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nyttyn posted:This situation probably wouldn't be as heated as it is if this wasn't piggy backing off of two expansions of no new jobs for healers, with the given reasoning being that they had to re-balance them first. I mean if you genuinely think every thing is doomed and healers will be hated and they intend to replace healers with npcs and all the thing a people are saying then it might be a good idea to skip this expansion and see if it is fixed by the next because it seems to assume a level of malicious hatred rather than just disagreement on balance. I don't think it is wrong for people to be annoyed but some of the things being said in this thread are bonkers.
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May 29, 2019 18:56
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Also they completely removed Quickened Aetherflow, which was the best change SCH got in SB. Going back to 1m long Aetherflows is going to feel awful.
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May 29, 2019 18:56
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:There are two abilities that don't show up in AST's Gamerescape's tooltip image.  The subreddit has a collection of tooltips and such too.
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May 29, 2019 18:58
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Female DRG AF4 is some loving bullshit.
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May 29, 2019 19:03
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I got into the photoshop again.
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May 29, 2019 19:03
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I just know there's going to be so many "We Fall" shitposts. Especially about that tightrope.
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May 29, 2019 19:06
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ImpAtom posted:I mean if you genuinely think every thing is doomed and healers will be hated and they intend to replace healers with npcs and all the thing a people are saying then it might be a good idea to skip this expansion and see if it is fixed by the next because it seems to assume a level of malicious hatred rather than just disagreement on balance. Intentionally breaking a job you can't figure out how to balance is absolutely a thing game developers do; League of Legends used to do it as routine. I'd like to think that the XIV team is better than Riot, but I'm not exactly confident in that right now.
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May 29, 2019 19:10
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Saigyouji posted:Also they completely removed Quickened Aetherflow, which was the best change SCH got in SB. Going back to 1m long Aetherflows is going to feel awful. Without Energy Drain though will you really be spending Aetherflow that quick?
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May 29, 2019 19:13
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Magil Zeal posted:Without Energy Drain though will you really be spending Aetherflow that quick? Yes. Personally, I only ever used energy drain at times where fairy does all of the work. If there's healing to be done, lustrate/excog/incom is always the correct choice, and having 4 instead of 3 per minute is a 33% increase in free healing output 
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May 29, 2019 19:17
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Solo Wing Pixy posted:Intentionally breaking a job you can't figure out how to balance is absolutely a thing game developers do; League of Legends used to do it as routine. I'd like to think that the XIV team is better than Riot, but I'm not exactly confident in that right now. It's absolutely the right move. If you can't balance something the solution isn't to keep loving it up over and over, it's to build something you can balance.
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May 29, 2019 19:18
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Magil Zeal posted:Without Energy Drain though will you really be spending Aetherflow that quick? Yes, because healing with GCDs on SCH is an awful idea in 99% of situations.
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May 29, 2019 19:18
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Although, I guess with the heavy nerf on Embrace, dissipation might get used more now?
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May 29, 2019 19:20
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I only ever really used energy drain to dump aetherflow and get mp back and maybe that won’t be necessary anymore without knowing how the new aetherflow works in practice it’s hard to get all bent out of shape about it
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May 29, 2019 19:23
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Fair enough, my scholar play has always been for casual content only and I never really did much with it. But it makes sense when you put it like that.
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May 29, 2019 19:23
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Oxyclean posted:Dancer is aiming: Lol I know Rdps uses aiming, but...really? Ninja and Dragoon still have their own drops just to gently caress everyone else over every raid?
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May 29, 2019 19:24
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Saigyouji posted:Yes, because healing with GCDs on SCH is an awful idea in 99% of situations. Just yesterday it was being argued that Enegy Drain is absolutely central to Scholar's DPS
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May 29, 2019 19:24
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Magil Zeal posted:Without Energy Drain though will you really be spending Aetherflow that quick? You'd be surprised how often I burn Excogitation and Lustrates to keep people up. Granted, this was mostly is response to SCH shield feeling super weak in SB which they've addressed (in spades!) so we'll see
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May 29, 2019 19:25
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UHD posted:I only ever really used energy drain to dump aetherflow and get mp back and maybe that won’t be necessary anymore I mean. We do know how new Aetherflow works. It's a 1m CD that's used on all the same things it's used on currently and can only be used in combat. There aren't radical changes to it. (Except the bizarre decision to make it combat only) ImpAtom posted:Just yesterday it was being argued that Enegy Drain is absolutely central to Scholar's DPS That's because Energy Drain was deliberately used as a Aetherflow dump during the last 5/10/15s of Aetherflow to reset the CD. It wasn't used before that (outside of the opener, where you had 6 Aetherflow in stock) because of the risks of spending Aetherflow too early. Saigyouji fucked around with this message at 19:28 on May 29, 2019 |
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May 29, 2019 19:25
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ImpAtom posted:Just yesterday it was being argued that Enegy Drain is absolutely central to Scholar's DPS To be fair even in savage content there's phases where you don't heal a lot and energy drain gets used there to advance aetherflow/dps/get some mp without wasting stacks.
