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the default assumption should always be confirmation bias unless someone actually does code diving, to be honest people are really, really bad at trying to 'look in' at an RNG system and determine if it's fair or not, like, literally awful. it's how brains are wired.
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May 5, 2018 21:42
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Psion posted:the default assumption should always be confirmation bias unless someone actually does code diving, to be honest RNG or not it isn't exactly good game design? Like in XCOM I can look at a move and know exactly how it's going to play out. The two enemies that can fire on him do combined 8 damage, I have 9 HP, as long as neither crit he should be fine. This is a calculated move I can make. Sometimes you make bad calls and expose a 3rd enemy. Sometimes they get that crit. Sometimes you gently caress up. That's fine. That's "XCOM." In Battletech I've had matches where a Cicada rolled up, hit my Heavy/Assault and got a lucky crit on the CT and boom, Mechwarrior down. Felt like I hosed up, but in a good way. That's Battletech! In Battletech I've had dudes melee me/DFA me and get a head critical. Mechwarrior down. Again, it's my fuckup. That's Battletech! In both cases I could have, and I should have done better. I had ways of mitigating that, or doing it better/differently that I didn't use properly. I learned from those experiences, and they happen super rarely in the campaign. For a 1% chance to headshot, I've had numerous missions now where I've gotten 3 LRM Head Hits in a row and it didn't feel good. Hell, I've had numerous missions where I'll just get Head Hits from way offscreen on the first turn. I tend to get 3-5 Head Hits per match. Meanwhile I've never scored a single Head Hit despite having a SRM boat and a LRM boat and dumping constantly. It feels skewed even outside of confirmation bias. But hell, even if it's right, it's not fun. Getting a bad hit like that doesn't make me feel like I hosed up, it makes me feel like the game is bullshit, because there was nothing I could have done to counter that. No better planning, no "that's Battletech.". Just gently caress you, here's some head hits.
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May 5, 2018 21:51
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AI uses a lot of poo poo that has multiple rolls. Like any given locust is throwing eleven dice to hit that 1%.
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May 5, 2018 21:52
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It's not good or bad design - some games are inherently more deterministic than others. Battle Brothers is a great mercenary company game where RANDOM DECAPITATION happens and you just lose people. The problem I think Battletech has is that because you see Mechs rather than Mechwarriors and because mechwarriors don't get that distinctive you never get attached to them. Everyone remembers losing Dekker and probably the other members of the original squad - you probably don't remember the others.
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May 5, 2018 21:55
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I have Behemoth run in to punch the last mech to death on a mission, figuring the red pips on the ground are for geothermal. She gets crushed underneath the dropship.
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May 5, 2018 21:55
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Skippy McPants posted:Lancer (Bulwark, Multi, Breach) definitely seems like the best all-around skill set, but tactics is useful enough that I generally want at least one Vanguard. But Bulwark + Good At Guns seems to be the safest 'Eh, who cares what they are driving or what my tactics are' combo. Plus Bulwark and Multishot are skills you can feed an off the shelf 2/3/etc rookie in short order. I'm sure I'll be regretting my commander skill picks once enough time passes and enough tonnage enters my mechbay. Feeling jealous of my (hopefully) NPC Ace Pilot grasshoppers going hog wild. But Bulwark+Multishot is certainly feeling worthwhile in my early game Enforcer. "Commander, how the gently caress did you come out of Weldry with every torso exposed, missing most of your head armor, and STILL not have anything blown up?" "Well maybe if ANYONE ELSE could make their loving called shots, I wouldn't NEED to come back into LRM range to finish off the Trebuchet and Jagermech myself  I don't pay these guys to have more called shot bonuses than I do for their random commando headcapping."kater posted:AI uses a lot of poo poo that has multiple rolls. Like any given locust is throwing eleven dice to hit that 1%. "Okay guys, we have range on the Demolisher and can disable them at our leisure-OH gently caress IT'S A LOCUST! I don't want to go back to the hospita-MOTHER FUCKER" Section Z fucked around with this message at 22:00 on May 5, 2018 |
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May 5, 2018 21:57
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in addition to everything else, doesn't this game's dice have both a streakbreaker AND a spread-squash (shots displayed as 85% are closer to 74% behind the scenes, opposite direction at less than 50% shots--'cause nailing bad shots feels good i guess???? or maybe to balance the ai's lovely tactical judgment/lack of Reserve power) so fairness doesn't really enter into it anymore 
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May 5, 2018 21:58
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Alchenar posted:It's not good or bad design - some games are inherently more deterministic than others. Battle Brothers is a great mercenary company game where RANDOM DECAPITATION happens and you just lose people. Also, part of the meta strategy of this game is dealing with it when poo poo goes wrong, which is why sometimes poo poo just goes wrong.
