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Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

Liquid Communism posted:

Or given Harriezzer's obsessed with PopSci, just huck him off-planet and forget he ever existed. It's a big universe, after all.
Built-in wizardportation means that one is probably not as much of a permanent solution as it looks.

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Sit on my Jace
Sep 9, 2016

DACK FAYDEN posted:

and his sex life heyoooo

A subject I dearly wish I knew less about.

Tiggum
Oct 24, 2007

Your life and your quest end here.


Chapter 117: Something to Protect: Minerva McGonagall

It's the next day. McGonagall announces to the school that Dumbledore is gone, Voldemort is dead, Quirrell's dead, Hermione's alive, and - in front of the whole school - that the parents of several current students were death eaters and are now dead. You'd think she might want to break that news individually, but I guess not. And Harry feels bad about that.

Eliezer Yudkowsky posted:

And because Harry had read his father's science fiction and fantasy collection, because he had already read this scene a dozen times over when it happened to other protagonists, there was an image in Harry's mind of Mad-Eye Moody, of the scarred man called Alastor. And Mad-Eye's image was saying, in just the same voice he'd used to speak to Albus Dumbledore in memory, that the Death Eaters had been pointing their wands at Harry, that they had already chosen to take the Dark Mark, that they had been guilty of sins beyond reckoning and maybe beyond Harry's imagination, that they had foregone the deontological protection of good people and made themselves targetable if there was a strong reason to sacrifice them. That it had been necessary to save Harry's innocent parents from torture and Azkaban, that it had been necessary to protect the world from Voldemort. That plain old ordinary Aurors and judges had to do much more morally questionable things than killing sworn and blooded Death Eaters who were pointing wands at them, in the course of carrying out ordinary justices that were less clear-cut but still necessary to society. If it were not right to do what Harry had done, if it were not right to do much more morally ambiguous things than what Harry had done, then society as human beings knew it could not exist. Nobody with common sense would blame Harry for doing it, Neville wouldn't blame him, Professor McGonagall wouldn't blame him, Dumbledore wouldn't blame him, even Hermione would tell him it had been the right thing to do once she knew.

And all of this was true.

Just as it was also true that some part of Harry's mind had calculated that wiping out the blood purist political elite would make it easier and more convenient to rebuild magical Britain afterward. It hadn't been an important consideration, but it had still been calculated in those instants of rapid thought, a check on the long-term consequences to see if they rated as catastrophic, and a decision that they actually rated as pretty much okay. And that check had forgotten that Death Eaters had children at Hogwarts or that one of them wore the face of Draco's father. It wouldn't have changed anything. It wouldn't have changed anything at all. But that was the truth of the calculation Harry's mind had performed, given only seconds to think.

At least Harry could, if the Death Eaters' survivors were in any sort of financial trouble, do something about that easily enough. Transfigure gold, and use the Stone to make it permanent - unless making that much gold would be troublesome to the wizard economy at large, or cause objections from goblins who didn't understand market monetarist economics - though it wasn't as though Harry didn't also have useful services to sell -
And then McGonagall accepts the position of "Acting Headmistress" - because Dumbledore's not technically dead and apparently he automatically gets his job back if he ever returns, regardless of how long he's been away?

Five chapters to go. How are there still five chapters to go?

Skanker
Mar 21, 2013
Oh, I thought this was the last chapter for some reason. This has been an incredibly long ride and I think I understand Yud even less now.

DACK FAYDEN
Feb 25, 2013

Bear Witness

Anil Dasharez0ne posted:

A subject I dearly wish I knew less about.


I was fully prepared for this spoiler to not be nearly as funny as it was, oh my god that's literally perfect

Xander77
Apr 6, 2009

Fuck it then. For another pit sandwich and some 'tater salad, I'll post a few more.



DACK FAYDEN posted:

I was fully prepared for this spoiler to not be nearly as funny as it was, oh my god that's literally perfect
Do I want to know?

divabot
Jun 17, 2015

A polite little mouse!

Xander77 posted:

Do I want to know?

Their toxic shithole of a subculture had a massive loving #metoo moment last year. Here's a twitter thread on the abusiveness to be found in the LessWrong/Effective Altruism/MIRI cult. Women = "math pets". They've tried cleaning house a bit, but mostly act like it's the victims' faults for being crazy bitches u kno

edit: here's the /r/sneerclub thread. Content warning: discussion of rationalist abusers.

divabot fucked around with this message at 17:40 on Jun 20, 2019

Sit on my Jace
Sep 9, 2016

Yeah, the broader context of "the Rationalist Community™ is a predatory sex cult" isn't actually funny, but "Eliezer Yudkowsky gets off on making women do math problems" is.