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May 29, 2019 19:26
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They should really switch to a token system for exclusive dungeon gear, I really wanted the Skallic Striking set but could never get the last piece or two to drop after countless runs of one of my least favorite dungeons.
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May 29, 2019 19:27
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Also disappointing with Scholar, I had been working my way up to 70 on it (currently 67) but the new changes seem really uninteresting. I am not an excellent healer, and as a result I often am not fully taking advantage of my kit. I will try to keep my dots up on bosses and everyone alive, but unless the fairy was covering the healing 100% I always knew there were better ways I could be optimizing and doing more damage. The new setup seems so basic in comparison I feel like my brain is just going to turn off during in most dungeons with no real impact on my healing or damage.
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May 29, 2019 19:27
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Saigyouji posted:I mean. We do know how new Aetherflow works. It's a 1m CD that's used on all the same things it's used on currently and can only be used in combat. There aren't radical changes to it. (Except the bizarre decision to make it combat only) i'm really mad it doesn't have charges lol
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May 29, 2019 19:29
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Rastan Beeza posted:Lol I know Rdps uses aiming, but...really? Ninja and Dragoon still have their own drops just to gently caress everyone else over every raid? It took ten years for WoW to solve the problem of int plate.
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May 29, 2019 19:29
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Arist posted:They should really switch to a token system for exclusive dungeon gear, I really wanted the Skallic Striking set but could never get the last piece or two to drop after countless runs of one of my least favorite dungeons. At the least, you can usually solo the previous expansion's dungeons fairly easily once you gear up something like WAR or DRK a bit.
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May 29, 2019 19:29
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Saw in a video that porting to a same zone aether cost 200g. Is it 100 in Stormblood? I forgot.
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May 29, 2019 19:29
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Truga posted:To be fair even in savage content there's phases where you don't heal a lot and energy drain gets used there to advance aetherflow/dps/get some mp without wasting stacks. But that is different from what was being argued. It feels like Scholar arguments boil down to "every change ever is bad" even when it is contradictory. That or a lot of people don't understand how to play Scholar even in Sav/Ex content which is a problem.
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May 29, 2019 19:30
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ImpAtom posted:But that is different from what was being argued. It can be both. You use aetherflow primarily to heal but it is a pretty decent chunk of dps because you don't constantly heal throughout the entire fight.
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May 29, 2019 19:32
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ImpAtom posted:I mean if you genuinely think every thing is doomed and healers will be hated and they intend to replace healers with npcs and all the thing a people are saying then it might be a good idea to skip this expansion and see if it is fixed by the next because it seems to assume a level of malicious hatred rather than just disagreement on balance. Nah I don't think things are doomed, I just think it's very understandable to feel pessimistic looking at this initially from the understanding that this is after a full expansion worth of them kicking the healer can down the road, and that this is what we will have to deal with for a full expansion because the team can only do so many changes so fast. If anyone likes the direction things are going, great for them of course! But there's absolutely a level below "we're doomed forever and healer is being deleted" but above "everything is fine" that can be considered reasonable given the context leading into these changes that probably would not be considered reasonable if this had launched with stormblood instead of after it.
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May 29, 2019 19:38
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Givin posted:Saw in a video that porting to a same zone aether cost 200g. Is it 100 in Stormblood? I forgot. minimum is 100g in SB, yeah the question is whether they got rid of the 999g cap how far is it to another dimension, anyway?
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May 29, 2019 19:43
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nyttyn posted:Nah I don't think things are doomed, I just think it's very understandable to feel pessimistic looking at this initially from the understanding that this is after a full expansion worth of them kicking the healer can down the road, and that this is what we will have to deal with for a full expansion because the team can only do so many changes so fast. If anyone likes the direction things are going, great for them of course! But there's absolutely a level below "we're doomed forever and healer is being deleted" but above "everything is fine" that can be considered reasonable given the context leading into these changes that probably would not be considered reasonable if this had launched with stormblood instead of after it. The thing is that even the most extremely pessimistic view is that healers will hit fewer DPS buttons. Not that they will be unplayable or even bad. Yet it is being treated like the end of days. It feels extreme. People whose favorite classes are being fully reworked are less pessimistic.
