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Back when I actually actively played TT, I made it a point that customizing standard mechs (with clan tech) is hard as gently caress. As in the mech you like is out of commission for months, it costs triple the repair costs and any other weird effects I could add. This usually meant that people I played with only swapped maybe one or two weapons at all. Though it's fun building your death vehicle of +3 nerd killing, doing so really fucks the game up and I try not to encourage it. So I guess my point is that TT clans tech fucks poo poo up and make things too easy.
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May 10, 2018 20:23
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| # ? May 31, 2024 00:19 |
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Clan PPCs were 15 heat. Which was part of the problem with energy weapons in BattleTech as a general rule: 1:1 damage/heat is very efficient which was why the PPC's heat in this game was pushed up.
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May 10, 2018 20:27
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Major Spag posted:Back when I actually actively played TT, I made it a point that customizing standard mechs (with clan tech) is hard as gently caress. As in the mech you like is out of commission for months, it costs triple the repair costs and any other weird effects I could add. This usually meant that people I played with only swapped maybe one or two weapons at all. Though it's fun building your death vehicle of +3 nerd killing, doing so really fucks the game up and I try not to encourage it. Makes sense. I mean, it's an entirely different tech base, there's gotta be all sorts of technical gremlins in there trying to make clantech play nice with spheremech.
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May 10, 2018 20:29
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I modded my game to have the weapons generate 4 heat for every 1 in BT while keeping the heatsinks at -3. Also toying around with having pulse lasers being able to ignore at least some evasion pips without having any increased general accuracy.
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May 10, 2018 20:29
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I'm still trying to see the reason to take things like PPCs, Large Lasers, AC2s, or AC5s. Medium lasers are by far the best energy weapon, AC10s and AC20s are great for direct damage, and a lot of folks here like SRMs while l love LRM boats. So where do you use the less popular weapons? PPCs in particular seem like a challenge for me to want to put anywhere.
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May 10, 2018 20:35
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AC5s are more efficient for the tonnage than AC10s and probably the best long range gun in the game aside from like, the gauss and LRM boating
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May 10, 2018 20:37
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On one hand the Clans being unbalanced is an integral part of the experience. If the Clan storyline features us as an IS unit you can easily represent it by making it the way the Clans were supposed to be played: inferior numbers in superior equipment that are easily outwitted because they have no clue how to actually fight a war. Like you can easily get a unit around to their rear because the dumb stupid Clanner doesn't consider that Mech a threat yet. Include poo poo like lying when they make their Batchall and setting traps on the battlefield. As the campaign progresses and you salvage more and more Clan gear they start increasing the numbers and stopping the stupid honor tactics until they reach parity in units and finally, like this game, more units. Or have you fighting their dezgra second line units with ramshackle Mechs. On the other hand yeah if you can rebalance them in a way that keeps them in spirit to the tabletop but less stupid by all means do it.
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May 10, 2018 20:39
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This is probably the only BT/MW game I've ever played where AC/5s are worthwhile
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May 10, 2018 20:40
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Clans are stupid and I hope they retcon/reboot them in some way that makes them less stupid; Succession Wars eras are the best.
Unormal fucked around with this message at 20:43 on May 10, 2018 |
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May 10, 2018 20:40
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:I'm still trying to see the reason to take things like PPCs, Large Lasers, AC2s, or AC5s. Medium lasers are by far the best energy weapon, AC10s and AC20s are great for direct damage, and a lot of folks here like SRMs while l love LRM boats. So where do you use the less popular weapons? PPCs in particular seem like a challenge for me to want to put anywhere. Never really used medium lasers, to be honest. I have them peppered as a way to eat up energy hard points and some tonnage all over my units, but they're also the first weapon I throw out if I need some extra-armor or heat sinks. For some reason I'm mostly fighting at ranges where medium lasers can't fire, anyway. Or they have lovely to-hit values and in the few times I got to use them, half the time I have to switch them off in a turn so my main weapons can fire without overheating. And I'm still using the AC2s of my Blackjack and use improved AC5s on my Shadowhawks to great effect. SRMs and LRMs are also something I like, so they get used. PPCs are my favorite, anyway. Really, now that I think about it, MGs are the only weapon I don't really see the point of, since small lasers exist and don't come with explosives strapped to your mech. Everything else I found a use for. 