Tunicate
May 15, 2012

Anil Dasharez0ne posted:

"the Rationalist Community™ is a predatory sex cult" .

I disagree that is actually pretty funny

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
Everything's funny if you're not the victim, I guess.

Stroth
Mar 31, 2007

All Problems Solved

Tunicate posted:

I disagree that is actually pretty funny

I mean, the whole thing was kicked off in support of a woman who killed herself with the express intent of using her suicide as a weapon against sexual abusers in the rationalist community.

Maybe a little respect.

YaketySass
Jan 15, 2019

Blind Idiot Dog
I always cringe a little when people assume Yudkowsky and co must be bitter weirdo virgins because it turns out they're a very different and more toxic kind of pest.

DACK FAYDEN
Feb 25, 2013

Bear Witness

Stroth posted:

I mean, the whole thing was kicked off in support of a woman who killed herself with the express intent of using her suicide as a weapon against sexual abusers in the rationalist community.

Maybe a little respect.
Man, every loving time I read this I start off feeling really bad about the community (which will not make me not laugh at a well timed math pets joke because I am a horrible person) and then like, halfway through it morphs into feeling really bad she didn't get help, because she actively killed herself because, basically, she wasn't willing to get therapy and reject the cesspool. And sure, she dressed that up in fancy words like "nepethe" that I had to google, but the narrative is literally that therapy didn't work for her so she stopped trying and got burned out and was not willing to be a SJW. And that's a verbatim quote on that last one, she literally said "social justice warrior" and how hosed up is it that she thought fighting against Big Yud and co was a loving politicized issue?

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
Almost as sad as the fact that there are people in the world who would say "I would literally rather be abused and kill myself than not be a chud" and mean it.

DACK FAYDEN
Feb 25, 2013

Bear Witness

Cardiovorax posted:

Almost as sad as the fact that there are people in the world who would say "I would literally rather be abused and kill myself than not be a chud" and mean it.
Exactly. I just... like, what she did was, from her perspective, rational, and that is all it takes for me to reject the rationalist movement without reading a word from every one of those idiots that I've read far too many words from.

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
The most disturbing thing about this is that it tacitly acknowledges that "SJWs" would stand against that kind of treatment and then still rejects it as a matter of partisan principle. It's literally the opposite of rational.

Darth Walrus
Feb 13, 2012
At least Yudkowsky was helpful enough to warn us all that this was coming with his OKCupid profile.

Reminds me of an effortpost I did earlier in the thread about another Harry Potter cult that turned lethal.

Darth Walrus fucked around with this message at 17:02 on Jun 30, 2019

Fajita Queen
Jun 21, 2012

"Though I'm also cool with trophy collection, if you only want to sleep with me once so you can tell your grandchildren."

:allbuttons:

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
You almost have to admire that kind of ego. I don't think I've ever met another person so utterly convinced of his own importance without literally anything at all to their name.

Tiggum
Oct 24, 2007

Your life and your quest end here.


Chapter 118: Something to Protect: Professor Quirrell

It's Quirrell's funeral and people wanted Harry, an eleven-year-old child, to give the eulogy but he declined. So instead they have a teenager do it.

Eliezer Yudkwosky posted:

"Professor Quirrell was very sick," the tall boy said, his wavering voice falling into a hush of students, occasionally broken by a muffled sob. "I think if Professor Quirrell had been able to fight in the fullness of his power, You-Know-Who couldn't have beat him easily, and maybe not at all. They say that David Monroe was the only one that You-Know-Who was ever afraid of, in his day. But," Oliver's voice broke, "Professor Quirrell wasn't in the fullness of his power. He was very sick. He had trouble walking by himself. And he went to face the Dark Lord, alone."

There was a pause, then, while the students cried for a while.

Oliver wiped away his tears with his sleeve, and spoke again. "We don't know exactly what happened," said Oliver. "I imagine the Dark Lord laughed at him. Maybe made fun of the Professor, for challenging him when he couldn't stand up. Well, he's not laughing now, is he."

