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crispix posted:Tbh I have very mixed feelings about the language. I'm the same as you, but from the catholic side. Christian Brothers school in the 90s, all catholic, and Irish and French was drummed into us from 11 until 13. And its a loving mess imo. Languages should be taught to us from an earlier age, like everywhere else in the EU and other parts of the world. Expecting us to learn two new languages at once, especially a useless one like Irish, it's no wonder the main hook to learn it is political. At 13 we could select our GCSEs (lol Im old), and holy poo poo no one wanted Irish. They had to force us to take it, and most failed it. I did. Now I am working in the Republic, surrounded by Germans, Swedish, Polish, Russians, Spanish, and I can't understand what they say when they talk to each other, or when their customers talk to me that I could help with. But gently caress that, I can understand a few of the smaller words of badly dubbed Super Ted on TG4!
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# ? Apr 22, 2018 13:26 |
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# ? Jun 3, 2024 23:45 |
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It sure is a hosed up old island, all right.
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# ? Apr 22, 2018 14:51 |
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WeAreTheRomans posted:Also, heartened by the very pro-choice tenor of the 1992 referendums, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_constitutional_referendums,_November_1992 I wouldn't read too much of a pro choice attitude from the 92 referendums, though people read the 12th as restricting suicide as a grounds for termination it also importantly would have inserted permission for termination on other grounds. The full text was: quote:It shall be unlawful to terminate the life of an unborn unless such termination is necessary to save the life, as distinct from the health, of the mother where there is an illness or disorder of the mother giving rise to a real and substantial risk to her life, not being a risk of self-destruction. If I remember correctly the pro life crowd opposed it on the grounds that it would insert a constitutional permission for abortion and they still refused to accept even limited abortion. The 13th was a bit more clear cut cause a lot of people found the treatment of X to be a bit heavy handed. And the 14th was p much forced by Ireland losing Open Door and Dublin Well Women v Ireland at the ECHR Looking at the 25th vote might be more reflective but who knows: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fifth_Amendment_of_the_Constitution_Bill_2002_(Ireland)
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# ? Apr 22, 2018 14:54 |
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kustomkarkommando posted:
Fair enough, I was being uncharacteristically cheery, must be the nice weather. I agree, the 25th is probably a better reflection of trends, still encouraging though.
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# ? Apr 22, 2018 15:02 |
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I'm still a bit loving tetchy about sub-50% yes results and repeated assurances undecideds will break yes considering the mess that was the SSM referendum polling and even the Lisbon polling that were out by over 10% at times.
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# ? Apr 22, 2018 15:25 |
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Those 25th amendment details are horrifying. It came scarily close to passing. And it wasn't even that long ago, it was this century... Rural Ireland really is still dangerously stuck in the 1950s.
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# ? Apr 22, 2018 22:12 |
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The 25th ammendment was a clusterfuck of attempted compromise to try to finally create some kind of framework off the back of the X case after decades of prevarication - so the ProLife crowd where given risk of suicide being dropped as grounds for termination while the ProChoice crowd where offered a legislative definition on the beginning of protection for the unborn being after implantation which would clarify the legality of the morning after pill (which was a fuzzy area). Some prolife groups, youth defence, where against it because "life begins at conception" etc etc There was some lukewarm acceptance from doctors, midwifes etc backing a Yes vote to finally create a workable legislative framework but then Deirdre Conroy (of D v Ireland) had a letter published in the Irish Times detailing her experience with her FFA and pointing out the changes to the laws would do nothing to help women in her position - which forced some of the weak Yes supporters to admit their where significant flaws in the proposal. Probably worth pointing out that since then the Supreme Court ruled in R v R in 2009 that constitutional protection for the unborn in fact does only begin at implantation (in a case dealing with frozen embryos) so the olive branch being offered in 2002 was p lovely
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# ? Apr 22, 2018 22:42 |
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It was v much pitched to voters as the reasonable middle ground solution between the two "extremes" and lord we do know how tiger-era voters lapped that shite up (that still do)
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# ? Apr 22, 2018 22:49 |
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crispix posted:Tbh I have very mixed feelings about the language. I have no problem with it - it seems like a lovely language, but it is hugely political here in NI and I cannot be outside of that. I went to school at an extremely working class (second worse in NI at the time - I was there thanks to selective education, i developed late - seriously, my voice did not break until i was almost 16 years old) protestant school so there was no possibility of teaching there. There was one guy in my year who was catholic and he was "the catholic guy". Anyway, I mean I missed out on learning it at school and since leaving school I have a lot of poo poo to do by way of surviving. I will be honest, if I had the time to invest in achieving fluency in a language I would learn German because it'd make me more indispensable at work. My Dad is from Belfast and moved to Dublin in the 70s. Probably only spoke about 5 words of Irish. In recent years, he and my mother have joined local Gaeilgeoir groups and have begun speaking it quite regularly. If you want more resources, there are the Pop-Up Gaeltacht groups also. WeAreTheRomans posted:In 8th news, I'm continually heartened by the polls irlZaphod fucked around with this message at 09:16 on Apr 23, 2018 |
# ? Apr 23, 2018 09:13 |
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Did someone say posters. Its time for another round of the popular past time of complaining they exist! http://www.thejournal.ie/eighth-amendment-posters-3974693-Apr2018/ quote:68% of the 1,000 Irish adults consulted said there should be a total ban on campaign posters in the run-up to the referendum. File this under the general grumpiness about politics daring to intrude into peoples lives and complaints about how the referendum is "political" alongside all those agonised opeds about people having to explain things to their children
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# ? Apr 24, 2018 18:08 |
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Truly, posters are the flegs, of Politics
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# ? Apr 24, 2018 18:14 |
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I like the posters because they provide reliable and accurate information in a rational manner so that the general population have all they could possibly need to make changes to the laws of the land.
