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It’s one of my favorite DS9 episodes and I’m excited for Greatest Generation to get to it.
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Oct 4, 2018 14:54
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Instant Sunrise posted:It’s one of my favorite DS9 episodes and I’m excited for Greatest Generation to get to it. It's one of the best episodes of anything But like most best episodes of anything it's a payoff that needs what's come before it to be really good. I see these lists where people want to show Trek n00bs Measure of a Man and The Inner Light and BoBW and The Visitor and sometimes Civil Defense is on that list and I really don't think it would be good at all without a couple seasons of who Gul Dukat is
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Oct 4, 2018 14:58
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When I rewatched it I noticed a few things 1) As Quark and Odo are trapped and the situation escalates, Starfleet personnel continue to roam about the promenade outside looking completely unconcerned 2) Garak got Dukats dad prosecuted? I didn't remember that! That's really interesting!
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Oct 4, 2018 15:04
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Al Borland Corpse posted:2) Garak got Dukats dad prosecuted? I didn't remember that! That's really interesting! So natch, they don't follow up on it. However, it ends up sort of weird in the context of Dukat's conversation with Sisko in the Maquis two-parter, because if Cardassian justice is perfect, and Cardassians don't make mistakes, then you can't really blame someone who was part of the system that got your dad executed. Fun fact: According to "Tribunal", family members are present at the executions, which are part of a globally televised event to inspire and entertain the citizenry, so sisko could probably pull up a clip of Dukat watching his dad bite the big one.
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Oct 4, 2018 15:16
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https://twitter.com/donoteat1/status/1047847434737635328
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Oct 4, 2018 16:00
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I love the loving Quark callout towards Sisko when he's like "yeah you're fuckin accepting and tolerant, if the other person has all your same values".
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Oct 4, 2018 16:03
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MikeJF posted:I know, it's just my general lack of trust in the new show combined with it being an easy topic to gently caress up. I should give them another chance, I suppose. I'll probably give them another chance to do it right but I don't have much faith in Kurtzman and company. Too bad we'll never get another Civil Defense. But gently caress paying 10 bucks a month for those 10 minutes episodes.
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Oct 4, 2018 23:17
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Evek posted:I'll probably give them another chance to do it right but I don't have much faith in Kurtzman and company. Too bad we'll never get another Civil Defense. What, they're putting the short Treks up behind the All Access Paywall? gently caress that.
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Oct 5, 2018 01:01
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Drink-Mix Man posted:What, they're putting the short Treks up behind the All Access Paywall? gently caress that. Yup. And so far Netflix has declined to stream them and stick to Discovery only for now.
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Oct 5, 2018 01:04
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Drink-Mix Man posted:What, they're putting the short Treks up behind the All Access Paywall? gently caress that. It's going to literally be the only place to see them. For whatever reason, Netflix aren't getting them either.
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Oct 5, 2018 01:04
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The_Doctor posted:It's going to literally be the only place to see them. we'll All Access them elsewhere 
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Oct 5, 2018 01:09
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If you’re lucky enough to live in Canada, they’ll be airing on Space starting tonight and select Thursdays after at 9 eastern.
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Oct 5, 2018 01:33
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The Bloop posted:we'll All Access them elsewhere Not all of us.
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Oct 5, 2018 01:54
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Pick posted:I love the loving Quark callout towards Sisko when he's like "yeah you're fuckin accepting and tolerant, if the other person has all your same values". If you mean culturally: is the Federation shown doing anything (other than "exist," which to be fair is a profound provocation) to the Ferengi beyond, possibly, not allowing them all the business opportunities they might perceive?
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Oct 5, 2018 01:55
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:Not all of us. There are good arguments on either side. I'm generally a proponent of paying for content if you can afford it. In this case I want them to know that Trek is popular but their service isn't. Game of Thrones is the most pirated thing ever and HBO knows it, but they still make plenty of money using their subs so they don't really care. CBS needs to make some changes and I want them to feel it but but not mistake it for disinterest in Trek.
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Oct 5, 2018 02:00
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Runaway was cute. 
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Oct 5, 2018 02:48
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The Bloop posted:There are good arguments on either side. I'm generally a proponent of paying for content if you can afford it. In this case I want them to know that Trek is popular but their service isn't. Game of Thrones is the most pirated thing ever and HBO knows it, but they still make plenty of money using their subs so they don't really care. CBS needs to make some changes and I want them to feel it but but not mistake it for disinterest in Trek. You misunderstand me. I want them to know I want neither the service nor the show. If the Picard thing is good that'll give me a better opportunity to distinguish it.
