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I mean there was that time the zabis had someone put on a suit of armor and try to kill char with a sword in the middle of the night
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Jun 24, 2019 01:28
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ninjewtsu posted:I mean there was that time the zabis had someone put on a suit of armor and try to kill char with a sword in the middle of the night They did that after Jimba was an idiot and tried to get arms from Anaheim electronics to fight against the zabis. He was the main target if I remember and with deikun s kids it was more like, "kill the kids as well since the Ral's are relying on them." Plus, Jimba's the one who hammered it into char's head that the Zabi's killed his father and that he should get revenge. After they head to texas colony they don't try again until char tries to leave. Monaghan fucked around with this message at 01:49 on Jun 24, 2019 |
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Jun 24, 2019 01:39
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Monaghan posted:I love how Zeon Deikun, who in the anime is depicted as space jesus, is, in the origin, a guy who thinks he's space jesus. He may have just been a guy who worked himself to death, since you know, he was ranting and raving and hadn't slept for days prior to his death. Really, to propose something like the newtype theory you have to be kinda nuts. Plus he wasn't a peacenik at all, which is a nice touch. He was a religious zealot and that adds way more to the character. eh I don't really like when they try to paint everything in shades-of-grey I kinda enjoyed his original version where he was space jesus with the greatest failson of all time, and had his message hijacked to run a brutal dictatorship
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Jun 24, 2019 04:31
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Yinlock posted:eh I don't really like when they try to paint everything in shades-of-grey Honestly The Origin's depiction of Deikum makes me think of the mistake other fiction makes of "showing the monster." What makes him (and thinks like Reapers in Mass Effect, or Kyros in Tyranny) so fascinating is how little you know about them. They're mythical creatures with no reliable source information, but great cultural significance. When the mystique surrounding them is stripped away and they are 'shown,' the audience can't project their own versions of the myth on them, and suddenly they become something knowable. When they are knowable, they cease to be larger than life because Deikum is just a crazy philosopher. I think it would have been better if they had just started with his death. Leave the mystique in place, since that isn't the significant part of The Origin.
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Jun 24, 2019 05:51
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Warmachine posted:Honestly The Origin's depiction of Deikum makes me think of the mistake other fiction makes of "showing the monster." What makes him (and thinks like Reapers in Mass Effect, or Kyros in Tyranny) so fascinating is how little you know about them. They're mythical creatures with no reliable source information, but great cultural significance. When the mystique surrounding them is stripped away and they are 'shown,' the audience can't project their own versions of the myth on them, and suddenly they become something knowable. well the origin OVAs at least only care about Char and not, yknow, the actual gundam story sure we could have seen all those cool scenes from the manga, but here's a better idea: let's go into detail about char clipping his toenails
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Jun 24, 2019 05:53
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Darth Walrus posted:I think we can reasonably assume that they weren't what won the Calamity War, though - we only see them used on a single, elite late-war test unit, and it was the Gundams that took the MAs down. It's also stated that the damage to the Moon was from Dainsleifs. I don't know if that's in show or just side material though. It doesn't particularly make sense that you could take such a huge chunk out of the Moon using only kinetic bombardment, even if they were nuclear tipped, but that's apparently what happened. The kind Rustal was using, along with those in the Flauros Gundam were apparently severely under-powered in some manner, so it would make sense that more lethal ones were what finished the war in the show's backstory if they did have that kind of power. Neddy Seagoon posted:What we see of them is a single MS-portable weapon model. It's like saying guns are ineffective against people compared to swords because all you've seen is a bolt-action rifle. Nevermind that we've actually seen them kill something on par with a Mobile Armor. Two targets that were far smaller than a Mobile Armor in fact, from orbit, and they went down clean to a bunch of grunt soldiers with mass-produced weapons. To be fair, the main reason the Dainsleif's could even hit Mika or Akihiro was because both of them inexplicably decided to stand perfectly still for the time it takes for the Dainsleifs to leave the barrel and then impact, which would probably take 15 seconds or more. I say that given that they were probably shot about 100km up, so even if they were shot a 6km/s (twice the projected atmospheric speed of the "rod from