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Admiral Ray
May 17, 2014

Proud Musk and Dogecoin fanboy

Skippy McPants posted:

This only applies to California: here's an article with a decent summary. More annual rainfall, but constricted into a narrower timeframe leading to worse flooding and worse fires. Weee!

As for everything east of the Rockies, well, I hope you like sand!

The fires will get worse and will spur more forest care so can be moderately handled. More landslides and flooding, though, and a helluva lot more coastal erosion. More annual rainfall does mean more snowpack, which is good for the state.

The big thing I'm worried about is having ARk Storms as 50 year events. That storm is loving brutal and will destroy the state.

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Trabisnikof
Dec 24, 2005

lol it’s been 80 years and yall still got to poo poo on Okies.

California’s a garden of eden, a paradise to live in or see. But believe it or not, you won’t find it so hot if you ain’t got the dough ray me....

Keyser_Soze
May 5, 2009

Pillbug
someone recommended this comedy podcast about the evil Resnicks, and although I am not familiar with the comedians, it was pretty good, just fast forward a bit after the beginning.

https://thedollop.libsyn.com/356-the-resnicks-water-monsters

...the first 5 minutes are about other stuff.


there was also this Oligarch Valley e-book from 2013 (that despite some clumsy editing) covers all of it including the Tejon Ranch scumbags that own the Highway 5 "Grapevine"

https://www.amazon.com/Journey-Through-Oligarch-Valley-ebook/dp/B00FPGZ59U

Keyser_Soze fucked around with this message at 21:22 on Feb 27, 2019

Rodenthar Drothman
May 14, 2013

I think I will continue
watching this twilight world
as long as time flows.
Don't fast forward, the ads are how they make a living, yo.

Family Values
Jun 26, 2007


Podcasts are essentially offline media and unless the player you're using reports back, there's no way to track metrics like who listens to what ad.

ChaseSP
Mar 25, 2013



Shear Modulus posted:

what if they knew they werent sustainable but kept doing it anyway because they didnt give a poo poo

I'm not aware on the average farm hands knowledge pre Dust Bowl so maybe they did know, if so whelp. No excuse today though.

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

The actual dust bowl (as opposed to the fake advertised one in southern california) is a great example of a tragedy of the commons. It happened because of systemic problems created by farming and land use laws, not because dirt farmers in oklahoma were stupid greedy bastards.

...which undoubtedly some of them were, of course, but that's irrelevant. Government has to restrain private industry when the economic incentives for each individual or company lead to systemic overexploitation of a shared resource, or disaster will happen, every goddamn time.

Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 21:22 on Feb 27, 2019

Turtlicious
Sep 17, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
How is there not an app that pulls public databases and tells you where the closest nuclear shelter is?

drilldo squirt
Aug 18, 2006

a beautiful, soft meat sack
Clapping Larry

Trabisnikof posted:

lol it’s been 80 years and yall still got to poo poo on Okies.

California’s a garden of eden, a paradise to live in or see. But believe it or not, you won’t find it so hot if you ain’t got the dough ray me....
A lot of people warned you, you hosed it up and then the government taxed us more to save your idiot asses, that is the history of small town america.

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

Turtlicious posted:

How is there not an app that pulls public databases and tells you where the closest nuclear shelter is?

Shelters for all sorts of disasters are set up on an ad-hoc or on-demand basis depending on the type and location of the shelter.
That said:
https://www.disasterassistance.gov/
includes lookups with your zip code or address to find the nearest shelter during an emergency.

drilldo squirt
Aug 18, 2006

a beautiful, soft meat sack
Clapping Larry

Turtlicious posted:

How is there not an app that pulls public databases and tells you where the closest nuclear shelter is?

I don't think we still have those.

atelier morgan
Mar 11, 2003

super-scientific, ultra-gay

Lipstick Apathy

Turtlicious posted:

How is there not an app that pulls public databases and tells you where the closest nuclear shelter is?

Unless you live near a missile silo there ain't no such thing. Small scale fallout shelters were always bullshit. California's garbage for underground work anyway so there's not even any good subway systems to hide in.

Best bet is to just move up north, there's nothing on any target maps between Sacramento and the Puget Sound. You're even out of the fallout plume once you're out of the valley.

Sydin
Oct 29, 2011

Another spring commute
tbh if the nukes fall I'd rather just eat one and get vaporized then slowly die of radiation poisoning or be turned into a raider slave in the resulting Mad Max future.

