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https://twitter.com/Charles_Lister/status/1131924071795572736?s=19quote:Controlled by the #YPG/#SDF, the #Tabqa Dam - the largest source of electricity in #Syria - has been repaired & reconnected to the national grid. I'd love to know the specifics of the agreement and how power sharing (both political and literal electrical power sharing) works between the regime and Northeast Syria, but details are not very forthcoming; most of the news about Tabqa is related to the battle that took place back in 2017.
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May 27, 2019 21:24
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Rigged Death Trap posted:Healthcare, Utilities, government services. Oh, so not anything where privatization might have the theoretical benefit of reducing the Saud family's death grip on the country. That figures.
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May 27, 2019 21:28
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It says a lot about that a ghoul like Lister doesn't even bother to hide his dismay at the prospect of a shattered and war torn country getting its power grid back online.
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May 28, 2019 03:54
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Helsing posted:It says a lot about that a ghoul like Lister doesn't even bother to hide his dismay at the prospect of a shattered and war torn country getting its power grid back online. This post would probably carry more weight if the regime wasn't still bombing the piss out of Idlib, and going to kill and permanently displace an awful lot of people when it's ready to move on it. https://twitter.com/tobiaschneider/status/1133021658497912836 The cities being bombed, where people are most vulnerable, aren't going to get any power as a result of any of this. The regime has always used it as a tool. Volkerball fucked around with this message at 06:50 on May 28, 2019 |
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May 28, 2019 06:44
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“Won’t somebody think of HTS!”
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May 28, 2019 16:27
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Volkerball posted:This post would probably carry more weight if the regime wasn't still bombing the piss out of Idlib, and going to kill and permanently displace an awful lot of people when it's ready to move on it. For the majority of the Syrian population that has been victimized by this war surely it is a good thing that the power grid is getting repaired? Whatever you wanted to see happen in the civil war isn't this an unambiguously good thing at this point from the perspective of the average Syrian?
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May 28, 2019 16:29
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It’s not because the insane crew of Jihadis didn’t win, and American shitlibs are mad about it.
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May 28, 2019 16:30
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I loving hate Liberals lol.
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May 28, 2019 16:31
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True leftists celebrate heartily in the streets at the victory of the apartheid state mafia family regime.
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May 28, 2019 16:58
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Grape posted:True leftists celebrate heartily in the streets at the victory of the apartheid state mafia family regime. as it stands you mostly celebrate a hideous war with no good winning options coming to an end. it is a muted celebration, but it beats the poo poo out of grinding your teeth over how DARE the filthy creatures of Syria have power again.
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May 28, 2019 17:04
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Yeowch!!! My Balls!!! posted:as it stands you mostly celebrate a hideous war with no good winning options coming to an end. it is a muted celebration, but it beats the poo poo out of grinding your teeth over how DARE the filthy creatures of Syria have power again. Well, for definitions of 'coming to an end' depending on how enthusiastic Assad's post-war purges are. Looks like there'll be people going into military hospitals and not coming out for a good long while yet.
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May 28, 2019 17:27
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Grape posted:True leftists celebrate heartily in the streets at the victory of the apartheid state mafia family regime. Since the war is more or less over in most of the government held areas isn't it better that some semblance of normalcy, including functional utilities, be restored to the greatest extent possible? What's a better short term outcome to be hoping for?
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May 28, 2019 18:06
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Helsing posted:What's a better short term outcome to be hoping for?
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May 28, 2019 18:23
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Rent-A-Cop posted:Peace sans fascism? There was just a long brutal civil war that has more or less established that the government isn't going to be overthrow any time soon, so perhaps in light of that it would be better for the Syrians to at least have functioning utilities? I'm just not getting how anyone who is ostensibly concerned with the welfare of the people in the country could be saying that the restoration of basic services is a bad thing. I guess it would make a sort of brutal realpolitik sense to want conditions to be really bad in government held territory if you thought the government was on the verge of falling but I don't think anyone still seriously believes that to be the case so viewing the restoration of basic services as a bad seems more like a desire that the Syrian people need to be collectively punished for having a bad government.
