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kingcom posted:Okay but like I said, I have no interest in doing a dungeon crawl and since so many of the wotc adventures have a big ol' dungeon crawl in them, I have no reason to really run through them. e: oh no beaten by monster envy the shame
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Jun 4, 2018 09:18
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in my experience, these large sprawling dungeons tend to have a couple of glaring issues: * if you're using a random generator to create them, they tend to be way too empty: according to the original AD&D 1e DMG, you're supposed to roll a d20 to determine a room's contents, and 1-12 are empty. D&D 3.0's DMG isn't much better, with 42% of rooms not having any monsters, nor traps, nor treasure. D&D 5e's DMG actually improves on this, with only 8% of rooms being completely empty, but then that leads us to ... * ... if your dungeon is moderately well-stocked, which tends to happen with hand-crafted dungeons, it then becomes very difficult, as a practical matter, to put together the map versus the room-content-description versus all the different room relationships into a cohesive whole. If the map is on page 1, and the room descriptions are fifty pages long, any DM is guaranteed to just run the thing as a room-by-room, encounter-by-encounter checklist, rather than as a more reactive ecosystem or inhabited facility because there's too many factors to keep track of otherwise. This would be fine in a more old-school game where the point is to get as much gold as possible and player agency is centered around which next room to try to go down as they push their luck, but then that leads us to ... * ... if the advancement system is based largely on monster kills and/or plot advancement, then you don't really need the dungeon to be that sprawling because all the poo poo that's NOT the McGuffin is going to be ignored as soon as the McGuffin actually is found and retrieved.
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Jun 4, 2018 09:34
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The AD&D empty room thing is OK if you're being strict enough with the time/resource sub-game that took an extra 30 minutes can be as bad as had to get in a fight. Noncombat dungeon movement was at 10' per " of movement per 10 minute turn. Humans have a move of 12". They move 120' through the dungeon in 10 minutes. (e: Or is it 9"? If it is, it's 90'/turn). The Light spell has a duration of 1 turn per level of the caster. Find Traps has a duration of 3 turns. Torches burn for 6 turns. A pint of lamp oil burns for 24 turns in a lamp. Mapping and casually examining a 20x20 room takes 1 turn. Thoroughly searching it takes another turn. Elector_Nerdlingen fucked around with this message at 11:15 on Jun 4, 2018 |
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Jun 4, 2018 11:06
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Undermountain is still a great megadungeon, sorry. You can not like it, but it's a fantastic setting for a game with factions, varied rooms, etc. It's easy to have your eyes glaze over looking at this huge loving thing, but it's easy as hell to cut out chunks of this map and use it. You see this map and immediately think your players have to scour every room for something, when this was made at a time when the novelty was to go sniff out where the treasure is. There's a disconnect that a lot of people in this thread aren't perceiving.
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Jun 4, 2018 14:29
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We see it it's just an artifact at this point and like AlphaDog and others have pointed out, with the way 5e plays fast and loose with some things throwing this out there without a thoughtful conversion is just more lazy lovely work in the name of nostalgia.
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Jun 4, 2018 16:16
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I think D&D probably works better as a dungeon crawler than trying to hammer it into a low-rent narrative game - the new adventure might be okay. I'm expecting a lot of "room with generic MM monsters" though. I'd rather run in BX or SotDL than this though - I think they fit the type of gameplay AlphaDog describes perfectly.
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Jun 4, 2018 16:38
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Razorwired posted:We see it it's just an artifact at this point and like AlphaDog and others have pointed out, with the way 5e plays fast and loose with some things throwing this out there without a thoughtful conversion is just more lazy lovely work in the name of nostalgia. But the maps are going to be different. There are going to be 23 floors, but none of them are going to be as big as that earlier one. There will be paths that lead off map that gives the DM the option to expand the floor with their own content if they so wish, so you could make it that large. But no floor should be Halls of Undermountain sized by default.