Proust Malone
Apr 4, 2008

Fallout shelters are for fallout. If you're anywhere near to the blast, you're dead anyway. The shelters are supposed be a place to hide until the fallout has subsided and you can get on with the business of rebuilding painfully dying of multiple melanomas

Trabisnikof
Dec 24, 2005

drilldo squirt posted:

A lot of people warned you, you hosed it up and then the government taxed us more to save your idiot asses, that is the history of small town america.

Those in mudslide, wildfire, drought, and earthquake prone houses should probably not throw the first stone on this one.


I’d recommend retrofits.

drilldo squirt
Aug 18, 2006

a beautiful, soft meat sack
Clapping Larry
Living in an area that naturally might kill you is very different than loving somewhere up to the point that it might kill you.

Trabisnikof
Dec 24, 2005

drilldo squirt posted:

Living in an area that naturally might kill you is very different than loving somewhere up to the point that it might kill you.

Well the cool part about the future is we’re doing both to everywhere!

drilldo squirt
Aug 18, 2006

a beautiful, soft meat sack
Clapping Larry
I don't understand why you guys are so defensive about it, it makes me wonder how you learn from mistakes.

atelier morgan
Mar 11, 2003

super-scientific, ultra-gay

Lipstick Apathy

Sydin posted:

tbh if the nukes fall I'd rather just eat one and get vaporized then slowly die of radiation poisoning or be turned into a raider slave in the resulting Mad Max future.

could be worse, you could be living in portland which would probably be untouched and then be stuck living in portland forever

Trabisnikof
Dec 24, 2005

drilldo squirt posted:

I don't understand why you guys are so defensive about it, it makes me wonder how you learn from mistakes.

It is weird how people refuse to admit that human activity is why mudslides and fire cause such damage in California.

Cup Runneth Over
Aug 8, 2009

She said life's
Too short to worry
Life's too long to wait
It's too short
Not to love everybody
Life's too long to hate


Trabisnikof posted:

lol it’s been 80 years and yall still got to poo poo on Okies.

California’s a garden of eden, a paradise to live in or see. But believe it or not, you won’t find it so hot if you ain’t got the dough ray me....

They paved paradise and put up a parking lot

drilldo squirt
Aug 18, 2006

a beautiful, soft meat sack
Clapping Larry

Trabisnikof posted:

It is weird how people refuse to admit that human activity is why mudslides and fire cause such damage in California.

Case in point dude.

Admiral Ray
May 17, 2014

Proud Musk and Dogecoin fanboy

Turtlicious posted:

How is there not an app that pulls public databases and tells you where the closest nuclear shelter is?

If there's any large concrete structures near you with a 3rd level basement that's your best bet. For protection from the gamma rays it's best to just go like 10 feet underwater.

Kobayashi
Aug 13, 2004

by Nyc_Tattoo

Rodenthar Drothman posted:

Don't fast forward, the ads are how they make a living, yo.

Block every ad everywhere.

Cup Runneth Over
Aug 8, 2009

She said life's
Too short to worry
Life's too long to wait
It's too short
Not to love everybody
Life's too long to hate


Kobayashi posted:

Block every ad everywhere.

:emptyquote:

Buttcoin purse
Apr 24, 2014

Keyser_Soze posted:

someone recommended this comedy podcast about the evil Resnicks, and although I am not familiar with the comedians, it was pretty good, just fast forward a bit after the beginning.

https://thedollop.libsyn.com/356-the-resnicks-water-monsters

They're the same guys who did Feinstein and the Flag which I'm pretty sure was linked in this thread.

fermun
Nov 4, 2009
PG&E identified the transmission lines that caused the Camp fire as needing to be replaced in 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016, and 2017. Each time it was pushed off due to the cost of $30.3 million.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/pg-e-delayed-safety-work-on-power-line-that-is-prime-suspect-in-california-wildfire-11551292977

quote:

PG&E Delayed Safety Work on Power Line That Is Prime Suspect in California Wildfire
RUSSELL GOLD FEBRUARY 27, 2019
For five years, PG&E Corp. repeatedly delayed a safety overhaul of a century-old high-voltage transmission line that is a prime suspect behind the deadliest wildfire in California history.

