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mcmagic posted:I guess the more politically savvy senators don't think this is a fight worth having but Schumer is so obviously terrible at his job in every possible way... If you compare the types of people in the Senate and house, there's not enough ideological difference between Schumer and his caucus to cause them to change leadership. In the house the only people making noise are centrists and the left saying their vote isn't a given. Strangely politics has very little to do with it so much as a lack of awareness.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:26
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Condiv posted:this is quite simple. the gop are scum for writing and passing a resolution saying "we support ICE" in the middle of ICE ripping kids away from their parents. sinema is scum too for signing on to that resolution, regardless of her reasons for doing so And here you are trying your hardest to help the GOP get the most advantage they can possibly squeeze out of their resolution. That either makes you scum or the platonic ideal of a useful idiot.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:28
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I like how the argument of symbolic action versus real power has downgraded from "Manchin's Supreme Court vote" to "Simena's non-binding ICE vote". And yet everyone is still just as entrenched in their positions, my self included. As for Pelosi talk, the whole thing seems to be that 50+ representatives have publicly said they don't wont vote Pelosi on the floor, but nobody else wants the job. Guess we'll see if the Democrats have their own Freedom Caucus in a few months.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:30
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Naturally, they don't want their press passes pulled when the left retakes the white house
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Nov 14, 2018 17:30
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Wilhelm posted:AOS is good since she'll support progressive policies but does she actually have the knowledge base necessary to actually craft good policy No one knows anything about anything. As long as she hires a decent staff she'll be fine. That said, I really wish she'd stop mentioning her bachelor's degree in economics as if it gave her special insight into anything at all. That's annoying and she should stop.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:32
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1337JiveTurkey posted:And here you are trying your hardest to help the GOP get the most advantage they can possibly squeeze out of their resolution. That either makes you scum or the platonic ideal of a useful idiot. I'm gonna say the people helping the GOP get the most advantage they can out of their resolution aren't nobodies posting on a dead hetero forum that no one will ever read or care about, the people helping the GOP would be the Democrats who voted for said resolution (which will be used against them later to defend GOP policies, while at the same time the GOP gives those Democrats zero credit and accuses them of wanting to abolish ICE anyway)
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Nov 14, 2018 17:32
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CuddleCryptid posted:Naturally, they don't want their press passes pulled when the left retakes the white house Kind of cynical of them to imply there might be a post Trump universe. Ogmius815 posted:No one knows anything about anything. As long as she hires a decent staff she'll be fine. One eye in land of the blind. It's not like she's in the Chicago school.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:32
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1337JiveTurkey posted:And here you are trying your hardest to help the GOP get the most advantage they can possibly squeeze out of their resolution. That either makes you scum or the platonic ideal of a useful idiot. No, they are criticizing a powerful person who abused their position of authority in order to further the cause of child concentration camps. You're going to have to learn how to stomach criticism of your leaders if you expect to make it through this whole fascism trying to overthrow our society phase we're going through right now, because I assure you no matter how this turns out there is a fuckload more of legitimate criticism of our leadership figures coming in the near future. This attitude that criticizing your leaders is something only dumb plebs do as result of being manipulated by the enemy is well... there's a word for that that begins with a capital N. Prester Jane fucked around with this message at 17:41 on Nov 14, 2018 |
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Nov 14, 2018 17:35
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Ripoff posted:I can almost hear the teeth grinding at Fox from here. That's one of those "right thing for the wrong reasons" deals. They're only protecting their asses in the future against a democratic president. They don't give a flying gently caress about CNN or Jim Acosta.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:35
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Most politicians don’t actually know that much and rely on underlings for their knowledge. What will make the difference is energy and commitment, and AOC seems to have both. She seems like a doer, not a sayer. We’ll see.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:37
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1337JiveTurkey posted:And here you are trying your hardest to help the GOP get the most advantage they can possibly squeeze out of their resolution. That either makes you scum or the platonic ideal of a useful idiot. explain how i'm helping the GOP. there is no current or coming elections, and sinema won't face a challenger for 6 years. is all criticism of any dem verboten cause it could in some nebulous way help the GOP? Tibalt posted:I like how the argument of symbolic action versus real power has downgraded from "Manchin's Supreme Court vote" to "Simena's non-binding ICE vote". No, manchin is still extremely poo poo for his supreme court vote. sinema's poo poo because of how she's betraying immigrants
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Nov 14, 2018 17:37
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Ogmius815 posted:No one knows anything about anything. As long as she hires a decent staff she'll be fine. It makes her way more qualified to talk economic policy than nearly every GOP rep.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:37
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Ogmius815 posted:No one knows anything about anything. As long as she hires a decent staff she'll be fine. misogyny senses... tingling...
