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I guess there's gonna be an Ontario segment now after tonight.
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Jun 8, 2018 03:29
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The problem with parts of the world like that is that all the conspiracy theories that you get conditioned to be skeptical about have an equal chance of being true or false, and many otherwise reliable media sources suddenly get all muddled between propaganda, denials, and genuinely unclear information.
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Jun 8, 2018 04:21
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I recommend reading the New Yorker article that likely prompted the piece on elderly guardianship abuse. The show really didn't have time to go deep enough on how astonishingly evil these people are. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/10/09/how-the-elderly-lose-their-rights
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Jun 8, 2018 13:09
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While it's questionable to say Chavez was "obviously" or even definitely given cancer by the CIA, it would not be the most outlandish thing the CIA and other American organizations have done/planned (given how controlled all information we receive from the region is, it's hard to truly know) in the region. http://foreignpolicy.com/2013/03/07/the-cia-didnt-give-chavez-cancer-but-crazier-things-have-happened/ It's easy to say "oh, that was just crazy Cold War stuff", but that's what people said about rumored CIA activities and plans in the Vietnam era before Cold War era documents were declassified, and the same thing will happen again as more recent information becomes declassified. It's the domain of out-of-whack conspiracy theorists to make detailed claims about CIA bioweapon murder plots of foreign heads of state, but it would be equally insane to believe the biggest capitalist superpower, whose intelligence agencies have a documented history of doing everything in their legal power and more to destroy communist or socialist states, has nothing to do with the state of Venezuela.
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Jun 8, 2018 17:29
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The secret is we pretty much hosed up every outlandish thing we tried. Like the only thing we ever got right was "Give rape gangs guns and training to rape and murder people". Which is horrific, but it's also pretty loving blunt as far as tools go. So no, you are an idiot if you even consider that the CIA could have given him cancer because even if it were possible the CIA is incompetent at finesse actions. If you said the CIA raped him and lit a preschool on fire on the way out of the country, all while screaming "USA! USA! USA!" and waving a big American flag, that's a maybe. That's the type of thing the CIA would actually pull off. The CIA are thugs, not masterminds.
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Jun 8, 2018 18:00
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Yeah lets not forget that the CIA was completely fooled by a James Bond movie prop scuba mouthpiece with no air tank.
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Jun 8, 2018 19:11
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ACES CURE PLANES posted:I guess there's gonna be an Ontario segment now after tonight. You say that like we're more important than we actually are.
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Jun 8, 2018 19:54
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Mulva posted:The secret is we pretty much hosed up every outlandish thing we tried. Like the only thing we ever got right was "Give rape gangs guns and training to rape and murder people". Which is horrific, but it's also pretty loving blunt as far as tools go. So no, you are an idiot if you even consider that the CIA could have given him cancer because even if it were possible the CIA is incompetent at finesse actions. If you said the CIA raped him and lit a preschool on fire on the way out of the country, all while screaming "USA! USA! USA!" and waving a big American flag, that's a maybe. That's the type of thing the CIA would actually pull off. The CIA are thugs, not masterminds. Yeah look at how many times they tried and failed to assassinate Castro. The only effective tool the CIA really has is to set up channels to funnel weapons to radical groups to destabilize a nation. They might TRY a lot of crazy poo poo but the relatively boring "sell guns to terrorists" is the only thing that ever actually works. Arcsquad12 posted:You say that like we're more important than we actually are. I feel like it might get a passing mention just because of the fact that it's Doug Ford. Rob became a bit of a thing in the US after the crack video and just that association is probably enough to get the attention of at least a few comedians regardless of the politics.
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Jun 8, 2018 21:58
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Arcsquad12 posted:You say that like we're more important than we actually are. I mean, they had this on a few years ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSKJqEY5EOo
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Jun 8, 2018 22:03
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The CIA was built out of a core of servile Ivy League silver spooners who weren't quite swift enough to take over "Father's" company.
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Jun 8, 2018 22:48
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The Cheshire Cat posted:I feel like it might get a passing mention just because of the fact that it's Doug Ford. Rob became a bit of a thing in the US after the crack video and just that association is probably enough to get the attention of at least a few comedians regardless of the politics. Doug also takes the same policy positions as Rob did. I'm not sure what Doug has actually done but I'm sure it's the sort of stuff John usually mocks.
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Jun 8, 2018 22:56
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The Fords are essentially Canada's Trump/Brexit. Can't wait to see how the American liberal press which has portrayed Trudeau's Canada as magically immune from the West's problems try to make sense of a nationalist meltdown up north.
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Jun 9, 2018 00:54
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So is Trudeau thoroughly screwed next federal election?
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Jun 9, 2018 00:59
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Lycus posted:So is Trudeau thoroughly screwed next federal election? He probably wouldn't be if he'd followed through on his promise for electoral reform but he decided that since the Liberals won, Canadians are fine with the electoral system as is. So yes.