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May 10, 2018 20:47
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MGs are just as good at blowing up someone's ammo as they are at exploding your mech. They also cost 0 heat and that makes them easier to use constantly on a fast-jumping backstabbing Firestarter.
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May 10, 2018 20:48
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MG's can crit like motherfuckers, it's great.
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May 10, 2018 20:49
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Finished the campaign: of the original pilots, only Dekker survived to the final scenario, and he ended up the only one being wounded. A few contributions to the ongoing discussions: 1. In addition to a minor reduction in LRM stab damage to make PCCs and ACs more useful for capturing mechs, I think that indirect LRM fire needs modification. At present it's strictly superior to direct-fire LRM shots: you have an increased chance of hitting the head, and it's less likely that the AI can fire back. I think indirect LRM fire should do less stability damage than direct fire, because shots hitting the top of a mech aren't going to knock it off-balance as badly as shots hitting front/back/sides. That forces some harder decisions both about positioning your LRMboat and about whether to armor it. 2. The easiest way to give lighter mechs a role in the later game is to have some missions on Ice terrain, where mechs above a certain weight will go through the ice. But really, there's no way to force late game lighter mech usage: the few merc missions that call for them are the same ones that players seem to be skipping, like the convoy destruction mission. 3. On the whole Bulwark/evasion question, I think there's a few points where parity breaks down that are causing design problems. Evasion means you probably don't get hit, but with a high volume of fire (especially from missiles) it ends up meaning you get hit less frequently, versus taking half damage from everything, and you're also taking full stability damage from every impact. As others have pointed out, a bulwarked heavy mech can possibly tank fire from two lances, where an evading medium or light isn't going to be able to dodge that many hits thanks to evasion degrading after every shot. Even worse, unless you're playing some deep initiative games, the last shots coming in on that evading mech are going to be the biggest ones. Add that your mechs depending upon evasion can likely take fewer hits before they lose parts, and most players are likely to go for the choice that's more obviously safe. Evasion can be countered by Sensor Lock, volume of fire, or inducing instability in the target mech. Bulwark is countered by Breaching Shot (but for that shot only), melee attacks, or actually knocking down the target mech. It also makes a knockdown somewhat harder. The issue here is that Breaching Shot limits the damage you're inflicting on the target mech that turn, and it doesn't REMOVE bulwark. Melee attacks also involve a damage tradeoff unless your mech is kitted out for DFA or melee attacking, and it's a bad solution in many instances as the attacking mech is most likely exposed to counterfire. Also, the AI seems to love standing up that formerly-bulwarked mech with no arms and kicking out your cockpit. I think making bulwark's damage blocking effect (guarded?) countered by instability, not knockdown, might help address the problem, but there's still the overall issue that removing bulwark's effects means doing less damage while possibly exposing a mech to counterattack, while evasion doesn't require doing very much different except maybe letting the LRMboat fire first. It's hard to say the extent to which the imbalance is psychological versus actual, but I'm sure somebody has the time and interest to crunch some numbers and determine some average damage numbers for evading vs bulwarked mechs.
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May 10, 2018 20:50
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Every single Support Weapon secretly rules.
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May 10, 2018 20:50
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Machine guns are decent in groups. Like 4 with one ammo box. I seem to get a decent amount of pilot hits with them, and of course some equipment destruction. 1mg plus ammo for 1.5 tons is not good at all though, in my opinion.
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May 10, 2018 20:52
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Yeah, Small Lasers are a way better choice for 'I only have 2 support slots'.
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May 10, 2018 20:53
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Medium lasers and MGs are great (though, as others have pointed out, all the support weapons are pretty sweet and yeah, machine guns are better in groups wrt ammo). Large Lasers are my #1 "why?" weapon. So much heat, so much tonnage, no stability damage...
