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My favorite problem about TLJ in a haystack full of them is that Holdo sacrificing herself for the cause was (apparently) supposed to be heroic but Finn selflessly attempting it was misguided and cowardly. Thanks Rian. He couldn't even get the themes right.
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Apr 15, 2019 07:51
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Finn isn't supposed to die for that old senators fight. At the beginning of the movie he knew that and was running away. Rose (I think her name?) stopped him that time, but by the end she found she actually cared more about him than these old white people fighting with swords
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Apr 15, 2019 07:54
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Donovan Trip posted:The space Nazis were boring dogshit Abrams introduced and barely a thing in TLJ, their death planet is destroyed and Rian killed their leader and destroyed their ships. Like neither the rebellion or the space Nazis have poo poo all left "The First Order reigns."
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Apr 15, 2019 07:58
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Milkfred E. Moore posted:"The First Order reigns." What in the opening scrawl? Did you make it to the end of the movie tho? All that's left is an angry teenager and a ginger
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Apr 15, 2019 07:59
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Slutitution posted:My favorite problem about TLJ in a haystack full of them is that Holdo sacrificing herself for the cause was (apparently) supposed to be heroic but Finn selflessly attempting it was misguided and cowardly. Zane fucked around with this message at 08:23 on Apr 15, 2019 |
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Apr 15, 2019 08:11
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TheIncredulousHulk posted:All the Disney Star Warses have been deeply flawed, but each in their own individual way, and that's kinda interesting they keep trying to catch the lightning, but the lightning was just that it was a complete story, told in a familiar setting with interesting peripherals, and made with ground breaking technology that finally made sci-fi feel immersive and realistic. empire worked so well because it was a natural continuation and perfect inverse of the original's story, providing a unique experience for a blockbuster in that it was a tragedy. jedi was just pure fan service and the weakest of the OT by far, but at least fulfilled some of the ambitions of the story arc and provided a slightly more nuanced conclusion beyond "might makes right," keeping with the growth of the narrative themes begun in empire well that was stupid and took too much effort. the answer is they're trying way too hard and imprisoned by nostalgia the lighting was in our hearts all along RaySmuckles fucked around with this message at 08:15 on Apr 15, 2019 |
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Apr 15, 2019 08:13
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Half of Return of the Jedi is some of the worst material associated with Star Wars and half of it is the best thing in the franchise. Good thing the ending part was the good half!
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Apr 15, 2019 08:16
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Barudak posted:Half of Return of the Jedi is some of the worst material associated with Star Wars and half of it is the best thing in the franchise. Good thing the ending part was the good half!
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Apr 15, 2019 08:18
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My Grade 6 and 7 students all agreed that TLJ was "dumb and boring", and even the action scenes were "dumb and boring". This leaves me with a bit of a problem... Either TLJ was too dumb and boring for Fortnite fanatics, or all of my students are Russian bots and MRA Nazis.
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Apr 15, 2019 08:23
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CJacobs posted:People always poo poo talk the prequel trilogy's lightsaber fights for being over coreographed but personally I just cannot get enough of these dumb assholes doing unnecessary corkscrews and backflips and pirouettes like they're geralt from the witcher I still like to watch Duel of the Fates sometimes when I'm bored, it's fast and fierce with great music. I also really like the tension of them fighting over massive drops and getting separated to change the odds. I decided to watch some of the ep2 and3 fights recently and in comparison they are just awful. Having a person who can actually do a lot of acrobatic stuff made it look so much better. e: and watching it again just now, the difference in attitudes between Jin and Maul comes across so well, where Jin kneels down to meditate but Maul is pacing back and forth without breaking eye contact. It communicates so much about the characters without having to say anything. TheMostFrench fucked around with this message at 08:29 on Apr 15, 2019 |
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Apr 15, 2019 08:26
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i like to think of the trilogy as a spiral the first film is a half of a perfect looking circle. that's awesome, a perfect circle! how satisfying! then the second film subverts your expectations because its not a circle at all anymore! in fact its something different! but its concluded under the starting point of the circle, a tragic unfulfillment of the original sensation, leaving you wanting. the circle is ruined, but now its something more. the third film is boring at first because now its just a smaller half-circle that you know isn't going to end up a circle, but the conclusion is great because it comes to the terminal point of the spiral, leaving a satisfying, unique creation  that was a stupid post. i'm going to bed
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Apr 15, 2019 08:27
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Donovan Trip posted:The space Nazis were boring dogshit Abrams introduced and barely a thing in TLJ, their death planet is destroyed and Rian killed their leader and destroyed their ships. Like neither the rebellion or the space Nazis have poo poo all left But it's not clear how they got all that stuff and people and uniforms and planet-gun in the first place, so they can just get it again through the same offscreen means. Here Comes the First Order Coast Guard Unless there's some line or something in the movies that says it that I missed, but I ain't watching them stinkers again.