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Nov 14, 2018 17:40
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Prester Jane posted:She's the one who chose to put her name to it, and we're just reacting to that decision. I'm judging a powerful person by how they chose to use their power. "Sure it's a ploy, but by doing what they wan't I'm not actually falling for it"  The Sinema situation sucks and I don't know what the right answer is, but this doesn't sound like a sensible approach.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:42
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How the gently caress are we still circling around this Sinema thing?
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Nov 14, 2018 17:43
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Ogmius815 posted:No one knows anything about anything. As long as she hires a decent staff she'll be fine. How dare someone who has a degree in a field talk with some level of knowledge in it This history and English degree is worthless, and I should accept the person who knows best is a politican who thinks Democrats are still the party of the KKK.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:43
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Sinema is poo poo, in no small part because AZ is poo poo. It is simultaneously true that we’re objectively, materially better off that she won rather than McSally. It’s really not that hard.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:44
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Petr posted:"Sure it's a ploy, but by doing what they wan't I'm not actually falling for it" the right answer is what her peers in arizona did. they voted present, and against the resolution. this isn't hard
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Nov 14, 2018 17:44
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What a neat argument, I really gained a lot of perspective.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:45
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RuanGacho posted:If you compare the types of people in the Senate and house, there's not enough ideological difference between Schumer and his caucus to cause them to change leadership. The issue isn't his politics.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:45
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Mineaiki posted:How the gently caress are we still circling around this Sinema thing? There's very little real news right now and leftists love circular firing squads. Also all Dems from red states are varying degrees of bad yes I intentionally structured that so you can do the clever edit to "all dems are bad" have at it
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Nov 14, 2018 17:45
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Petr posted:"Sure it's a ploy, but by doing what they wan't I'm not actually falling for it" When someone tells you who they are the first time, believe them. Sinema told us honestly who she is with her vote to support child concentration camps. I don't care that it was a ploy, the fact of the matter is the gop's ploy revealed a snake in our midst. If you throw out a piece of monster bait and a couple of monsters bite into it, then it really doesn't matter that it was baked. What matters is that you now know who the monsters are and can adjust your plans accordingly.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:46
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Condiv posted:explain how i'm helping the GOP. there is no current or coming elections, and sinema won't face a challenger for 6 years. is all criticism of any dem verboten cause it could in some nebulous way help the GOP? I dunno, just seemed a bit mean to call you a useless idiot. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Nov 14, 2018 17:46
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Your Taint posted:That's one of those "right thing for the wrong reasons" deals. They're only protecting their asses in the future against a democratic president. They don't give a flying gently caress about CNN or Jim Acosta. Totally agreed, but I can still see a contingent at Fox saying “...but what if it kills CNN, though?” Fox is going so apoplectic over anything Dems do, though, that it wouldn’t surprise me if “gently caress White House access, burn it to the ground and encourage domestic terrorism against Democrats” was a “Plan B” in their minds if the Dems retake the government in 2020. They seem to be losing sight of the “make millionaires into billionaires” target and are huffing straight from the rancid rear end of white supremacy as of late, probably in a desperate act to keep their viewership as the boomers croak from old age.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:46
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The thing about supporting cruel immigration policies for votes is that it doesn't work anyway. Did Hillary get any credit from the GOP for years of impossibly brutal anti-immigrant policies as senator and which she supported as First Lady? No. Did Obama? No. The only time Obama's true record on illegal immigration was even acknowledged by the GOP was when they used it as political cover for their own policies, and they still called him an open borders white genocide purveyor out of the other side of their mouths as they did it!
