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UnknownMercenary posted:murdering everything else around the dozer if you are using a Graze build. Can someone capture this for me sometime, because it sounds hilarious.
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Mar 2, 2018 02:52
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UnknownMercenary posted:Are you really defending when Boiling Point made all its units do blue cop levels of damage?  The other period was when they did something similar with the Cobras and they all had a fire rate of ~20,000 shots per second.
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Mar 2, 2018 04:49
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Discendo Vox posted:
I no lie miss the days when Rats 2 was a death run through trenches with gang members raining deadly mac-10 fire from above.
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Mar 2, 2018 04:53
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RandallODim posted:I no lie miss the days when Rats 2 was a death run through trenches with gang members raining deadly mac-10 fire from above. It was genuinely pretty thrilling betraying the Cobras in Rats day 2, given that most pub groups I'd play with could ace day 1 no problem, then they'd get wiped 50% of the time on day 2, leaving me to keep getting them up or even running for the van to hide inside with the intel, solo. Given how many rats day 2 runs I went through back in the day when Infamy only went up to 5, with 95% of day 1s involving blowing up the lab and hiding in the basement until the van showed up, day 2's old lethality has a very special place in my heart.
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Mar 2, 2018 05:08
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Micro uzi still S tier bullet hose, Mosin Nagant now has a reason to be used by me again as I go hitscan cop bowling 
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Mar 3, 2018 04:57
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Dozers are easy with dodge and a crit Mark-10 with speed pull mag. Aced Specialized Killing optional. Aced Trigger Happy is incredible now and lets you shred dozers even faster than the aforementioned crit Mark-10. Shotgun dodge builds still need silencers to maximize concealment, so the Izhma has effectively been nerfed. Not by much though, 64 damage with crits as compared to 70 damage with crits previously. Should still lay waste on the highest difficulties. Getting to 100% achievements again by just launching the game also felt good, and it was sensible to make the new achievements retroactive. Overall, this update is better work than OVK has done for a very long time.
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Mar 3, 2018 06:01
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I hadn't done the haunted killroom on one down/death sentence and had to log in for 80 cheevos and then do one heist for 5 more.
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Mar 3, 2018 16:02
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Sorry about your 3 minutes in a locked room, waiting for a button and a whole bunch of despawned cops.
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Mar 3, 2018 16:25
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It pales in comparison to others in this thread, but I've put 1200 hours into Payday 2 which is by far the most I've played any game, yet I haven't even touched the thing in over a year and change. Every day I come home, look at my Payday 2 doormat, and wonder "is this game enjoyable again?" and the answer is always "haha, no." Overkill and below were way too easy while Mayhem and up were super monotonous, and it doesn't seem like any of the new maps, perk decks, weapon rebalances, skill tree revisions, game modes, friendly AI improvements etc have done much to change this. I guess there are still 50K people playing the game as I write this so it must be just me, but I wish there was a way to roll back to a previous version and play that with some friends.
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Mar 3, 2018 19:34
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Mayhem has actually gotten pretty easy with this rework although I guess if you can't click heads with just about any automatic weapon then I can't really help you.
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Mar 3, 2018 20:08
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LMGs went from "why are you bringing this piece of poo poo gun" to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qy66alFL0M&t=7s (imagine waves of dying piggies here)
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Mar 3, 2018 20:18
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Imagine the part in Rambo 4 where he has the .50 cal except there are four people who are all Rambo.
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Mar 3, 2018 20:24
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He didn't say hard, he said monotonous. I can see that.
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Mar 3, 2018 20:25
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Discendo Vox posted:He didn't say hard, he said monotonous. I can see that. Well I find it quite refreshing that the cops don't just auto target me and turn me into Swiss cheese, but evidently a lot of folks were playing a much easier version of Payday 2 than I was.  I've found this current update to be way better than the monotony that was having to murder my way through 400 angry auto-aiming cops. Also Mayhem is very much more towards the Overkill end of the difficulty curve now.
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Mar 3, 2018 20:51
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Wait is that a thing now? You don't just round a corner and insta-splat to a pile of cops anymore?