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Jun 9, 2018 01:46
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Propaganda Machine posted:Doug also takes the same policy positions as Rob did. I'm not sure what Doug has actually done but I'm sure it's the sort of stuff John usually mocks. As someone who lives in the area: a TON of anti-LGBT rhetoric. Much was made of a recent sex-ed curriculum that acknowledged that gay people exist and what safe sex looks like for them, and transphobia always plays well as has been proven. Needless to say not feeling super good about the fact that I came out less than eight months ago 
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Jun 9, 2018 04:00
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Yeah, short of health care being sacrosanct, some Canadian conservatives are starting to look an awful lot like American ones, whereas generally they're more like Democrats. I lived in Alberta for two years and some of their politicians were bonkers.
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Jun 9, 2018 04:20
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We had those bonkers candidates separated into the Wildrose party, but because it led to smarter heads prevailing and a "socialist" party being elected the rights decided to unite again. Now we are going to have those crazy fucks in charge of our province again this time next year 
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Jun 9, 2018 06:03
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Propaganda Machine posted:Yeah, short of health care being sacrosanct, some Canadian conservatives are starting to look an awful lot like American ones, whereas generally they're more like Democrats. I lived in Alberta for two years and some of their politicians were bonkers. Honestly I don't know how Trump can complain about a trade deficit when we're the largest importer of lovely American politics.
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Jun 9, 2018 11:25
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Propaniac posted:I recommend reading the New Yorker article that likely prompted the piece on elderly guardianship abuse. The show really didn't have time to go deep enough on how astonishingly evil these people are. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/10/09/how-the-elderly-lose-their-rights Holy poo poo. That is just incredibly scary.
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Jun 9, 2018 21:19
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TXT BOOTY7 2 47474 posted:While it's questionable to say Chavez was "obviously" or even definitely given cancer by the CIA, it would not be the most outlandish thing the CIA and other American organizations have done/planned (given how controlled all information we receive from the region is, it's hard to truly know) in the region. http://foreignpolicy.com/2013/03/07/the-cia-didnt-give-chavez-cancer-but-crazier-things-have-happened/ This doesn't make the claim not an outright lie, since Chavez being poisoned is neither obvious nor definite. In fact if the CIA wants you dead, they send a drone or they pay a "resistance group" to do it.
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Jun 9, 2018 21:27
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Phenotype posted:Holy poo poo. That is just incredibly scary. Honestly the craziest thing about this segment and the whole concept to me is that someone can just like, file some court paperwork and give themselves power of attorney over someone else. Like how on earth did someone write up this legislation and not see how incredibly prone to abuse it would be?
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Jun 10, 2018 04:51
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Power. The sins of the states are simply based in power.
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Jun 10, 2018 05:04
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One thing to at least be optimistic about is that because a lot of these stories are coming from communities with a high retiree population (which makes sense), odds are pretty good that the more national attention it gets the more likely those states are to HEAVILY revise the laws - because this kind of thing is not something they're going to want wealthy retirees thinking about when it comes time to decide where to move for their twilight years.
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Jun 10, 2018 06:06
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The Cheshire Cat posted:One thing to at least be optimistic about is that because a lot of these stories are coming from communities with a high retiree population (which makes sense), odds are pretty good that the more national attention it gets the more likely those states are to HEAVILY revise the laws - because this kind of thing is not something they're going to want wealthy retirees thinking about when it comes time to decide where to move for their twilight years. Wish I shared that faith. In a nation of people unaware of the law and eager to believe whatever the TV tells them, the elderly are the most unaware and eager. Lawmakers know that. Fox News won't cover this. Wealthy retirees won't care. Wealth will, as always, insulate them from the consequences of horrid legislation - in this instance, because wealthy retirees are likely to have power of attorney already settled via having an attorney.
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Jun 10, 2018 12:23
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What's weird is that this is exactly the sort of thing that gets made up as a fearmongering tactic like those Obamacare death panels or Antifa mass decapitations. You'd think something like that but real would immediately raise a big stink.
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Jun 10, 2018 15:54
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What I don't understand is how they can do it to old people who still have living kids or relatives. How the gently caress does some scam artist trump the person's kid? I guess that's where the complicit judge comes in.
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Jun 10, 2018 17:42
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My grandmother got scammed by her own daughter (My aunt). She stuck her in the cheapest assisted living facility she could find, and then blew all of her savings on expensive vacations, an expensive wedding, etc., while my grandmother died of Alzheimer's.
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Jun 10, 2018 18:01
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Yeah, family can and often does suck more than some random stranger.