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Jun 4, 2018 18:34
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Let's be honest, "urban campaign" just sounds cooler than "sewer adventure" but they mean the same thing I looked up that guy's maps and they look good. I'm sure this will end up being one of the better adventures.
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Jun 4, 2018 18:38
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Just looking at that map makes me think it would be rad to use. Pretty classic dungeony artifact.
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Jun 4, 2018 18:42
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They are going to release some setting material. http://comicbook.com/gaming/2018/06/04/dungeons-and-dragons-fifth-edition-campaign-settings/
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Jun 4, 2018 19:04
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Kaysette posted:It’ll vary DM to DM but when I’m attacking players I usually just ask “does an X hit?” then they can quickly do the math. Yeah. I was hoping AL would have a standard, but I guess I'll just see how it plays out. It's a bit annoying since I went War Magic and my level 2 trait is basically "Shield, but also for saves" and burning that on stuff where it's not gonna affect it will get old quick.
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Jun 4, 2018 19:18
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What's the min maxiest way to build a gish around CHA to do double duty as a party face? Paladin 2/Hexblade 1/Blades Bard X? I'm thinking Hex warrior, smites, expertise for social skills, and both higher dc's for spells along with higher attack and damage. I guess it wouldn't really come online until later, but even at lower levels I'd have the short rest spell slots from warlock, GFB for attacks, access to bless and protection from good/evil, lay on hands to deal with poison and disease, and heavy armor so I wouldn't have to worry about stat-ing for STR/DEX beyond enough STR to wear plate. Can maximize bonuses with protection fighting style from paladin and dueling fighting style from blades bard. Alternately I could just go DEX bard, but that feels too easy 
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Jun 4, 2018 19:41
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Edit: Someone has guessed it's a streaming thing in a way that makes complete sense. Was hoping for it to be a Planescape thing.
MonsterEnvy fucked around with this message at 19:49 on Jun 4, 2018 |
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Jun 4, 2018 19:43
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As a wood elf life cleric going into my 4th level, what feats should I be looking at? Alternately, what ability score should I bump? I’m thinking wisdom...
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Jun 4, 2018 20:44
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NickRoweFillea posted:As a wood elf life cleric going into my 4th level, what feats should I be looking at? Alternately, what ability score should I bump? I’m thinking wisdom... It seems like it's almost never a good option for casters to take feats as opposed to bumping their key ability, which is wisdom for you.
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Jun 4, 2018 20:47
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NeurosisHead posted:What's the min maxiest way to build a gish around CHA to do double duty as a party face? Paladin 2/Hexblade 1/Blades Bard X? I'm thinking Hex warrior, smites, expertise for social skills, and both higher dc's for spells along with higher attack and damage. I guess it wouldn't really come online until later, but even at lower levels I'd have the short rest spell slots from warlock, GFB for attacks, access to bless and protection from good/evil, lay on hands to deal with poison and disease, and heavy armor so I wouldn't have to worry about stat-ing for STR/DEX beyond enough STR to wear plate. Can maximize bonuses with protection fighting style from paladin and dueling fighting style from blades bard. Both Hexblade 1/Bard (College of Swords) or Paladin 2/Bard (College of Swords) work. It's not worth it to get both Paladin and Hexblade, since they start overlapping and even cancelling each others benefits out (ie the point of Hex/Bard is full Charisma focus, but you need to have 13 STR for the Paladin multiclass). As for which is better that's up to what you want to do. Hex/Bard is more of a caster that can melee when necessary, while Paladin/Bard is tougher with 21 AC and delivers Smites with its spell slots in combat. Hexblade + Draconic Sorcerer is another combat-focused option. Personally prefer paladin/bard to emphasize the martial aspect, and because Divine Smite is awesome, so the minmax with that is: For reference a Hexbard will have +11 to CHA skill by level 9, while the other two will have +8. Either way, minmaxing on the Bard MCs means starting with Variant Human and taking Polearm Master and Resilient Constitution (rounding up a 13 to 14), using a Quarterstaff+Shield with Dueling Fighting Style (+ Defensive if Paladin). Paladin goes 16 STR and Heavy Armor (first 2 levels Paladin), HexBard does 14 DEX and wears Medium. Sorlock is likewise medium+shield+whatever d8 weapon and attacks with Green-Flame Blade + Quickened Green-Flame Blade, so no need for PAM or Resilient since Sorc gives Constitution saves, so it can be any CHA bonused race. Half-Elf is good. NickRoweFillea posted:As a wood elf life cleric going into my 4th level, what feats should I be looking at? Alternately, what ability score should I bump? I’m thinking wisdom... Wisdom until maxed. The only other worthwhile options are either Resilient (Constitution) or War Caster to help pass Concentration checks.