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Mar 4, 2018 00:31
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John Murdoch posted:Wait is that a thing now? You don't just round a corner and insta-splat to a pile of cops anymore? Previously the game tied AI tasks (movement, targeting, etc) directly to framerate. Framerate being highly variable meant if you had a slower PC, you had a much easier game and vice versa. As of this latest update the game still does this, but performs the tasks under an assumed 60 framerate. So if you're someone like me who's used to the game running at a blazing 100 FPS on an i5, the game is a lot easier. Keep in mind they also increased the spawn cap without telling anyone, so small maps are still inundated with too many cops. They also haven't adjusted down enemy damage on Deathwish or Death Sentence, only Mayhem. Death Sentence also has another weird undocumented change that doubles the speed of all units (but not actually all units because of the messy implementation, but I'll let Vox get into more detail about that if he so wishes).
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Mar 4, 2018 04:14
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It's basically all enemies; I don't recall the details either. The fun part ("fun") is that it's a flat multiplier, because Jules. Dozer speed is twice what it used to be.... and cloaker speed is twice what it used to be. You can see where that's going. The removal of reinforce tasks and increase in enemies breaks a lot of the intended design of maps, so areas you're supposed to traverse fast become slogs. Area defenses like Panic Room, and any heist where all spawnpoints are redirected to a single zone, are basically like a horde event in L4D, but with bullets. At the same time, without reinforce spawns, many larger maps are easier because there are no enemies set to guard objectives- if you move from one part of the map to another, it's much more likely to be completely empty. Heck, let me take a minute and post something I cooked up awhile back. This should give a sense of the scale of the damage done by removing reinforce groups. Bear in mind that they were removed because Jules said they were "breaking spawns" and "clogging maps". Sorry, this is going to be long. In the words of our founder, please look away if this offends you. General reinforce task inventory Be aware that I can't guarantee that these are all called, or exactly where they call enemies to. I'm also not exhaustively documenting when they start or terminate, just making note if I can easily tell. All of these are now doing nothing in payday 2.
Bottom line? A ton of maps use no reinforce groups, so this change is just adding a lot of enemies to them. But a ton of maps use reinforce groups for specific purposes- and most of them aren't the ones that had a reputation for getting "clogged"! Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 07:23 on Mar 4, 2018 |
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Mar 4, 2018 07:19
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Goat Sim day 2 driver drove from the barn to the bridge. Entirely backwards. And sandwiched between 2 turrets when needed to be repaired. 
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Mar 5, 2018 04:41
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The Switch port of PD2 runs like buttered rear end and the pub stove is good and hot. But I gotta admit, when it works, being able to murder pigs while I take a dump is rad. If only the game pinged more than three lobbies at a time. 
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Mar 5, 2018 06:29
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Doctor Shitfaced posted:The Switch port of PD2 runs like buttered rear end and the pub stove is good and hot. But I gotta admit, when it works, being able to murder pigs while I take a dump is rad. I need more details on this. Also I need to hear about the Switch port.
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Mar 5, 2018 07:02
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Performance wise, the game has a 30 FPS cap like the other console versions. 1600x900 resolution in docked mode, 720p in handheld mode. The visual quality settings are kinda all over the place, but pretty close to the 360/PS3 versions. Chromatic aberration is disabled. The game regularly struggles to hit the FPS cap. The average is usually like 20-25 FPS. I played Meltdown on Normal with a full pub group and was regularly sub-15 FPS. I don't want to imagine how that map runs on One Down. Patch wise, the game is sitting at a chopped down version of the complete Housewarming update set. None of the heists added in that update set, no new clubhouse, no coins, but the game balance and technical status is at that point in patch history. I imagine this also applies to how spawns, AI, bugs, etc behave, but I only have about 6 or so hours logged right now so take what I say with a grain of salt. Joy sure is a new character you can play as. Yep. Nothing special. I haven't touched her perk deck at all, trying to focus on maxing out grinder for now. It's centered around throwable ECM jammers. Apparently they're just bog standard jammers with shorter timers all around. The rest of her deck boosts her health and when maxed, restores health whenever a teammate kills a cop, period. Her new SMG isn't anything special. Her melee is a reskin of the existing police baton. Her voice is a little annoying. At least her mask is rad. All the menus have been redone for touchscreen controls. It works reasonably well. HD rumble feels good and is directional based. E.g., if I pick a lock and look at the lock dead on, I feel rumble in both joycons. If I look to my left, I only feel rumble in the right joycon. This is the only version of the game to have LAN support. I don't have anyone to test this with. The Crime.net screen only pings about five active lobbies at most. Half the time I try to join a lobby, the game softlocks trying to join. No one has ever joined a lobby I've hosted. There is absolutely no voice or text chat. You cannot communicate with teammates beyond using shout commands and flailing about. The pub stove is red loving hot. The hottest I have ever experienced in Payday. Every typical pub stove stereotype is in full effect. When poo poo *actually* works though, it's Payday 2, for better or worse.
