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Darth Walrus posted:There are certain later revelations that suggest Vidar might actually have had better luck with the Hashmal than Mika. Yeah I know about the AVE, but I'm not sure if Vidar would have wanted to subject it to that.
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Jan 29, 2019 02:54
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Kurieg posted:Yeah I know about the AVE, but I'm not sure if Vidar would have wanted to subject it to that. Eh, he just wants to give his old buddy a last chance at glory after a deeply ignoble death. What could be better for that than a spot of dragonslaying?
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Jan 29, 2019 03:02
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Kingtheninja posted:It's been a while since I've had to do it, but can I use my US card info to buy the digital game on a Singapore account? Unfortunately you can not. PSN cards are the best way.
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Jan 29, 2019 03:31
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Darth Walrus posted:There are certain later revelations that suggest Vidar might actually have had better luck with the Hashmal than Mika. Ugh, I never made that connection. Rather lovely not to join in and help.
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Jan 29, 2019 06:55
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Solkanar512 posted:Ugh, I never made that connection. Rather lovely not to join in and help. As I said, I thought that the first time through, but on rewatch, Julieta specifically goes "Someone needs to watch Iok so he doesn't gently caress everything up forever. Again. Vidar?" "On it." Sure, he would have been useful, but I don't blame him for assuming that sending the overwhelming majority of the best pilots in the solar system would be enough to handle things in a prepared killbox. Also, the best thing about Mika in a SRW game will be him meeting the mysterious masked men from various settings and instantly identifying them. chiasaur11 fucked around with this message at 08:15 on Jan 29, 2019 |
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Jan 29, 2019 07:51
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Kurieg posted:It's also part of the whole "Old guard of Gjallarhorn getting killed off for their own stupidity so that Rustal can reform it, even though he's a rat bastard." thing. Yes. The ending of IBO is hopeful. Despite the tragedies society is in a much better place than when it started. Pragmatists won the day, the space slaves are free, Mars is out from the yoke of Earth's economic oppression. Iok somehow surviving isn't better, it's just darker. There's already more than enough bitterness without keeping the poster child for Gjallarhorn's problems around.
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Jan 29, 2019 13:27
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sassassin posted:Iok somehow surviving isn't better, it's just darker. There's already more than enough bitterness without keeping the poster child for Gjallarhorn's problems around. It's also just bad storytelling after teasing it so many different ways to not deliver on it in some fashion by the end.
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Jan 29, 2019 13:52
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If they wanted Iok to go out on a high note then he should have dove in front of the Ryusei-Go's Danslief shot rather than have Julietta toss a sword. He gets his sacrificial death and it actually means something rather than having him try to get a Mercy Kill out of McGillis, fail, then die because he wanted to get a glory kill on a man missing an arm. e: Rustal's speech to him about how the Kujan Family's loyalty is the "True backbone of Gjallarhorn" seemed a bit like "I don't believe any of this bullshit but I need to keep you in line because you're such a massive loose canon."
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Jan 29, 2019 14:42
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Kurieg posted:If they wanted Iok to go out on a high note then he should have dove in front of the Ryusei-Go's Danslief shot rather than have Julietta toss a sword. He gets his sacrificial death and it actually means something rather than having him try to get a Mercy Kill out of McGillis, fail, then die because he wanted to get a glory kill on a man missing an arm. No, Iok had to go down the way he did. His entire story arc is "he is an idiot nobleman who only thrives on the sacrifice of better people looking out for him" and doing something beneficial in any way does not support that. Even if it's by accident. The only trajectory he had from square one was to keep doing stupid things until he ran out of people to take the bullet for him because he would. Not. Learn.
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Jan 29, 2019 14:45
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Iok's death is thematic because the one thing IBO hates is people who care about glory or pride over sense. It killed Carta and Ein, it will kill McGillis, it kills Shino, Orga, and ultimately Tekkadan, it gets Biscuit and Naze killed, it makes tons of other people suffer and there are characters who get good ends just by cutting and living a happy life instead of trying to live up to something imaginary. Iok is the most intense (and, really, on-the-nose) illustration of what is fundamentally everyone's tragic flaw.
