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enraged_camel posted:So is Turkey going to try to hold on to the areas they are controlling in Northern Syria after the war is officially over? Or will they relinquish control to Assad? Seeing as they're proclaiming certain areas of iraq as new regions of turkey i doubt it. Assas wont be be to stand up militarily to turkey.
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Sep 16, 2018 06:10
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enraged_camel posted:So is Turkey going to try to hold on to the areas they are controlling in Northern Syria after the war is officially over? Or will they relinquish control to Assad? They’re definitely going to give it back. And Hatay too. But more likely Afrin will be come their Golan Heights and the rest they’ll give back to Syria at some point in order to leverage their permanent control over Afrin.
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Sep 16, 2018 07:35
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Saladman posted:They’re definitely going to give it back. And Hatay too. Man why? Syria cant wage war on turkeys current territories. Turkey has a very large professional army far superior to syrias hardly functioning military.
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Sep 16, 2018 07:51
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LeoMarr posted:Man why? Syria cant wage war on turkeys current territories. Turkey has a very large professional army far superior to syrias hardly functioning military. I assume you’re responding to my second part and not the first which was a joke. They’ll probably give Idlib back at some point because it’s poor and full of Arabic speaking people and they will suffer more backlash from the Arab world than if they colonize Afrin and replace the Kurds. All bets are off for the Al Bab area, maybe they’ll try and keep that too. I mean Israel gave back Sinai after 10 years too in order for some carrots, and were they going to do with it anyway? They already have the relatively huge wasteland of the Negev.
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Sep 16, 2018 09:22
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Saladman posted:I assume you’re responding to my second part and not the first which was a joke. Hey! I grew up in that wasteland!  Sinai is of significant strategic importance: it borders the Suez Canal and the Straits of Tiran, the blocking of which by Egypt had been casus belli before. There are also oil fields there. There were even some Israeli settlements which managed to form before the territory was returned, which were forcibly evacuated. It's still a popular tourist attraction, too. The carrots given were significant. Peace with the most heavily armed Israeli enemy after the deadly October/Yom Kippur/Ramadan War, access to the Arab world, some financial and military guarantees from the US, others which don't pop into my head right now.
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Sep 16, 2018 15:29
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Hey! I grew up in that wasteland! The US (literally, I believe) built Israel an airbase or two inside Israel to compensate for the airfields they'd built (and gave up) in Sinai. And the billions in US aid Israel gets every year? Pretty much a sweetener from the peace treaty, which has usually been such a cold peace it's difficult to tell the difference from "well they're at war but not shooting at each other". Similar with all the aid Egypt gets - the reason both sides get military aid is because it is effectively a string that forces them not to shoot at the other party, since if they do the aid gets cut off. In the event, Egypt needs the aid way more than Israel, but them's the breaks of economic development since 1980.
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Sep 16, 2018 16:01
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Volkerball posted:It's pretty clearly a logistical issue. There's nothing that's going to stop the regime from going after Idlib with the full support of Russia. I don't think it was a logistical issue. The regime had been massing its forces for over a month, the propaganda war pointed to an impending invasion, and the pre-invasion bombardment had already started after a trilateral summit between Russia, Iran and Turkey in which Russia and Turkey were at clear cross purposes. Then suddenly the bombardment stopped, Turkey reinforced the area, Nusra took advantage of the lull to arrest groups favoring reconciliation, and Putin and Erdogan are meeting next week, so it seems like Russia and the regime blinked at the last second and watched the difficulty of an operation grow in the process. I'm not suggesting Turkey has the means to militarily prevent Russia from taking Idlib, or that Putin may not change his mind tomorrow and go in anyway, but for now Erdogan's objections (presumably backed by those of European leaders who also fear a renewed refugee crisis) seem serious enough to make Putin at least think twice before entering the province.
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Sep 16, 2018 18:28
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The bombardment hasn't stopped. Yeah there was a big protest, but there's been protests for weeks in the face of the bombings. There are millions of people in Idlib, and there's nowhere to bus them to. Idlib is where everyone who's surrendered has been displaced to. There's nowhere left for them but Turkey. It's going to be a loving nightmare for everyone involved, and it's going to take a really long time. It might be quite a while before the regime starts pushing, but the push is most certainly in the cards.
