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Uncle Boogeyman posted:not gonna lie you lost me there What we get about their relationship is that Christian's primary thrust in life is to take passive control, and that Dani needs a therapist to properly deal with her PTSD and anxiety. The proper response to a situation like that is to break up, not to literally burn him alive, but the narrative goal of the film is to get her to that point, and there's a lot of odd justifying going on to get there without enough substance. I feel that more detail was needed to properly explore these "grey area" people, as I think, Aster referred to them, because without that detail they're not complex, they're just ciphers, and it puts the audience in the position of doing a lot of guesswork about these people and their motivations. I found it hard to really engage with her decision at the end, because I a: didn't feel one way or another about it and b: it was hard for me to tell what she was making her decision based on. There's this great, almost devil's advocate moral quandry in the beginning regarding responsibility on both sides that's functionally dissolved by the end, and that's frustrating.
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Jul 10, 2019 17:24
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Magic Hate Ball posted:What we get about their relationship is that Christian's primary thrust in life is to take passive control, and that Dani needs a therapist to properly deal with her PTSD and anxiety. The proper response to a situation like that is to break up, not to literally burn him alive, but the narrative goal of the film is to get her to that point, and there's a lot of odd justifying going on to get there without enough substance. I feel that more detail was needed to properly explore these "grey area" people, as I think, Aster referred to them, because without that detail they're not complex, they're just ciphers, and it puts the audience in the position of doing a lot of guesswork about these people and their motivations. I found it hard to really engage with her decision at the end, because I a: didn't feel one way or another about it and b: it was hard for me to tell what she was making her decision based on. There's this great, almost devil's advocate moral quandry in the beginning regarding responsibility on both sides that's functionally dissolved by the end, and that's frustrating. See I mostly agree with all this but everything from the Carrie comparison on in your previous post is what lost me
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Jul 10, 2019 17:31
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:See I mostly agree with all this but everything from the Carrie comparison on in your previous post is what lost me Carrie is very clear about how we should feel about Carrie, while this film is much more ambiguous (almost to a fault), and it kind of reminds me of the Aziz Ansari thing where the big question became the degree to which he deserved to be publicly shamed for being pushy, entitled, and horny. He's a stonewalling dickbag, but she's deeply codependent (your partner is not your therapist!) - the horror should arise from the painful irony that she's found a "place" that a: requires her to literally murder her way out of her past and b: she functionally takes advantage of, but because so much of the film is vague and ambiguous, it feels more like a clumsy thought experiment than a satisfyingly twisted moral conclusion (again, see also Oleanna, which is more successfully provocative but is also Mamet bending himself into a pretzel to make Anita Hill and Clarence Thomas equally villainous and sypathetic).
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Jul 10, 2019 17:59
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beanieson posted:Are we meant to think this ceremony happens once every 90 years? Because Pelle says his parents died in a fire and I’m think now that maybe this was just the 90th anniversary of when they first started these annual sacrifices 🤷🏻♂️ It's sort of a  cop out, but there is not enough there to make sense of it. 
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Jul 10, 2019 18:07
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my assumption is there's some kind of sacrifice within the community more often than the grand 9 day festival with 9 sacrifices that requires outsiders.
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Jul 10, 2019 18:14
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Groovelord Neato posted:my assumption is there's some kind of sacrifice within the community more often than the grand 9 day festival with 9 sacrifices that requires outsiders. That makes sense. A 90 year gap is more than enough for something like this to be seen as gruesome by a younger generation. All these people were just fine with flaying/burning people and watching gramps & grandma fall to their death. No way they’d all be fine with that if it had never happened before during their lives.
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Jul 10, 2019 18:21
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Danger posted:Catching up on this thread, the debate about Christian is a bit unsettling. The dude was essentially raped. Yeah holy poo poo no kidding. Nothing in those scenes was remotely consensual. There’s a big difference between being interested in someone and everything that plays out in the movie.