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# ? Apr 24, 2018 19:46 |
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lemonadesweetheart posted:I like the posters because they provide reliable and accurate information in a rational manner so that the general population have all they could possibly need to make changes to the laws of the land. I like when I walk into them and take a pointy corner to the eyeball
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# ? Apr 24, 2018 19:51 |
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lemonadesweetheart posted:I like the posters because they provide reliable and accurate information in a rational manner so that the general population have all they could possibly need to make changes to the laws of the land. I don't think the solution to bad political posters is to ban all posters
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# ? Apr 24, 2018 21:01 |
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Furthermore, without the posters how exactly do you get your bonfire going?! Typical anti protestant bigotry
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# ? Apr 24, 2018 21:02 |
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kustomkarkommando posted:I don't think the solution to bad political posters is to ban all posters It's true, D&D would have been nuked long ago kustomkarkommando posted:Furthermore, without the posters how exactly do you get your bonfire going?! The local North Dublin young fellas around me put in a good showing for the Catholics (?)
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# ? Apr 24, 2018 21:48 |
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WeAreTheRomans posted:I like when I walk into them and take a pointy corner to the eyeball
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# ? Apr 24, 2018 22:11 |
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Never actually looked at all those failed constitutional amendments. There sure are some doozies in there... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amendments_to_the_Constitution_of_Ireland 2 attempts to change from STV to FPTP. (3rd & 4th) Another reason to hate that conservative/theocratic/patriarchal prick de Valera.
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# ? Apr 25, 2018 13:40 |
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Bedshaped posted:Never actually looked at all those failed constitutional amendments. There sure are some doozies in there... If FPTP had gone through we'd be even shitter than the UK now, no chance of being a socially moderate first-world economy e: in daily abortion news at Jim Jefferies deciding to gently caress with Justin Barrett by making him fly to London https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Pk1d0ob1w Icing, on the cake? Barrett crying about it on twitter https://twitter.com/JustinBarrettNP/status/989113872891117568 I can even forgive the fact that it's (a) not funny and (b) has a horrendous laughtrack WeAreTheRomans fucked around with this message at 18:59 on Apr 25, 2018 |
# ? Apr 25, 2018 18:18 |
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kustomkarkommando posted:Furthermore, without the posters how exactly do you get your bonfire going?! I brought a wooden pallet back to our local Home Depot the other day. I felt bad, thinking of all the bonfires it could have fed.
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# ? Apr 25, 2018 21:12 |
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Did anyone watch the LateLate last night? Never watch it anyway but would have been curious to see how they would have handled it
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# ? Apr 28, 2018 09:32 |
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Together for yes put out a really, really strong showing imo. They had Peter Boylan talking and a really good doctor from TMFR. Vote no ran with Wendy Grace and another woman I can’t remember the name of. They did the usual thing, lied through their teeth and no-one really called them out on it. Trotted out Mary (the one on the posters) who told a different story than she had on Clair Byrne again.
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# ? Apr 28, 2018 09:51 |
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Another poll for the poll pile, new Red C in the Sunday Business Post today also https://twitter.com/oconnellhugh/status/990494744584310785 5% dip in confirmed support for 12 weeks is a bit disheartening - seen a good bit of speculation in the Irish Times and elsewhere that legislation may not be put forward until the Autumn which might mean an election first (i don't think anyone is thinking the confidence and supply arrangement is gonna survive past the next budget). An election run with the 12 week issue at its core ain't gonna be pretty outside Dublin
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# ? Apr 29, 2018 14:55 |
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If repeal does pass, how much do you want to bet that the HSE will make an absolute balls of getting the necessary services up and running?
