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!Klams posted:I see a lot of vitriol for Human Revolution, and at the time peeps ragged on the bossfights a lot, but what really got me was how stupid the map layout was. It made out like you were in a city, implying open world / free roaming, but actually secretly it was a doom / wolfenstein style maze of a map. It felt so insanely stupid to be, that in this game where you can supposedly make any decision, you had less geographical freedom than Bioshock, who's whole shtick is it's rail roading you. Yeah i got lost like a motherfucker in hr, it's not even that big
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Jul 23, 2018 09:29
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sebmojo posted:The vox pop was blatantly about racism as original sin, though it wasn't done well. And the ending owned, getting drowned by multiple Elizabeths to a cappella gospel was excellently fetishistic The ending won me over with the little coda implying somewhere out there was a version of the character who got a Dark Tower-style second chance
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Jul 23, 2018 11:30
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FoolyCharged posted:This is the swimming skill, its unused in all but a handful of locations making it normally a waste of points, but if you don't invest in it you'll be hosed in those areas. I like how the first 2 fallouts had it so most dialogue options were tied to the intelligence stat, which people would usually have at a high level anyways due to it also effecting skillpoint gain. Also low intelligence speech options were nice if you wanted to play a character too stupid to talk to folks.
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Jul 23, 2018 12:51
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old game good new game bad
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Jul 23, 2018 13:33
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!Klams posted:I see a lot of vitriol for Human Revolution, and at the time peeps ragged on the bossfights a lot, but what really got me was how stupid the map layout was. It made out like you were in a city, implying open world / free roaming, but actually secretly it was a doom / wolfenstein style maze of a map. It felt so insanely stupid to be, that in this game where you can supposedly make any decision, you had less geographical freedom than Bioshock, who's whole shtick is it's rail roading you. I never got the hatred for the boss fights either. At least they were interesting. For me, HR's main sin is just how loving boring the world is. In Deus Ex you fight through Liberty Island, an undersea laboratory, the Paris catacombs, Area 51, a cathedral, an ICBM silo, a massive container ship, etc. Your enemies start out as bog standard gunmans but then you get to cyborgs with rocket launchers for arms, genetically engineered mutants, psionic aliens, men in black that explode when you kill them... In HR you spend 90% of the game in slums and office complexes full of desks, fighting the same Small, Medium, and Large mercs. Occasionally they'll throw one of those box robots at you that immediately dies to the EMP grenade you throw at it while it's transforming. This and the fact that everything you read / see / hear characters talking about seems to revolve around human augmentation makes the world feel incredibly small and dull. Why they chose to make a prequel to Wacky Conspiracy Superspy: The Game that's played completely straight is beyond me. Invisible War, despite its many many flaws, at least had cool poo poo like the Omar. Also Adam Jensen is a depressing drip while JC Denton is hilarious and likeable despite (because of?) his nano aspergers.
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Jul 23, 2018 14:36
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basic hitler posted:I seriously wonder if the totally idiotic portrayal of the vox populi was a result of producer meddling. Like ken levine probably pissed people off by mocking his bosses and other egomaniac execs with andrew ryan, and any point he wanted to make was likely hobbled from the outset. In the game's defense there is certainly a trend in human history of revolutionary groups becoming more or less as bad as their oppressors. The issue was that the game handled it so distastefully while still pretending to be "smart". It did a good job explaining why Vox Populi should exist, but a terrible job at showing it's corruption and fantacism, and how ideologues and hierarchy enforce such behavior. punk rebel ecks fucked around with this message at 16:52 on Jul 23, 2018 |
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Jul 23, 2018 16:34
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punk rebel ecks posted:In the game's defense there is certainly a trend in human history of revolutionary groups becoming more or less as bad as their oppressors. The issue was that the game handled it so distastefully while still pretending to be "smart". The big problem here was it skipped the Vox's rise entirely. Maybe if they had shown some poo poo or something. I enjoyed Infinite, but the Vox could have been done way better.