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Nov 14, 2018 17:48
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Wicked Them Beats posted:
Went for something. Also lol at fuckers defending a Yea vote, like she couldn't have just voted Present and been done with it.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:48
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If an anti-lgbt faction takes the speakership I might actually throw up. The thought is that nauseating to me.
CascadeBeta fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Nov 14, 2018 |
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Nov 14, 2018 17:49
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StealthArcher posted:Went for something. 
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Nov 14, 2018 17:51
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SMH at these "leftists" crying about morality like a bunch of babies who need their diapers changed. If Republicans want to feed toddlers into an industrial shredder feet first, we elect Democrats that will legislate that said toddlers be fed in head first. It's called compromise. It's called being an adult. It's what winning looks like. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Nov 14, 2018 17:51
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1337JiveTurkey posted:I dunno, just seemed a bit mean to call you a useless idiot. I like how you just didn't answer the question and instead took an opportunity for a cheap shot. I personally would like to see Condiv's questions answered.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:51
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axeil posted:It makes her way more qualified to talk economic policy than nearly every GOP rep. I remember after 2010 that not a single one of the morons in the newly-christened Tea Party caucus knew that the deficit and the national debt were different. Don't remember them getting the third degree.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:51
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1337JiveTurkey posted:I dunno, just seemed a bit mean to call you a useless idiot. so you have no point and are just lashing out cause you're upset that I'm criticizing sinema. got it StealthArcher posted:Went for something. one of her D-Arizona peers did exactly that
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Nov 14, 2018 17:52
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CascadeBeta posted:If an anti-lgbt faction takes the speakership I might actually throw up. The thought is that nauseating to me. Is that big challenger to Pelosi (can’t remember his name) a bigot? Serious question, by the way. I actually don’t know.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:52
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Whether or not we choose to condemn her is kind of moot. The real solution is to keep pushing the party left so that in six years her decision to vote in symbolic approval of ICE is no longer seen as a cynical but necessary support for a corrupt agency but rather a blight on her voting record. Most of us can't affect politics in AZ but we can try to push the national discourse away from compromise candidates. It's gonna take a long time.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:53
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Prester Jane posted:I'm just going to throw this out there but maybe trying to carry water and apologize for someone who went out of their way to publicly support child concentration camps is a bad thing and you shouldn't ever do it. Because it makes you sound like an amoral sociopath who doesn't understand basic human empathy, and not some sort of pragmatist who can make the hard decisions. I wasn't intimately familiar with the issues debated in the AZ Senate race, but a quick google search seems to firmly suggest that you are wrong about Sinema wrt child concentration camps. She's not even in favor of holding families for very long prior to their immigration hearing. Saying we should not abolish ICE != "family separation is a good idea". Its not like ICE went rogue, Trump ordered it. quote:"Separating families is wrong. It’s also wrong to detain families indefinitely," she said. "We can secure our border and keep Arizona communities safe while also staying true to our shared values." Her opponent was hard-core Trumpy about immigration and spent a lot of her time attacking Sinema as being weak.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:54
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Mineaiki posted:Is that big challenger to Pelosi (can’t remember his name) a bigot? Serious question, by the way. I actually don’t know. Tim Ryan, and no at least not as of this current election, idk if he's evolved and if so how long he's been pro-LGBT
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Nov 14, 2018 17:54
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Mendrian posted:Whether or not we choose to condemn her is kind of moot. Condemning her publicly on forums like this is one tiny little bit of shifting the party left though.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:55
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It's alright buddy, we're all a little bad in here.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:55
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Mineaiki posted:Is that big challenger to Pelosi (can’t remember his name) a bigot? Serious question, by the way. I actually don’t know. Someone posted a tweet before that the effort to derail Pelosi is from a centrist Dem coalition that wants to dump the pro-women/lgbt platforms.
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Nov 14, 2018 17:55
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the whole aoc is a dumb kid thing is hilarious because paul ryan king of wonks the smart man's conservative dreamed up a social security privatization plan that would've led to full communism.
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