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Who do you wish to win the Democratic primaries? This poll is closed. |
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| Joe Biden, the Inappropriate Toucher |
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18 | 1.46% |
| Bernie Sanders, the Hand Flailer |
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665 | 54.11% |
| Elizabeth Warren, the Plan Maker |
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319 | 25.96% |
| Kamala Harris, the Cop Lord |
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26 | 2.12% |
| Cory Booker, the Super Hero Wannabe |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Julian Castro, the Twin |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Kirsten Gillibrand, the Franken Killer |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Pete Buttigieg, the Troop Sociopath |
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17 | 1.38% |
| Robert Francis O'Rourke, the Fake Latino |
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3 | 0.24% |
| Jay Inslee, the Climate Alarmist |
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8 | 0.65% |
| Marianne Williamson, the Crystal Queen |
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86 | 7.00% |
| Tulsi Gabbard, the Muslim Hater |
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23 | 1.87% |
| Andrew Yang, the $1000 Fool |
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32 | 2.60% |
| Eric Swalwell, the Insurance Wife Guy |
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2 | 0.16% |
| Amy Klobuchar, the Comb Enthusiast |
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1 | 0.08% |
| Bill de Blasio, the NYPD Most Hated |
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4 | 0.33% |
| Tim Ryan, the Dope Face |
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3 | 0.24% |
| John Hickenlooper, the Also Ran |
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7 | 0.57% |
| Total: | 1229 votes | ||
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KingNastidon posted:Can this ever not be true until Sanders and every other furthest-left candidate wins their primary and the general? Arguments against leftist positions come from the right. Feel free to drop the mask and go join the people you agree with.
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Jul 26, 2019 20:52
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Unoriginal Name posted:Arguments against leftist positions come from the right. 
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Jul 26, 2019 21:01
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Unoriginal Name posted:Arguments against leftist positions come from the right. Perfect.
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Jul 26, 2019 21:03
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KingNastidon posted:Can this ever not be true until Sanders and every other furthest-left candidate wins their primary and the general? lol yeah, tell me more about how tens of millions of people just so happen to independently reach the conclusion that they should be working against their material interests with no meaningful outside influence involved.
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Jul 26, 2019 21:03
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KingNastidon posted:Don't you feel it's bit presumptuous to believe your personal politics are so objectively superior such that the only reason other people don't arrive at them is because of an establishment/media conspiracy? reasonable people can be forgiven for thinking a thumb might be on the scale when the semi-official media arm of the democratic party establishment has an employee say on air the leftmost candidate makes her skin crawl
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Jul 26, 2019 21:04
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the Warrenists and Bidenists are outing themselves a bit early this time, makes things just a bit too easy
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Jul 26, 2019 21:12
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Ytlaya posted:I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. Someone was just arguing that Clinton had higher support among higher income people. That pleasing rich people is fruitless on election day, because there are way more poor people who can vote.
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Jul 26, 2019 21:14
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Chilichimp posted:That pleasing rich people is fruitless on election day, because there are way more poor people who can vote. Well yes, that's part of why the centrists are so lovely at actually winning elections.
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Jul 26, 2019 21:15
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https://twitter.com/maxwelltani/status/1154842750392700929 Good for you, Lil Nas X. Good for you.
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Jul 26, 2019 21:36
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bowser posted:https://twitter.com/maxwelltani/status/1154842750392700929 Imagine having that kind of nerve after what buttigieg has already been exposed doing.
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Jul 26, 2019 21:58
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Guess Harris v Biden: Round 2 isn't going to be the only fight at the debate. https://twitter.com/AndrewYang/status/1154830980060012545?s=19 The world is waiting with bated breath for these titans' rumble.
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Jul 26, 2019 22:03
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Gyges posted:Guess Harris v Biden: Round 2 isn't going to be the only fight at the debate. why does yang hate bennet
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Jul 26, 2019 22:08
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also yang does understand if you want to gain in the polls, you attack one of the major candidates right? not the other guy nobody has heard of
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Jul 26, 2019 22:09
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joepinetree posted:And Jon Favreau is on the board of United States of Care, a position he shares with several HMO CEOs and also like Bill Frist. the only important criticism is that last bit and maybe the last bullet, I'd be totally fine with P Andrew Torres and Robert Evans making money off those things
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Jul 26, 2019 22:49
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otoh Andrew is an open and vocal Warren supporter so he's on the gulag list
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Jul 26, 2019 22:55
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The only campaign sign out in my neighborhood right now is one for Andrew Yang. It’s been up for months now
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Jul 26, 2019 23:12
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Cerebral Bore posted:lol yeah, tell me more about how tens of millions of people just so happen to independently reach the conclusion that they should be working against their material interests with no meaningful outside influence involved. I don't know man. It seems that lack of action towards radical socialist/communist movements isn't just limited to the US and that blaming the US democratic establishment or US left-of-center media for everything is a bit misguided. Even if you do 100% believe the brainwashing it's useful to consider that when putting on your pundit cap and debating the likelihood of Sanders exceeding his existing preference share and winning the primary.
