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The big thing I like about nWoD is that they make much more explicit that weird, uncategorized poo poo abounds. That idea was around in oWoD but never emphasized as much.
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Sep 24, 2018 21:55
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Pope Guilty posted:The big thing I like about nWoD is that they make much more explicit that weird, uncategorized poo poo abounds. That idea was around in oWoD but never emphasized as much. It's something that's hard to just throw in a game without concrete mechanics behind, so the inclusion of non-denominational Horror creation rules in CofD (presumably originating in Hunter's generic monster creation) was a very smart move.
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Sep 24, 2018 22:10
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Terrorforge posted:It's something that's hard to just throw in a game without concrete mechanics behind, so the inclusion of non-denominational Horror creation rules in CofD (presumably originating in Hunter's generic monster creation) was a very smart move. Yeah, and Hunter: the Vigil and the blue blooks both really leaned into it in a way that Hunter: the Reckoning never did. Most of the material on hunters in oWoD was line-specific, like Hunters Hunted or Project Twilight. nWoD is much more deliberate about supporting playing both regular humans and a wide variety of empowered humans and near-humans. e: Also, I'm reading Beckett's Jyhad Diary (for a metaplot dork like myself this is pure catnip) and does anybody know who the notes by O and cursive A are? Block letter A is clear Anatole, L is obviously Lucita, and I though cursive A was Victoria Ash for a moment but now I doubt it. Pope Guilty fucked around with this message at 22:16 on Sep 24, 2018 |
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Sep 24, 2018 22:13
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Life in the Chronicles of Darkness is absolutely really lovely. It's basically a world where everyone growing up knows someone who was eaten by the boogeyman and no one talks about it -- think the town of Derry in IT, only that's everywhere. The flip side of this is that, by and large, it's not completely hopeless. Nearly everything that's wrong with the world is the result of specific, temporal events and their consequences. The Exarchs can be overthrown, the God-Machine broken, the Underworld can be destroyed or repaired, and so on. It takes a degree of power, cooperation, and incorruptibility that people rarely have, but the shittiness isn't the natural or inevitable state of humanity; it's something imposed from above by powers that need us, while we don't need them. (With the possible exception of the God-Machine, anyways, which may or may not be the only thing keeping humanity safe from world-ending disasters. But that's probably self-serving bullshit or at least greatly exaggerated since it's only been around for a few thousand years.) Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 22:22 on Sep 24, 2018 |
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Sep 24, 2018 22:19
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:Life in the Chronicles of Darkness is absolutely really lovely. It's basically a world where everyone growing up knows someone who was eaten by the boogeyman and no one talks about it -- think the town of Derry in IT, only that's everywhere. ...you didn't grow up with at least one of your classmates at some point in your school career dying of some random idiot mischance, disease or other problem?
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Sep 24, 2018 22:49
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Mors Rattus posted:...you didn't grow up with at least one of your classmates at some point in your school career dying of some random idiot mischance, disease or other problem? There's no intention behind a car accident, and it's not like the ChroD universe lacks mundane horrors and deaths as well as supernatural ones. Also to be perfectly honest I regard the real world as kind of lovely too? 
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Sep 24, 2018 22:52
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Terrorforge posted:It used to be the explicit case nWoD was shittier on a mundane level - more corruption, more abuse, more apathy. IIRC The Chrondark world is a bit uglier BECAUSE of the unspoken weird gribblies. Even if they're just weird and not malevolent, there's this deep vein of mistrust under the surface of society, because people don't want to be seen as crazy and/or believe that if they try and talk to anyone about that time their buddy Keith knocked over the weird wicker idol man in the forest and started puking up leeches by the bucketful, they make themselves a target for the Forces of Darkness. People are more paranoid and deceitful, essentially.