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Jun 4, 2018 20:54
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That’s what i figured. Thanks folks
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Jun 4, 2018 21:20
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Firstborn posted:Let's be honest, "urban campaign" just sounds cooler than "sewer adventure" but they mean the same thing There is a very good reason low level D&D characters are referred to as 'shitfarmers'.
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Jun 5, 2018 00:04
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kingcom posted:There is a very good reason low level D&D characters are referred to as 'shitfarmers'. As long as I get my small, but vicious, dog when I play it I will not mind at all. Also I have only really started playing dnd, despite reading this thread and others like it for years now due to a variety of things. I am in my first proper campaign, setting things up etc. The problem is that we, a very newbie heavy group have started playing Tomb of Annihilation, and we are all getting very badly lost and wondering what the hell we are supposed to do. I think it might have been best to start us off on a quest without a time limit and, whilst keeping the high lethality, maybe easing us into descriptions of how the world works. Saying that I do like the fact that the DM is currently playing Acerack using a voice that is half Papyrus and half Skeletor. I don't want any spoilers necessarily, but we have 11 days to end the death curse before we stop getting paid we have only just found a war golem that helps us go faster through the jungle and we are a days trip out from camp vengeance. How hosed are we and what none spoilery things do you think we can do to unfuck ourselves?
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Jun 5, 2018 00:29
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Josef bugman posted:As long as I get my small, but vicious, dog when I play it I will not mind at all. Look for the Giant Floating Heart. It's just south west. Also the time limit before you stop getting paid is 79 days in the adventure, have you been wondering around for 68 days? Also when I read the book the time limit did not appear that it should be shared, the players are just supposed to be told there is a time limit and to hurry. MonsterEnvy fucked around with this message at 01:12 on Jun 5, 2018 |
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Jun 5, 2018 01:10
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MonsterEnvy posted:Look for the Giant Floating Heart. It's just south west. Also the time limit before you stop getting paid is 79 days in the adventure, have you been wondering around for 68 days? Also when I read the book the time limit did not appear that it should be shared, the players are just supposed to be told there is a time limit and to hurry. ... We were told it was 20. Holy gently caress I hope the DM hasn't made that big of an error/expected a really newbie party (some of us haven't played a board game more complex than monopoly) to find an impossible artifact in less than half the time. I mean he is a really good dude in general so I think there must be something planned.
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Jun 5, 2018 01:15
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Josef bugman posted:... We were told it was 20. Yeah I would hope he has a plan. But still I do recomend heading south west from Camp Vengence and looking out for the Giant Stone Heart floating in the air.
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Jun 5, 2018 01:23
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MonsterEnvy posted:Yeah I would hope he has a plan. But still I do recomend heading south west from Camp Vengence and looking out for the Giant Stone Heart floating in the air. Will do. Also wanted to link some of the really cool character art I was given during the game. This is the Warlock I was building last time: 
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Jun 5, 2018 02:08
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Josef bugman posted:... We were told it was 20. RAW if you go on foot it would take you some 30 days just to get to where you’re supposed to be going, and that’s if you know where to go and head straight there with no stops.