god" idea Dainsleif's are obviously based on) they'd take about that long to hit. Arcsquad12 posted:Tomino will finally get greenlit for a 50 episode F91 remake and then have it get unceremoniously canned so Sunrise can make 0083: Rebellion. I doubt Tomino would be interested in working on it anyway. He seems like the kind of guy that loses interest in past works once they're done with, in any sense, and just moves on to new projects. He left UC behind as a story playground 30 odd years ago, and I doubt he wants to go back. He seems far more interested in telling relatively stand alone stories with a lighter atmosphere (even if the backstory is dark) and a happy ending these days. amigolupus posted:Something I noticed while watching the Origin movies with a friend who has no experience with Gundam is just how little explanation is given to you about the world. Going by the first movie, it doesn't really give you much of an explanation about the Earth Federation, about Spacenoids or why they're in colonies, about what the Federation does to Spacenoids or why Deikun wants independence for Side 3. You don't really get much explanation of those later two points in 0079 either. What explanation you do get isn't provided for something like 37 episodes either, until Char and Sayla finally meet and talk in the Texas Colony. The opening narration talks about why Gihren brought Side 3 to war against the Federation (he wants independence), not about why the movement had any momentum or what the Federation did to Spacenoids. You do get hints of it throughout, like the older people on White Base saying they thought they'd never see Earth again, but it's very sparse and all of it is scattered in to minor conversations so you might never notice if you weren't looking for it. Monaghan posted:I love how Zeon Deikun, who in the anime is depicted as space jesus, is, in the origin, a guy who thinks he's space jesus. He may have just been a guy who worked himself to death, since you know, he was ranting and raving and hadn't slept for days prior to his death. Really, to propose something like the newtype theory you have to be kinda nuts. Plus he wasn't a peacenik at all, which is a nice touch. He was a religious zealot and that adds way more to the character. I'm with Yinlock on this one. I preferred the original show's implication that he was a decent guy whose message was hijacked for greedy purposes by his friend, and then his friend birth an unintentional monster by showing his son that greed is more important than ideals. It makes for a more interesting tragedy in my opinion. I don't think it works as a development so well for a character we see any significant amounts of, but as backstory "he was a good guy whose message was twisted by his followers" is neat. tsob fucked around with this message at 14:43 on Jun 24, 2019 |
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Jun 24, 2019 14:40
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I don't think you really need a lot of context for the OYW in 0079, since it's not the story of the OYW, but the story of Amuro within the war. There's been a mountain of material written about the conflict in the ensuing forty years so there's a lot for people to dig into if they want to follow the setting more closely, but the premise of "space war giant robots get in the Gundam" with incidental references to past events is really all you need to get by with watching the OG series.
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Jun 24, 2019 15:53
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i quickly grew tired of the 100,000 gundam prototypes in the OYW but now i'm kind of attached to them and will not be satisfied until there are more gundams than gms e: like has the federation ever noticed that every time they make a gundam Weird poo poo starts happening Yinlock fucked around with this message at 17:54 on Jun 24, 2019 |
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Jun 24, 2019 17:29
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Yinlock posted:i quickly grew tired of the 100,000 gundam prototypes in the OYW but now i'm kind of attached to them and will not be satisfied until there are more gundams than gms Imagine being the one guy in a group of trainees assigned a GM instead. You get a Gundam  and you get a Gundam  and you get a Gundam  Everybody gets a Gundam  Except you. You get a GM. Good luck. 
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Jun 24, 2019 17:54
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tsob posted:Imagine being the one guy in a group of trainees assigned a GM instead. alright phillips your gundam is powered by ghosts so watch out for that, dickerson your gundam can turn invisible so make sure to stay in formation, avery your gundam shoots lasers from it's eyes, watch where you're looking what about me captain your gm has a beam spread gun, it's like a beam rifle except lovely.
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Jun 24, 2019 17:58
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"What about me sir?" "Oh gently caress, we forgot about Bob. Uh... poo poo... Okay, we're gonna slap a gun on that work pod over there, you can use that".
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Jun 24, 2019 18:21
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Neddy Seagoon posted:"What about me sir?" Just slap a face on that work pod and tell him it's a Gundam, let's see how long it takes him to realize. 
