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Reene posted:Why can't oVampire characters do the things introduced in Rice books that came out half a decade after oVampire did? I dunno, man. I just rewatched "Interview" this weekend because it popped up on US Netflix. Aside from being way more homoerotic than I remembered, it holds up really well, and Claudia gave me an idea for a possible NPC for a game I'm thinking about. Basically I want a kid vampire who is also the prince of the city. The Little Prince.
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Aug 8, 2018 06:06
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Isn't embracing children a big no-no in civilized kindred society because they turn into tiny sociopaths with no concept of right or wrong? EDIT: Also, in the Changeling PDF, the 'Dance of the Toys' contract is a bit vague in some of the particulars in what and how it does. The duration of how long the object states animated for open-ended tasks (like the example of commanding a door to shut itself and stay shut), which is presumably a scene, but isn't stated. There's not really a stated size for the object, either, which is noticable because cars are mentioned as something you can animated. I would assume that it presumably has to fit entirely within the changeling's Wyrdx10meter radius, but that does mean that Wyrd 2 Wizened might be able to just command a house to uproot itself and fly away. On that note, while Wizened animated objects can fly around if they want, 'normal range of movement' is pretty nebulous for other devices. Can I make toy soldiers march? articulated action figures? Mannequines? Crasical fucked around with this message at 08:05 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 07:17
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joylessdivision posted:I just rewatched "Interview" this weekend because it popped up on US Netflix. Interview with the Vampire is a genuinely good movie and the book honestly holds up pretty well too. I would definitely recommend it to anyone putting together a *WoD game featuring vampires. All the books are actually fairly readable through Queen of the Damned. I wouldn't read anything after that though unless you're very invested in the setting/characters.
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Aug 8, 2018 08:05
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Crasical posted:Isn't embracing children a big no-no in civilized kindred society because they turn into tiny sociopaths with no concept of right or wrong? That's more of a thing in other vampire literature than VtM, though forms of it show up here or there. So on the one hand you have that Tzimisce elder who had embraced a child that went feral, and then was now all a fleshcrafted hybrid thing. But you also had the Tremere chantry leader of Chicago (and primogen) who was embraced as a kid and was fine. Mechanically, I think the child flaw mostly just affected physical stats, it didn't really make one more or less prone to fall to the beast as I recall. More generally, the whole "don't embrace kids" bit always struck me as a bit of modern thinking applied backwards. For a lot of history, in many cultures kids were expected to start behaving as essentially little adults from a pretty young age. While I could see a lot of kindred in history deciding not to embrace children, it would likely be more out of a logic of physical maturity more than emotional, or about them just not having developed the skills yet to be useful. Of course, that also gets us into the whole "antideluvians should be 4'10" with bad teeth and nearsightedness" argument, so eh. VtM probably doesn't need to be super historically accurate.
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Aug 8, 2018 10:32
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Like all the better lore, the best bit of V:tM in-universe rationale for not embracing Children is simply selfish - Children are slower to learn that you shouldn't flaunt the power, and as a result, are Masquerade breaches waiting to happen. Given that said breach ends with your local Sheriff (Or Caine forbid, Scourge) staking you out, thanks to the Traditions for the morning rooster to peck over when you're done getting a tan, there's not much surprise why the average Vampire granted the Embrace chooses a better target. Hell, even the Sabbat know better than to break the Masquerade in ways that are irrefutable. They're crazy, but they ain't stupid.
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Aug 8, 2018 11:02
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I don't think there was refined sugar in Enoch, so the Antediluvians shouldn't have teeth that awful.Reene posted:
I enjoyed the Vampire Armand and Blood & Gold, both were relatively grounded entries, IMNHO. Now, Merrick was so awful that I entirely stopped reading anything from Anne Rice. [Edit] there is a Prince Lestat and the Realms of Atlantis of book! It is a crossover between Requiem and Awakening! ZearothK fucked around with this message at 11:07 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 11:03
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Crasical posted:Isn't embracing children a big no-no in civilized kindred society because they turn into tiny sociopaths with no concept of right or wrong? Speaking as a schoolteacher, they pretty much start out this way.
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Aug 8, 2018 12:35
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Blood & Gold was alright, but it had stretches where it was bad-creepy. The only line from The Vampire Armand I remember is "giggling angels licked honey from my nether parts" and it is frankly a curse that will stay with me until the day I die.
