tech somehow, and when they finally do its kinda out of nowhere. Based on what you said you should definitely just cut your losses instead of going on to season 2 because it's only gonna ramp up a lot of those problems from there.
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Jan 6, 2018 18:12
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tsob posted:Setsuna kills his parents with a handgun in their home as his mother pleads to know why he's just killed her husband and is pointing a gun at her. Which isn't just implied or spoken of, it's shown. Setsuna's father is bloody corpse behind his mother as she trembles in fear and asks an emotionless kid Setsuna why he's doing this. Followed by a gunshot. Followed by an almost zombie like Setsuna walking out his house to join a couple of dozen kids, some of whom can be heard doing the same thing in their own homes before being congratulated by a war monger for doing Gods' bidding and becoming part of a holy war. IBO might be up there in brutality, but it is not a lone, singular experience and there are other things in Gundam of a similarly horrific nature. Similarly, we see the manifestation of Hallelujah as a little boy in a surgical gown with a bloody knife and bloody smears around his mouth cornering another little boy who’s begging for his life. Kids killing unarmed victims is not new to Gundam.
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Jan 6, 2018 18:22
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Or you could watch thunderbolt and have people evaporated by beam swords and an army of suicidal amputees setting off bombs
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Jan 6, 2018 19:17
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Arcsquad12 posted:Or you could watch thunderbolt and have people evaporated by beam swords and an army of suicidal amputees setting off bombs Thunderbolt is so comically edgy that it not only loops back to hilarious, but continues its arc long enough to no longer be funny and just becomes tiresome around the time it introduces the battalion of actual, for real children.
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