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Sep 24, 2018 22:53
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The main difference between nWoD and CofD as I see it is that in the latter there is a far greater degree of emphasis on capital s Systems (foremost being the God Machine, naturally) that are not embodied or directed the way the nWoD’s abundant conspiracies are. Player characters aren’t fighting against an apocalyptic decline, as they were in nWoD, they’re fighting stasis and bondage. The worst case scenario is life going on miserably the way it always has. Which, in a way, adds a tint of optimism to the setting. If you fail, there’s going to be a next guy. It also helps that CofD has no real metaplot. Basic Chunnel fucked around with this message at 23:14 on Sep 24, 2018 |
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Sep 24, 2018 23:12
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I suspect the things the God-Machine is ostensibly protecting us from are just the results of its own failings. So causing a hurricane because you destroyed critical Infrastructure is like if someone built a jenga tower on top of your TV Guide and you dropped it on your toes trying to dislodge the magazine. Sure, that bottom jenga was "protecting" your toes from blocky trauma, but it's only an issue because someone put the drat tower there in the first place.
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Sep 24, 2018 23:19
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Pope Guilty posted:e: Also, I'm reading Beckett's Jyhad Diary (for a metaplot dork like myself this is pure catnip) and does anybody know who the notes by O and cursive A are? Block letter A is clear Anatole, L is obviously Lucita, and I though cursive A was Victoria Ash for a moment but now I doubt it. That would be Okulos, Beckett's Nosferatu pal.
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Sep 24, 2018 23:27
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Dawgstar posted:That would be Okulos, Beckett's Nosferatu pal. Oh, duh, thanks.
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Sep 24, 2018 23:29
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Basic Chunnel posted:The main difference between nWoD and CofD as I see it is that in the latter there is a far greater degree of emphasis on capital s Systems (foremost being the God Machine, naturally) that are not embodied or directed the way the nWoD’s abundant conspiracies are. Player characters aren’t fighting against an apocalyptic decline, as they were in nWoD, they’re fighting stasis and bondage. The worst case scenario is life going on miserably the way it always has. Which, in a way, adds a tint of optimism to the setting. If you fail, there’s going to be a next guy. Kinda like the vigil metaphor of New Hunter.
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Sep 24, 2018 23:32
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Speaking of the next guy, have we heard anything about Deviant recently*? I'm really curious about those character replacement mechanics. e: * by which I mean "in the last few months" because I've been out of the loop for a while
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Sep 24, 2018 23:41
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The other A is Aisling Sturbridge, the signature Tremere. (Incidentally, I really like Aisling's choices for the snippy quotes she attaches to her emails.)
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Sep 24, 2018 23:42
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:(With the possible exception of the God-Machine, anyways, which may or may not be the only thing keeping humanity safe from world-ending disasters. But that's probably self-serving bullshit or at least greatly exaggerated since it's only been around for a few thousand years.) Terrorforge posted:I suspect the things the God-Machine is ostensibly protecting us from are just the results of its own failings. So causing a hurricane because you destroyed critical Infrastructure is like if someone built a jenga tower on top of your TV Guide and you dropped it on your toes trying to dislodge the magazine. Sure, that bottom jenga was "protecting" your toes from blocky trauma, but it's only an issue because someone put the drat tower there in the first place.
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Sep 24, 2018 23:59
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:Life in the Chronicles of Darkness is absolutely really lovely. It's basically a world where everyone growing up knows someone who was eaten by the boogeyman and no one talks about it -- think the town of Derry in IT, only that's everywhere. It's not all getting eaten, though. It's more about mystery than evil, like World of Darkness. So when someone at school says their first cousin was making out with a girl and she had teeth down there, or that their uncle works for a top secret government kill squad that hunts vampires, they might be telling the truth. Everyone's had some contact with the supernatural, but a lot of it is just benignly weird, like the pizza deliverman mentioned above.