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May 28, 2019 18:32
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Having a hard time getting excited that the trains to the death camps will be running on time.
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May 28, 2019 18:38
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Frond posted:I loving hate Liberals lol. On this issue you are actually on the same side as a large proportion of American liberals, which is one of the reasons the US never seriously intervened.
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May 28, 2019 18:45
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Rent-A-Cop posted:Having a hard time getting excited that the trains to the death camps will be running on time. it beats demolishing cities block-by-block because someone heard a shiite might have laid eggs somewhere in the vicinity, i guess.
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May 28, 2019 18:46
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Yeowch!!! My Balls!!! posted:it beats demolishing cities block-by-block because someone heard a shiite might have laid eggs somewhere in the vicinity, i guess. Wait, are you suggesting demolishing cities block by block is not a thing Assad does? 
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May 28, 2019 19:17
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Darth Walrus posted:Wait, are you suggesting demolishing cities block by block is not a thing Assad does? oh, god no. comment's entirely about how in the absence of an open war we can expect to see less of that.
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May 28, 2019 19:22
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Helsing posted:For the majority of the Syrian population that has been victimized by this war surely it is a good thing that the power grid is getting repaired? Whatever you wanted to see happen in the civil war isn't this an unambiguously good thing at this point from the perspective of the average Syrian? Most of the centers of Assad's power are relatively untouched by the war, and weren't in need of power. It's simply another tool at his disposal to punish victims and flex nuts at the rest of the country. Same deal with humanitarian aid going into his hands. It's humanitarian aid, it's good! Then it ends up being sold in shops in Damascus and not seen in the places most affected, so the smuggling networks still end up doing just as much work. These networks rely on cracks within the Syrian political apparatus to deliver aid because the state relentlessly pursues them. The more stabilized the Assad regime becomes, the worse the humanitarian situation is going to be for whoever he deems an enemy, so there's nothing "unambiguously good" when it comes to his consolidation of power. Frond posted:“Won’t somebody think of HTS!” gently caress yeah, shock and awe, bitch. https://twitter.com/AFP_Beirut/status/1133422182883831811 Take your outright bloodlust somewhere else.
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May 28, 2019 19:29
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Volkerball posted:Most of the centers of Assad's power are relatively untouched by the war, and weren't in need of power. It's simply another tool at his disposal to punish victims and flex nuts at the rest of the country. Same deal with humanitarian aid going into his hands. It's humanitarian aid, it's good! Then it ends up being sold in shops in Damascus and not seen in the places most affected, so the smuggling networks still end up doing just as much work. These networks rely on cracks within the Syrian political apparatus to deliver aid because the state relentlessly pursues them. The more stabilized the Assad regime becomes, the worse the humanitarian situation is going to be for whoever he deems an enemy, so there's nothing "unambiguously good" when it comes to his consolidation of power. I don’t think this is necessarily true, if only because commodities like food are liquid and Assad has only so much control over the smuggling and distribution networks. I don’t know about the dam but I think it will at least likely benefit the East, and help get industry and jobs restarted elsewhere.
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May 28, 2019 19:35
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Guys, I heard Assad won the war most, right? Right. So logically he must control 100% of everything in Syria now, right? Right. So the people there should starve and live in darkness to spite him! Right guys?! RIGHT??!?!?
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May 28, 2019 20:08
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A good chunk of the middle east is going to be too hot on average (50 C averages, 30 C nights) for human habitability in a few decades, let's not forget.
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May 28, 2019 21:27
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Volkerball posted:This post would probably carry more weight if the regime wasn't still bombing the piss out of Idlib, and going to kill and permanently displace an awful lot of people when it's ready to move on it. you mean the people who the SDF has been at war with for the past five years aren't going to be connected to the drat they just repaired? that is unforgivable and frankly i think it's just one more reason to the pile for america to invertene regime tools like this SDF controlled electric drat, so they can't be abused by the SDF regime
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May 28, 2019 21:47
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Yeowch!!! My Balls!!! posted:oh, god no. comment's entirely about how in the absence of an open war we can expect to see less of that. I don't think I'd put money on that. The demolitions were and are happening in neighbourhoods that the SAA has occupied and pacified in order to encourage civilians who've fled to stay gone. The war ending will mean that they can safely demolish more homes, and they'll have a more urgent reason to do so it the form of returning refugees who might disrupt their little ethnic-cleansing project.