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Jun 5, 2018 02:50
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Toshimo posted:Yeah. I was hoping AL would have a standard, but I guess I'll just see how it plays out. It's a bit annoying since I went War Magic and my level 2 trait is basically "Shield, but also for saves" and burning that on stuff where it's not gonna affect it will get old quick. edit NM, I misread. You should be able to ask the DM what the result of the attack roll was. I've never met an AL DM who would withhold that info. St0rmD fucked around with this message at 03:11 on Jun 5, 2018 |
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Jun 5, 2018 03:08
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nm replying before the edit above
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Jun 5, 2018 03:12
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In tonight's session my party killed an ogre and then two of them proceeded to make ogre stew I don't have a question or any thoughts about this, just putting it out there so someone other than me knows
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Jun 5, 2018 06:18
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Blockhouse posted:In tonight's session my party killed an ogre and then two of them proceeded to make ogre stew Thats kind of creepy. Though it's kind of funny that the Ogre if he won would have eaten them yet I don't find that creepy.
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Jun 5, 2018 06:44
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It was the barbarian's idea and most of the party's reaction was "ew" but then genasi was down for trying anything once and cooked a regular non-ogre meal for the rest of the group anyway I'm mainly thinking about the ethical implications. It's not something I've ever really considered before.
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Jun 5, 2018 06:48
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Blockhouse posted:It was the barbarian's idea and most of the party's reaction was "ew" but then genasi was down for trying anything once and cooked a regular non-ogre meal for the rest of the group anyway How cool are people with eating intelligent creatures, even if they are of low intelligence.
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Jun 5, 2018 06:50
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Would you eat a troll. What about an imp. How about a talking squirrel. It's creepy.
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Jun 5, 2018 07:05
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Ogres are sapient, bilingual, and understand enough in the world to have an alignment. Eating them is monstrous.
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Jun 5, 2018 07:07
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Mendrian posted:Would you eat a troll. I think you can actually die from eating troll. (Particularly if it's not roasted before hand.)
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Jun 5, 2018 07:08
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Mendrian posted:Would you eat a troll. I would probably eat a talking squirrel if it tried to murder me and I had to kill it in self-defense That's perfectly good squirrel
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Jun 5, 2018 07:10
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Blockhouse posted:I would probably eat a talking squirrel if it tried to murder me and I had to kill it in self-defense Okay. What about a blink dog.
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Jun 5, 2018 07:28
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Mendrian posted:Okay. well blink dogs are lawful good boys so you shouldn't have to kill one unless you're evil or something and then you might eat it
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Jun 5, 2018 07:32
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Blockhouse posted:I would probably eat a talking squirrel if it tried to murder me and I had to kill it in self-defense I am of the opinion that if a Cannibal tried to kill and eat me, and I killed him in self defense. I would probably not eat him. That is pretty much the exact situation with the Ogre.
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Jun 5, 2018 07:35
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If you don't have moral qualms about killing someone, then you shouldn't have moral qualms about eating them. It's an ecological choice. Meat for food, skin for mittens, bones for whatever you need bones for.
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Jun 5, 2018 08:56
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This came up recently for me too. My DM wasn't very happy about my gnome ranger eating bullwugs; hell I didn't even kill them!MonsterEnvy posted:I am of the opinion that if a Cannibal tried to kill and eat me, and I killed him in self defense. I would probably not eat him. What about a dolphin? Or a chimpanzee? the onion wizard fucked around with this message at 09:11 on Jun 5, 2018 |
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Jun 5, 2018 09:06
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SettingSun posted:RAW if you go on foot it would take you some 30 days just to get to where you’re supposed to be going, and that’s if you know where to go and head straight there with no stops. Tangfastic. Still though, I do hope he has something planned. I mean he does do this a lot more than I do, so won't second guess.
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Jun 5, 2018 09:16
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