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Jun 24, 2019 18:25
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Raxivace posted:Yeah that's what happens when you do a (Mostly) straight adaptation of a manga arc that was never meant to stand on its own without any context. Arcsquad12 posted:I don't think you really need a lot of context for the OYW in 0079, since it's not the story of the OYW, but the story of Amuro within the war. There's been a mountain of material written about the conflict in the ensuing forty years so there's a lot for people to dig into if they want to follow the setting more closely, but the premise of "space war giant robots get in the Gundam" with incidental references to past events is really all you need to get by with watching the OG series. These are really good ways of putting it. I think the main thing is that you need the context of the Federation having Spacenoids under their thumb to get why Deikun wanting independence is so important, or why Zeon is so desperate to go to war. I just really like the Origin OVAs, and I'm just worried it's gonna get cut up into chunks for the TV series and won't have anything added to help ease people new to Gundam. Warmachine posted:Honestly The Origin's depiction of Deikum makes me think of the mistake other fiction makes of "showing the monster." What makes him (and thinks like Reapers in Mass Effect, or Kyros in Tyranny) so fascinating is how little you know about them. They're mythical creatures with no reliable source information, but great cultural significance. When the mystique surrounding them is stripped away and they are 'shown,' the audience can't project their own versions of the myth on them, and suddenly they become something knowable. I kind of like how they handled Deikun on a meta level. There's probably some folks who take the "Zeon was right" way too seriously, so showing that their SpaceJesus was actually a rambling philosopher who would've gone to war anyway puts a dent on them trying to justify that Zeon is in the right or something.
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Jun 24, 2019 18:36
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tsob posted:Just slap a face on that work pod and tell him it's a Gundam, let's see how long it takes him to realize. Works for at least 6 Rick Doms.
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Jun 24, 2019 18:52
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amigolupus posted:I kind of like how they handled Deikun on a meta level. There's probably some folks who take the "Zeon was right" way too seriously, so showing that their SpaceJesus was actually a rambling philosopher who would've gone to war anyway puts a dent on them trying to justify that Zeon is in the right or something. Rambling philosopher or not, the problem with Zeon is the Zabis and space fascism. What Deikun was doesn't necessarily factor into it--whether he was SpaceJesus or Alex Jones, it was the Zabis who took his calls for independence and spawned the One Year War. If we take The Origin's hawkish depiction, Zeon declaring independence in U.C. 63 or whenever that was (I don't have the dates in front of me) would have likely lead to a swift suppression and oppression of Side 3 by the Federation. No OYW, because Zeon at the time doesn't have the technological advantage to pull off something like Operation British and force a stalemate. What Zeon apologists can't get away from is that any post-OYW Zeonism always hearkens back to the Principality and the Zabis. When you have Peacenik Deikun, Zeon remnants claiming they're fighting for the "ideals of Zeon" can't be talking about Deikun--he wasn't the one calling for a war of independence. Hawkish Deikun would potentially even lionize the Zabis to a Zeon apologist. The Federation crushing the rebellion in the 60's would have left no room for a nearly-successful rebellion in 79. If anything, Hawkish Deikun dying made it possible for Zeon to almost win the war by giving Degwin and Ghiren time to manufacture an advantage against the Federation.
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Jun 24, 2019 19:04
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amigolupus posted:These are really good ways of putting it. I think the main thing is that you need the context of the Federation having Spacenoids under their thumb to get why Deikun wanting independence is so important, or why Zeon is so desperate to go to war. I just really like the Origin OVAs, and I'm just worried it's gonna get cut up into chunks for the TV series and won't have anything added to help ease people new to Gundam. You don't really get any clarification for that in animation until after 0079. In fact, I'm not even sure it's in Zeta or ZZ Gundam, though I haven't seen Zeta fully in years and I've never watched all of ZZ. I do think it's possible Char's Counterattack is the first Gundam entry to go in to any real detail on the fact that Spacenoids resent Earthnoids for ruling them from afar and not giving them a vote though, because I don't remember it being in Zeta and I don't think ZZ is bothered about that issue from what I have seen of it. Zeta does give a bit more detail on Newtypes for instance, but not on the inequality between Earthnoids and Spacenoids (at least, not that I recall). Blex is a member of the Federation Assembly and attends meetings several times during the show, despite being leader of the AEUG and fighting on behalf of Spacenoids; which implies Spacenoids have some voice in the assembly, even though it's never made clear whether he's an Earthnoid or Spacenoid himself. Not that that means Spacenoids definitively have a voice, it