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Mar 6, 2018 07:00
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I’m guessing they’re going with the “oh, poo poo” angle with the throwable jammers, like if you realize someone’s wandering in front of a camera or alerted a guard that they can’t get to. That sounds good, in theory.
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Mar 8, 2018 19:09
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Meanwhile:
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Mar 11, 2018 22:31
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T-1000 mod when?
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Mar 12, 2018 14:39
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I hear Restoration mod is always open to new ideas; you should suggest it to those folks.
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Mar 12, 2018 14:40
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Death Vox Update: Iamgoofball is temporarily having to halt development due to a messed up GPU, but fear not: in the meantime, I, Vox, have figured out custom mapping! Death Vox Heists are happening! Don't worry, they're not using most of the horrible design things I've mentioned in the past iterations of this thread, because custom mapping tools are finicky.  Thread PollI need your advice. I want to have a decent variety of maps available when the mod launches, and at this point almost every heist is on the table. Which heists should I screw up for initial release? I've already got changes mostly plotted for Aftershock and Car Store. The only real restriction is I want to avoid altering maps with "boss characters" or Winters spawns, because those will require more attention from iamgoofball.
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Mar 15, 2018 23:55
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Discendo Vox posted:Death Vox Update: 1. Vanilla H&T bank heists as a yardstick. After that, 2. Brooklyn Bank 3. Reservoir Dogs 4. Beneath the Mountain 5. Yacht Heist
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Mar 16, 2018 00:04
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Clearly, it should be the zenith and the nadir of heisting: The Big Bank and Brooklyn 10-10. But, Winters. So I guess... Golden Grin and Brooklyn 10-10?
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Mar 16, 2018 00:21
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I should mention here that one of the general Death Vox changes that will be happening on these heists is preplanning and assets are not available. The players are left with the default heist setup, with only a couple heist-specific changes (you will get an extra cutter on Alesso, for example).
Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 03:23 on Mar 16, 2018 |
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Mar 16, 2018 02:03
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I would like loud versions of the forced stealth heists, please. Shadow Raid has Meltdown as an equivalent, but Car Shop and Yacht Heist should be amusing to play loud with new objectives and mechanics.
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Mar 16, 2018 05:30
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I'd be fine with a total removal of the stealth mechanics. They fuckin suck.
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Mar 16, 2018 05:35
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Wastrel_ posted:I would like loud versions of the forced stealth heists, please. Shadow Raid has Meltdown as an equivalent, but Car Shop and Yacht Heist should be amusing to play loud with new objectives and mechanics. That's likely outside of scope for the mod, I'm afraid- plus converting a stealth only map to loud would be pretty agonizing, I'd have to basically rework the whole thing from the ground up. stealth only maps are missing a bunch of enemy navigation systems and spawnpoint elements, and ultimately they're not laid out in a way that would make loud play very enjoyable. Sometime down the line, once everything else is done with death vox, I may give this a shot, though. SolidSnakesBandana posted:I'd be fine with a total removal of the stealth mechanics. They fuckin suck. I'm afraid I'm also wedded to preserving stealth and loud options for all the heists that currently have them (aside from Mallcrasher and Firestarter day 1). Furthermore the mechanical changes happening to stealth will also likely make it even less pleasant for people who don't enjoy it already. On the other hand, when I'm done with these heists, no one's going to enjoy any of them!
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Mar 16, 2018 05:39
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SolidSnakesBandana posted:I'd be fine with a total removal of the stealth mechanics. They fuckin suck. Yeah, the mechanics are the broken part, the rules are okay. It's just the whole "cops can see through a 1px misalignment in level geometry" thing that fuckin' sucks. So yeah  o
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Mar 16, 2018 05:40
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I will say that I'm not doing any of the most commonly proposed "quick fix" ways of making stealth harder, all of which are terrible. I've seen mods with faster alert time, wider enemy viewcones, even a flat pager reduction and re-introducing a small alert radius for silenced weapons, which is just  .The general stealth changes so far are:
The vast, vast majority of death vox stealth changes have to be done on a map-by-map basis. For you loudfans, I can promise that, with the possible exception of Shadow Raid, the stealth only maps on Death Vox will have relatively easy changes to work around. key word: relatively. Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 05:48 on Mar 16, 2018 |
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Mar 16, 2018 05:44
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I'd probably be OK with the stealth if you got rid of the hard limit of 4 radio calls. And how heavily RNG factors into a successful run.