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Sep 25, 2018 00:13
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Promethean question: Hey so I just realized I've been doing Alembics super-wrong this whole time, so I need some clarification: Apparently, you charge an Alembic for the scene by spending Pyros. Spending more lets you use stronger abilities (IE spending 1 in Unconquered lets you activate Cyclopean Might, but spending 3 would let you use Cyclopean Might, Titan's Throw, AND Wrath of the Gods). My question is, I suppose, if I charge it with three Pyros and activate Wrath of the Gods, does that fully expend those three Pyros I charged the Alembic with for the scene? OR Is the Alembic just flat out charged for the scene and I can use my silly powers to my heart's content (or the scene's end)? The book seemed to be unclear on that, but maybe I missed the part that explains it. I've just been using them like I'd use Vampire powers, IE, spend pyros, activate Transmutation, which is... incorrect. EDIT: Specifically, it says that you can use the "Distillation (or any lesser Distillation) for the remainder of the scene." I guess my question is, does that mean use it once and then you have to recharge it, or you can pop all three transmutations in an Alembic and benefit from them for the remainder of the scene? FrostyPox fucked around with this message at 01:36 on Sep 25, 2018 |
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Sep 25, 2018 01:24
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When it says Cost under each Distillation, it's listing how much Pyros you need to have charged the Alembic with. Once you meet the required charge you can use it freely for the rest of the scene. Some Distillations involving spending Pyros on top of the base charge; generally the base charge is 1 - 2 - 3 Pyros for each set of three Distillations and the extra expenditures are in parentheses. This does mean that most Alembics can be charged for 3 Pyros and then you can use all the Distillations freely for the scene. It is not presented as neatly in the book as it could have been.
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Sep 25, 2018 03:40
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Gerund posted:Why yes, the rules in the BNS game reflect the setting evolution that was written in the BNS game! A left shoe is only weird if you purposefully ignore that a right shoe exists. The issue isn't oh no an apocalypse', it's that the way to get there was handled very poorly and a lot of decisions make no sense even within that context. Nor is it 'dishonest' to look at the tribal weakness of 'kicked out of egypt' (the classic weakness) or even the updated weakness of 'compulsion to wander' (which mechanically does not prohibit sept ownership or territorial claims, while we're at it) and still find the idea of them handing over the caern that facilitates their wandering more than literally any other thing on the face of the earth a dumb and terrible idea.
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Sep 25, 2018 08:46
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Terrorforge posted:I suspect the things the God-Machine is ostensibly protecting us from are just the results of its own failings. So causing a hurricane because you destroyed critical Infrastructure is like if someone built a jenga tower on top of your TV Guide and you dropped it on your toes trying to dislodge the magazine. Sure, that bottom jenga was "protecting" your toes from blocky trauma, but it's only an issue because someone put the drat tower there in the first place.
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Sep 25, 2018 09:47
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Dawgstar posted:That would be Okulos, Beckett's Nosferatu pal. So, has all the crazy poo poo Okulos got involved in the run up to Gehanna been retconned?
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Sep 25, 2018 09:54
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Loomer posted:The issue isn't oh no an apocalypse', it's that the way to get there was handled very poorly and a lot of decisions make no sense even within that context. Nor is it 'dishonest' to look at the tribal weakness of 'kicked out of egypt' (the classic weakness) or even the updated weakness of 'compulsion to wander' (which mechanically does not prohibit sept ownership or territorial claims, while we're at it) and still find the idea of them handing over the caern that facilitates their wandering more than literally any other thing on the face of the earth a dumb and terrible idea. Also, here's the Bone Gnawers, whose whole thing is that they're the lowest of the low whom nobody fails to qualify to join and who will come out of nowhere to strike the final- *touches earpiece* I'm being told they're experiencing upward socioeconomic mobility.
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Sep 25, 2018 10:48
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See, that's a change I don't mind so much. If we really are talking about the final battles, well, the Bone Gnawers pulled their weight and held their caerns better than anyone else by virtue of being numerous, rock hard, and willing to fight dirty, so they really should experience a change in status just by virtue of the glory accrued during the fighting. The bigger tonal clash with them is that they're now fully embracing the Weaver like the Glass Walkers, rather than finally being on the rise.