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May 28, 2019 22:05
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Helsing posted:There was just a long brutal civil war that has more or less established that the government isn't going to be overthrow any time soon, so perhaps in light of that it would be better for the Syrians to at least have functioning utilities? I'm just not getting how anyone who is ostensibly concerned with the welfare of the people in the country could be saying that the restoration of basic services is a bad thing. by functioning utilities, does this include hospitals Also lol at 'we had to bomb the city and fire MLRS into civilian areas to bring power and water to them'
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May 28, 2019 23:01
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Volkerball posted:This post would probably carry more weight if the regime wasn't still bombing the piss out of Idlib, and going to kill and permanently displace an awful lot of people when it's ready to move on it. Won't someone think of the rump state of territory seized and controlled by literal genocidal jihadist militias 
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May 29, 2019 03:55
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Helsing posted:For the majority of the Syrian population that has been victimized by this war surely it is a good thing that the power grid is getting repaired? Whatever you wanted to see happen in the civil war isn't this an unambiguously good thing at this point from the perspective of the average Syrian? It would if the average Syrian was reconnecting power to their white-picket fence houses and going back to their normal 9 to 5. Or if the Russians and the Assad regime was intending to use that power to create the conditions for a peace process rather than a military victory followed by a genocide. Since that clearly isn't happening there's little to be excited about. The "average Syrian" whose house was blown to poo poo and family scattered to the four winds and is crossing their fingers that they don't get picked up in the purges like half their friends isn't benefiting from Assad having a functional power grid to dole out as he chooses. While at this point it's pretty clear that anyone who can should flee rather than continue fighting, the reality is that a quicker end to the war isn't going to reduce the casualties at this point - any opposition still in Syria is going to be killed before the shooting stops. A dam going back online is not a return to normalcy, it's just a noose tightening.
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May 29, 2019 06:12
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thatfatkid posted:Won't someone think of the rump state of territory seized and controlled by literal genocidal jihadist militias thatfatkid posted:[angry farting noises]
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May 29, 2019 06:16
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I find it curious that the same people that were insisting that a Syrian govt victory in the battles for Aleppo and Damascus would surely end with the genocide of the population of the rebel-held territories, continue to insist that a Syrian govt victory in Idlib will surely end in the genocide of the population there as well. This of course despite the fact that the local populations of rebel-held Aleppo and Damascus were in fact not put to the slaughter. Why continue with the lies after being proved wrong time and again for so many years now?
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May 29, 2019 06:27
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It's amazing that it's this many years in and there's still plenty of idiots who seem happy to pretend that the Syrian war is not a genocide. 12 million people are domestic or international refugees. Who exactly are you trying to convince?
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May 29, 2019 07:37
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Kaal posted:It's amazing that it's this many years in and there's still plenty of idiots who seem happy to pretend that the Syrian war is not a genocide. 12 million people are domestic or international refugees. Who exactly are you trying to convince? bashar assad is fuckin' great, i'm not sure what your objection is thatfatkid posted:I find it curious that the same people that were insisting that a Syrian govt victory in the battles for Aleppo and Damascus would surely end with the genocide of the population of the rebel-held territories, continue to insist that a Syrian govt victory in Idlib will surely end in the genocide of the population there as well. This of course despite the fact that the local populations of rebel-held Aleppo and Damascus were in fact not put to the slaughter.
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May 29, 2019 07:43
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Kaal posted:It's amazing that it's this many years in and there's still plenty of idiots who seem happy to pretend that the Syrian war is not a genocide. 12 million people are domestic or international refugees. Who exactly are you trying to convince? Only a fool would deny the genocidal nature of the Sunni jihadist rebels.