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Jun 10, 2018 18:44
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TXT BOOTY7 2 47474 posted:Wish I shared that faith. In a nation of people unaware of the law and eager to believe whatever the TV tells them, the elderly are the most unaware and eager. Lawmakers know that. Fox News won't cover this. Well that's the thing - the people targeted were chosen specifically because they were wealthy. The New Yorker article goes into more detail about it but even people who already had wills drafted up and executors named would get placed into guardianship anyway. There's not a lot of point in taking over the finances of someone who doesn't have any money to steal, after all. Doctor Reynolds posted:Yeah, family can and often does suck more than some random stranger. The big problem is that because this SOMETIMES is true, it leaves the door open for bad actors to claim it's ALWAYS true. This is where proper oversight would come in to determine if the third party actually DOES have the person's best interest at heart but as mentioned in the bit, there's no agency to actually keep track of people in this system. The Cheshire Cat fucked around with this message at 19:08 on Jun 10, 2018 |
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Jun 10, 2018 19:05
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The Cheshire Cat posted:Well that's the thing - the people targeted were chosen specifically because they were wealthy. The New Yorker article goes into more detail about it but even people who already had wills drafted up and executors named would get placed into guardianship anyway. There's not a lot of point in taking over the finances of someone who doesn't have any money to steal, after all. I kept thinking this while John was doing the segment - surely there's another side to this case? Like, was there squabbling family or some other drama we don't know about? But apparently not; according to that article Parks literally just bribed a hospital staffer to say they needed guardians, filed a motion in court and it was done without them even knowing. Which, yeah, is horrifying. But after reading the article and watching the segment, I'm actually surprised there isn't a whole industry of companies doing this thing. Or at least not yet, anyway. I guess with the lack of oversight and regulation the scale of the problem isn't readily apparent, but both of those indicate that it seems to be a not-particularly-huge number of "guardians" doing the exploiting.
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Jun 10, 2018 21:40
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LegionAreI posted:What I don't understand is how they can do it to old people who still have living kids or relatives. How the gently caress does some scam artist trump the person's kid? If they have nearby living relations guardianship will likely only be adjudicated because the actual relations have declared they want nothing to do with it.
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Jun 10, 2018 23:46
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Macdeo Lurjtux posted:If they have nearby living relations guardianship will likely only be adjudicated because the actual relations have declared they want nothing to do with it. Did you bother reading the article?
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Jun 11, 2018 00:52
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You’d be surprised how little fucks people give to elderly relatives cause they’re returning to an infant state. Unless they have money that is.
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Jun 11, 2018 01:54
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webmeister posted:I kept thinking this while John was doing the segment - surely there's another side to this case? Like, was there squabbling family or some other drama we don't know about? But apparently not; according to that article Parks literally just bribed a hospital staffer to say they needed guardians, filed a motion in court and it was done without them even knowing. Which, yeah, is horrifying. Well the big thing is that the laws about this kind of thing are controlled at the State level, so other places may be much stricter about when a non-family member can be granted a guardianship, or at least have just enough hoops to jump through that it's not viable to run a scam on the level that Parks was. The thing about Parks in particular is that it was more than just her - both the lawmakers and courts were complicit as well (the article goes into more detail about this than the segment did, but basically there are a few key names that show up in a LARGE number of these cases). I think part of the reason behind the timing of the article and Oliver's segment is to raise awareness about this kind of thing BEFORE it becomes a new industry like payday loans and other predators. The number of retirees is still rising pretty sharply in the next decade and if there isn't some kind of protection put in place now, then it's just going to lead to a lot more exploitation in the future. Plus these particular cases are just the ones we know about. Florida is another potential hotspot for this kind of thing but all of its guardianship records are sealed so actually uncovering it is even more difficult than it was in Nevada. It may already be a huge industry that people simply don't know about because there's no public numbers to make people go "wait... that looks wrong".
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Jun 11, 2018 06:16
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I hope they upload the entire alternate ending to Youtube.
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Jun 11, 2018 10:32
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Ed Balls! I love that name. I love that he was in Parliament, I love that he was far from the most funkadelic of MPs, and the tweet "Ed Balls" is funny on a lot of levels. We haven't seen those kinds of levels of on-the-nose-isms since 1884's Randy Bullocks (R-MA) or 1902's anti-suffragist Fannie Kuntz (D-DE).
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Jun 11, 2018 16:24
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John Oliver is still pushing the Olsen Twin conspiracy I see.
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Jun 11, 2018 16:59
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I kinda love the UK Parliament whenever I see clips of it. The way that they have long, almost ritualized traditions of jeering, the whole thing where they regularly ask questions, and John Bercow's really fun way of wrangling all those dorks. It's a shame that they have all those laws against using direct footage for comedy purposes. Closest you can get is Yes Minister. Also, not that Duterte being a creep about women isn't a bad thing, but it's not as bad as all those killings.
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Jun 11, 2018 17:20
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Alhazred posted:John Oliver is still pushing the Olsen Twin conspiracy I see. It's not a conspiracy because there's only one of them.
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Jun 11, 2018 19:03
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tarlibone posted:It's not a conspiracy because there's only one of them. That doesn't explain Elizabeth Olsen though.
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Jun 11, 2018 19:16
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