The company told federal regulators in 2013 it planned to replace many of the towers, wires and hardware pieces on the line, called the Caribou-Palermo, regulatory filings show. It again proposed the project in 2014, 2015 and 2016—pushing it back each year. The company planned to start work June 2018 and finish late last year. It hasn’t begun.

On Nov. 8, 2018, winds picked up before sunrise near Paradise, Calif., when a wire snapped free from the Caribou-Palermo line, creating an electric arc that scorched the metal tower supporting it. A few minutes later, a PG&E worker spotted a quarter-acre fire under the line, the company has disclosed. Within hours, what became known as the Camp Fire destroyed Paradise and killed 85 people. California fire investigators haven’t yet determined the fire’s cause.

PG&E restarted the line following last November’s fire after spot repairs, it said this week. The line underwent a close inspection in December, with linemen climbing some towers for the first time in years. The inspection uncovered additional problems, the company said, and it has shut down the entire line and has no estimate for when it will resume service.

PG&E’s repeated delays of the Caribou-Palermo line’s maintenance project haven’t been previously reported, nor has the decision by the company to shut down the line.

PG&E operates a vast network of power lines, many through rural regions now at elevated wildfire risk. PG&E said that overhauling the Caribou-Palermo line has proven unexpectedly complex and that it is still planning to replace aging towers and hardware, some of which has been in use since the line began operating in 1921. It said delays in upgrading the line in recent years were due to engineering challenges, partly related to permitting in a federal forest.

The story of the Caribou-Palermo line is part of California’s wildfire reckoning. The state’s largest utility is now at the center of scrutiny after a series of deadly wildfires that have swept the company’s service territory in recent years. California fire investigators have determined the company’s equipment played a role in starting 18 blazes that killed 22 people in 2017.

This year, PG&E has accepted Chief Executive Geisha Williams’s resignation, moved to replace more than half its board, begun restructuring in anticipation of liabilities from hundreds of lawsuits and filed for bankruptcy protection.

It has vowed to do more to prevent its equipment from sparking fires and now plans to consider turning off power lines proactively during high-fire-risk periods in a wide swath of its territory.

PG&E spokeswoman Lynsey Paulo said: “PG&E has heard the calls for change and is committed to taking action by focusing our resources on reducing risk and improving safety throughout our system.”

The emerging picture of the transmission line’s problems could deepen the utility’s legal problems and threaten to add to its growing regulatory headaches. The failure to maintain the Caribou-Palermo line is part of a broader set of challenges the company faces in managing its operations. These include antiquated record-keeping systems that make it difficult to assess the safety and reliability of the aging power grid, according to regulators and regulatory filings.

PG&E has for years worked to digitize and fix errors and gaps in its records, but the work has been slow and remains incomplete. Until 2015, the company said in a state regulatory document, it used “paper wall maps and push pins” in control centers to track electricity-distribution system operations, which provide service over a 70,000-square-mile area to 16 million people.

The company said it is committed to keeping accurate records in accordance with state regulations and, since the Camp Fire, has doubled down on the effort with enhanced inspections. It plans to have completed enhanced inspections of transmission and distribution equipment in high-risk areas by May. As a result of those inspections, the company shut down more than a dozen transmission lines for immediate repair. The Caribou-Palermo is the only one that remains out of commission.

The California Public Utilities Commission said it has opened a wide-ranging investigation into the Camp Fire’s cause, including PG&E’s past maintenance and spending. An agency spokeswoman declined to comment on the Caribou-Palermo line.

PG&E has previously reported the 115,000-volt Caribou-Palermo line malfunctioned on Nov. 8, some 13 minutes before the PG&E employee noticed a fire underneath it as he drove along a rural two-lane highway.

PG&E in 2013 told federal regulators it had planned maintenance work on the line because it sagged too much and trees were encroaching upon it. It planned to complete the work by February 2016. Instead, it delayed the $30.3 million project several times.

The company again scheduled work on the Caribou-Palermo line to begin last June, according to records it filed with the federal government. It delayed again. The line wends over hard-to-access ridges and across steep draws along the north fork of the Feather River, some towers perching on rocky outcrops.

PG&E said the tower that malfunctioned before the Camp Fire wasn’t slated for maintenance as part of the project proposed in 2013. It is currently reconsidering the work’s scope in light of December’s findings, which revealed problems with the line’s structural foundations and hardware supporting wires.

The Caribou-Palermo line has experienced a series of problems within the past decade after the expansion of nearby towns strained its capacity. Since 2016, population growth in Paradise and neighboring Chico has outpaced that of the state, boosting regional demand for electricity and exacerbating wildfire risk in an area hurt by drought.