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May 5, 2018 22:00
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Every time I build a mech I seem to end up with either all LRMs and no armor, or all Medium Lasers and SRMs. Perhaps an occasional AC20. Building anything with a preferred range in between those two just doesn't feel viable with the current numbers.
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May 5, 2018 22:01
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Rookersh posted:RNG or not it isn't exactly good game design? Gambit: "that's Battletech Mon Cheri"
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May 5, 2018 22:06
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Given the combination of number of attacks and action economy, 1% is too high imo. On the other end, standing at a downed mechs head and getting a 2% chance to hit is p dumb. I still love this game though. Just have to adjust to its Byzantine internal logic.
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May 5, 2018 22:07
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Tae posted:It's not like Adam Jensen has any future employment 
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May 5, 2018 22:10
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Well it's true. His employment is almost 1000 years in the past.
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May 5, 2018 22:11
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Ciaphas posted:in addition to everything else, doesn't this game's dice have both a streakbreaker AND a spread-squash (shots displayed as 85% are closer to 74% behind the scenes, opposite direction at less than 50% shots--'cause nailing bad shots feels good i guess???? or maybe to balance the ai's lovely tactical judgment/lack of Reserve power) https://www.reddit.com/r/Battletechgame/comments/8gjr3j/displayed_hit_percentages_above_50_are_boosted/
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May 5, 2018 22:13
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Insert name here posted:You got it the wrong way around: shots above 50% are boosted and shots below 50% are penalized drat it, i was intelligent once  
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May 5, 2018 22:22
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Insert name here posted:You got it the wrong way around: shots above 50% are boosted and shots below 50% are penalized To be fair someone posted this on Reddit the other way first, it got corrected later Nion posted:Every time I build a mech I seem to end up with either all LRMs and no armor, or all Medium Lasers and SRMs. Perhaps an occasional AC20. Building anything with a preferred range in between those two just doesn't feel viable with the current numbers. Congrats you can do simple arithmetic and are smarter than 90% of the grognards who are feverishly nerfing the AC5 for the crime of not being 100% terrible to use all the time.
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May 5, 2018 22:26
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Wizard Styles posted:
Mech should be named the "Garrus".
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May 5, 2018 22:32
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Nion posted:Every time I build a mech I seem to end up with either all LRMs and no armor, or all Medium Lasers and SRMs. Perhaps an occasional AC20. Building anything with a preferred range in between those two just doesn't feel viable with the current numbers. I've been adopting an AC20 and then melee approach for everything other than my black knight...the black knight is all medium and small lasers (it out discos the hunchback).
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May 5, 2018 22:39
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ulmont posted:I've been adopting an AC20 and then melee approach for everything other than my black knight...the black knight is all medium and small lasers (it out discos the hunchback). Medium Lasers++ with +10 Damage are hilariously broken on the hunchback. 180 Damage/round forever? Don't mind if I do.
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May 5, 2018 22:45
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I must be broken, I'm running very light on energy weapons, usually I pack an AC/5 or /10 and a bevvy of SRMs on Mechs that aren't designated LRM throwers. Though I'm rolling in improved ACs and SRM packs, aint found poo poo for even + MLas'. Arrath fucked around with this message at 22:48 on May 5, 2018 |
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May 5, 2018 22:45
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I'm getting a patch, anyone have the notes? It's almost 800 MB Also I hate when developers gently caress with to-hit percentages. Just show what they are, it's fun to watch babies cry about it.
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May 5, 2018 22:46
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Arrath posted:I must be broken, I'm running very light on energy weapons, usually I pack an AC/5 or /10 and a bevvy of SRMs on Mechs that aren't designated LRM throwers. The heat output on the Large Lasers and PPCs makes them a tough fit, but mediums and smalls are very efficient, and add up to a lot on something like the disco Hunchback or the Grasshopper.
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May 5, 2018 22:50
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Outfit a grasshopper with nothing but lasers on night missions and host disco parties.