just makes me think the series never went in to that disparity and that it instead had other things it wanted to tackle. Warmachine posted:If we take The Origin's hawkish depiction, Zeon declaring independence in U.C. 63 or whenever that was (I don't have the dates in front of me) would have likely lead to a swift suppression and oppression of Side 3 by the Federation. No OYW, because Zeon at the time doesn't have the technological advantage to pull off something like Operation British and force a stalemate. There probably was a rebellion of some kind in about UC 0063 within the original timeline, because in the third 0079 movie, during the scene where Degwin compares Gihren to Hitler, Gihren mentions that he too fought in Deikun's rebellion years ago and Degwin talks about how the Federation recognized them as the first autonomous Side as well as stating that the reason he founded the Principality was because Deikun's methods could only take Side 3 so far. It implies that Deikun lead, or at least caused, a rebellion confined to Side 3 20 odd years ago before he died, and that they succeeded and the Federation recognized them as autonomous due to it. It wasn't enough for Gihren though, who was mostly itching for a war anyway, and he whipped up sentiment against the Federation for more than that autonomy, along with creating a military and began the One Year War. tsob fucked around with this message at 19:31 on Jun 24, 2019 |
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Jun 24, 2019 19:23
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tsob posted:Imagine being the one guy in a group of trainees assigned a GM instead. Hey, worked out alright for the White Dingos. tsob posted:It's also stated that the damage to the Moon was from Dainsleifs. I don't know if that's in show or just side material though. It doesn't particularly make sense that you could take such a huge chunk out of the Moon using only kinetic bombardment, even if they were nuclear tipped, but that's apparently what happened. The kind Rustal was using, along with those in the Flauros Gundam were apparently severely under-powered in some manner, so it would make sense that more lethal ones were what finished the war in the show's backstory if they did have that kind of power. The math for rods from the gods paints them as able to do similar damage to nukes, something that'd be even more true on the Moon without as much atmosphere to get in the way. You'd need a lot to gently caress up the moon that bad, but if you damaged Ahab reactors in the process, well, that'd make things pretty messy. And no, the kind Rustal was using weren't underpowered. Those were the genuine article. You're confusing them with another plot point. The deal is that the railgun that can fire Dainsleifs is in a legal grey area. It's only the actual ammo (made of the same absurd supermaterial as a Mobile Suit's inner frame) that's illegal. Thus, Shino's collapsing the canyon was fine and dandy, while Rustal needed a false flag to get away with his stunt. chiasaur11 fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Jun 24, 2019 |
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Jun 24, 2019 20:44
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Warmachine posted:Rambling philosopher or not, the problem with Zeon is the Zabis and space fascism. What Deikun was doesn't necessarily factor into it--whether he was SpaceJesus or Alex Jones, it was the Zabis who took his calls for independence and spawned the One Year War. On another note, if it weren't for Char instigating that rebellion that he dragged Garma into, it probably would have taken even longer for the OYW to have happened
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Jun 24, 2019 20:59
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chiasaur11 posted:The math for rods from the gods paints them as able to do similar damage to nukes, something that'd be even more true on the Moon without as much atmosphere to get in the way. You'd need a lot to gently caress up the moon that bad, but if you damaged Ahab reactors in the process, well, that'd make things pretty messy. Recent evolutions in the math and testing of the "rod from God" process actually disprove the nuclear level damage thing apparently. Or at least, kind of disprove it. My understanding of it is that because all the energy is concentrated downwards, so long as the rods can penetrate where they hit then there won't actually be a massive explosion and all their force will go in to that penetration instead; resulting in a deep, but fairly confined and narrow hole in to the ground and/or whatever they hit. It's only if they meet something they can't penetrate that there'll be an explosion, because it'll try to push all that energy in to whatever object it meets and when it's rejected, explode outwards. IBO appears to go with that kind of depiction as well, since the Dainsleifs attacks produce relatively small results that aren't nuclear explosions by any stretch, and don't appear to do damage too far beyond them to the ranks of Graze's watching. That said, even the explosion of a reactor shouldn't produce close to enough damage to take that kind of chunk out of a moon. Planets (or planetoids) are big; nukes are small. Relatively speaking. It's the same kind of thinking where people talk about how we now have enough nuclear power to destroy the planet. We don't. Not even close. We could certainly take ourselves off of the planet or gently caress with the environment, but we're magnitudes of order off from actually destroying the planet with them and there'll never be a big enough nuclear arsenal or destructive enough nukes to