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Apr 15, 2019 08:31
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TLJ tried to tell a message about war and violence that our hyper violent fascist nation isn't really feelin, I think that's what hurt it. OT was nostalgia for beating the Nazis at a time when no one was watching war films because the cold war was a fuckin drag. Prequel trilogy was about a gilded age that a few missteps in trade relations could completely undo everything, that was real anxiety boomers felt about the end of the 90s/NAFTA The new trilogy is being made at a time of endless war and nationalist societies looking for symbols we recognize to kind of keep us together, TFA was generally liked because it understood we're searching, culturally, for familiar markers. And then Rian comes in and says "gently caress you. gently caress Star Wars" and challenges all the themes of Star Wars, because he's really more of a sci fi guy. People wanted old fashioned fantasy Star Wars, because reality is pretty poo poo at the moment for a lot of people, and here comes this dweeb to try and get creative with it. But that's part of why I love it I guess.
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Apr 15, 2019 08:35
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Blistex posted:My Grade 6 and 7 students all agreed that TLJ was "dumb and boring", and even the action scenes were "dumb and boring". This leaves me with a bit of a problem... TLJ was pretty bad but I’m a russian bot so take my opinion with a grain of salt.
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Apr 15, 2019 08:35
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TBH even if everything else in TLJ had been perfect I probably still would have hated it because of the laser shells having a ballistic trajectory in space. Whenever I think back on that movie that’s the thing that most haunts my nightmares. That and the terrible casino scenes.
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Apr 15, 2019 08:38
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doctorfrog posted:But it's not clear how they got all that stuff and people and uniforms and planet-gun in the first place, so they can just get it again through the same offscreen means. Here Comes the First Order Coast Guard Here's the problem: JJ gives them the biggest gun in the universe, but they also behave like a terrorist organization kidnapping people and making them soldiers? When the guns gone and the leaders are dead who in first order would be like "yeah let's do this" Neither JJ or Rian gave them consistency or like, backstory I think because JJ doesn't care about those types of details and Rian didn't care for the FO existing period. Donovan Trip fucked around with this message at 08:52 on Apr 15, 2019 |
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Apr 15, 2019 08:38
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Chomp8645 posted:Star Wars symbolizes unchecked, vain consumerism.
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Apr 15, 2019 08:46
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Instead of making episode 9 they should have made a new episode 8 to replace TLJ sorta like the Hulk reboot or the third Spider Man reboot.
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Apr 15, 2019 08:49
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Slutitution posted:My favorite problem about TLJ in a haystack full of them is that Holdo sacrificing herself for the cause was (apparently) supposed to be heroic but Finn selflessly attempting it was misguided and cowardly. Finn had to be shutdown in order to cement the message of the earlier casino scene: FINN: It was worth it, though. To tear up that town, make 'em hurt. ROSE (freeing the space horses): Go. Now, it's worth it. Finn wants to destroy the oppressors. Rose repeatedly tells him "No...our freedom and life shouldn't come at the expense of the space-nazis right to exist or the war profiteers right to live in fabulous wealth". You can see why the wealthiest media company in the world might be keen the send such a message even while profiting from superficial progressive imagery.
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Apr 15, 2019 09:01
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the GONK robot is the true hero of the star wars
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Apr 15, 2019 09:12
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Donovan Trip posted:TLJ tried to tell a message about war and violence that our hyper violent fascist nation isn't really feelin, I think that's what hurt it.
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Apr 15, 2019 09:14
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kecske posted:the GONK robot is the true hero of the star wars Hell yeah. Get in with that Gonk Weed. 
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Apr 15, 2019 09:16
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Saint Drogo posted:TLJ is the least creative Star Wars film in every way, and it has no message. "sorry, you're no one" is second only to "I'm you're father" but ymmv I've posted what i consider to be the message and themes of TLJ in this thread, if you didn't care for them or didn't read them it is ok either way. I love Star wras and at some point you either meet the movies on their terms or stop watching them Donovan Trip fucked around with this message at 09:27 on Apr 15, 2019 |
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Apr 15, 2019 09:18
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Applewhite posted:TBH even if everything else in TLJ had been perfect I probably still would have hated it because of the laser shells having a ballistic trajectory in space. Whenever I think back on that movie that’s the thing that most haunts my nightmares. I was hoping that the hacker was just going to be Lando livin it up at the casino and we'd spend 30 minutes with him seducing and then graphically making love to finn's new girlfriend. Then Lobot walks in, looks at Finn and is like "lol owned" before taking a fat rip off a space bong Go ahead, tell me that would be a worse movie. You can't, because it wouldn't.