PG&E spends enormous sums on transmission-line upkeep, costs passed to ratepayers. Some big customers have questioned whether it is spending prudently.

Randy Howard, general manager of the Northern California Power Agency, a collection of municipal utilities relying on PG&E’s lines to deliver power to customers, called the company’s annual budget for replacing transformers, towers and other equipment a “black box” with little oversight or accountability. The group challenged a 2017 PG&E federal tariff filing—its request for spending on behalf of the shared bulk-power-transmission system—arguing that it failed to justify why it needed transmission-rate increases to recoup its costs.

“They ask for the money, they get approval for it, they never have to demonstrate they actually did the work,” Mr. Howard said. “There isn’t transparency. There doesn’t seem to be an actual asset-management plan.”

PG&E’s Ms. Paulo said the company, as part of its spending requests, “has been forthcoming with information about our transmission asset management programs and the additions that have occurred year to year.”

Last year, PG&E filed to spend $1.96 billion annually on its transmission system, more than twice the $946 million request a decade earlier.

State regulators have expressed skepticism in filings with federal regulators about PG&E’s transmission spending. Lawyers for the California Public Utilities Commission argued in a federal filing last year PG&E had no effective way of ranking which projects were most necessary to ensure safe and reliable operations. An internal PG&E audit from 2013 found that the company focused mainly on spending its allotted budget, not ensuring expenditures were prudent and effective, and that it lacked performance data and other records for many projects.

Little had changed since then, regulators said last year in federal filings. They argued PG&E continued to build certain projects to meet budget targets and let others slip—in part because it lacked construction, maintenance and inspection records necessary to prioritize the work.

PG&E faces similar problems in tracking its electricity-distribution operations, an issue it acknowledged in regulatory filings after a 2010 natural-gas-pipeline explosion in San Bruno, Calif., that killed eight.

Part of its efforts to improve its record-keeping involved a sweeping inventory of its overhead and underground lines. Some records in its central database had, since the 1970s and 1980s, been missing information such as the make and age of switches, circuit breakers and voltage regulators—information the company said was critical in addressing system safety risk.

Regulators approved about $97 million for a records-system overhaul between 2014 and 2016. By the period’s end, the company in filings estimated it had spent only 15% of that on the effort because of technological challenges and used the rest for other projects.

PG&E is seeking additional funding to complete its distribution-line inventory and fix gaps in records, an undertaking it projected will continue through 2024.

“PG&E does understand that it has issues,” said Garrick Jones, a consultant who has examined the company’s record-keeping spending for the Utility Reform Network, a consumer advocacy group. “But its history of making promises and under-delivering makes one question whether they undertook the records program with all due haste.”

A discarded insulator under a PG&E transmission line in an area burned by the Camp Fire.Photo: Max Whittaker for The Wall Street Journal

The long-distance transmission lines that run near Paradise, including the 56-mile Caribou-Palermo, are among America’s oldest, dating to the early 1920s when electricity was an urban luxury. They became part of a system tapping into Sierra Nevada dams and powerhouses known as the “Stairway of Power.” In the 1960s, the Caribou-Palermo line was in a relatively sparsely populated region.

In 2010, the California grid operator said the line would soon face “thermal overload”—a designation that means there’s too much power moving through it—as nearby communities expanded. It concluded: “There is more than ample time to schedule implementation by 2018.”

PG&E undertook sporadic repair work on the lines near Paradise. Near Camp Creek, the remote waterway that gave the fire its name, it’s possible to see under towers a few replaced disc-shaped insulators and metal anchors—evidence of small-scale repairs over the past few years.

Xela Young, 37, has lived her whole life in Yankee Hill, a few miles from Paradise. PG&E transmission lines cut through her community. A year or two before the Camp Fire, she said, she saw PG&E workers planning for clearing vegetation or doing maintenance.

“The same frickin’ tree got marked three times, but was never cleared,” she said. “It seemed like they did a lot of preparation, but not a lot of follow-through.”

In December 2012, a storm blew through and five towers on the Caribou-Palermo collapsed. PG&E erected temporary wooden towers and devised a $2.9 million plan to replace them.