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Aug 8, 2018 12:35
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Currrrrrrrrrrssssssssse youuuuuuuuuuuuu
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Aug 8, 2018 12:43
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Thanks for the comments everyone. I figured embracing children was more of a "Yeah, probably shouldn't" rather than "IT'S THE LAW" kind of thing in Vampire vs Rice's novels. My train of thought was, after coming up with the little prince reference, is that an embraced kid has to be something special to become the Prince of a city, and they either got their through cunning political manipulation or sheer ruthlessness. Basically I really like the idea of the most powerful vampire in a city looks like he's 10, and he will ruin your existence.
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Aug 8, 2018 14:19
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Sounds like Travis Stout is stepping down as Geist lead after the core book’s done. No indication of why but I’d imagine it was a decision that was made awhile ago but kept under wraps to prevent it from hurting the KS
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Aug 8, 2018 15:07
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One thing about VtR was that Danse Macabre discussed that, while most vampires don't embrace children and have not historically, the age at which childhood ends has changed over the years. Which is to say - you could run into an elder who was embraced as an 'adult', aged 16, in 1352. And now the elder has to master the art of high school and pretending to care about it, or at least finding an excuse for why they have to take night classes.
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Aug 8, 2018 15:12
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joylessdivision posted:Thanks for the comments everyone. I figured embracing children was more of a "Yeah, probably shouldn't" rather than "IT'S THE LAW" kind of thing in Vampire vs Rice's novels. Here is a character you might be able to draw some inspiration from. http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Christopher_Houghton
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Aug 8, 2018 15:36
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Shockeh posted:Like all the better lore, the best bit of V:tM in-universe rationale for not embracing Children is simply selfish - Children are slower to learn that you shouldn't flaunt the power, and as a result, are Masquerade breaches waiting to happen. Given that said breach ends with your local Sheriff (Or Caine forbid, Scourge) staking you out, thanks to the Traditions for the morning rooster to peck over when you're done getting a tan, there's not much surprise why the average Vampire granted the Embrace chooses a better target. Yea, you don't embrace kids because kids are dumb and likely to meet 'hey surprise you're an immortal super predator' with their brain straining and not knowing not to show off and all that kinda stuff. I really doubt even the most high humanity vampires would look at kids as 'too innocent' or whatever, it's just more 'these things make weaker, usually dumber, harder to teach, vampires when I could just wait a few years for them to grow up a bit and oh hey I don't age so waiting is fine'.
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Aug 8, 2018 15:42
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Mors Rattus posted:One thing about VtR was that Danse Macabre discussed that, while most vampires don't embrace children and have not historically, the age at which childhood ends has changed over the years. Which is to say - you could run into an elder who was embraced as an 'adult', aged 16, in 1352. And now the elder has to master the art of high school and pretending to care about it, or at least finding an excuse for why they have to take night classes. One of my favorite lines in a Requiem book is still about how this sample Mask is about learning when to text Becky about who Josh is going out with instead of glowering with your ancient eyes and mumbling curses in forgotten tongues. Basic Chunnel posted:Sounds like Travis Stout is stepping down as Geist lead after the core book’s done. No indication of why but I’d imagine it was a decision that was made awhile ago but kept under wraps to prevent it from hurting the KS On the last round of V5 bullshit in this thread, where they had defended Zak S. and somebody slipped in the Hitler numbers but we publically said Nazis bad therefore we're golden: GimpInBlack posted:poo poo like this is why I will not be working on any more White Wolf-owned IPs after Geist.
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Aug 8, 2018 17:04
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https://www.belladonnascupboard.com/collections/vampire-the-masquerade-5th-edition-collection
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Aug 9, 2018 00:05
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Dawgstar posted:You're a Lupus, so congrats on having the highest starting Gnosis possible. Bump up your Rage and your Willpower because you'll need both at decent levels and then figure out what Gifts you want and make sure you have decent dice pools for them. And you're a Ragabash so Stealth and Subterfuge will probably come up a lot. Brawl and Athletics will never hurt. Crinos form can carry you through most fights. Try to pick up gifts that use Gnosis, since you'll be able to use those a bunch. Lupus also has another advantage in that while they have limited skills they can choose from, all of their Lupus Gifts will key off of those skills, so you'll only have to worry about the dice pools for your Tribe and Aspect(?) gifts. For you, that benefit will transfer over to your Red Talon gifts as well.