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Oct 5, 2018 02:51
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Nessus posted:If Quark means personally, he's full of poo poo; tolerance does not mean you have to associate with someone with whom you dissent. Yeah, Quark is like one step away from saying "Oh, you don't want to deal with Orion slavers? So much for the tolerant Federation..."
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Oct 5, 2018 03:19
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The Federation is the most successfully culturally imperialistic force in the Star Trek universe, and they hold prosperity over the heads of developing worlds like Bajor in exchange for adherence to Federation cultural standards (e.g. no caste system). A powerful, post-scarcity institution ragging on a smaller power for its traditional practices, which that larger institution itself once engaged in prior to having transcended its benefits, is... oh, it's something like rich Californians objecting to underprivileged rural hunters. crazy lmao.
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Oct 5, 2018 03:26
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Tom Guycot posted:Yeah, Quark is like one step away from saying "Oh, you don't want to deal with Orion slavers? So much for the tolerant Federation..." Quark's big complaint, I seem to recall, is that Sisko doesn't like Ferengi because the greed of the Ferengi remind him of what humans used to be like, but that, in reality, human history was more oppressive than Ferengi history, because the Ferengi never had things like slavery and genocide. At another point, Quark basically tells Nog, that while Nog admires humanity and the Federation, humans seem to be a civilized species because they have so much wealth and their needs are satisfied, but that, if you take that away, if humans are hungry, frightened, and deprived of creature comforts, they revert back to violence and savagery. Epicurius fucked around with this message at 03:54 on Oct 5, 2018 |
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Oct 5, 2018 03:50
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Ferengi women are basically bought and sold in marriage contracts, quark was full of poo poo
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Oct 5, 2018 03:53
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The Bloop posted:There are good arguments on either side. I'm generally a proponent of paying for content if you can afford it. In this case I want them to know that Trek is popular but their service isn't. Game of Thrones is the most pirated thing ever and HBO knows it, but they still make plenty of money using their subs so they don't really care. CBS needs to make some changes and I want them to feel it but but not mistake it for disinterest in Trek. There is nothing you can do to prevent the people in charge from taking every wrong lesson away from what they did.
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Oct 5, 2018 03:57
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Pick posted:The Federation is the most successfully culturally imperialistic force in the Star Trek universe, and they hold prosperity over the heads of developing worlds like Bajor in exchange for adherence to Federation cultural standards (e.g. no caste system). A powerful, post-scarcity institution ragging on a smaller power for its traditional practices, which that larger institution itself once engaged in prior to having transcended its benefits, is... oh, it's something like rich Californians objecting to underprivileged rural hunters. crazy lmao. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TREQGl54BU8
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Oct 5, 2018 05:56
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Pick posted:The Federation is the most successfully culturally imperialistic force in the Star Trek universe, and they hold prosperity over the heads of developing worlds like Bajor in exchange for adherence to Federation cultural standards (e.g. no caste system). A powerful, post-scarcity institution ragging on a smaller power for its traditional practices, which that larger institution itself once engaged in prior to having transcended its benefits, is... oh, it's something like rich Californians objecting to underprivileged rural hunters. crazy lmao. There is room for debate, I think, in how much the Federation ought to share. They were clearly sharing with the Bajorans, to whatever extent. But there are no doubt a lot of cultures underneath the interdict of the Prime Directive whose live members in the present day (so to speak) would benefit immensely from Fed technology even if the impacts would be great. You could also argue that perhaps the Federation should be overtly interfering with cultures such as the Ferengi in a direct and targeted way: Are there not uncounted female Ferengi suffering in servitude? I think Quark was salty because, living in close contact with the Federation for such a long period of time, he was starting to see the cracks in his worldview, even if he adhered to it more strictly than his brother or his nephew.
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Oct 5, 2018 06:06
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Pick posted:The Federation is the most successfully culturally imperialistic force in the Star Trek universe, and they hold prosperity over the heads of developing worlds like Bajor in exchange for adherence to Federation cultural standards (e.g. no caste system). A powerful, post-scarcity institution ragging on a smaller power for its traditional practices, which that larger institution itself once engaged in prior to having transcended its benefits, is... oh, it's something like rich Californians objecting to underprivileged rural hunters. crazy lmao. There's definitely some parts of the Federation that are a little oppressively, but the concept of "we will only take you as an equal partners if you are all equal partners" isn't one of them.
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Oct 5, 2018 06:19
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Yeah that's a good point. Letting a civilization into your egalitarian club that permits gross inequality essentially means your club is no longer egalitarian.
