|
he hasn’t learned nothing he’s learned that he doesn’t like it, no sir
|
#
?
Dec 3, 2018 21:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 11, 2024 02:16 |
|
|
remember: change is bad
|
|
#
?
Dec 3, 2018 21:42
|
|
|
Boiled Water posted:go is gonna go one of two ways: the go community is centered around a shared denial of use cases and it fragments and dies as the individual people find themselves in a situation where they really want one of aliases / generics / dependency management / error propagation / expressive types / immutability / good concurrency primitives but none of that other stuff thank you very much i like simple languages
|
|
#
?
Dec 3, 2018 22:27
|
|
|
Boiled Water posted:go is gonna go one of two ways: On the other hand, it's a language designed to suit google's use cases perfectly and they probably has a pretty bad case of NIH syndrome so I'm not sure how they're going to deal with that (force everyone to Dart? I don't think that's gong to happen, especially on the server. Make a new language?). I'd assume that google would stick with it for practical reasons, but I don't think their egos will be able to deal with it when potential recruits start listing go as a reason they don't want to work at google. mystes fucked around with this message at 22:43 on Dec 3, 2018 |
|
#
?
Dec 3, 2018 22:40
|
|
|
What happened to dart anyway?
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 00:23
|
|
|
HappyHippo posted:What happened to dart anyway? this did https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2TcYP8qiRI
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 00:25
|
|
|
They keep trying to get people to use it. There was just some medium post pushing it as an alternative to electron for desktop apps a couple days ago. It's really dumb to develop flutter as a reason to use dart though since they could have just written it in any other loving language that people actually want to use.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 00:46
|
|
|
is dart one of those wave-like things where they can’t disassemble a team and don’t want to fire them so they just wall them off on a project to nowhere as a quarantine to protect the rest of the org? and on the off chance they stumble into something useful google can still take the credit/control?
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 04:24
|
|
|
Partly and if it was clearly just a research project that would be one thing but along with fuschia the main thing it seems to be accomplishing is to cause confusion about Google's future plans for Android/java by making people worried that at some point everyone will be forced to use it when Google throws out the bathwater along with the baby. If it's really just to keep them busy, Google really needs to make them stop announcing stuff in a way that makes people think that it's the official way forward. mystes fucked around with this message at 04:43 on Dec 4, 2018 |
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 04:39
|
|
|
mystes posted:fuschia wahts that
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 04:46
|
|
|
their microkernel
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 04:57
|
|
|
a ground-up os redesign and rewrite. has its own microkernel and a ui layer written in dart for some reason. has no clear strategic purpose
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 05:04
|
|
|
mystes posted:If it's really just to keep them busy, Google really needs to make them stop announcing stuff in a way that makes people think that it's the official way forward. at some point it becomes partly the people’s fault for falling for it yet again but maybe we aren’t there yet idk
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 05:09
|
|
|
like, is it supposed to go on phones and replace android? is it supposed to go on laptops and replace chromeos? is it supposed to go on servers and replace linux? is it supposed to go on some brand-new gadget? are product teams dying to ship it? are product teams skeptical but genuinely interested? are product teams giving it lip service to avoid political problems, allowing it to limp forward for as long as some vp has their ego invested? are product teams all secretly scheming to get it killed? nobody knows!
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 05:14
|
|
|
rjmccall posted:dart lmbo google really do have insane nih going on, don't they
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 05:23
|
|
|
rjmccall posted:like, is it supposed to go on phones and replace android? is it supposed to go on laptops and replace chromeos? is it supposed to go on servers and replace linux? is it supposed to go on some brand-new gadget? are product teams dying to ship it? are product teams skeptical but genuinely interested? are product teams giving it lip service to avoid political problems, allowing it to limp forward for as long as some vp has their ego invested? are product teams all secretly scheming to get it killed? nobody knows! i assure you the answer to all these questions "uh sure why not" and there are five other competing microkernel teams inside google which arent open source
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 05:55
|
|
|
rjmccall posted:like, is it supposed to go on phones and replace android? is it supposed to go on laptops and replace chromeos? is it supposed to go on servers and replace linux? is it supposed to go on some brand-new gadget? are product teams dying to ship it? are product teams skeptical but genuinely interested? are product teams giving it lip service to avoid political problems, allowing it to limp forward for as long as some vp has their ego invested? are product teams all secretly scheming to get it killed? nobody knows!
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 06:00
|
|
|
Boiled Water posted:go is gonna go one of two ways:
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 06:14
|
|
|
rjmccall posted:like, is it supposed to go on phones and replace android? is it supposed to go on laptops and replace chromeos? is it supposed to go on servers and replace linux? is it supposed to go on some brand-new gadget? are product teams dying to ship it? are product teams skeptical but genuinely interested? are product teams giving it lip service to avoid political problems, allowing it to limp forward for as long as some vp has their ego invested? are product teams all secretly scheming to get it killed? nobody knows! these same questions, but for every decision apple makes, and even less scrutable to the public e: swift is good tho tyvm
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 06:40
|
|
|
comedyblissoption posted:making go slightly more tolerable so that more people begrudgingly adopt it through gopher fanaticism and middle managers going it's from google so it must be good despite its glaring deficiencies would be the absolute worst ending you'd have to double my salary for me to program in go all day and welp that's pretty much what google pays
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 06:41
|
|
|
DELETE CASCADE posted:you'd have to double my salary for me to program in go all day and welp that's pretty much what google pays i would still love an explanation of why google has a policy of hiring people who are, in the immortal words of rob pike, "not capable of understanding a brilliant language". if they're not paying peanuts, why do they settle for code monkeys? and why are the shareholders not looking at go and running a mile?