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Jul 23, 2018 16:44
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My problem with a lot of these types of stories is that they try so hard to be "woke" but are created by people who are too (can't think of a better word sorry) "overeducated" for their own good. By that I mean that they have a tendency to substantially over exaggerate events and how much of an effect they have on society. For example the main character participating in both The Battle of Wounded Knee and the Boxer Rebellion. Now I'm not implying that these events are not a blight in American history, but the game makes it out that these were tremendously huge events. When in reality the former had less than 500 troops participating in it, while the later had about 2000. I feel that they could have found better historical events to use, but clearly they just went with low hanging fruit. Another example is how in the game's world the Irish tend to be as underprivileged as blacks. And while the Irish were absolutely looked down upon in 1800s and early 1900s America, the distaste for them was never nearly as bad as say what blacks, native americans, or latinxs got. Still, despite all of these attempts to be "woke" and seeing America "how it really was", they can't properly frame a botched rebellion as anything but "those oppressed are often as bad as the oppressors". The issue is that when these subjects are tackled in media they are often done by people who get their perspective from popular media or the classroom rather than life experience or opinions of the locals, and it really shows.
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Jul 23, 2018 16:53
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Infinite was big and stupid and flashy and fun but really has 0 actual staying power when you actually give it a hard look. It was basically the Independence Day of videogames.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:04
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Infinite got a lot of mileage out of those doors opening into the world at the beginning of the game.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:08
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All video games are ruined by being a goddamn chore to play in some way. The only redeemable qualities to appreciate are the art design, rarely the characters or story, and very rarely the soundtrack.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:12
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Minimum Syntaxing posted:All video games are ruined by being a goddamn chore to play in some way. I think it just depends on what you're playing and how you're playing it. For instance, just goofing around in fighting games and learning the systems and stuff can be very fun even if you don't go to tournaments or play seriously.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:25
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Minimum Syntaxing posted:All video games are ruined by being a goddamn chore to play in some way. The best opinion, that all video games are bad
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Jul 23, 2018 17:41
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Sky Bioshock is the only one that’s actually fun to play
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Jul 23, 2018 18:07
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IDONTPOST posted:Sky Bioshock is the only one that’s actually fun to play Skyoshock, if you will
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Jul 23, 2018 18:21
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Twelve Batmans posted:Infinite was big and stupid and flashy and fun but really has 0 actual staying power when you actually give it a hard look. Fun?! Apart from the opening sequence it's a chore/bore to play through. Bullet-sponge retarded enemies, a stupid upgrade system and a death system where each death would leave you with less money each time you die so you don't have enough money to upgrade your gun and you die again and have less money the next time you come back to life. Who was it that tweeted moronic tweet that it was "spooky" that Ebert died when Bioshock Infinite was released insinuating that Bioshock Infinite was the "games are art" game?
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Jul 23, 2018 18:23
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IDONTPOST posted:Sky Bioshock is the only one that’s actually fun to play It felt weird to play a Bioshock game that didn't have minigames sprinkled in.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:41
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Bioshock Infinite was good on it's first playthrough. But it really is akin to a summer blockbuster like say Edge of Tomorrow. In which the game comes out, sells millions, then nobody talks about it ever again.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:42
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punk rebel ecks posted:Bioshock Infinite was good on it's first playthrough. It was painfully average.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:45
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YagotmeIdidit posted:Fun?! Apart from the opening sequence it's a chore/bore to play through. Bullet-sponge retarded enemies, a stupid upgrade system and a death system where each death would leave you with less money each time you die so you don't have enough money to upgrade your gun and you die again and have less money the next time you come back to life. Hey I had fun the first bit of time in- though I attributed my fatigue at towards the middle/end to be more my own laziness than the fault of the game. Such lethargy has indeed struck me before playing titles that I still love to this day. In retrospect yeah it was kind of a bad game that handwaved a lot of important poo poo like consistency so it could run the whole "WHAT IF SKY-RACISTS" narrative- but it was at least exciting the first time through.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:47
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punk rebel ecks posted:Bioshock Infinite was good on it's first playthrough. But it really is akin to a summer blockbuster like say Edge of Tomorrow. In which the game comes out, sells millions, then nobody talks about it ever again. That's kind of all the big AAA cinematic story experience trying-to-be-movies games though. And Infinite was from the more original end of the scale too. I still can't understand the hype around the Last of Us for example. It's not that it was David Cage levels of overrrated trash, but there sure as hell was nothing interesting about anything it did either. Although I find it funny that the video game equivalent of an extremely safely written oscar-bait movie is is a very self-serious post-apocalyptic zombie game.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:52
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The best part about the vox populi is that in the absolute dogshit DLC they retcon it such that Fitzroy was asked/forced by the twins to go after the kid to make elizabeth a killer. It becomes a worse and worse look the more you think about it. Totally nullifies her agency.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:52
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BioMe posted:That's kind of all the big AAA cinematic story experience trying-to-be-movies games though. And Infinite was from the more original end of the scale too. TLOU just went for that low hanging fruit combo of dads + feels.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:57
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Cinematic illusion of freedom in videogames is vastly superior to just having kilometers of empty boring map.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:00
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I don't really think any of the bioshocks had good gameplay. Infinite was really boring me halfway through the game. I think it's mostly the enemies? Yeah you get powers and stuff but the enemies are so loving dumb and dull and generic that it's not fun to murder spree them. Plus I don't really like the artstyle of the game... Only Elisabeth looked decent, everything else was this weird offputting cartoonweirdness Doom 2016 had good gameplay. That's the bar other FPS games need to pass
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Jul 23, 2018 19:00
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Colonel Cancer posted:Cinematic illusion of freedom in videogames is vastly superior to just having kilometers of empty boring map. Only if they can maintain the illusion. Uncharted from at least 3 onwards played by itself.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:03
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Twelve Batmans posted:TLOU just went for that low hanging fruit combo of dads + feels. See God of Dad Is it unpopular to say the Uncharteds were good and enjoyable?