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Oct 5, 2018 07:08
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Epicurius posted:Quark's big complaint, I seem to recall, is that Sisko doesn't like Ferengi because the greed of the Ferengi remind him of what humans used to be like, but that, in reality, human history was more oppressive than Ferengi history, because the Ferengi never had things like slavery and genocide. I mean... yeah, no poo poo if you take any creature and torture it its going to revert to a loving survival mentality. Not exactly some great fuckin' insight by Quark, like it always gets trotted out as. The Ferengi were disgusting, and while DS9 humanized individual Ferengi, nothing was ever redemptive about their culture. Maybe Sisko just doesn't like the Ferengi because, I dunno, they basically treat women as slaves currently, and the unchecked and celebrated capitalism of the Ferengi has to be the most soul crushing awful thing outside of the few glimpses we get of the well off Ferengi they only ever show us. I mean, all morality is an invention, and completely artificial so you either just party down with anything and everything without complaint in the galaxy, or you draw some line for yourself of what things you consider wrong. That includes imperialism and hypocrisy. No right or wrong answer. Either way, Quarks 'great insights' are so much meaningless fluff, devoid of substance.
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Oct 5, 2018 07:15
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Tom Guycot posted:Either way, Quarks 'great insights' are so much meaningless fluff, devoid of substance. I think this is why it's important that he is, to a certain extent, a successful Ferengi, because we then have the contest between him and Rom (the unsuccessful Ferengi - who we might reasonably expect to reject a system that has done him few favors) or Nog (who is a child). To be clear, this is not to somehow justify "the Ferengi social system" or say that there's a Quark in every capitalist, but that it is possible for people to become better.
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Oct 5, 2018 07:28
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Sure, I mean if theres one thing star trek has always been about, its about growing and being better people.
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Oct 5, 2018 07:32
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Already posted in the Discovery thread, but I give Short Trek: Runaway a solid meh. We learn Tilly has a caffeine addiction and security is lax on Discovery as once again some kinda alien manages to sneak onboard.
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Oct 5, 2018 08:11
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Security has always been rather lax on Starfleet ships.
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Oct 5, 2018 08:16
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Gonz posted:Security has always been rather lax on Starfleet ships. Apparently nobody reinvented push notifications after WW3, because they never have even the most basic of automatic alerts like "Ensign Nativeamericanstereotype has vanished from deck 3" or "Ensign Russiansterotype has remained in quarters for two hours beyond the normal start of his shift". And that's just the stuff doable with combadges and not even TNG sensors, where the computer could just run constant scans of every public area and report anybody who's not supposed to be there. Roadie fucked around with this message at 08:57 on Oct 5, 2018 |
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Oct 5, 2018 08:55
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Roadie posted:Apparently nobody reinvented push notifications after WW3, because they never have even the most basic of automatic alerts like "Ensign Nativeamericanstereotype has vanished from deck 3" or "Ensign Russiansterotype has remained in quarters for two hours beyond the normal start of his shift".
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Oct 5, 2018 09:05
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The ship’s sensors can break down the DNA signatures of alien species from orbit around a planet, but god help you if there’s an unauthorized alien anomoly on board the drat ship.
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Oct 5, 2018 11:33
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The Federation Privacy Act of 2285 outlawed functional internal sensors.
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Oct 5, 2018 11:39
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Blade_of_tyshalle posted:The Federation Privacy Act of 2285 outlawed functional internal sensors. Something like this is really the only explanation. I mean, obviously the explanation is writers who can't deal with what they've created, much like with shuttle transporters etc., But in-universe, they must value privacy more than safety. Of course, anyone can ask where anyone is or walk into each other's holodeck programs, but.. ehhhh.... well shoot
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Oct 5, 2018 12:25
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The Bloop posted:Of course, anyone can ask where anyone is or walk into each other's holodeck programs, but.. ehhhh.... well shoot The holodeck's more likely to seriously threaten the ship than an intruder.
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Oct 5, 2018 12:34
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Angry Salami posted:The holodeck's more likely to seriously threaten the ship than an intruder. Holodeck, safeties off authorization Yoeman Dingus Alpha Three Niner. Create a stack of warp cores and then give them sentience but make them extremely depressed
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Oct 5, 2018 12:37
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How many times did they do the thing with the computer saying “The Captain is not on board the ship” (cut to ad break) Got to be at least five times with TNG alone right? Also drat this Disco thing not being on Netflix, now I have to actually go to some effort to watch this show for the first time.
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Oct 5, 2018 13:02
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marktheando posted:How many times did they do the thing with the computer saying “The Captain is not on board the ship” (cut to ad break) DS9's version at least in the first two seasons is a crew member dramatically taking off their comm badge
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Oct 5, 2018 13:17
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