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Sep 16, 2018 18:39
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Sergg posted:Also it really bugs me when people say Idlib are all "al-Qaeda" because the vast majority of people living there are civilian refugees not wanting to be disappeared into Assad's camps & HTS only controls 60% of the territory there and there's still constant infighting between rebel groups. Also because HTS/JAN has never attacked anyone outside of Syria that I'm aware of, despite being on the receiving end of plenty of American bombs. If you want to use epithets against them, call them "the Syrian Taliban" or "fanatical Islamists". They broke ties with and disavowed al-Qaeda years ago because Julani was focused on issues in Syria proper and didn't give a poo poo about a dumb caliphate. While there's obviously value in recognizing the complexities of the situation, in almost every circumstance the majority of people involved are just normal civilians dragged into the mess. It's difficult for anyone to constantly reference that nuance when in general conversation. I'm not sure why you think its relevant to point out the JAN never launched attacks outside of Syria. That wasn't because they opposed them on principle or anything, they just didn't see it tactically useful in-so-far as it comes to achieving their goals in Syria. They subscribe to exactly the same ideology as Zawahiri et al., they are just focused on different projects. US federal agencies acknowledge no distinction between HTS and al Qaeda central. They OFFICIALLY broke ties with al-Qaeda, but that doesn't mean they no long have any relationship, and they definitely didn't "disavow" al-Qaeda. There are good quotes on the subject from HITS leaders on their relationship with al-Qaeda. quote:Indeed, a senior HTS official known as Abu Abdullah al Shami later wrote on his Telegram channel that the “idea of the project [meaning JFS] was to change the name of the group…and announce what would be understood in the media as breaking the ties with al Qaeda.” However, according to al Shami, “there would remain a secret undisclosed allegiance to” al Qaeda’s leaders, “in a state which would resemble the situation before our dispute with ISIS.”** Al Shami meant that JFS would, as of July 2016 and in the months that followed, maintain a secret oath of allegiance to Zawahiri, just as Al Nusrah Front had prior to the outset of its conflict with Abu Bakr al Baghdadi’s Islamic State more than three years earlier. Subsequent to this the relationship became more strained, with Zawahiri criticizing HTS for becoming more nationalistic and associating with more moderate elements, but there's no indication the fundamental relationship has dramatically changed.
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Sep 16, 2018 19:33
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Volkerball posted:The bombardment hasn't stopped. Yeah there was a big protest, but there's been protests for weeks in the face of the bombings. There are millions of people in Idlib, and there's nowhere to bus them to. Idlib is where everyone who's surrendered has been displaced to. There's nowhere left for them but Turkey. It's going to be a loving nightmare for everyone involved, and it's going to take a really long time. It might be quite a while before the regime starts pushing, but the push is most certainly in the cards. The bombardment didn't come to a total halt, but the Russian air force isn't flying massive sorties anymore, as they were when invasion appeared imminent. I'm not saying the whole thing is over forever or anything, just that Turkey's frantic diplomacy seems to have bought at least a small reprieve, and that they've been using that reprieve to reinforce the area with combat forces. It's still at least possible they'll end up attacking Nusra themselves in order to prevent a full invasion by Russia and the regime.
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Sep 16, 2018 20:01
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Youd think russia would be dumping as much munition onto idlib as they could to reduce transit weight in the exit. Especially since the war would be practically over if idlib fell. The defenders have been shoring up their positions for weeks. Why let them do more if it only stands to extend the effort needed to uproot their positions
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Sep 16, 2018 20:36
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Idlib has been in rebel hands for years. They pounded Douma and Jobar for months before they moved in. Really years in the case of Jobar.
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Sep 16, 2018 20:38
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I dont remember a lull like this in ghouta
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Sep 16, 2018 20:48
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Russia's repeatedly held meetings with Turkey on the matter, and Putin is meeting with Erdogan again next week to discuss it, so Turkey's pretty clearly the reason for the lull, whether it holds or not. Turkey's not a great power, but it is a regional power, and one that's more important for Russia's long term interests than whether or not Assad pacifies another piece of his patchwork country he may never fully recapture, at least as long as the attacks on Tartus from Idlib come to an end. That doesn't mean Turkey automatically gets its way, but they have enough of a stake in the matter that they're being extensively consulted, and the observation points they've been reinforcing thus far remain unchallenged. If Russia wanted to take a hard stand against Turkey keeping territory out of the regime's hands, stopping them from conquering Afrin seems like it would have been a significant step in that direction, but instead they sat by while Turkey extended their occupation-by-proxy in the north. We know Turkey got a green light at some point, because they stopped being afraid of sending their air force to back the invasion.