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May 29, 2019 19:44
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it's because healers in this game represented a different design philosophy than most trifecta games and now these changes are being seen as a push towards being more in line with the standard, with damage as an afterthought and not something a healer would actively push towards doing well. i get that not every healer cares about that since most parse abysmally anyway but its still A Thing that was unique and interesting about ffxiv. Plus, other trifectas that have damage as an afterthought have encounters where you need to work to heal through them, whereas in ffxiv all non-raid content is a snoozefest to heal through unless you fall asleep at the keyboard. This doesn't bother me as much because I heal on AST and I like the card minigame (and I don't care about the cards being changed - having to sift through them for damage types to get global buffs sounds fine to me in exchange for not getting 4 ewers in a row or whatever) but SCH's big thing was handling a bunch of little optimizations while healing ogcd and all of those little optimizations have been pruned away.
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May 29, 2019 19:51
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:Did anyone notice the potency drop on Holy (140) and Gravity (130)? They don't have falloff anymore though, so at 5+ targets it's actually a buff which is when you'd be using them anyways.
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May 29, 2019 19:52
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Let people vent imo. The news posts are only a few hours old and the healer changes are not insignificant. Might play different when ShB launches but emotional reactions are valid, especially for the first day or so.
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May 29, 2019 19:55
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Impermanent posted:it's because healers in this game represented a different design philosophy than most trifecta games and now these changes are being seen as a push towards being more in line with the standard, with damage as an afterthought and not something a healer would actively push towards doing well. i get that not every healer cares about that since most parse abysmally anyway but its still A Thing that was unique and interesting about ffxiv. Plus, other trifectas that have damage as an afterthought have encounters where you need to work to heal through them, whereas in ffxiv all non-raid content is a snoozefest to heal through unless you fall asleep at the keyboard. This doesn't bother me as much because I heal on AST and I like the card minigame (and I don't care about the cards being changed - having to sift through them for damage types to get global buffs sounds fine to me in exchange for not getting 4 ewers in a row or whatever) but SCH's big thing was handling a bunch of little optimizations while healing ogcd and all of those little optimizations have been pruned away. But that isn't going away? 2 out of 3 healers have pretty much the exact same buttons as before? Healers will still DPS as much or little as they were before
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May 29, 2019 19:55
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Klades posted:"Surely they learned their lesson with chakra in HW and they didn't just give SAM a move they can only use after extended downtime" It's fine. It's not great, but I was thinking about it the other day and if I had access to that ability in current content I would typically use it at full blast at least once a dungeon and multiple times a raid. Also, why I am sure it's going to work in the dumb way (1 meditation charge every time you get a tick of kenki regen), if it was 1 charge a second and full power after 5 you could get a lot of use out of it. Unrelated, it's interesting to me that the dnc abilities still have fall off on their AoE. Failboattootoot fucked around with this message at 20:13 on May 29, 2019 |
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May 29, 2019 20:00
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Next person that wants to go lol energy drain has to post their O12S parses, or something from an Ultimate, or at least a selfie with an Omega or Ultimate Codex. Hell, I'll start myself with a picture that more-or-less represents how I feel right now. Ironically, lol energy drain is a semi-correct opinion now; it's a lot less important since they just straight up deleted Quickened Aetherflow, which I didn't notice until now. Christ, to complete my Riot analogy from before, they really did go full Evelynn.
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May 29, 2019 20:04
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I don't know how I feel about the new card system for AST 
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May 29, 2019 20:09
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Solo Wing Pixy posted:Next person that wants to go lol energy drain has to post their O12S parses, or something from an Ultimate, or at least a selfie with an Omega or Ultimate Codex. Hell, I'll start myself with a picture that more-or-less represents how I feel right now. Among other things you can't just balance a class around people who finish the hardest content in a game like this.
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May 29, 2019 20:12
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RIP healers, and with that possibly the end of what used to be a fairly healthy end game scene, it was fun while it lasted, can't help but feel expansion looking worse for every bit of info released.
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May 29, 2019 20:12
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Not to distract from SCH chat, which is important, but anyone else get the feeling that GNB is PLD but better?
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