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May 10, 2018 20:55
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Night10194 posted:Yeah, Small Lasers are a way better choice for 'I only have 2 support slots'. Yeah, and it's a shame that many mechs seem pretty low on support overall.
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May 10, 2018 20:56
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Narsham posted:At present it's strictly superior to direct-fire LRM shots: you have an increased chance of hitting the head, Is this actually true or is it similar to the belief that missiles can hit the head multiple times per salvo
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May 10, 2018 20:56
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I did find a use for two large lasers on one of the highlander. It's something to fire while closing distance for some SRM shower. That's also a nasty alpha strike if the mech has no heat.
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May 10, 2018 20:58
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Libluini posted:Never really used medium lasers, to be honest. I have them peppered as a way to eat up energy hard points and some tonnage all over my units, but they're also the first weapon I throw out if I need some extra-armor or heat sinks. MGs are fantastic because they get three hit rolls for every time you shoot, which means you have a LOT of chances to hit someone in the head. They're great for seeking out crits. AC2s and AC5s I can't seem to get into. Maybe I'm just hyper-focused on wanting to do as much damage as possible, which medium lasers excel at once you focus fire.
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May 10, 2018 21:01
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:MGs are fantastic because they get three hit rolls for every time you shoot, which means you have a LOT of chances to hit someone in the head. They're great for seeking out crits. And other things!
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May 10, 2018 21:17
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May 10, 2018 21:20
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:MGs are fantastic because they get three hit rolls for every time you shoot, which means you have a LOT of chances to hit someone in the head. They're great for seeking out crits. AC2s suck and will always suck unless you're plinking lights from far range. AC5s are PPCs that trade heat for ammo. AC5s own. pangstrom posted:Medium lasers and MGs are great (though, as others have pointed out, all the support weapons are pretty sweet and yeah, machine guns are better in groups wrt ammo). Large Lasers are my #1 "why?" weapon. So much heat, so much tonnage, no stability damage... LLs were preventatively nerfed to proactively safeguard against the inevitable ER LL and CLPL menace.
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May 10, 2018 21:25
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Last night, my wife called to me to read to her so she could go to sleep. I gave her a bunch of poo poo choices (my top 4 currently-reading books in my kindle) and she picked "decision at thunder rift", one of the battletech books someone recommended ITT a while ago. Anyway, I have this weird ... thing... where in movies or whatever I say "wait a minute who is that guy?" and a character on-screen will say "this man is <xyz> who did <abc> and is important because <ij>". Or I'll say "why are they doing this again?" and on-screen some actor will say "we need to do this because blah blah blah". We joke about it because it's my 'superpower.' (This is SA so I know I need to say this: it's a joke. it's coincidence. I know I don't have a superpower) Anyway, she hasn't read the book and I'm like 1/4 of the way through so I explained some stuff as I was reading. To paraphrase: "he rubbed mud on his face and all over his hair" *stops reading "oh you see everyone on the planet has dark hair so he's disguising himself, fyi." *reads* "to fit in with the natives who all had dark hair" wife: <laughs for like 2 minutes straight> "he wanted to get back to the space port" *stops reading* "pirates invaded and took over the space port and castle you see" *starts reading* "after the pirates had invaded and took over the space port and castle". I stopped explaining stuff at that point.
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May 10, 2018 21:28
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The mind of a seriously disturbed individual, ladies and gentlemen.
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May 10, 2018 21:34
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If you kept going you could've spent the entire night constantly repeating yourself
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May 10, 2018 21:37
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:MGs are fantastic because they get three hit rolls for every time you shoot, which means you have a LOT of chances to hit someone in the head. They're great for seeking out crits. Oh, I know MGs have their uses in certain situations, I just hate them irrationally.
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May 10, 2018 21:39
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I increased the range on MGs for no other reason than to see their visual effects fly out for longer.