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Sep 25, 2018 11:07
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Charlz Guybon posted:So, has all the crazy poo poo Okulos got involved in the run up to Gehanna been retconned? Gehenna didn't happen, although it's implied that Okulos remains super-cheesed with Beckett, although Beckett hasn't figured this out.
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Sep 25, 2018 12:29
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Pope Guilty posted:Also, here's the Bone Gnawers, whose whole thing is that they're the lowest of the low whom nobody fails to qualify to join and who will come out of nowhere to strike the final- *touches earpiece* I'm being told they're experiencing upward socioeconomic mobility. What if Red Talons but homids too.
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Sep 25, 2018 14:12
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Dawgstar posted:What if Red Talons but homids too. Just like my fan fictions.
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Sep 25, 2018 14:17
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Rand Brittain posted:Gehenna didn't happen, although it's implied that Okulos remains super-cheesed with Beckett, although Beckett hasn't figured this out.
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Sep 25, 2018 14:42
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[note: i have no time quoting the post talking about if the setting is grimdark so here's my two cents] So what i'm getting at here is that it's not overly lovely but it still kinda sucks. I don't hate the gothic aesthetic but the gothic tone is what turns me off a tad bit. I have a dark sense of humor so things that I do in stuff tends to take jabs at dark themes. overly serious things aren't my cup of tea but i can understand some people have fun with drama. I'm more of a comedy person despite having a few screwed up ideas for horror stories. but why would you want to set up your characters to fight against beings way above them in power like the god machine? I understand it's irrational motivations but what if killing the god machine might break the world's matrix/code? Or if the exarchs were defeated, what would become of the world? things like these are why i tend to like self contained stories that don't end in a bang.
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Sep 25, 2018 16:14
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So, I got BJD at the big sale and... yeah, it's the catnip I was afraid of. I really like the section on the southeast USA and how it's recovering from the Sabbat's Crusade at the turn of the millennium. While I'm not sure about the 'every clan/bloodline/whatever that likes voudoun are having a giant zombie party in New Orleans and the Camarilla is passing it off as those fun runs in zombie makeup' I do really dig the idea of the Southron Lords. (In essence, they were very old vampires who came over to take advantage of chattel slavery because they were old enough to remember it being a thing from earlier in their existence and went to sleep to avoid the Civil War. So there's like a dozen super old vampires sleeping it off with the potential for the fracas to wake them up.) They also might not actually exist because it's a Malkavian who says they do. It also deals with the Schismatic Assamites coming to the Camarilla and I'm tickled by the idea of my hometown of Birmingham, Alabama being the epicenter for their integration.
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Sep 25, 2018 16:23
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Fruity20 posted:[note: i have no time quoting the post talking about if the setting is grimdark so here's my two cents] Well, if the exarchs are defeated, the world itself is entirely remade; that said, most games are just not going to involve fighting the Exarchs. Likewise, killing the God-Machine is rarely the focus of a game. You beat its plan, preventing whatever it was trying to do until the next occult conjunction 200 years from now or whatever. Your average game is going to be much more street level and deal with lower-grade stuff unless you're going for a game specifically about killing the God-Machine or the Ascension War. Which are not the default modes of play, even for Mage. Demon, well, Demon does tend to a larger scale but even then you might just be trying to make this spot free of the Machine so you can live safely and peacefully. E: and if we're talking games other than Mage or Demon, well, you can go an entire game without ever dealing with anything larger scale than your one city. Werewolves care about their patch and that's usually it, same with Hunters and blue book portals. Vampires have no grasp of the wider world to begin with. Prometheans are a wholly personal journey of discovery. Changelings are too busy dealing with the Gentry, who while insanely powerful also aren't existential threats to the world - they're just supremely potent fae rear end in a top hat abusers.