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Jul 10, 2019 18:44
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Yea someone earlier in the thread was making the argument that since he willingly took the drink, he obviously consented to sex and I was like 
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Jul 10, 2019 18:50
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You can tell it wasnt consensual because as soon as he got out of the trance he lost that chub like a deflated balloon Like, yeah, he blew his load, but even post load you are still gonna still be pulling at least a mushy sausage for a few minutes Nope, he just went right into floppy
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Jul 10, 2019 19:00
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Quite the analysis there bud
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Jul 10, 2019 19:01
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RCarr posted:Quite the analysis there bud where's the lie
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Jul 10, 2019 19:07
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actually had the same thought lol.
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Jul 10, 2019 19:20
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Well it’s been fun thread but I’m outta here
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Jul 10, 2019 19:25
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Well it’s been fun thread but I’m outta here Yeah, jeepers
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Jul 10, 2019 19:25
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how american...smashing in an old man's noggin is all fun and games but i gotta jet when someone mentions a post-cum dick.
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Jul 10, 2019 19:28
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Groovelord Neato posted:how american...smashing in an old man's noggin is all fun and games but i gotta jet when someone mentions a post-cum dick. yeah lol I will never not adore the power of an exposed penis in cinema to make people deeply uncomfortable y'all getting uncomfortable about some weiner chat
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Jul 10, 2019 19:41
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I don't think the movie portrays Christian as cheating, he's clearly out of his gourd and didn't consent to any of it. It's all the stuff he does the rest of the time that the movie condemns him for. I actually think it muddles the ending a bit-- seeing him "cheating" (heavy heavy quotation marks on this) is the turning point for Dani, but it definitely shouldn't have been.
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Jul 10, 2019 19:41
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Unironically one of my favorite part of the movie was how long they just had his penis fully exposed in broad daylight versus how limited or desexualized the female nudity was Penis is like the last great frontier of making people uncomfortable and more penises need to be in movies
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Jul 10, 2019 19:44
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Erm, I don't think it's the weiner chat in as much as the declaration that because his penis wasn't hard enough for you post-load that we can divine great truths about him not being a poo poo-bag.
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Jul 10, 2019 19:45
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Groovelord Neato posted:how american...smashing in an old man's noggin is all fun and games but i gotta jet when someone mentions a post-cum dick. Mel Mudkiper posted:yeah lol More like I’m increasingly afraid to find out how y’all feel about age of consent laws
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Jul 10, 2019 19:45
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that is a...helluva leap.
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Jul 10, 2019 19:46
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:More like I’m increasingly afraid to find out how y’all feel about age of consent laws A. not sure how can infer we have opinions on age of consent laws based on dick floppiness B. Go gently caress yourself for implying we are pedophiles
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Jul 10, 2019 19:46
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qwewq posted:Erm, I don't think it's the weiner chat in as much as the declaration that because his penis wasn't hard enough for you post-load that we can divine great truths about him not being a poo poo-bag. Look, that was terror dick Like, people don't realize that the David of Michaelangelo has a tiny dick because its depicting the moment he first beheld Goliath and his tiny little weiner is meant to suggest the great fear he felt at that moment Christian was absolutely rocking a rod that was too floppy post-coital to not be confused and terrified
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Jul 10, 2019 19:48
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:More like I’m increasingly afraid to find out how y’all feel about age of consent laws what
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Jul 10, 2019 19:48
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Call me a prude if you must but I don’t think being on mushrooms at the time excuses a grad student loving a 16 year old
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Jul 10, 2019 19:49
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Groovelord Neato posted:that is a...helluva leap. me watching the attestupa.