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Mar 16, 2018 05:48
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SolidSnakesBandana posted:I'd probably be OK with the stealth if you got rid of the hard limit of 4 radio calls. And how heavily RNG factors into a successful run. Most stealthable heists are designed with the 4 pager limit in mind; and luck plays a minimal role in high-level stealth play.
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Mar 16, 2018 05:51
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Discendo Vox posted:I will say that I'm not doing any of the most commonly proposed "quick fix" ways of making stealth harder, all of which are terrible. I've seen mods with faster alert time, wider enemy viewcones, even a flat pager reduction. How about suppressors don't just remove the sound from the universe but simply make it so they can't be heard through walls, and rifles don't count as suppressed at all because they're firing supersonic rounds. I.e. you're really discouraged from using guns unless you're beaning some mook from another rooftop. If you don't bag someone up quick they leave a bloodstain You have to zip tie and then gag hostages (i.e. a second ziptie)
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Mar 16, 2018 05:52
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I think a fair change to stealth would be to make it easier for guards to be alerted (currently with 3 detection you can literally crouch-move about 10m in front of a guard and not get detected, which is stupid as gently caress) but to stop pagers from going off when you kill unalerted guards (yes, like in Silent Assassin). The pager limit can remain or even be reduced if 4 pagers is found to be too many in such a system. That'll give the option of controlling any map, yet make it still require skill in not being detected, and will fix some of the stuff that doesn't make any sense in stealth.
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Mar 16, 2018 07:25
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Discendo Vox posted:I will say that I'm not doing any of the most commonly proposed "quick fix" ways of making stealth harder, all of which are terrible. I've seen mods with faster alert time, wider enemy viewcones, even a flat pager reduction and re-introducing a small alert radius for silenced weapons, which is just It's hard to say because achievements weren't in from the beginning, but I'm going to assume that "high level stealth play" is enjoyed by something like 0.5% of the entire Payday 2 population. Can someone link me some videos of this high level stealth play? Are there people out there so good that any stealth mission is effortless? I realize I'm a scrub compared to most of you guys so I probably don't represent the target audience of what you're describing. I just know that restarting 50 times isn't fun, especially in a game with such a massive money/exp grind. All 50 of those restarts are straight up wastes of time and it just puts a sour taste in your mouth. Game mechanics should allow you to make mistakes and still be able to continue in some way, unless you're on the hardest difficulty or something. I'm also describing from the perspective of someone who duo's the missions with a friend of mine. Obviously its a different story when you have 4 people. So far the best heist to stealth duo has been Jewelry Store because it just has the two guards (plus the security room guard) so you don't have to worry about the pager hard limit (which, once again, is the shittiest part of the stealth formula). It also has the alarm on display cases for an added wrinkle. The patrols are set up so that eventually the guards and/or the manager end up on their own, but you also have the option of just blasting the two guards simultaneously and both going for the pagers. This heist is good because it has mulitple ways to complete it. Some of the other ones feel like there's one solution. Then there's something like Shadow Heist where the pieces you need might be right next to the entrance, or all the way in the fuckin back. That's what I meant by RNG factoring into the missions. What makes them so frustrating is, once again, the 4 pager hard limit. Not even gonna talk about Mallcrashers. What would have fixed that would be some way to get guards and/or civilians to go somewhere. Like throwing a rock in Far Cry 3 or knocking on a wall in Metal Gear Solid. Just SOME way to distract them. Totally off the top of my head, pay a kid 50 bucks to steal something and run so that the guards chase him. Have a non-masked player engage the guard in some sort of conversation, causing him to look in a different direction. ANYTHING. SolidSnakesBandana fucked around with this message at 12:01 on Mar 16, 2018 |
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Mar 16, 2018 11:56
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The only stealth level I genuinely like is Yacht Heist, the 4 pagers don't feel stifling, new guards don't come, there's plenty of places to duck into and peek from.
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Mar 16, 2018 12:27
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