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 09:19
|
|
|
Google also contributes maintenance and enhancement to Steel Bank Common Lisp, so there clearly are people there using a brilliant language
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 10:17
|
|
|
i liked reading this about utf7, thank you
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 10:34
|
|
|
karms posted:i liked reading this about utf7, thank you i wish i could write cool stuff like that
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 11:09
|
|
|
meh, a shame that the standard had a mistake, but with everyone having a consistent read it seems both simple and efficient enough for email (everything being mashed into base64 is pretty much tradition after all, if you're fussed it is better to add some transport- and storage-level compression rather than messing about with such a broadly and weirdly implemented high-level protocol to try to save bits) i take way more issue with the idea of having the mta's trying to negotiate encodings by comparison, software negotiating almost never turns out terribly helpful/robust. while not really "neat", or actually necessary, it seems to me just having the top-level always do utf-7, being semi-compatible with old 7-bit ascii, and leaving really weird additional encoding requirements as mime multipart stuff, would simplify things a lot with little in the way of real downsides
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 18:38
|
|
|
lol at the idea of the shareholders looking at go
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 19:05
|
|
|
what's so bad about Dart exactly
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 19:32
|
|
|
Soricidus posted:i would still love an explanation of why google has a policy of hiring people who are, in the immortal words of rob pike, "not capable of understanding a brilliant language". if they're not paying peanuts, why do they settle for code monkeys? and why are the shareholders not looking at go and running a mile? they have more jobs to fill than there are good programmers. it's true at every major. for every competent programmer you have a dozen idiots who mostly run in circles and make messes for the competent ones to clean up.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 20:37
|
|
|
Maximo Roboto posted:what's so bad about Dart exactly when is the last time you saw any real world thing about dart
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 20:38
|
|
|
cinci zoo sniper posted:when is the last time you saw any real world thing about dart dangerous path because this standard makes electron good
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 20:51
|
|
|
cinci zoo sniper posted:when is the last time you saw any real world thing about dart https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/12/google-bridges-android-and-ios-development-with-flutter-1-0/ Apparently these things are written in Dart.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 20:54
|
|
|
CPColin posted:https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/12/google-bridges-android-and-ios-development-with-flutter-1-0/ ah yes, a google product. this is sure to live a long and healthy life
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 20:55
|
|
|
Maximo Roboto posted:what's so bad about Dart exactly It was supposed to be a dynamically typed language that would replace javascript in the browser, but nobody wanted to use it. Then it was supposed to be a dynamically typed language that would run outside the browser but nobody wanted to use it. Then since dynamically languages aren't hot now, they turned it into a statically typed language. Still, nobody cares about the actual language so to force people to use it they created a new cross-platform UI library (flutter) for it. They could have done this in any language, but they decided to use dart solely to force people who want to use flutter to use dart. It's probably an OK language but there's nothing really special about it and nobody wants to learn another mediocre language just so they can use use a new UI library. Plus, it's not even like Google is clearly putting its momentum behind it. Unless Google announces it's discontinuing java, kotlin, and go, betting on Dart seems extremely dangerous. mystes fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Dec 4, 2018 |
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 21:07
|
|
|
i love that someone looked at javascript and said "the problem here is that there are no classes"
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 21:17
|
|
|
Oh also, flutter currently only supports android and ios but they're apparently working on transpiling to javascript so you can use it in the browser. It didn't support physically keyboards on android until a few months ago. I tried to run the flutter gallery app just now to see if it can handle input of east asian languages properly, but one of the demos caused my phone to completely lock up which has never happened before. (One of the main people involved in flutter was involved in Silverlight, which IIRC never supported input of east asian languages ).
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 21:49
|
|
|
Soricidus posted:i would still love an explanation of why google has a policy of hiring people who are, in the immortal words of rob pike, "not capable of understanding a brilliant language". if they're not paying peanuts, why do they settle for code monkeys? and why are the shareholders not looking at go and running a mile? turnover is very, very high
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 01:23
|
|
|
mystes posted:(One of the main people involved in flutter was involved in Silverlight, which IIRC never supported input of east asian languages ). if i recall correctly, silverlight never had an "input" layer at all the programmer was expected to scrape raw key events, so good luck guessing wtf keyboard the user has in hand
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 01:24
|
|
|
I actually tried the flutter app again and once I found a demo with a text box it did work properly, so at least it has that going for it. I probably wouldn't mind flutter if it wasn't inexplicably tied to dart. Apparently the actual engine is in c++ so maybe people will be able to make direct bindings for other languages that don't go through dart. Although, that might not work with the other implementations (html, etc.) that are apparently in progress. mystes fucked around with this message at 01:50 on Dec 5, 2018 |
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 01:47
|
|
|
Notorious b.s.d. posted:if i recall correctly, silverlight never had an "input" layer at all lmao what
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 02:15
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 11, 2024 02:16 |
|
|
Silverlight was wpf so idk what hes on about
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 02:18
|
|