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Jul 26, 2019 23:13
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So you can't argue against leftist policy, you can only argue "why haven't you won already", a terrible argument that can be used to defend any status quo no matter how horrible. E: "well if you're so right, then why haven't the slaves been freed already, Mr Douglas?  "
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Jul 26, 2019 23:19
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The vulgar Marxist narrative about how everyone who doesn't love Bernie just suffers from false consciousness is pretty simplistic and obnoxious but then again if your arguing against someone who apparently forgot that the Cold War was a thing then I suppose it all balances out.
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Jul 26, 2019 23:21
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KingNastidon posted:I don't know man. It seems that lack of action towards radical socialist/communist movements isn't just limited to the US and that blaming the US democratic establishment or US left-of-center media for everything is a bit misguided. Even if you do 100% believe the brainwashing it's useful to consider that when putting on your pundit cap and debating the likelihood of Sanders exceeding his existing preference share and winning the primary. See this is a lot of words that say absolutely nothing. You're just saying "well consider the ideological landscape" as if it is some sort of useful commentary. Except everyone who is pointing out the ideological divide in the party already has done so. That's why posters keep calling out the bullshit from centrists pretending to care about MFA, because they see the ideological landscape and see that they've staked their entire worldview on believing Sanders must fail so of course they're going to keep coming up with new ways to restate the same premise. Of course we recognize that these centrists are not ever going to be amenable to a real MFA bill, they'll always find issues with it until it is watered down to meaninglessness then approve.
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Jul 26, 2019 23:24
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KingNastidon posted:I don't know man. It seems that lack of action towards radical socialist/communist movements isn't just limited to the US and that blaming the US democratic establishment or US left-of-center media for everything is a bit misguided.
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Jul 26, 2019 23:25
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Clearly the better explanation is "everyone on earth wants to die in climate apocalypse, please ignore all polling on the issue kthxbye"
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Jul 26, 2019 23:35
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GreyjoyBastard posted:the only important criticism is that last bit and maybe the last bullet, I'd be totally fine with P Andrew Torres and Robert Evans making money off those things charging over a hundred dollars for a ticket to see a podcast taping is pretty bad.
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Jul 26, 2019 23:37
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Gripweed posted:charging over a hundred dollars for a ticket to see a podcast taping is pretty bad. Pretty sure the Chapo shows are like $10-25
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Jul 26, 2019 23:41
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KingNastidon posted:I don't know man. It seems that lack of action towards radical socialist/communist movements isn't just limited to the US and that blaming the US democratic establishment or US left-of-center media for everything is a bit misguided. Even if you do 100% believe the brainwashing it's useful to consider that when putting on your pundit cap and debating the likelihood of Sanders exceeding his existing preference share and winning the primary. Yeah that makes sense, I too have blacked out my memory of what american foreign policy and the CIA have done to every left of center world government and am a big special opinion boy just like you, KN.
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Jul 26, 2019 23:42
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Gripweed posted:charging over a hundred dollars for a ticket to see a podcast taping is pretty bad. on the one hand it's not great on the other hand anyone who pays that kinda deserves to have the money transferred so I also have no idea how much the First Opening Arguments Live Show costs but they apparently have more going in there than just a podcast taping
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Jul 26, 2019 23:48
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The fact that as a politician you can grift money from rich idiots isn't an excuse for pricing poor people out of your events in order to carry out said grift.
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Jul 27, 2019 00:12
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VitalSigns posted:The fact that as a politician you can grift money from rich idiots isn't an excuse for pricing poor people out of your events in order to carry out said grift. but why would poor people ever want to attend such obvious centrist operation as pod save american anyway when they could be using their time to go to leftist political events instead
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Jul 27, 2019 00:15
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VitalSigns posted:E: "well if you're so right, then why haven't the slaves been freed already, Mr Douglas? Yeah there's a difference between something being the moral and righteous belief and broad public sentiment coming to that conclusion. But the voters ultimately came around and the issue was resolved at the ballot box without bloodshed. twodot posted:If you don't have a competing theory on what basis are you calling this theory misguided? "the rich and powerful have systemically sabotaged leftist interests that would harm the status of the rich and powerful" seems like a real good explanation unless you can offer a better one. I think many people vastly overstate receptivity of the class war/equality or anti-capitalism narratives among folks that aren't automatically writing off the left of center party for social/cultural issues. M4A is a good example -- if people actually gave a poo poo about 100% equal care and destroying every for-profit entity that touch it then they'd unquestionably be voting Sanders. But they don't, they just want to help people get insurance and that's why the opt-in plan currently is and has always been more popular when polled against each other. People vote against their economic self-interest all the time. VitalSigns posted:Clearly the better explanation is "everyone on earth wants to die in climate apocalypse, please ignore all polling on the issue kthxbye" Another good example. A lot of people care about climate change, but some percentage fewer care about it to the point where they want to diminish their standard of living in the short term or see a wind turbine in the middle of their lake. If they truly believed it was an existential threat then they'd seek out a candidate who explicitly states everything must be done to make their plan a reality, including moving away from a consumption/growth based economy. ross perot in hell posted:Yeah that makes sense, I too have blacked out my memory of what american foreign policy and the CIA have done to every left of center world government and am a big special opinion boy just like you, KN. A large portion of likely voters lived through the cold war and thus may not be as receptive to leftist politics than those who haven't. That could help explain Bernie's relative weakness with older voters. Thinking they're dumb and wrong and repeatedly telling them so doesn't make Bernie any more likely to secure their vote. How many older relative's minds have you convinced that Bernie is actually a compromise candidate? (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jul 27, 2019 00:29
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KingNastidon posted:I think many people vastly overstate receptivity of the class war/equality or anti-capitalism narratives among folks that aren't automatically writing off the left of center party for social/cultural issues. M4A is a good example -- if people actually gave a poo poo about 100% equal care and destroying every for-profit entity that touch it then they'd unquestionably be voting Sanders. But they don't, they just want to help people get insurance and that's why the opt-in plan currently is and has always been more popular when polled against each other. People vote against their economic self-interest all the time.