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Jul 10, 2019 19:49
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Call me a prude if you must but I don’t think being on mushrooms at the time excuses a grad student loving a 16 year old So you are saying if someone drugs you for sex and they remain sober that its still consensual? thats hosed up
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Jul 10, 2019 19:50
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*man is literally raped by a 16 year old girl* "wow I cannot believe that guy is a pedophile"
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Jul 10, 2019 19:51
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Call me a prude if you must but I don’t think being on mushrooms at the time excuses a grad student loving a 16 year old i was solely commenting on the post-coital tumescence.
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Jul 10, 2019 19:52
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Call me a prude if you must but I don’t think being on mushrooms at the time excuses a grad student loving a 16 year old Ya I don’t think anyone is saying that. But I’m pretty sure Christian was raped.
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Jul 10, 2019 19:52
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I think it says something about how much the film delves into the loss of male power and masculine inadequacy when a man is literally raped and murdered for the crime of being a bad boyfriend and some of y'all are still trying to make it act like he had the power in the scenario because the idea of male impotence is so alien to you
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Jul 10, 2019 19:54
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qwewq posted:Erm, I don't think it's the weiner chat in as much as the declaration that because his penis wasn't hard enough for you post-load that we can divine great truths about him not being a poo poo-bag. Yea, it’s this. Doing a scientific analysis of how erect a dude’s dick is in order to prove he did nothing wrong is pretty weird. But feel free to double down on calling people weird for being uncomfortable with your thesis.
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Jul 10, 2019 19:55
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Is the thread forgetting that Christian gets kicked by Maja near the beginning of their time at Harga while the conga line is going around? He makes eye contact with her, he's clearly intrigued and then he leaves Dani and gets up to join the line. I watched the movie a second time last night and, knowing his fate, it's impressive how much of a shithead Christian is made out to be throughout the entire movie. I mean the first time we meet him, there is a very deliberate shot of him checking out a waitress' rear end as she walks away from his table at the pizza parlor.
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Jul 10, 2019 19:56
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RCarr posted:Yea, it’s this. Doing a scientific analysis of how erect a dude’s dick is in order to prove he did nothing wrong is pretty weird. But feel free to double down on calling people weird for being uncomfortable with your thesis. Don't get mad at me because you are unwilling to look at the visual clues provided by the filmmaker to suggest the mental state of the characters. Thom and the Heads posted:Is the thread forgetting that Christian gets kicked by Maja near the beginning of their time at Harga while the conga line is going around? He makes eye contact with her, he's clearly intrigued and then he leaves Dani and gets up to join the line. So you are saying a person deserves to be raped by another person if they show any sort of attraction to them? Thats hosed up
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Jul 10, 2019 19:58
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Mel Mudkiper posted:So you are saying a person deserves to be raped by another person if they show any sort of attraction to them? Did I post that?
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Jul 10, 2019 20:00
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Thom and the Heads posted:Did I post that? Why does it matter that he danced with her during a festival when we are talking about how she rapes him? Sounds like you think he was asking for it
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Jul 10, 2019 20:01
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I apologize for joining in on the free for all of taking everything someone else says in the worst possible way, but I do think people are forgetting or choosing to ignore some crucial things in order to fit their narrative
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Jul 10, 2019 20:03
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Mel Mudkiper posted:Why does it matter that he danced with her during a festival when we are talking about how she rapes him? I don't think he was asking for it but I do think the movie does imply that he is at the very least interested in a 16 year old.
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Jul 10, 2019 20:05
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If you’re asking me to take the “but he didn’t have a half chub!” thing seriously my response would be the actor likely didn’t have an erection because the actors likely did not actually have unsimulated sex while filming. Maybe they did and Ari Aster’s on some Catherine Breillat poo poo but I kinda doubt it
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Jul 10, 2019 20:06
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:I apologize for joining in on the free for all of taking everything someone else says in the worst possible way, but I do think people are forgetting or choosing to ignore some crucial things in order to fit their narrative Sure, but I do think people are choosing to discount the fact that Christian was literally raped Like, all jokes aside, that dude was raped
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Jul 10, 2019 20:06
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