There were fierce nods from the students; all of them that Harry could see, from Gryffindor to Slytherin.
It goes on, and it's all just as bad. I was going to quote more of it - maybe all of it - but I decided to spare you. I'll just skip to near the end.

Eliezer Yudkwosky posted:

"Professor Quirrell told us at the beginning of this year that what he taught us would always be our firm foundation in the arts of Defense. And it will be. Forever. We'll teach it to the new students next year, no matter who we have for a professor. The older students will teach the younger ones. That's the solution to the curse on the Defense position. We won't sit around waiting for authority to teach us. And we'll make sure that Professor Quirrell's teachings never die out of Hogwarts."

Harry looked at where Professor - no, Headmistress McGonagall - was sitting, and saw the Headmistress nodding silently, a look that was sad and stern and proud.
Why is the story not over yet? What is left to say at this point?

Jazerus
May 24, 2011


Tiggum posted:

Why is the story not over yet? What is left to say at this point?

yud professor quirrell is the dreamiest, most intellectual-awe-inspiring man to ever live

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
Notice me, Wizard Hitler-senpai!

DACK FAYDEN
Feb 25, 2013

Bear Witness
I have to admit, the idea that the Defense Against The Dark Arts Professor position is cursed so you learn from them and then the students teach themselves is kind of clever. That could be good in the right authorial hands.

Doctor Spaceman
Jul 6, 2010

"Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

DACK FAYDEN posted:

I have to admit, the idea that the Defense Against The Dark Arts Professor position is cursed so you learn from them and then the students teach themselves is kind of clever. That could be good in the right authorial hands.

It's what happens in the 5th book with Dumbledore's Army.

Unless :thejoke:

DACK FAYDEN
Feb 25, 2013

Bear Witness

Doctor Spaceman posted:

It's what happens in the 5th book with Dumbledore's Army.

Unless :thejoke:
half the joke, half that JKR also isn't really the right hands

(but mostly :thejoke: because Yud never read the books)

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
It would be pretty funny if half the poo poo that happens in the later novels is because everyone was teaching themselves defense and therefore their own accursed DADA teacher by default.

YaketySass
Jan 15, 2019

Blind Idiot Dog

Cardiovorax posted:

It would be pretty funny if half the poo poo that happens in the later novels is because everyone was teaching themselves defense and therefore their own accursed DADA teacher by default.

That'd be the kind of dick move that would make the curse effective, but Quirrelmort is a rather extreme example of "actually the best teachers must be abusive sociopaths who secretly know what's best". Say what you will about Snape, at least the text acknowledged that he's a godawful teacher because he's such an rear end in a top hat.

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
Well, it's pretty obvious that Quirrelmort reflects the type of super-intellectual sociopathic Nietzschean Übermensch Yud wants to think of himself as being, rather than the petty conman and cult leader he really is.

When any given individual of the scientific demigod types that he so earnestly worships from a distance would curl their lips at him in contempt the moment they find out what kind of person he really is, I suppose "I am so awesome and unemotional that I do not care about the feelings of anyone else" sounds like the kind of superpower he'd really want for himself. It's understandable, in a pathetic kind of way.

Cardiovorax fucked around with this message at 16:46 on Jul 3, 2019

divabot
Jun 17, 2015

A polite little mouse!

Cardiovorax posted:

Well, it's pretty obvious that Quirrelmort reflects the type of super-intellectual sociopathic Nietzschean Übermensch Yud wants to think of himself as being, rather than the petty conman and cult leader he really is.

I mean, most rambling Mary Sue epics only have one author insert character who always wins, not two.

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
Which I assume is where the reveal that they're actually the person somehow comes from, lol.

YaketySass
Jan 15, 2019

Blind Idiot Dog

divabot posted:

I mean, most rambling Mary Sue epics only have one author insert character who always wins, not two.

Something can't give Frodo a lightsaber without giving Sauron the Death Star something

divabot
Jun 17, 2015

A polite little mouse!

YaketySass posted:

Something can't give Frodo a lightsaber without giving Sauron the Death Star something

you can't give Mary Sue a sparklypoo sabre without giving another Mary Sue a magical death star

Grace Baiting
Jul 20, 2012

Audi famam illius;
Cucurrit quaeque
Tetigit destruens.



    ““You can't imbue one character with a Biglight Yudsaber without also imbuing their antagonist with the Bigdeath Yudstar””

〰️ Albert Einstein

Tiggum
Oct 24, 2007

Your life and your quest end here.