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Aug 9, 2018 00:40
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Pretty certain any 800 year old Elder in a 16 year old body is simply powerful enough with enough minions they just chill in their web, ordering people about and generally being a low Humanity monstrous thing. They don't go to school because they have no real need to even interact with humans beyond lunch.
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Aug 9, 2018 01:28
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Wraith 20 is out in the wild. It's pretty so far. I missed some of these artists who I liked, but only really liked on Wraith.
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Aug 9, 2018 01:46
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Shockeh posted:Pretty certain any 800 year old Elder in a 16 year old body is simply powerful enough with enough minions they just chill in their web, ordering people about and generally being a low Humanity monstrous thing. They don't go to school because they have no real need to even interact with humans beyond lunch. Not in Requiem. They get sleepy and go into a coma which saps their Blood Potency, then wake up again with no networks or surviving minions.
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Aug 9, 2018 03:01
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Reene posted:Interview with the Vampire is a genuinely good movie and the book honestly holds up pretty well too. I would definitely recommend it to anyone putting together a *WoD game featuring vampires. Yeah. Skipping through to the first Prince Lestat (because holy poo poo what was she smoking with alien birds that feed on suffering and immortal self-cloning clones) is pretty good. Prince Lestat is actually interesting in that you see some other elder vamps, and you get some of the VtM feel in them setting up their government and such.
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Aug 9, 2018 03:38
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MoonKnight posted:Yeah. Skipping through to the first Prince Lestat (because holy poo poo what was she smoking with alien birds that feed on suffering and immortal self-cloning clones) is pretty good. Prince Lestat is actually interesting in that you see some other elder vamps, and you get some of the VtM feel in them setting up their government and such. Strix?
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Aug 9, 2018 03:48
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I didn't know one of the Wieck brothers died last summer. That's sad.
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Aug 9, 2018 04:26
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MonsieurChoc posted:I didn't know one of the Wieck brothers died last summer. That's sad. It was really sudden, too. Just terrible.
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Aug 9, 2018 05:01
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Just look at this poo poo:  Man, I hope you really wanted that extra die you just spent 20-ish sessions saving for.
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Aug 9, 2018 06:04
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What the hell is thin-blood formula?
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Aug 9, 2018 06:06
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MonsieurChoc posted:What the hell is thin-blood formula? It's magic spells but for Thin-Bloods specifically, it seems. Its best utility seems to be duplicating Disciplines, at a higher in-game cost but roughly similar XP cost. There are also some specific, ?unique? EDIT: I'm flipping through a friend's copy, and I have to say the layout-as-reference is horrendous. It seems clear from the way Thin-Blood's temporary Discipline thing and Alchemy work that they can't actually outright buy a normal Discipline, but I haven't seen anywhere that clearly states that, particularly not in the XP advancement sections nor, crucially, the "here is how being Thin-Blooded works" section. Character creation just says Thin-Bloods "don't start with any intrinsic Disciplines." EDIT 2: I really mostly like the Hunger mechanic, and if I ever have occasion to run Requiem again I'd seriously consider seeing if I can house rule it in. That's about the best thing I can say about this book so far, and it's something we all already knew from the "pre-alpha" playtest. That Old Tree fucked around with this message at 06:33 on Aug 9, 2018 |
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Aug 9, 2018 06:17
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That Old Tree posted:It's magic spells but for Thin-Bloods specifically, it seems. Its best utility seems to be duplicating Disciplines, at a higher in-game cost but roughly similar XP cost. There are also some specific, ?unique? Screenshots please.
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Aug 9, 2018 06:29
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Kurieg posted:Screenshots please.  If it were any other book, I'd chalk it up to "woops, language and culture are complex and ever-changing, please try harder next time" but man not this loving book. EDIT: Like, I still think it's just a thoughtless, unforced error—not something insidious—but hey, maybe after a couple dozen unforced errors that should tell you something about the way you're writing your game and interacting with your customer base. EDIT: This whole book, with the tacked-on "Safe Play" appendix that's not even in the printed books, is mostly mediocre except it absolutely calls back to the "glory days" of 90's White Wolf, but mostly in the sense of being clueless privileged people patting themselves on the back for yelling "GAY PEOPLE EXIST, DAAAAAD!" EDIT: Good gently caress why three-column layout. Why. That Old Tree fucked around with this message at 06:44 on Aug 9, 2018 |
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Aug 9, 2018 06:38
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Pro:
Edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hieros_gamos GET ME MY loving PUNCHING GLOVE Kurieg fucked around with this message at 06:59 on Aug 9, 2018 |
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Aug 9, 2018 06:53
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Kurieg posted:Edit:  I literally hit "quote post" before your edit to post that.