actually destroy the planet. Though I'm sure some nations will certainly make good efforts to get us to that point. chiasaur11 posted:And no, the kind Rustal was using weren't underpowered. Those were the genuine article. You're confusing them with another plot point. The deal is that the railgun that can fire Dainsleifs is in a legal grey area. It's only the actual ammo (made of the same absurd supermaterial as a Mobile Suit's inner frame) that's illegal. Thus, Shino's collapsing the canyon was fine and dandy, while Rustal needed a false flag to get away with his stunt. Wouldn't be a massive surprise that I got it mixed up, really. I'm not a huge fan of IBO, and had to look up the name for Space Guts along with the Dainsleif Gundam, so lots of it definitely didn't stick in my head. tsob fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Jun 24, 2019 |
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Jun 24, 2019 22:47
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tsob posted:Recent evolutions in the math and testing of the "rod from God" process actually disprove the nuclear level damage thing apparently. Or at least, kind of disprove it. My understanding of it is that because all the energy is concentrated downwards, so long as the rods can penetrate where they hit then there won't actually be a massive explosion and all their force will go in to that penetration instead; resulting in a deep, but fairly confined and narrow hole in to the ground and/or whatever they hit. It's only if they meet something they can't penetrate that there'll be an explosion, because it'll try to push all that energy in to whatever object it meets and when it's rejected, explode outwards. Ahab reactors aren't nuclear. They gently caress with gravity instead. If they can create the Shoal Zone where meteors are dense enough to be a serious navigation hazard, then ruining the moon isn't a big surprise.
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Jun 24, 2019 23:27
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chiasaur11 posted:Ahab reactors aren't nuclear. They gently caress with gravity instead. If they can create the Shoal Zone where meteors are dense enough to be a serious navigation hazard, then ruining the moon isn't a big surprise. Asteroids and other cosmic debris being close enough to create hazards is pretty common in space opera and science fantasy though. Also, the only thing I could find about shoals in Iron Blooded Orphans looking it up out of curiosity was the debris zone Tekkadan has to navigate in episode 12, which is actually made up of debris from ships and suits used during the Calamity War; not of meteors. Is that what you're referring to? Were there any reactor explosions in IBO out of interest? I don't remember any, but I haven't even seen half the show so even if I was right about season one lacking them, that wouldn't mean they don't exist. Edit: the only suit explosion I could find on a quick skim that's near enough to other objects to give a proper sense of scale is Galan Mossa's Geirail, and that's a pretty tiny explosion that barely scratches the Gusion Rebake, so I'd assume it's self destruct didn't include the reactor and was more meant to take out sensitive data and specific internal parts or something. The Flauros explodes too for instance, but it's in space and the shot is so zoomed out, it's difficult to get any kind of sense of scale; even assuming the reactor does explode then. Edit 2: IBO seems like it does the whole thing of asteroid fields being really close conglomerations of rock too, since Mikazuki and Lafter fight in what appears to be an asteroid field at the end of episode 7 and the rocks are all very close to each other. tsob fucked around with this message at 02:33 on Jun 25, 2019 |
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Jun 25, 2019 01:23
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Wasn't the Moon Moon colony from ZZ located in a shoal zone of destroyed colonies and ships?
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Jun 25, 2019 03:12
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Maarak posted:Wasn't the Moon Moon colony from ZZ located in a shoal zone of destroyed colonies and ships? I thought it was just hanging around in Side 1.
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Jun 25, 2019 03:21
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4 entire Sides of maybe 40 colony cylinders each and a good chunk of a 5th were destroyed according to the narrator, so it wouldn't be shocking if there were several shoal zones in UC really.
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Jun 25, 2019 03:27
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Also the closely-grouped asteroid clusters in UC (and probably IBO) aren't natural. How the Sides were built was by dragging in a shitload of asteroids and breaking them down for materials close by.
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Jun 25, 2019 03:29
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Neddy Seagoon posted:"What about me sir?" bob is the only one who gets credit in the end since an ironclad federation rule is that no gundam prototypes may be deployed near ensign amuro when questioned about this the brass just mumbled something about retcons e: the brass was afraid that the powerful Tem Ray Circuit, clearly the secret to amuro's success in combat, would make all their robots look bad Yinlock fucked around with this message at 04:17 on Jun 25, 2019 |
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Jun 25, 2019 04:13
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Give Bob a GM-Sniper, watch him be the team ace.