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Sep 16, 2018 21:05
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Turkey sentences alleged British YPG fighter for 'terrorism' https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/09/turkey-sentences-alleged-british-ypg-fighter-terrorism-180916070842159.html Can't wait for Turkey to arrest the United States Military.
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Sep 16, 2018 21:17
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Do you ever get tired of portraying Russia as playing this leading, restraining role with Assad and having reality kick you in the teeth? gently caress, two weeks ago your were acting like Erdogan was cowering in fear at the idea of making Russia upset, and now you've done a complete 180 out of nowhere based on nothing. Assad is not not going to invade Idlib. This isn't controversial.
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Sep 16, 2018 21:21
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Volkerball posted:Do you ever get tired of portraying Russia as playing this leading, restraining role with Assad and having reality kick you in the teeth? gently caress, two weeks ago your were acting like Erdogan was cowering in fear at the idea of making Russia upset, and now you've done a complete 180 out of nowhere based on nothing. Assad is not not going to invade Idlib. This isn't controversial. Assad 100% can't fight Turkey without Russia's approval and battlefield support. I still acknowledged that Turkey can't act without Russia's acquiesence either, but Russia telling Assad to slow down is a better explanation for the fact that the planned invasion he needs Russia's help to accomplish didn't start on time than your  I've made it clear that I still think Russia could change their mind and go ahead over Turkish objections anyway, but those objections do seem to have been sufficient to halt things at least temporarily.
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Sep 16, 2018 21:43
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Russia has been expensively ashing out the rebels. Their current method is very cost prohibitive not just in the regional conflict but on the domestic side as well. There are daily airlifts of troops from russia to syria as well as the obvious cost to Russian PMC Wagner. The only real reason to halt instead of increase an already proven bombing strategy is due to a change in diplomatic efforts. If you honestly think Assad just does as he pleases and Russia has no restraint at all you're a fool. This would be the same thing as saying the CIA had no control over Noriega. Russia is propping Assad up, Politically and militarily. Without Russian assistance the Idlib campaign would be a lasting stalemate. Turkey has benefited from permeable borders heavily. Allowing the flow of munitions to continue the conflict is very in their interest. Do you think Assad just gives some Russian commander a buzz every time he has a problem with ratty rebels? Look at the US control over Afghanistan military decisions at the HQ level as a perfect example of what goes on in the SAA HQ. Don't you know anything of intrigue?
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Sep 16, 2018 21:51
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Syria is not Panama and Assad is not Karzai. Russian troops were at the staging areas for previous chemical weapons attacks as they were being prepared. They do not give a single gently caress about the lengths Assad goes to reclaim Syria for his regime. The bombing campaign hasn't even stopped and troops are still massing. Israel has played more of a limiting role in Syria than anyone recently because they have been bombing the Damascus airport every other day.
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Sep 16, 2018 22:01
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CherryCola posted:Turkey sentences alleged British YPG fighter for 'terrorism' I don't think that is the type of thing Turkey would hesitate on. They did arrest that American priest and are still holding him, despite (or probably because of) all the pressure and harsh language from Trump and friends.
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Sep 16, 2018 23:56
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Speaking of Erdogan, I guess he withstood the economic crash without any appreciable lasting damage?
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Sep 17, 2018 00:04
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Squalid posted:While there's obviously value in recognizing the complexities of the situation, in almost every circumstance the majority of people involved are just normal civilians dragged into the mess. It's difficult for anyone to constantly reference that nuance when in general conversation. Thanks for the information. It's not like I was singing HTS' praises or anything. In fact I think I was the only person posting negative stories about them this past week that isn't an Assad supporter in this thread, but it's always good to be more informed about something.