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Aug 9, 2018 07:00
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While I hate virtually everything about that ritual, I don't object in and of itself to the use of magical hermaphroditism in an alchemical context. That part's appropriate. The rest, including using it to change your gender and sex, is not. Since the Great Hermaphrodite is the impossible perfect union of positive and negative, light and dark, fire and water, male and female, the last thing you'd want to do if you'd found a way to embody it is to then dramatically align yourself into any binary system, including that of gender and that of sex, because within that alchemical context the one binary is a microcosm of the greater cosmic binary. It's like going 'cool, I am a perfect being. Now, I am going to so massively skew myself into imperfection that it is an act of extreme violence against myself and the cosmos'. So yeah. Even on a Muh Alchemy level, it's not great. EDIT: I mean, to be clear, what we're talking about is pure loving madness here. Even the manliest person you can think of is not purely male within this system of binaries, nor the most feminine purely female. This is like shoving yourself into a crucible and burning away huge parts of what made you you to become something that quite simply Should Not Be in the material world. That could even be cool, if that was the idea rather than it being a pretty 'lol we change genders!!' thing, but it's the kind of poo poo that is hella scary. Loomer fucked around with this message at 07:09 on Aug 9, 2018 |
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Aug 9, 2018 07:06
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Like, i'm pretty sure they made the mistake I almost did and thought that Gamos, as Gamete's root, meant something related to the sex organs. But at this point my brain is just going "Mawage. Mawage is what bwings us togevar, todawy. (Rips off penis)"
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Aug 9, 2018 07:09
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You know you hosed up when even the guy deeply devoted to the idea of magical hermaphrodites is giving you the side-eye over your magical gender change spells.
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Aug 9, 2018 07:12
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Kurieg posted:Mawage is what bwings us togevar, todawy. (Rips off penis)" I think we've found our latest thread title.
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Aug 9, 2018 08:32
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I’m trying to figure out what they think “fully identifies” means because either they think it means ‘has the genitals associated with and also identifies as’ which fits the rest of the weirdness or they mean ‘identifies as’ which would be less gross but nonsense in the context of the rest of the grossness of the power.
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Aug 9, 2018 09:17
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It's exactly what they mean. They're essentializing the gender to genitals, and implying you can't fully identify as a man without a dick or a woman without a pussy. This is actually a spell for transsexual transformation, not transgender transformation.
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Aug 9, 2018 09:26
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Why not use Fleshcrafting
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Aug 9, 2018 09:38
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Is there a ready converter somewhere for using the new WoD rules with Masquerade source? I just bought the new WoD core book, but I'd appreciate a leg up.ZearothK posted:One of the factors that made Vampire: The Masquerade super popular is that it was one of the first high-profile games that weren't about murder-hobos (though a lot of people did play it that way), and it appealed to a lot of players who weren't into that style, at least locally it was the first RPG that you'd see women playing regularly. Plus it was very much in the Zeitgeist of the time, Anne Rice's Vampire Chronicles were best-sellers, and its movie adaptation, plus Lost Boys and Coppola's Dracula were huge cultural markstones, Goth was most definitely in and it was the right RPG to explode at the time. This. I came in around 1998 or 99, was a nerd goth and by the time Bloodlines rolled around I was an old hand already.
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Aug 9, 2018 09:38
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Tias posted:Is there a ready converter somewhere for using the new WoD rules with Masquerade source? I just bought the new WoD core book, but I'd appreciate a leg up. If you mean using Requiem to run Masquerade, there's a "translation guide" for its first edition in DTRPG. I never had much use for them, so I don't remember if that one in particular or any of them at all are very good. I don't know how much difference using Requiem 2e would make to the translation guide's utility.
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Aug 9, 2018 10:28
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