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Jun 25, 2019 05:13
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MonsieurChoc posted:Give Bob a GM-Sniper, watch him be the team ace. GMs being deployed near amuro don't tend to fare well either, but they also seem to suddenly appear when char needs to look cool near him rip that one gm that materialized out of nowhere at jaburo just for char to impale
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Jun 25, 2019 06:23
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tsob posted:IBO appears to go with that kind of depiction as well, since the Dainsleifs attacks produce relatively small results that aren't nuclear explosions by any stretch, and don't appear to do damage too far beyond them to the ranks of Graze's watching. That said, even the explosion of a reactor shouldn't produce close to enough damage to take that kind of chunk out of a moon. Planets (or planetoids) are big; nukes are small. Relatively speaking. It's the same kind of thinking where people talk about how we now have enough nuclear power to destroy the planet. We don't. Not even close. We could certainly take ourselves off of the planet or gently caress with the environment, but we're magnitudes of order off from actually destroying the planet with them and there'll never be a big enough nuclear arsenal or destructive enough nukes to actually destroy the planet. Though I'm sure some nations will certainly make good efforts to get us to that point. IBO definitely shows that the Dainsleifs have some kind of explosive area of effect when fired from orbit to ground. In the big climactic scene where Akihiro and Mika get bombarded, the Grazes fighting them are told to fall back to a ridiculous distance, like so far away that Akihiro and Mika are momentarily confused by how far they've fallen back, which leads to them standing still long enough to get hit:  The impact is shown to be incredibly dramatic, which doesn't line up with the "most of the force is pushed downward" science:  The orbital snipers are also shown to be insanely accurate despite what should theoretically be a delay in travel time for their shots from such a distance, because Mika and Akihiro only pause for a few seconds and Mika realizes what's happening at the last second, yet the Dainsleifs still score at least two direct hits(we only see a single Dainsleif stuck in each of them but both of their suits are horribly mangled, suggesting either more than one direct hit each or the fallout from the explosions hosed them up brutally).
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Jun 25, 2019 06:38
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Kanos posted:IBO definitely shows that the Dainsleifs have some kind of explosive area of effect when fired from orbit to ground. In the big climactic scene where Akihiro and Mika get bombarded, the Grazes fighting them are told to fall back to a ridiculous distance, like so far away that Akihiro and Mika are momentarily confused by how far they've fallen back, which leads to them standing still long enough to get hit: Also the Hashmal's agility is for close-combat strikes. At full traveling speed it's not actually that fast, and if you shoot it from a distance with a barrage, your odds of nailing it are pretty decent compared to two Gundams. It also would also need to be aware that it's about to get hosed from above by high-speed objects. And, again, we only ever see one weapon model. Cannons scale upwards. Even then, you could distract it pretty easily with a Gundam or conventional Mobile Suits seeing as the original pilots were also canonically disposable child soldiers.
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Jun 25, 2019 06:52
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HitTheTargets posted:It’s called UC Next 100 but it goes from the years 0097 to 0104. The new opening for the TV cut of Origin has a big fat "GUNDAM 40TH" in it, even https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4wy9lr0Fjw
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Jun 25, 2019 07:41
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Yinlock posted:GMs being deployed near amuro don't tend to fare well either, but they also seem to suddenly appear when char needs to look cool near him GMs are scary as gently caress in The Origin. And GM-Snipers own.