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Jul 23, 2018 19:05
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BioMe posted:That's kind of all the big AAA cinematic story experience trying-to-be-movies games though. And Infinite was from the more original end of the scale too. Apparently the game is very good in "survival mode" or more difficult game modes? But to me it doesn't matter since most people didn't play the game in those modes but in normal.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:06
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A. Beaverhausen posted:See God of Dad The first one sucks balls. It's a tech demo. 2 is fun but probably a little long, and the final boss is dumb. I haven't played 3 or 4 yet, but I would say 2 is good and enjoyable and not unpopular.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:10
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Colonel Cancer posted:Cinematic illusion of freedom in videogames is vastly superior to just having kilometers of empty boring map. I've spent the past five minutes trying to parse what the first part of this sentence even means. My best guess is you're upset about some dumb nerd argument about linear vs. open world games? Yeah, sure, cinematic games are linear as a side effect of trying to structure games exactly like movies but with some extra shooty bits (and handholdy walking bits) in the middle, but it's not what makes them painfully mediocre. EDIT: By the way yes, my dumb nerd opinion is that open world games are mostly bad
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Jul 23, 2018 19:15
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Bioshock and similar games are vastly superior to Oblivion and Fallout because you don't need to bunny jump for 30 minutes before doing or seeing anything interesting.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:18
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Colonel Cancer posted:Bioshock and similar games are vastly superior to Oblivion and Fallout because you don't need to bunny jump for 30 minutes before doing or seeing anything interesting. I love Elder Scrolls and Fallout and I agree.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:26
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Bioshock games aren't even fun "oh woweee i get to shoot the same braindead enemy one hundred times while listening to disembodied voices on tapes" At least in Skyrim I could like, shoot ice magic at a dragon and then bash it in the face with a hammer
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Jul 23, 2018 19:28
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Zzulu posted:Bioshock games aren't even fun See thats where the rabbit hole of fun being defined comes in. I had fun exploring the world they had created and the atmosphere was amazing.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:31
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punk rebel ecks posted:Bioshock Infinite was good on it's first playthrough. But it really is akin to a summer blockbuster like say Edge of Tomorrow. In which the game comes out, sells millions, then nobody talks about it ever again. Nah, everyone talks about all the bioshock games all the time. Mostly about how they controversially hate them. I would have agreed if you'd said this about "Singularity". (Which I maintain is the greatest console FPS of all time).
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Jul 23, 2018 20:10
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!Klams posted:Nah, everyone talks about all the bioshock games all the time. Mostly about how they controversially hate them. So I guess it's the Avatar of videogames then?
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Jul 23, 2018 20:28
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The worst uncharted game is the last of us
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Jul 23, 2018 20:50
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IDONTPOST posted:The worst uncharted game is the last of us I have a hard time playing The Last of Us because of its glacial cinematic suspense pacing.
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Jul 23, 2018 20:58
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punk rebel ecks posted:So I guess it's the Avatar of videogames then? Yes! That's absolutely it! Haha
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Jul 23, 2018 22:22
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One thing I will never understand about the complaints about Bioshock Infinite when people say the shooting was boring.
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Jul 23, 2018 22:40
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