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Sep 17, 2018 00:09
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steinrokkan posted:Speaking of Erdogan, I guess he withstood the economic crash without any appreciable lasting damage? https://www.economist.com/finance-and-economics/2018/09/15/what-the-sliding-lira-and-economy-mean-for-turkeys-banks quote:The economy over which Mr Erdogan presides, by contrast, is embroiled in a battle for survival. This year the lira has fallen by 40% against the dollar, tumbling especially hard last month after a diplomatic row with America. Inflation is nearly 18%. The central bank, pressed by Mr Erdogan to keep interest rates down, has been slow to react, but on September 13th, even as the president urged a cut, it raised its policy rate by 6.25 percentage points, much more than markets had expected, to 24%. The lira leapt in response. Saladin Rising fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Sep 17, 2018 |
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Sep 17, 2018 00:36
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Volkerball posted:Syria is not Panama and Assad is not Karzai. Russian troops were at the staging areas for previous chemical weapons attacks as they were being prepared. They do not give a single gently caress about the lengths Assad goes to reclaim Syria for his regime. The bombing campaign hasn't even stopped and troops are still massing. Israel has played more of a limiting role in Syria than anyone recently because they have been bombing the Damascus airport every other day. Do you honestly think israel bombing is the most significant action currently being taken? Assad isnt dictating the lengths he will go. He is a ghost at this point. Russia is dictating those lengths fully. Just because an syaaf officer said to do a bombing or a minister did does not mean that they arent on the strings. Russia literally assassinates people in foreign capitals more secure than damascus. If you dont thi k the majority of whats left of the political and military hq is very vulnerable to russian subterfuge please rethink that.
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Sep 17, 2018 00:48
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Turkish Lira has plummeted over the past 10 years. Just because it has temporarily stabilized doesn't mean the outlook is good.
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Sep 17, 2018 00:52
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Assad is in an interesting situation now where militarily he has very little power, but strategically he is actually more powerful than Trump, Putin, or Erdogan in Syria because of how he can play the others against each other. At this point Russia is far too invested in the war to afford Assad losing, so no matter what idiotic decision Assad makes Putin will have to support him. Similarly while Trump and Erdogan have been in a row lately, Turkey is still a key ally with the US, so Turkey really can't afford a war with a Russian-backed Assad, since that will require the US to help Turkey. The US also can't afford having a potential direct confrontation with Russian forces in the unlikely chance that Assad somehow manages to score a few victories against Turkey and his forces start getting dangerously close to one of the US nuclear bases in Turkey. Of course in the later scenario it would also force Israel to directly engage Assad's forces to prevent him from acquiring the nuclear weapons.
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Sep 17, 2018 00:59
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LeoMarr posted:Do you honestly think israel bombing is the most significant action currently being taken? Assad isnt dictating the lengths he will go. He is a ghost at this point. Russia is dictating those lengths fully. Just because an syaaf officer said to do a bombing or a minister did does not mean that they arent on the strings. Russia literally assassinates people in foreign capitals more secure than damascus. If you dont thi k the majority of whats left of the political and military hq is very vulnerable to russian subterfuge please rethink that. Russia has played a supporting role throughout the entire process. All you have to point to otherwise is a bunch of hearsay and people pretending they basically have a seat in high level meetings in foreign countries because they read an article. Based on what we actually have seen, Russia has not stood in the way whatsoever when it comes to the regime conquering what's left of Syria, and in fact, have supported them diplomatically and militarily every step of the way. As of today, state media is still running articles talking about an impending false flag chemical weapons attack, and then you come in this thread and read that hell Russia barely even cares about Idlib and they're making backroom deals to stop its invasion. I don't know what the gently caress planet y'all are from. How many years in a row can someone have a weekly "Russia is negotiating this out and they don't care about what Assad wants" point, only to see Russia end up completely and totally backing Assad in the pursuit of his foreign policy goals every time, before they start to wonder if it's possible they don't know what the gently caress they're talking about?