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Jan 29, 2019 17:56
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Caphi posted:Iok's death is thematic because the one thing IBO hates is people who care about glory or pride over sense. It killed Carta and Ein, it will kill McGillis, it kills Shino, Orga, and ultimately Tekkadan, it gets Biscuit and Naze killed, it makes tons of other people suffer and there are characters who get good ends just by cutting and living a happy life instead of trying to live up to something imaginary. Iok is the most intense (and, really, on-the-nose) illustration of what is fundamentally everyone's tragic flaw. Unfortunately Iok's love of honor and glory over sense is what kills the Turbines.
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Jan 29, 2019 18:53
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Kurieg posted:Unfortunately Iok's love of honor and glory over sense is what kills the Turbines. Should we really be mourning the "sexual predator with a heart of gold" character?
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Jan 29, 2019 19:09
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Kurieg posted:Unfortunately Iok's love of honor and glory over sense is what kills the Turbines. I'm pretty sure what kills the Turbines is Orga ignoring politics and specific warnings to defend Naze's honor in a petty but "manly" way?
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Jan 29, 2019 19:49
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Caphi posted:I'm pretty sure what kills the Turbines is Orga ignoring politics and specific warnings to defend Naze's honor in a petty but "manly" way? And then Naze deciding he'll take his harem with him to his dramatic last stand. It shouldn't be a huge surprise that Orga's mentor fucks up the exact same way he does.
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Jan 29, 2019 19:53
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Kurieg posted:e: Rustal's speech to him about how the Kujan Family's loyalty is the "True backbone of Gjallarhorn" seemed a bit like "I don't believe any of this bullshit but I need to keep you in line because you're such a massive loose canon." You can look at it as the backbone of old Gjallarhorn. The Seven Stars and their loyal retainers are part of the rot. Iok has done nothing to earn the loyalty of their retainers and they only enable him to trip over his own feet again and again.
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Jan 29, 2019 20:32
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To what extent is narrative enjoyable for someone who's never seen unicorn
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Jan 29, 2019 21:13
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Darth Walrus posted:And then Naze deciding he'll take his harem with him to his dramatic last stand. It shouldn't be a huge surprise that Orga's mentor fucks up the exact same way he does. Except he didn't do that, only Naze and Amida died while the rest of the Turbines escaped and continued on under Azee's command. (I'm not even sure if there's any point to the spoiler tags anymore, but better safe than sorry.)
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Jan 29, 2019 23:37
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ninjewtsu posted:To what extent is narrative enjoyable for someone who's never seen unicorn Debatable. It drops you in assuming you know the motions of what happened in Unicorn or are at least familiar with it.
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Jan 29, 2019 23:47
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Paper Kaiju posted:Except he didn't do that, only Naze and Amida died while the rest of the Turbines escaped and continued on under Azee's command. Well, Some died. A small portion, since there's over 30,000 members of the organization, but some. But it wasn't meant to be a heroic last stand. It was meant to be a surrender. Naze goes up to Iok, says "Hey, you're after me, here I am.", maybe gets shot, maybe rots in jail for life, all neat and clean on his own head. It was just that Iok is... Iok. And that has consequences.
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Jan 29, 2019 23:58
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chiasaur11 posted:Well, Yep. Iok explicitly had them fire on fleeing launches. He'd written the epic of Naze's death in his head on the way there, and couldn't have things like 'surrender' or 'prisoners' mucking that up. e: maybe I should spoiler tag things
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Jan 30, 2019 00:01
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Honestly this last series of posts is exactly why I never bothered watching season 2 of IBO, it just sounds like a miserable experience overall
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Jan 30, 2019 00:16
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Warmachine posted:Yep. Iok explicitly had them fire on fleeing launches. He'd written the epic of Naze's death in his head on the way there, and couldn't have things like 'surrender' or 'prisoners' mucking that up. Don't forget the conversation between Julietta and her boss in either the last or second to last episode. "I'm finally done following these vile disgusting men." "And what the gently caress do you think I am? Dainslief squad please demonstrate."