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Jun 25, 2019 07:47
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MonsieurChoc posted:GMs are scary as gently caress in The Origin. Which makes it even scarier that Char in his Zaku II was able to take on a sizable group of GM's and win with minimal effort*, and even after that still gives Amuro a good fight afterwards^ *this basically being The Origin's excuse for why the White Base didn't get any GM's after Jaburo, the ones Char wiped out were the units intended for White Base and I guess they couldn't spare any others at the time ^which incidentally fixes a long standing complaint that many fans have about the original anime, that Char's Zaku never got a proper final fight
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Jun 25, 2019 10:51
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drrockso20 posted:Which makes it even scarier that Char in his Zaku II was able to take on a sizable group of GM's and win with minimal effort*, and even after that still gives Amuro a good fight afterwards^ did it need one though iirc all char really does in his zaku II is beat the piss out of Amuro a bunch and get whoever's on his squad killed intercepting some GMs is a good excuse as to why white base never got any and poor Hayato had to keep slumming it in a guntank though
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Jun 25, 2019 11:41
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Kanos posted:IBO definitely shows that the Dainsleifs have some kind of explosive area of effect when fired from orbit to ground. In the big climactic scene where Akihiro and Mika get bombarded, the Grazes fighting them are told to fall back to a ridiculous distance, like so far away that Akihiro and Mika are momentarily confused by how far they've fallen back, which leads to them standing still long enough to get hit: I honestly don't understand how you can cap both those screens and then say the Grazes fall back to a ridiculous distance when they appear to be a few hundred meters away at most. I don't get why you think that's a huge blast either. It's big, but it's not even close to "nuclear explosion" big. And yes, I realize there's a wider shot with a bigger explosion in the animation, but it's still nowhere near as big or as violent as a nuclear explosion would be. Even discounting that both units were intact enough to operate for a short while afterwards, and both pilots alive enough to do so. Military testing using nuclear explosions on military equipment with fairly average nuclear yields (23kt) destroyed everything within 300 odd meters of the blast, and heavily damaged stuff up to 1 kilometer out. Civilian structures 20 kilometers or more out would be feeling the effects through windows breaking and other, fairly superficial damage too. Stuff surviving at the focal point and things a few hundred meters out being totally fine beyond some superficial damage is nothing on that scale. Yinlock posted:iirc all char really does in his zaku II is beat the piss out of Amuro a bunch and get whoever's on his squad killed Even that was mostly confined to their first two encounters, and successive ones tended to be a little more even, with Amuro deliberately blocking or dodging a lot more of Char's attacks. I'd imagine it's less that Char's Zaku II needed a big farewall in and of itself, so much as that all the rest of his suits got destroyed in battle with Amuro (Z'Gok, Gelgoog and Zeong at the least), so the Zaku II just disappearing after several fights stands out more. tsob fucked around with this message at 13:46 on Jun 25, 2019 |
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Jun 25, 2019 13:15
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tsob posted:I honestly don't understand how you can cap both those screens and then say the Grazes fall back to a ridiculous distance when they appear to be a few hundred meters away at most. I don't get why you think that's a huge blast either. It's big, but it's not even close to "nuclear explosion" big. And yes, I realize there's a wider shot with a bigger explosion in the animation, but it's still nowhere near as big or as violent as a nuclear explosion would be. Even discounting that both units were intact enough to operate for a short while afterwards, and both pilots alive enough to do so. Kanos never said they were "nuclear explosion" big? Just that they are shown having a big explosion so you saying that the way they work where "most of the force is pushed downwards" and produces a small hole and not a big explosion clearly doesn't apply. "Nuclear explosions are huge, this thing has a pretty big explosion, but to compare it to a nuclear blast is a bit much" is all you had to say. It's fine.
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Jun 25, 2019 15:23
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EthanSteele posted:Kanos never said they were "nuclear explosion" big? The discussion involved someone saying that mathametical models for the" rod from God" concept painted them as causing nuclear explosions though. That was what caused the discussion off outward v downward force in the first place. And that's clearly not a nuclear explosion, and instead the damage appears pretty contained. Which makes it look more comparable to that modern interpretation of the "rod from God" concept than the older explosive one to me. tsob fucked around with this message at 15:42 on Jun 25, 2019 |
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Jun 25, 2019 15:39
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You do you, dude.
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Jun 25, 2019 15:56
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The original discussion that prompted my post was about if Dainsleifs would be effective at shooting at mobile suit and mobile armor targets, which you(tsob) suggested they would be impractical for due to being inaccurate against small targets and also not having enough of an area of effect to afford to miss. The point of my post was that, science aside, the show disproves both of those assertions pretty handily. They don't need to have nuclear explosion impacts to be effective anti-MS/MA weaponry.
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Jun 25, 2019 18:26
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| # ? May 26, 2024 15:59 |
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Oh man Luna Sea is doing all the openings for the tv cut and tbh I am all about it because I loved Luna Sea in high school. Their cover of Beyond the Time sounds a bit iffy tho.
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Jun 26, 2019 03:03
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