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Sep 17, 2018 01:09
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Volkerball posted:Russia has played a supporting role throughout the entire process. All you have to point to otherwise is a bunch of hearsay and people pretending they basically have a seat in high level meetings in foreign countries because they read an article. Based on what we actually have seen, Russia has not stood in the way whatsoever when it comes to the regime conquering what's left of Syria, and in fact, have supported them diplomatically and militarily every step of the way. As of today, state media is still running articles talking about an impending false flag chemical weapons attack, and then you come in this thread and read that hell Russia barely even cares about Idlib and they're making backroom deals to stop its invasion. I don't know what the gently caress planet y'all are from. How many years in a row can someone have a weekly "Russia is negotiating this out and they don't care about what Assad wants" point, only to see Russia end up completely and totally backing Assad in the pursuit of his foreign policy goals every time, before they start to wonder if it's possible they don't know what the gently caress they're talking about? Syria is loving protectorate of russia. Diplomatically, media wise, militarily and economically to some extent. With foreign support idlib could hold out for years -- Turkey is experiencing an existential crisis. They were a hair away from a Literal run on the banks not a solid outlook fkr tbe government. Only way to shore up is to get control of kurdish gas in syria. Or expand influence over Iraq in lieu of iran. WAR CRIME GIGOLO fucked around with this message at 02:15 on Sep 17, 2018 |
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Sep 17, 2018 01:57
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Volkerball posted:Russia has played a supporting role throughout the entire process. All you have to point to otherwise is a bunch of hearsay and people pretending they basically have a seat in high level meetings in foreign countries because they read an article. Based on what we actually have seen, Russia has not stood in the way whatsoever when it comes to the regime conquering what's left of Syria, and in fact, have supported them diplomatically and militarily every step of the way. As of today, state media is still running articles talking about an impending false flag chemical weapons attack, and then you come in this thread and read that hell Russia barely even cares about Idlib and they're making backroom deals to stop its invasion. I don't know what the gently caress planet y'all are from. How many years in a row can someone have a weekly "Russia is negotiating this out and they don't care about what Assad wants" point, only to see Russia end up completely and totally backing Assad in the pursuit of his foreign policy goals every time, before they start to wonder if it's possible they don't know what the gently caress they're talking about? They want the same thing Assad wants w/r/t Idlib, but taking territory that's under some degree of Turkish protection is different from anything we've seen so far in the war, and Russia has taken pains to work with Turkey, at times against the wishes of the regime, as when they allowed Turkey to invade Afrin, including through the full use of its airspace. Yeah, the regime had some interest in using the threat of a Turkish invasion to force the Kurds to the negotiating table, but the actual invasion and takeover by Turkish backed rebels was clearly opposed by the regime, because the regime isn't capable of forcing Turkey to leave, whereas the YPG was a group they could hope to defeat when the time came. Maybe Turkey won't be able to stave off the invasion of Idlib forever, but they do seem to have delayed it so far (and taken the opportunity to reinforce their border posts with heavy weaponry), when it appeared imminent a week ago, which is all I've been saying.
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Sep 17, 2018 02:15
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Sergg posted:Thanks for the information. It's not like I was singing HTS' praises or anything. In fact I think I was the only person posting negative stories about them this past week that isn't an Assad supporter in this thread, but it's always good to be more informed about something. Didn't mean to suggest you were praising them or anything, I try and adhere to a strict policy of not reading any subtext into anyone's posts. It is rather odd though to see some members of the anti-imperialist left adopt the logic of the war on terror to justify cheering on Assad. I once hoped there could be a settlement to freeze the conflict, in which some kind of moderate rebel faction could end up controlling Idlib for the immediate future. Yet with HTS running the show, where would that peace lead? Certainly not to a liberal democracy. Of course if I could snap my fingers and end the war exactly as things stand today I'd do it, if only to avoid the bloodshed that will come with resolution. It's hard though to justify taking active measures when the primary beneficiary is (until very recently) literally al-Qaeda. The end is bad regardless.
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Sep 17, 2018 02:36
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Sinteres posted:They want the same thing Assad wants w/r/t Idlib, but taking territory that's under some degree of Turkish protection is different from anything we've seen so far in the war, and Russia has taken pains to work with Turkey, at times against the wishes of the regime, as when they allowed Turkey to invade Afrin, including through the full use of its airspace. Yeah, the regime had some interest in using the threat of a Turkish invasion to force the Kurds to the negotiating table, but the actual invasion and takeover by Turkish backed rebels was clearly opposed by the regime, because the regime isn't capable of forcing Turkey to leave, whereas the YPG was a group they could hope to defeat when the time came. Maybe Turkey won't be able to stave off the invasion of Idlib forever, but they do seem to have delayed it so far (and taken the opportunity to reinforce their border posts with heavy weaponry), when it appeared imminent a week ago, which is all I've been saying. Turkey pretty much can stave off invasion forever if they want to. They are a major regional power that Assad absolutely cannot contest militarily or politically. Russia has some limited economic clout but very little force projection or (conventional) long range strike ability unless they decide to straight up invade through Georgia - and even then Turkey has the means to fight a big long war even without considering NATO. A war with Turkey of any scale short of a fantasy land limited nuclear exchange has the potential go very badly for Russia and any chance of being humiliated militarily is going to look extremely unattractive to a guy like Putin. Erdy similarly needs to look strong right now and isn't going to do anything that looks like backing down. Warbadger fucked around with this message at 12:19 on Sep 17, 2018 |
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Sep 17, 2018 12:11
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Putin and Erdogan just announced the creation of a 15km buffer zone in Idlib, to be administered by Turkish and Russian forces, and Erdogan made a point of talking about the need to focus on terror groups (the YPG) in the country's northeast, which is obviously a point of agreement between the two countries now that the US is using the YPG to indefinitely split the country. Looking forward to Volkerball's post about how Assad doesn't care what Turkey thinks and the invasion is starting any day now, compelling Russia to fully back it.