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Jan 30, 2019 00:17
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drrockso20 posted:Honestly this last series of posts is exactly why I never bothered watching season 2 of IBO, it just sounds like a miserable experience overall The last episode is rather redeeming. It’s a flawed series to be sure, but I thought it was worth it.
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Jan 30, 2019 00:20
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It's got some fantastic fight sequences. The protagonists are flawed to be sure but a lot of it is explainable as them being literal and/or emotional children in way over their heads and their immaturity gets preyed on by the extremely hateable villains (who almost universally get their comeuppance).
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Jan 30, 2019 00:37
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Kurieg posted:Don't forget the conversation between Julietta and her boss in either the last or second to last episode. Not quite. Julieta was talking about how there wasn't much difference between her and Tekkadan, except they'd run into nothing but evil adults, and she'd had Rustal and Galan. And Rustal responds with a kind of amused "Weren't you listening to me just now? I'm one of those shady adults you hate too." And Julieta basically goes "...Point." chiasaur11 fucked around with this message at 01:42 on Jan 30, 2019 |
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Jan 30, 2019 00:44
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Season 2 of IBO is very good, and everything to do with Gaelio and McGillis is fantastic. The only bad part of IBO is season 1 refusing to kill anyone off in the final fight, which makes it feel fake as hell, especially in a show like IBO.
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Jan 30, 2019 00:58
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S2 of IBO suffers from the problem of a lot of 2-season stories where the second season ends up spinning its wheels for a bit too long. It could have been half as long and not lost much. Honestly a major part of the issue is that S1 is building towards a climax, walks it back, and then they have to take the time to go back to the climax again but bigger.
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Jan 30, 2019 01:11
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ImpAtom posted:S2 of IBO suffers from the problem of a lot of 2-season stories where the second season ends up spinning its wheels for a bit too long. It could have been half as long and not lost much. Honestly a major part of the issue is that S1 is building towards a climax, walks it back, and then they have to take the time to go back to the climax again but bigger. Honestly, I feel the opposite - S1's middle stretch before they get to Earth is horribly boring and draws itself out way too long with some of the worst plot contrivances in the show's run(Akihiro talking about how much he misses his cool brother about five minutes before they run into him), whereas S2 has enough interesting stuff going on from multiple perspectives that I feel it makes pretty good use of its runtime, mostly by virtue of introducing other character perspectives to the mix. I can't really think of any part of S2 that I think is just boring and without merit and tangential to the story they're trying to tell. It also does a fairly good job of addressing those pulled punches from the end of S1. 
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Jan 30, 2019 01:18
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Paper Kaiju posted:Except he didn't do that, only Naze and Amida died while the rest of the Turbines escaped and continued on under Azee's command. No, a bunch of them got shredded when Iok whipped out the Dainsleifs, which forced Naze and Amida to fight a delaying action while they evacuated. Given that McMurdo had been completely clear that he understood what was going on and that he was willing to give Naze and his girls cover, there was no reason except stubborn pride for any of them to get anywhere near firing range of a Gjallarhorn fleet.
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Jan 30, 2019 05:52
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Lemon-Lime posted:The only bad part of IBO is season 1 refusing to kill anyone off in the final fight, which makes it feel fake as hell, especially in a show like IBO. I don't think that's really a valid complaint anymore with the series properly finished, just because in hindsight it looks an awful lot like someone ducked their head into the writers room at the last second and said "hey guys, you're actually getting a second season" rather than planning it that way from the start. Nevermind that season 2 more than makes up for those punches pulled.
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Jan 30, 2019 09:18
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Neddy Seagoon posted:I don't think that's really a valid complaint anymore with the series properly finished, just because in hindsight it looks an awful lot like someone ducked their head into the writers room at the last second and said "hey guys, you're actually getting a second season" rather than planning it that way from the start. Nevermind that season 2 more than makes up for those punches pulled. It really had an interesting meta effect going into the second season, looking back. Going so long without main characters dying made them start to feel invincible. (They were not.)