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# ? May 8, 2018 19:42 |
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Noticeable increase in No posters over the weekend, got to spend those American donor dollars somehow now that they can't buy Facebook ads. I drove through the midlands yesterday and saw hardly any Yes posters and a lot of No. Starting to feel like I've just been in a Dublin bubble. I'm getting worried about undecideds being bombarded with photos of 6-month-old babies and paintings of full term infants in birthing position with '6 months' written above them.
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# ? May 15, 2018 11:44 |
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Yeah I've seen a noticeable increase in No posters down here in Limerick over the weekend, and there were already way more in key locations before the increase. Before the online ban I was being pummeled with No ads before Google got the message. I have a feeling the No side will win, as both my parents are openly declaring they'll vote No, when they've never ever revealed their voting preferences before. Couple that with Harris hammering the phrase "unrestricted abortion" on the airwaves around a fortnight ago and more strenuous requirements to register to vote (Garda signature, I don't remember having to do this ten years ago), I'm a little worried. Didn't help that my 30 year old work colleague, who has never voted before, gave up on registering, because the process was time-consuming.
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# ? May 15, 2018 12:04 |
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How is it time consuming?
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# ? May 15, 2018 13:09 |
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He had to go to a Garda station (5 mins away from work) to get it stamped, then drop it off at Ennis. Taking the guts of two hours out of his day was too much. I imagine a lot of younger people are like this.
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# ? May 15, 2018 13:25 |
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Could have posted it to Ennis I think.
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# ? May 15, 2018 13:29 |
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Anecdotally, the couple of people I've chatted to doing yes campaigning in Donegal and Sligo aren't overly confident of a win there - but I don't think that's massively surprising
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# ? May 15, 2018 13:47 |
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School Nickname posted:He had to go to a Garda station (5 mins away from work) to get it stamped, then drop it off at Ennis. Taking the guts of two hours out of his day was too much. I imagine a lot of younger people are like this. I don't recall it requiring attending a garda station before. I tried update my address on the registry and decided against it when I found out I'd have to go get a Garda stamp. I'll just pop into my old polling station as it is in the city.
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# ? May 15, 2018 14:41 |
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kustomkarkommando posted:Anecdotally, the couple of people I've chatted to doing yes campaigning in Donegal and Sligo aren't overly confident of a win there - but I don't think that's massively surprising I'd be amazed if Roscommon voted Yes anyway
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# ? May 15, 2018 14:46 |
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I think its going to be very close. It'll probably come down to if the Yes campaign can get voter turnout high enough in the young urban population.
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# ? May 15, 2018 15:41 |
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But old people love voting!
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# ? May 15, 2018 15:42 |
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I know, thats the problem If you Nordies would just take Cavan, Monaghan and Donegal into NI it would really help out. Do your part!
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# ? May 15, 2018 16:15 |
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https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/rté-referendum-debate-sees-all-sides-trade-abuse-1.3495237%22 posted:Obstetrician John Monaghan suggested Dr Boylan go back to school and learn about the foetus. Dr Boylan had said the foetus was not fully developed at 12 weeks. Dr Monaghan said “there is nothing new after 12 weeks and if you don’t know that maybe you need to go back to school. If people can say this stuff without being laughed off stage then I'm worried. Apparently the argument is that 'all the organs are there' at 12 weeks. No matter that the foetus isn't in any way viable outside the body at that point.
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# ? May 15, 2018 21:48 |
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That debate was a poo poo show. RTE have really done the yes side no favours. They let the no side spout off nonsense and untruths without challenge, and allowed them to shout down the yes response.
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# ? May 15, 2018 22:32 |
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jacksbrat posted:If people can say this stuff without being laughed off stage then I'm worried. Apparently the argument is that 'all the organs are there' at 12 weeks. No matter that the foetus isn't in any way viable outside the body at that point. What the actual gently caress. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prenatal_development#Fetal_period This guy probably made a six figure salary.
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# ? May 15, 2018 23:08 |
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A poll for the poll gods https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/996995197128138752?s=20 Also speaking of Sligo https://mobile.twitter.com/N_Five_One_B_U/status/997019807261319168
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# ? May 17, 2018 10:33 |
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# ? Jun 3, 2024 23:45 |
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The media polls are underestimating how much the 'undecideds' are going to break for 'no' I think. My anecdotal experience is the people saying "don't know" or "undecided" to me are all actually shy 'no' voters. I have a few friends involved in the 'Yes' campaign and they also apparently expect the undecideds to break 3:1 for 'no'. Its going to be close.
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# ? May 17, 2018 10:52 |