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Sep 17, 2018 17:38
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Warbadger posted:Turkey pretty much can stave off invasion forever if they want to. They are a major regional power that Assad absolutely cannot contest militarily or politically. Russia has some limited economic clout but very little force projection or (conventional) long range strike ability unless they decide to straight up invade through Georgia - and even then Turkey has the means to fight a big long war even without considering NATO. A war with Turkey of any scale short of a fantasy land limited nuclear exchange has the potential go very badly for Russia and any chance of being humiliated militarily is going to look extremely unattractive to a guy like Putin. I agree with this assessment. Turkey's military is large, relatively modern, and also has a ton of experience from decades of fighting PKK's forces in tough terrain. It would absolutely crush Assad, and could stave off Russia if it came to an open confrontation with them.
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Sep 17, 2018 17:39
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enraged_camel posted:I agree with this assessment. Turkey's military is large, relatively modern, and also has a ton of experience from decades of fighting PKK's forces in tough terrain. It would absolutely crush Assad, and could stave off Russia if it came to an open confrontation with them. it's also been the subject of extensive purges fairly recently, so it might just choke completely and roll over
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Sep 17, 2018 17:58
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Sinteres posted:Putin and Erdogan just announced the creation of a 15km buffer zone in Idlib, to be administered by Turkish and Russian forces, and Erdogan made a point of talking about the need to focus on terror groups (the YPG) in the country's northeast, which is obviously a point of agreement between the two countries now that the US is using the YPG to indefinitely split the country. Looking forward to Volkerball's post about how Assad doesn't care what Turkey thinks and the invasion is starting any day now, compelling Russia to fully back it. Wait Russia is going to help Turkey fight the YPG? Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuun
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Sep 17, 2018 18:04
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V. Illych L. posted:it's also been the subject of extensive purges fairly recently, so it might just choke completely and roll over Yeahhh. And fighting local rebellions isn't the same as fighting other militaries. Counter-insurgency was blamed on Israel's poor performance vs Hezbollah. The idea was that they spent all their time mowing the human lawn in Gaza and doing quasi-police operations that they were not ready to face troops that didn't immediately run away during combat. But also Turkey has super short supply lines compared to Russia when it comes to fighting in Syria.
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Sep 17, 2018 18:06
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V. Illych L. posted:it's also been the subject of extensive purges fairly recently, so it might just choke completely and roll over They showed more competence in Afrin than they did in northern Aleppo/Al-Bab, so having some experience under their belts seems to have gotten them past the post-purge doldrums, even if it's also possible that the YPG was just an easier opponent than ISIS. Either way, obviously fighting the regime would be more challenging than fighting either ISIS or the YPG, but without heavy Russian assistance the regime would still be fighting out of its class. Unlike Russia, the regime wasn't content to watch idly as Turkey invaded Afrin, but regime-friendly forces sent to the region were bombed, and the regime obviously didn't try to escalate things since they knew they couldn't win. The regime very much wanted Al-Bab too, but aside from a few limited incursions which have been beaten back, they've left it alone. CherryCola posted:Wait Russia is going to help Turkey fight the YPG? They didn't go so far as to say that, but they do have a common interest in putting pressure on the US to abandon the YPG. With Iraq potentially transitioning to a less US-friendly government, the US may soon find itself relatively isolated there, even if nobody can actually force them out.
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Sep 17, 2018 18:09
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So Idlib just became the new Gaza Strip?
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Sep 17, 2018 18:09
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Sinteres posted:Putin and Erdogan just announced the creation of a 15km buffer zone in Idlib, to be administered by Turkish and Russian forces, and Erdogan made a point of talking about the need to focus on terror groups (the YPG) in the country's northeast, which is obviously a point of agreement between the two countries now that the US is using the YPG to indefinitely split the country. Looking forward to Volkerball's post about how Assad doesn't care what Turkey thinks and the invasion is starting any day now, compelling Russia to fully back it. Putin and Assad promised to recognize a demilitarized zone in this, the Syrian civil war? I am undone.
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Sep 17, 2018 18:13
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Sergg posted:So Idlib just became the new Gaza Strip? i'd say that idlib is landlocked and gaza isn't, but lol blockade
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Sep 17, 2018 18:15
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