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May 5, 2018 22:53
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I'm running mediums+smalls+JJs on all my brawler mechs and the stand up snipers are all PPC+LRMs (except for Gauss+LRM+LL highlander). I love my dumb triple LRM5, double PPC Orion, that thing is a beast. Until I hit the heavy and assault only phase of the game I never stopped using the triple AC5 Jagermech, Behemoth was basically living in it for 80% of the game.
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May 5, 2018 23:02
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Huh. I never thought of putting 3 AC5s on the Jaeger. The asymmetry would drive me nuts.
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May 5, 2018 23:05
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Eej posted:Headshots are base 1% chance and if you are always fighting 4v8 or more than you should expect to see twice as many received headshots than you deal out per mission. Is this per weapon or overall? Because if its per weapon enemies generally have larger numbers of shittier weapons so there's more chance of a cockpit hit.
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May 5, 2018 23:07
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I'm still trying to find an assault mech so I popped in a trap mission just to see if it was worth doing. The main pack is demolisher, shreck, LRM carrier, manticore - ouch enough but the reinforcements that spawn right next to them are an LRM jaeger, catapult C1 (LRMs) and a grasshopper. I rather fancy the catapult but it's not going to be fun wasing through the poo poo to get it.
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May 5, 2018 23:10
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Got my first assault, a banshee, what do I do with it? It comes by default with 2 ppc and that seems underwhelming. Maybe like 8mlas and 5-6 small lasers?
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May 5, 2018 23:11
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The Banshee or Zeus: Which is a sicker joke on the driver?
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May 5, 2018 23:12
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Night10194 posted:The Banshee or Zeus: Which is a sicker joke on the driver? The Banshee, a Zeus can at least be a sick joke with lrms.
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May 5, 2018 23:19
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OddObserver posted:The heat output on the Large Lasers and PPCs makes them a tough fit, but mediums and smalls are very efficient, and add up to a lot on something like the disco Hunchback or the Grasshopper. Well I just fitted out a Grasshopper with max JJs 7 MLas and 6 MGs. So here goes. Max armor on this thing leaves 0.19 tons free wtf is that.
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May 5, 2018 23:20
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Rookersh posted:RNG or not it isn't exactly good game design? XCOM is a really bad example for this because every difficulty level below Legendary actually has a hidden bonus to the player's chance to hit so your hit % is higher than what is actually shown on screen. Party Plane Jones posted:Is this per weapon or overall? Because if its per weapon enemies generally have larger numbers of shittier weapons so there's more chance of a cockpit hit. Yep I forgot to mention that stock mechs tend to have more weapons which means more chances at random glancing blows to the head.
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May 5, 2018 23:28
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I've noticed that MGs are really good at rolling random head hits for similar reasons probably
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May 5, 2018 23:30
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I just got a Victor for my first assault from a lucky head shot ... not really sure what to make of it, even with the AC20 it seems underwhelming for an "assault".
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May 5, 2018 23:30
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Less armor, jump jets and heat sinks means more guns!
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May 5, 2018 23:33
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Ciaphas posted:I don't think there's sufficient appreciation in this thread for how loving rad the OST for this game is It is really really good
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May 5, 2018 23:40
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Sonderval posted:I just got a Victor for my first assault from a lucky head shot ... not really sure what to make of it, even with the AC20 it seems underwhelming for an "assault". In this game, the Victor, Zeus, and Battlemaster all have the same free tonnage as the Onion and Black Knight so all you're getting on them is a bit more armor and fewer guns (because more weight spent on armor). But hey, at least they're not the Banshee!
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May 5, 2018 23:41
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Eej posted:XCOM is a really bad example for this because every difficulty level below Legendary actually has a hidden bonus to the player's chance to hit so your hit % is higher than what is actually shown on screen. There's this, but they also said "as long as nobody crits" well, there are a lot more shots going off in any given round of BT and you're gonna get crits, especially when some weapons are dedicated critseekers. This is how BT works. taking pilot hits is just poo poo happens, that's why you have a medbay. Don't even stress on them. Now headcaps, those are something where it's specifically been tuned to prevent all but a very few weapons from being able to one-hit you straight to dead, and that's (i mean, obviously) intentional
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May 5, 2018 23:41
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Skippy McPants posted:In this game, the Victor, Zeus, and Battlemaster all have the same free tonnage as the Onion and Black Knight so all you're getting on them is a bit more armor and fewer guns (because more weight spent on armor). I want an onion mech.
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May 5, 2018 23:42
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Tarezax posted:I've noticed that MGs are really good at rolling random head hits for similar reasons probably
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