Chapter 119: Something to Protect: Albus Dumbledore

Eliezer Yudkowsky posted:

"How - how's Hermione doing?" Harry hadn't had a chance to ask until now.

"Filius said she seemed rather in shock, which I suppose is not surprising. She asked where you were, was told you were at a Quidditch game, asked where you really were, and refused to speak with anyone about what happened until she was allowed to talk with you. She was taken to St. Mungo's, where," the Headmistress now sounded slightly perturbed, "a standard diagnostic Charm showed Miss Granger as a healthy unicorn in excellent physical condition except that her mane needs combing. Charms to detect active magic have each time detected her as being in the process of transforming into another shape. There was an Unspeakable who showed up before Filius, ah, removed him. He performed certain spells he probably ought not to have known, and declared that Hermione's soul was in healthy condition but at least a mile away from her body. At that point the senior healers gave up.
Mad-Eye Moody and Amelia Bones meet with Harry and McGonagall and he tells them that it was actually him who beat Voldemort and what he actually did. McGonagall also has two letters that Dumbledore left for Harry - one to be given in the event of Dumbledore's death and the other in the event of Harry defeating Voldemort. Since both happened in the same day he gets both.

The first one is all about how he's got to defeat Voldemort and the less important characters are going to be his sidekicks (even though they're adults and he's a child). The other letter is about how Dumbledore secretly listened to all the prophecies in the Ministry of Magic and hey said that Harry is going to destroy the world.

Eliezer Yudkowsky posted:

And so, it being clear that this world is not meant to last, I have gambled literally everything upon you, Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres. There were no prophecies of how the world might be saved, so I found the prophecies that offered loopholes in the destruction; and I brought about the strange and complex conditions for those prophecies to come to pass. I ensured that Voldemort discovered a certain one of those prophecies, and so (even as I had feared) condemned your parents to death and made you what you are. I wrote a strange hint in your mother's Potions textbook, having no idea why I must; and this proved to show Lily how to help her sister, and ensured you would gain Petunia Evans's heartfelt love. I snuck invisibly into your bedroom in Oxford and administered the potion that is given to students with Time-Turners, to extend your day's cycle by two hours. When you were six years old I smashed a rock that was on your windowsill, and to this day I cannot imagine why.

All in the desperate hope that you can pass us through the eye of the storm, somehow end this world and yet bring out its people alive.

Now that you have passed the preliminary test of defeating Voldemort, I place my all in your hands, all the tools I can possibly give you. The Line of Merlin Unbroken, the command of the Order of the Phoenix, all my wealth and all my treasures, the Elder Wand out of the Deathly Hallows, the loyalty of such of my friends as may heed me. I have left Hogwarts in Minerva's care, for I do not think you will have time for it, but even that is yours if you demand it from her.

One thing I do not give you, and that is the prophecies. Upon the moment of my departure, they will be destroyed, and no future ones will be recorded, for it was said that you must not look upon them. If you think this frustrating, believe me when I say that even your wit cannot comprehend what frustration you have been spared. I will die, or be lost by you, or in some other way be taken from you - the prophecies are unclear, naturally - without ever once knowing what the future truly holds, or why I must do what I do. It is all cryptic madness and you are well rid of it.
The Line of Merlin is... something. I don't know. Maybe I'm not paying as much attention as I could be. I don't even know if Yudkowsky made it up or if it's from the original books. But apparently one of its functions is that it makes Harry Chief Warlock of the Wizengamot. McGonagall and Bones, idiots that they are, think it might not be a great idea to give all that power and authority to a child, but wise, intelligent Moody blindly trusts that Dumbledore was right to do it (even though Dumbledore was clearly wrong about many things). They compromise and Harry makes Bones his regent.

And remember how Sirius Black and Peter Pettigrew are swapped around in this story, so Sirius is the bad guy and Peter's the good guy? Well Peter is also not merely an animagus but a full-on shapeshifter, and Sirius forced him to transform into a duplicate of Sirius and go to Azkaban in his place. But Sirius was one of the Death Eaters that Harry killed, so now they realise that the one in Azkaban is actually Peter and they're going to let him out. I don't know what the point of that revelation is.