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Apr 15, 2019 09:59
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Donovan Trip posted:"sorry, you're no one" is second only to "I'm you're father" but ymmv I mean, not really. Maybe they could have made it a big twist, but now it's just something some guy says, who has no business knowing that information if true, and it has no impact at all. Its only impact is giving parts of the audience an opportunity to laugh at other parts of the audience for crafting elaborate origin stories that were unceremoniously discarded. Which one would require extremely specific and online information to even "get". Hell, even in TFA she just wants to find her parents, she doesn't go around "gee I sure hope my true family is some kind of royalty or something  ", so outside of that external "owning the fans" context it doesn't even really make sense for her to "realize" they were nobody.
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Apr 15, 2019 10:11
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Donovan Trip posted:"sorry, you're no one" is second only to "I'm you're father" but ymmv what're you going to do when they make her a skywalker lmfao
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Apr 15, 2019 10:12
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Moon Atari posted:Finn had to be shutdown in order to cement the message of the earlier casino scene: Hey yeah >: ( I was wondering what was bugging me about that. The war profiteers weren’t depicted as evil, the Aesop presented was literally “actually there’s no difference between good and bad things you imbecile...”
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Apr 15, 2019 10:15
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Milkfred E. Moore posted:rian absolutely derailed it. the end of TFA, as confirmed by jj and hamill, was that rey would find luke meditating on the ocean planet, surrounded by huge floating boulders (and this was shot). rian asked for this scene to be changed into what we got. That floating boulder scene sounds stupid as hell and torpedoing it may be one of the few things that rian actually did right
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Apr 15, 2019 10:16
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QuarkJets posted:That floating boulder scene sounds stupid as hell and torpedoing it may be one of the few things that rian actually did right Luke throwing away the lightsaber was good because it’s classic “the master rejects the prospective student.” Too bad the rest of the movie was a complete shitshow from that moment on.
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Apr 15, 2019 10:19
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The last jedi was an extremely poo poo movie on many levels. They managed to be eve worse thsn the force awakens, which was already extremely poo poo.
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Apr 15, 2019 10:28
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Rey's parents are nobodies because Sheev made her using dark magic. They're literally no one because they don't exist.
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Apr 15, 2019 10:39
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her parents are jar jar binks and yoda
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Apr 15, 2019 11:04
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QuarkJets posted:That floating boulder scene sounds stupid as hell and torpedoing it may be one of the few things that rian actually did right it's pretty funny though because then he went and had rey do it at the end of TLJ lol
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Apr 15, 2019 11:07
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Zane posted:those are both bad in tlj. the first is bcz of poe's misjudgment. the second is bcz of finn's misjudgment. they're both misjudgments because they both enact the classic star wars morality that tlj criticizes at every turn: in which the best 'good' thing is always to destroy the closest 'evil' thing. the alternative tlj morality involves rethinking the whole approach. as rose suggests: 'not to destroy what you hate but save the thing that you love' but holdo destroys the thing she hates idgi
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Apr 15, 2019 11:40
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sebmojo posted:but holdo destroys the thing she hates idgi Finn: young black man, basically an escaped slave. Holdo: old white lady. I wonder why disney would want to send the message that it is okay for one of these to destroy their enemy and not the other. Also, Holdo was for sure one of a handful of pop culture characters that were meant in anticipation of a Hillary Clinton presidency, which is especially funny in this case because she was an incompetent and uncharismatic leader that the narrative chides the better liked character for not blindly following.
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Apr 15, 2019 11:58
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Probably if TLJ had been one of the three Rian trilogy movies about a totally different set of people it would have been great. Pretty much all of its problems stem from it trying to be part of the established story, and being a sequel to a really by-the-numbers SW movie. By the looks of it, the third one will be by-the-numbers as hell too, which is only going to make TLJ look even more ridiculous as time goes on.
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Apr 15, 2019 12:18
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Milkfred E. Moore posted:it's pretty funny though because then he went and had rey do it at the end of TLJ lol Right, he didn't want rey upstaged by Luke. In fact, there's a requirement that sequel characters beat the old actors they replaced.
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Apr 15, 2019 12:37
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You know what would make the first order work? Just get rid of nu death star, keep them the same bunch of neo-imperial losers but they figure out how to use spaceships like relativistic missiles with Force or whatever. So they 9/11 coruscant, and the rest follows existing material.
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Apr 15, 2019 13:03
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Everybody wondering how JJ Abraham's is going to resolve all the "plot lines" of the last jedi and make it mesh with the force Wakes and bring it all together is a satisfactory and cohesive ending.................. Real head scratcher here folks à real conundrum.
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Apr 15, 2019 13:31
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Colonel Cancer posted:You know what would make the first order work? They should have had the republic just turn into the first order immediately after overthrowing the old empire and all the ex-rebels are the only ones who oppose the new authoritarians.
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Apr 15, 2019 13:51
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