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May 29, 2019 07:53
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Kaal posted:It's amazing that it's this many years in and there's still plenty of idiots who seem happy to pretend that the Syrian war is not a genocide. 12 million people are domestic or international refugees. Who exactly are you trying to convince? if you had to pick either stalin or hitler. you know, what with the guys being bombed in idlib also being big on genocide... so what exactly is you point there? i mean i know, we should bomb assad so that the moderate jihadist rebels could do the genocide instead, but beyond that what is it that you're trying to prove to yourself?
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May 29, 2019 10:23
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Kurnugia posted:if you had to pick either stalin or hitler. you know, what with the guys being bombed in idlib also being big on genocide... so what exactly is you point there? i mean i know, we should bomb assad so that the moderate jihadist rebels could do the genocide instead, but beyond that what is it that you're trying to prove to yourself? I mean, even if you take away the casualties from aerial and artillery bombardment, the SAA has killed roughly twenty times as many civilians as ISIS, a literal fundamentalist death-cult who are the second most murderous faction in the country. It takes some serious and unusual dedication to genocide to get those sorts of numbers.
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May 29, 2019 10:39
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Kaal posted:It's amazing that it's this many years in and there's still plenty of idiots who seem happy to pretend that the Syrian war is not a genocide. 12 million people are domestic or international refugees. Who exactly are you trying to convince? The last thing I want to do is wade into the latest iteration of this dumb argument, but no it wasn't a genocide. War crimes? Sure. All manner of brutality and death and suffering and torture was meted out by Assad's thugs, as part of a campaign of terror to cow the populace. But numbers have nothing to do with genocide. The conflict was largely fought along sectarian lines, but not completely. By far the most important factor was who you were loyal to, what side you were on. Sunnis disproportionately suffered in this war, but Sunnis who fought for Assad were not systematically gotten rid of. This isn't meant as an apology for Assad, at all. Killing a bunch of innocent people because they don't like you is just as bad as genocide, imo. I'm a stickler for this because genocide has a real legal definition, and it shouldn't be diluted by false positives.
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May 29, 2019 11:53
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Count Roland posted:The last thing I want to do is wade into the latest iteration of this dumb argument, but no it wasn't a genocide. I feel like the neighbourhood-bulldozing and property seizure in places like Qaboun to keep Sunni refugees from coming back is an indicator of genocide. It's a clear statement of 'we don't want these people in our country'.
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May 29, 2019 12:10
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Darth Walrus posted:I feel like the neighbourhood-bulldozing and property seizure in places like Qaboun to keep Sunni refugees from coming back is an indicator of genocide. It's a clear statement of 'we don't want these people in our country'. By that rationale you could argue Croatians 'genocided' the Serbs in Krajina at the end of the Balkan wars, after they'd won. But there is a difference between that (which was basically ethnic cleansing and forced displacement) and what the Serbs did to the Croatians/Bosnians during the war (torture/death camps based solely on ethnicity + religion).
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May 29, 2019 12:36
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CrazyLoon posted:By that rationale you could argue Croatians 'genocided' the Serbs in Krajina at the end of the Balkan wars, after they'd won. But there is a difference between that (which was basically ethnic cleansing and forced displacement) and what the Serbs did to the Croatians/Bosnians during the war (torture/death camps based solely on ethnicity + religion). The neighbourhood demolitions are accompanied by torture/death camps, though? There's all those hospitals in Damascus with the rows of suspiciously long ditches out back, and then there's the ludicrously huge civilian casualty rates they're racking up on the front lines. The demolitions are just an indicator of who they're particularly targeting, and their target list seems suspiciously ethnic.
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May 29, 2019 12:45
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Darth Walrus posted:I mean, even if you take away the casualties from aerial and artillery bombardment, the SAA has killed roughly twenty times as many civilians as ISIS, a literal fundamentalist death-cult who are the second most murderous faction in the country. It takes some serious and unusual dedication to genocide to get those sorts of numbers. Not trying to whitewash here, but look at any of those estimates, and you will see a problem. The male portion of the civilian casualties is much higher, 5-15x, that of the women. The numbers of what are clearly combatants are being left in the same section as civilians. It’s sort of hard to say with any certainty, but this discrepancy is shown in pro-rebel SOHR numbers as well.
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