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May 10, 2018 21:42
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I just fired a srm that missed and hit a mountain like a mile away. Short range my rear end 
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May 10, 2018 21:47
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You know what I really want? Rotary Auto-cannons. Should be possible to mod them in, right? basically an AC5/AC2 that fires 6 shots like an SRM6, but with less damage per shot and more total heat.
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May 10, 2018 21:51
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Eldragon posted:You know what I really want? Rotary Auto-cannons. Should be possible to mod them in, right? basically an AC5/AC2 that fires 6 shots like an SRM6, but with less damage per shot and more total heat. https://www.nexusmods.com/battletech/mods/67
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May 10, 2018 21:55
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Nexusmods? Have they put big ol tiddies on the mechs yet? I'm asking for a friend.
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May 10, 2018 21:55
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Eldragon posted:You know what I really want? Rotary Auto-cannons. Should be possible to mod them in, right? basically an AC5/AC2 that fires 6 shots like an SRM6, but with less damage per shot and more total heat. Should be. Weapons have a "ShotsWhenFired" variable that dictates how many attacks a weapon makes when you fire with it. SRMs, LRMs, and MGs are the only weapons with a ShotsWhenFired value higher than 1. The "ProjectilesWhenShot" variable seems to be cosmetic, and determines whether your AC is a multi-shot type or a single-shot type. It is also possible to make MRMs, which someone did, and LB-X Autocannons (albeit only in shotgun mode). e: oh how bout that
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May 10, 2018 21:57
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Xarbala posted:Should be. Weapons have a "ShotsWhenFired" variable that dictates how many attacks a weapon makes when you fire with it. SRMs, LRMs, and MGs are the only weapons with a ShotsWhenFired value higher than 1. The "ProjectilesWhenShot" variable seems to be cosmetic, and determines whether your AC is a multi-shot type or a single-shot type. Didn't realize nexus was up and running for this game. Although I Might just roll my own and replace the default AC5 with a multi-shot version to minimum  Stats on that "Heavy Autocannon" "Type": "Autocannon", "WeaponSubType": "AC20", "MinRange": 0, "MaxRange": 300, "Rangesplit": [200,200,300], "AmmoCategory": "AC5", "StartingAmmoCapacity": 0, "HeatGenerated": 35, "HeatGenerated": 35, "Damage": 25, "OverheatedDamageMultiplier": 0, "EvasiveDamageMultiplier": 0, "EvasivePipsIgnored": 0, "DamageVariance": 0, "HeatDamage": 0, "AccuracyModifier": 0, "CriticalChanceMultiplier": 1, "AOECapable": false, "IndirectFireCapable": false, "RefireModifier": 2, "ShotsWhenFired": 5, "ProjectilesPerShot": 5, "AttackRecoil": 5, "Instability": 5, Eldragon fucked around with this message at 22:11 on May 10, 2018 |
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May 10, 2018 22:03
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Kurr de la Cruz posted:Nexusmods? Have they put big ol tiddies on the mechs yet? I'm asking for a friend. I will not be satisfied until I can pilot Aphrodite from Tranzor Z.
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May 10, 2018 22:04
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Eldragon posted:Didn't realize nexus was up and running for this game. Although I Might just roll my own and replace the default AC5 with a multi-shot version to minimum Download the mod and then edit the file. Adding weapons that show up in shops and stuff is trickier
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May 10, 2018 22:06
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RBA Starblade posted:I just fired a srm that missed and hit a mountain like a mile away. Short range my rear end
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May 10, 2018 22:09
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Didn't see a post but a new beta patch went out today that among other things fixes the external High/Low Spirits bug.
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May 10, 2018 22:18
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Radio Free Kobold posted:Makes sense. I mean, it's an entirely different tech base, there's gotta be all sorts of technical gremlins in there trying to make clantech play nice with spheremech. Well yes and no. They're both Star League tech, but ones been developed since and the other hasnt. More like putting a 21st century glass cockpit in an OG B52 or something. Which is a thing which has been done, actually.
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May 10, 2018 22:34
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