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Sep 25, 2018 16:39
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Fruity20 posted:but why would you want to set up your characters to fight against beings way above them in power like the god machine? I understand it's irrational motivations but what if killing the god machine might break the world's matrix/code? Or if the exarchs were defeated, what would become of the world? things like these are why i tend to like self contained stories that don't end in a bang. Killing the God-Machine might plunge the world into chaos, or even destroy it outright. Allowing it to continue existing will let it keep using humanity as (sometimes literal) grist for its cosmic mill. As for the Exarchs, Mage takes the gnostic stance that reality is oppressive and unjust by its very nature. We should exist as pure platonic Forms, not flawed, physical beings. Destroying reality isn't an unfortunate side effect of overthrowing the Exarchs, overthrowing the Exarchs is a necessary condition for the true goal of destroying reality. But in true CofD fashion, in either case there's no true answer. If you want to play with the pro/con stuff where maybe the God-Machine is necessary and struggle with the choice of whether it's better to die free or live a slave, you can. If you want to run a triumphant adventure where the "for your own good" stuff is so much hot air and God-Machine is fundamentally evil and destroying it only changes things for the better, you can. e: also, questions like yours are precisely why I do like stories of that scale. because yeah, what if loving with the God-Machine does cause the matrix to glitch out? What would that look like? How would it impact the characters? Is it a risk worth taking, and if not, how the hell do you go back to your life knowing what you could have done? Lots of fodder there e2: I mean hell, The Matrix itself is a whole movie that asks whether it's better to live free in a lovely real world or like cattle in a superficially safe and comfortable one that is fake and answers "the former but also you get to be a kung fu superhero terrorist in the fake world" Terrorforge fucked around with this message at 16:56 on Sep 25, 2018 |
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Sep 25, 2018 16:42
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But seriously, folks, which are the books that explain how Gehenna/Apocalypse didn't happen and the classic WoD just keeps on truckin'?
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Sep 25, 2018 16:42
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Dawgstar posted:What if Red Talons but homids too. Yeah who would want to play the plucky underdog that's constantly punching up while self-sacrificing everything to look after their own when you could, instead, play a Hills Have Eyes / Texas Chainsaw Massacre reject. WTF were they thinking.
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Sep 25, 2018 17:08
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Fruity20 posted:but why would you want to set up your characters to fight against beings way above them in power like the god machine? I understand it's irrational motivations but what if killing the god machine might break the world's matrix/code? Or if the exarchs were defeated, what would become of the world? things like these are why i tend to like self contained stories that don't end in a bang.
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Sep 25, 2018 17:24
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Basic Chunnel posted:You’re not supposed to defeat the GM or the Exarchs It's not the default assumption, but the Chronicles blue book talks about the possibility, including an example scenario that ends with the option to permanently lock the God-Machine out of reality.
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Sep 25, 2018 17:31
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I'll be honest, if you're not at least trying to fight the horrible system of the world in whatever ways you can, what's the point? That applies IRL too. You're not likely to bring down the GM or the Exarchs but you might bloody some noses and take part in making the world a bit closer to freedom from occult tyranny.
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Sep 25, 2018 17:32
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Halloween Jack posted:But seriously, folks, which are the books that explain how Gehenna/Apocalypse didn't happen and the classic WoD just keeps on truckin'? The 20th anneversary re-release are re-set before the end of everything, I think you're looking for Beckett's Jyhad Diaries.
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Sep 25, 2018 17:39
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Halloween Jack posted:But seriously, folks, which are the books that explain how Gehenna/Apocalypse didn't happen and the classic WoD just keeps on truckin'? Just take Gehenna/etc as books about the ends of the world, which hasn't happened yet, rather than a book which fits into the metaplot chronologically when it released.
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Sep 25, 2018 17:40
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:The 20th anneversary re-release are re-set before the end of everything, I think you're looking for Beckett's Jyhad Diaries. I doubt they'd do it, but it'd be kinda interesting to see what they'd do with Werewolf and Mage equivalents.
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Sep 25, 2018 17:54
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Halloween Jack posted:But seriously, folks, which are the books that explain how Gehenna/Apocalypse didn't happen and the classic WoD just keeps on truckin'? Well you see *Swedracula swoops in and flaps his cape*
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