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Jul 27, 2019 00:34
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VitalSigns posted:The fact that as a politician you can grift money from rich idiots isn't an excuse for pricing poor people out of your events in order to carry out said grift.
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Jul 27, 2019 00:36
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KingNastidon posted:I don't know man. It seems that lack of action towards radical socialist/communist movements isn't just limited to the US and that blaming the US democratic establishment or US left-of-center media for everything is a bit misguided. true. they're more often broken up by state violence KingNastidon posted:A large portion of likely voters lived through the cold war and thus may not be as receptive to leftist politics than those who haven't. That could help explain Bernie's relative weakness with older voters. Thinking they're dumb and wrong well i mean they also grew up constantly inhaling elevated levels of atmospheric lead, so... The Muppets On PCP fucked around with this message at 00:44 on Jul 27, 2019 |
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Jul 27, 2019 00:37
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KingNastidon posted:US left-of-center media There really isn't any
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Jul 27, 2019 00:44
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My posts are probably the most widely followed US left-of-center media. Which is honestly pretty sad.
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Jul 27, 2019 00:46
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wrap it up bernailures https://twitter.com/PodSaveAmerica/status/1154866044596609024
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Jul 27, 2019 00:53
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The Muppets On PCP posted:wrap it up bernailures This is, not good.
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Jul 27, 2019 00:58
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I'm so loving over Bernie I can't even, but its certainly bizarre to see the same Purity Leftists who defended Bernie's Fox News appearances lose their poo poo over him going on a moderate liberal podcast.
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Jul 27, 2019 00:58
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Typo posted:but why would poor people ever want to attend such obvious centrist operation as pod save american anyway when they could be using their time to go to leftist political events instead Being bad is not a defense of their character. If they're so bad poor people wouldn't want to attend, they should change and be good rather than gatekeep with ticket prices
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Jul 27, 2019 01:15
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If your position is that the status quo cannot be changed because if it could voters would have changed it already then what is there to debate and/or discuss. We agree that the status quo exists, and your circular argument is unfalsifiable as it preemptively dismisses all evidence as irrelevant because voters haven't already changed the status quo so there's nothing to do according to you but live as hedonistically as possible until the inevitable climate apocalypse
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Jul 27, 2019 01:21
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twodot posted:That is not the conversation we're having. The conversation is why do people vote against their economic self interest? The proposed answer is the media and establishment political figures have contrived an environment where people will do that. You said that seemed misguided without offering a better explanation. Is your explanation that people are just too dumb to vote for good things? I don't know if they're too dumb, but they certainly aren't highly motivated to explore information sources that would offer them a different, more left perspective. You don't have to be a brain genius to wonder whether MSNBC could have a vested interest in moderating anti-capitalist views given their ownership. It's not as if NYT or CNN totally prevents leftist voices or policies from getting positive airtime despite the occasional dumb poo poo panelist or op-ed writer. They could be a hell of a lot more antagonistic to people like AOC if that was their goal. In the case of cable news they just are pegging their content at the median democrat to maximize viewership. That median is more left than it was 10-20 years ago, but not at Bernie because he's not the median democrat in congress nor dem primary. If you want advocacy journalism from left viewpoint it isn't that hard to find in the age of the internet. People are capable of changing their positions, but it's probably a slower and more gradual process than you'd like. People don't want to believe they were wrong in the past and are generally risk adverse, especially older established folks or those with kids and feel as if they have something to lose. I believe we will get there, and it's just a matter of time and demographics, but 2020 may not be it.
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Jul 27, 2019 01:26
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