Harry then declares that they're going to shut down Azkaban and Hermione is going to kill all the Dementors. And he's opening a hospital where the Philosopher's Stone will be used to heal everyone any wizard who's dying of anything. The unbreakable vow he made stops him from being able to reveal magic to muggles since it's so dangerous. And we've still got three chapters left.

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

quote:

He performed certain spells he probably ought not to have known, and declared that Hermione's soul was in healthy condition but at least a mile away from her body. At that point the senior healers gave up.
Congratulations, Hermione, you're a lich.

quote:

The Line of Merlin is... something. I don't know. Maybe I'm not paying as much attention as I could be. I don't even know if Yudkowsky made it up or if it's from the original books.
He made it up and I'm not sure it's ever actually explained. Somewhat surprisingly, Merlin is actually not really very important in the Harry Potter books and setting. People know his name, but compared to more modern mythological figures like the Peverell brothers, he just really doesn't come up much and hasn't really done anything that still matters by the time they take place.

Which is, of course, why he would be important in a fanfic written by a person who has never read them.

Pvt.Scott
Feb 16, 2007

What God wants, God gets, God help us all
Unbreakable vow, you say? A precocious child should have a loophole to that one figured out in a day or two, tops.

Epicurius
Apr 10, 2010
College Slice

Cardiovorax posted:

. People know his name, but compared to more modern mythological figures like the Peverell brothers, he just really doesn't come up much and hasn't really done anything that still matters by the time they take place.

The big stuff about Merlin in the Harry Potter universe is that he was probably the most famous (vs infamous) Slytherin, he was one of the greatest enchanters,if not wizards, of all time, he was a staunch supporter of muggle rights and there's a order of merit named after him. Hes also got a portrait in Hogwarts.

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
Yeah, that's pretty much all of it, thanks for summing it up. That's what I meant with "he doesn't come up much." He has done things, but it's not plot relevant. He's important the way Charlemagne is important: you know who he was, you know vaguely what he did, but aside from the occasional mention within a historical context, he's just not relevant to your daily life. The books treat Merlin pretty much just like that.

Tiggum
Oct 24, 2007

Your life and your quest end here.


Chapter 120: Something to Protect: Draco Malfoy

Harry tells Draco that he killed Lucius, and then McGonagall wipes his memory. I don't know what the point of that was. Then this:

Eliezer Yusdkowsky posted:

"Here's the last thing," Harry Potter said. "I found it in a folded parchment whose outside said that it was the last weapon to be used against House Malfoy, telling me not to read any further until the whole war hung in the balance. I didn't want to tell it to you before because I thought it might prejudice your decision unfairly. If you were a good person who never killed or lied, but you had to do one or the other, which would be worse?"
Then we cut to a woman in Sydney who's obviously had her memories erased at some point. She thinks she suffered amnesia after a car crash. Until McGonagall shows up with Draco and restores her memories because she's Draco's mum¹ and Dumbledore didn't murder her after all, just wiped her memories and left her in Australia for some reason. I guess that's what happened anyway. It's written in this very vague way where you're obviously supposed to put it together yourself because you actually remember what happened in this story - which I don't - so I had to reread this whole chapter a couple of times to figure it out.

¹The amnesiac is Draco's mum. McGonagall is not Draco's mum.

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Grace Baiting
Jul 20, 2012

Audi famam illius;
Cucurrit quaeque
Tetigit destruens.



Tiggum posted:

Chapter 120: Something to Protect: Draco Malfoy

Harry tells Draco that he killed Lucius, and then McGonagall wipes his memory. I don't know what the point of that was.

You know how some apologies/confessions are much more for assuaging the conscience of the wrongdoer, not for showing genuine contrition nor setting up an authentic attempt at repairing any damage? Such performative apologies are also typically for forcing the onus of forgiveness onto the aggrieved or injured party.

Well this confession appears to be most of that, although with no expectation of forgiveness (memory wipes mean never having to face the music*!!), so it's just Harriezer executing this absolution-granting ritual of confession with zero consequences that make it mean anything. But I bet Harriezer feels better for having done it -- and that's what matters, since he is the godhead protagonist / authorial player character.

*It's not like the Harry Potter universe would include a villain who would memory wipe all sorts of people in order to steal credit for their accomplishments and to escape accountability for his own actions! Surely the Methods of Rationality Apocrypha, viz. the actually-published Harry Potter books, would never include such a Gilderoy Lockhart type of character.

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