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Jan 30, 2019 09:23
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chiasaur11 posted:It really had an interesting meta effect going into the second season, looking back. Going so long without main characters dying made them start to feel invincible. One thing I liked about the final stretch in hindsight is that killing off Orga "early" is quite important, and very well executed, for setting the tone of the finale proper; Nobody has plot armor.
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Jan 30, 2019 09:28
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Neddy Seagoon posted:I don't think that's really a valid complaint anymore with the series properly finished, just because in hindsight it looks an awful lot like someone ducked their head into the writers room at the last second and said "hey guys, you're actually getting a second season" rather than planning it that way from the start. Nevermind that season 2 more than makes up for those punches pulled. I don't really buy this at this point because I've seen a bunch of interview snippets floating around saying that they'd always planned to have two seasons, with 1 being the build-up and 2 being the fall. Even then, the s01 ending still sucks - they definitely didn't need to kill everyone in the fight against Ein, but they could have at least had some named casualties to better sell the threat and stay in line tonally with the rest of the show.
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Jan 30, 2019 09:31
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Lemon-Lime posted:I don't really buy this at this point because I've seen a bunch of interview snippets floating around saying that they'd always planned to have two seasons, with 1 being the build-up and 2 being the fall. Plenty of shows plan and hope for a multi-season run only to get cancelled after the first, and the season finale's written in a way that if they don't get their second season they still have a finale that puts a bow on everything relevant. If they earnestly thought they would get the full fifty-episode run from the get-go there'd be more lingering elements leading into the second season instead of a clean break.
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Jan 30, 2019 09:34
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Lemon-Lime posted:Even then, the s01 ending still sucks - they definitely didn't need to kill everyone in the fight against Ein, but they could have at least had some named casualties to better sell the threat and stay in line tonally with the rest of the show. On reflection, it works for me, what with Ein being a total gently caress-up at absolutely everything.
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Jan 30, 2019 10:21
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Lemon-Lime posted:I don't really buy this at this point because I've seen a bunch of interview snippets floating around saying that they'd always planned to have two seasons, with 1 being the build-up and 2 being the fall. The interviews I've seen have said that they were making plans to have the season 1 finale be the fall if they couldn't get a season 2, and when season 2 was granted, Okada had to scramble to make it not incredibly obvious to the characters and the viewers that Tekkadan was heading for disaster one way or another. (Merribit's freaking the gently caress out at the Carta fight was meant to be, like many of Zack's scenes in season 2, someone outside the Tekkadan Bad Decision Loop seeing it in action and responding sensibly, if not always clearly.) So, yeah. It's awkward because one plan got far enough that it left scars when it got ripped out. Not a good thing, but something I can sympathize with. (Interestingly, Okada was also the primary force making the second season's ending less bleak.)
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Jan 30, 2019 10:56
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The biggest flaw of s2 of IBO is that the vidar gundam didn't get more action scenes. That mobile suit was so loving cool looking.
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Jan 30, 2019 16:42
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Monaghan posted:The biggest flaw of s2 of IBO is that the vidar gundam didn't get more action scenes. That mobile suit was so loving cool looking. The double pistols where a functionally ridiculous but amazing addition.
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Jan 30, 2019 16:46
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Solkanar512 posted:The double pistols where a functionally ridiculous but amazing addition. They actually made a decent amount of sense. They're basically the equivalent of head gatlings in another Gundam show, small, handy rapid-firing weapons designed for shredding tanks, infantry and incoming missiles, as opposed to the rifle which is designed for engaging enemy suits.
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Jan 30, 2019 16:52
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Darth Walrus posted:They actually made a decent amount of sense. They're basically the equivalent of head gatlings in another Gundam show, small, handy rapid-firing weapons designed for shredding tanks, infantry and incoming missiles, as opposed to the rifle which is designed for engaging enemy suits. Oh poo poo, good point. I always thought the head guns looked silly anyway.
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Jan 30, 2019 17:22
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