In 2013, when it filed an annual transmission tariff with federal regulators, it unveiled a broader plan to overhaul the Caribou-Palermo line by 2017. In January 2017, wind blew trees into the line, causing a fault that shut down a powerhouse. The company cleared trees and resumed service, but it took six days to restore the powerhouse, PG&E documents show.

In July 2017, PG&E’s federal filing again included overhauling the line. More than one in four wire spans between towers were too close to vegetation, the filing said. The plan involved swapping 61 lattice towers with modern tubular-steel poles, and replacing wire and hardware connecting it to the towers. It never began the work.

Write to Katherine Blunt at Katherine.Blunt@wsj.com and Russell Gold at russell.gold@wsj.com

Vincent Van Goatse
Nov 8, 2006

Enjoy every sandwich.

Smellrose
I mean, be fair, where's a massive energy company going to get $30 million and change from?

The Glumslinger
Sep 24, 2008

Coach Nagy, you want me to throw to WHAT side of the field?


Hair Elf
God, gently caress PG&E in whatever orifice you would gently caress a corporation in


quote:

The story of the Caribou-Palermo line is part of California’s wildfire reckoning. The state’s largest utility is now at the center of scrutiny after a series of deadly wildfires that have swept the company’s service territory in recent years. California fire investigators have determined the company’s equipment played a role in starting 18 blazes that killed 22 people in 2017.

Charge them with loving murder

The Glumslinger fucked around with this message at 05:48 on Feb 28, 2019

Chichevache
Feb 17, 2010

One of the funniest posters in GIP.

Just not intentionally.
gently caress you if you're such a softie that you don't literally support burning PG&E executives alive. #GuillotinesR2Fast

Trabisnikof
Dec 24, 2005

Vincent Van Goatse posted:

I mean, be fair, where's a massive energy company going to get $30 million and change from?

Hey, PG&E asked for a rate base increase, blame CPUC! :v:

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Vincent Van Goatse posted:

I mean, be fair, where's a massive energy company going to get $30 million and change from?
You can't expect PG&E to have lower profits from the last quarter, can you? Think of the shareholders man. Creating value for shareholders is the whole point of civilization get with the program

FCKGW
May 21, 2006

Buttcoin purse posted:

They're the same guys who did Feinstein and the Flag which I'm pretty sure was linked in this thread.

Their episode on Uber is pretty good too if you want to know how they came about.

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

no no you see, if regulators approve rate increases to cover transmission costs, that means PG&E can't spend more money than that on transmission costs
profits are sacred! You can't spend the built-in, guaranteed-by-law profits on cost overruns!

Telsa Cola
Aug 19, 2011

No... this is all wrong... this whole operation has just gone completely sidewaysface

Admiral Ray posted:

The fires will get worse and will spur more forest care so can be moderately handled. More landslides and flooding, though, and a helluva lot more coastal erosion. More annual rainfall does mean more snowpack, which is good for the state.

The big thing I'm worried about is having ARk Storms as 50 year events. That storm is loving brutal and will destroy the state.

Forest care for fires is currently already not meetings its goals. There is no ways its going to be handled well.

Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 10:33 on Feb 28, 2019

JesusSinfulHands
Oct 24, 2007
Sartre and Russell are my heroes

Shear Modulus posted:

khanna endorsed bernie, which as far as I can tell makes him the only californian elected official to endorse anyone but harris

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/01/03/dianne-feinstein-2020-pick-joe-biden-1079024

Cup Runneth Over
Aug 8, 2009

She said life's
Too short to worry
Life's too long to wait
It's too short
Not to love everybody
Life's too long to hate



Biden, a fellow child-disparager, is the natural pick for Feinstein

Shear Modulus
Jun 9, 2010



Complications posted:

You can't expect PG&E to have lower profits from the last quarter, can you? Think of the shareholders man. Creating value for shareholders is the whole point of civilization get with the program



Telsa Cola posted:

Forest care for fires is currently already not meetings its goals. There is no ways its going to be handled well.

have we even started raking the leaves yet????

Admiral Ray
May 17, 2014

Proud Musk and Dogecoin fanboy

Telsa Cola posted:

Forest care for fires is currently already not meetings its goals. There is no ways its going to be handled well.

Yeah that was my unjustified optimism shining through.

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Doc Hawkins
Jun 15, 2010

Dashing? But I'm not even moving!


Vincent Van Goatse posted:

I mean, be fair, where's a massive energy company going to get $30 million and change from?

We should give the shareholders that amount when we municipalize it.

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