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Guavanaut posted:What if you pick a broadcast channel that turns out to be wrong? It’s kind of funny seeing this thread interweave entirely correct mockery of anarchocapitalism with full-throated defence of it when it comes to the web, and media in general. Providing up to date political information is a core state function; with the demise of customer-funded news media it is no longer one that can be left to the private sector.
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Aug 2, 2019 21:53
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So which one of us was silly enough to volunteer to make ukmt podcast spreadsheets or something? Been a bit out of things as I've no roaming in this alpine paradise.
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Aug 2, 2019 21:53
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You know say what you like about the silent hill movie the practical effects were really good.
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Aug 2, 2019 21:54
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radmonger posted:Providing up to date political information is a core state function; lol no it isn't. radmonger posted:with the demise of customer-funded news media it is no longer one that can be left to the private sector. Think about this sentence for a minute... What exactly makes you think "customer funded news media" is dying? What do you think subscribe to my patreon for 20 million hours of me ranting in your preferred political corner is?
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Aug 2, 2019 21:54
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Junior G-man posted:So which one of us was silly enough to volunteer to make ukmt podcast spreadsheets or something? Rarity posted:I made a spreadsheet for people to log interest in being part of UKMP. You can also let everyone know the things you're particularly knowledgeable about/would like to chat about!
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Aug 2, 2019 22:03
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ShaneMacGowansTeeth posted:At one end of the mascot spectrum we get I have a really bad cough right now and this made me laugh and cough so hard I got light-headed. Thanks for nearly making me literally die laughing.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:05
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CGI Stardust posted:Going back a bit, the parallels between fascism and neoliberalism are fascinating. Few pages back, but just I was busy helping someone move today so a bit of a late response, but I can't say I agree. Especially when it comes to your characterisation of rationality in neo-liberal politics. Neo-liberalism does in fact rely in great part on a rational modernity and a very particular conception of rationality. As you, quite rightly, say neo-liberalism does in fact rely on a totally rational market as the foundation of their politics, but within this market and within their politics people are completely and totally rational. Their entire conception of man is one of a Homo Economicus, the rational actor in a market situation who would always do what is rational in a particular situation. This gives them the ability to claim that the market does not allow for any kind of discrimination. There would be no need for top-down measures to alleviate in-equality, both in opportunity and outcome, because no market (which is perfectly rational by definition) would allow for this kind of irrational behaviour. Neo-liberalism is a heinous ideology, only able vaguely combat inequality at a social level while greatly increasing economic inequality, while simultaneously doing everything they can to protect the status-quo, but it is not heinous in the same way (ur-)fascism is. Its 'capitalism with a human face' is much more insidious and ordinary than the complete destruction of status-quo that any fascism will necessarily entail. They're both awful, though, perhaps unfortunately, they're very different.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:09
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AceOfFlames posted:I have a really bad cough right now and this made me laugh and cough so hard I got light-headed. Thanks for nearly making me literally die laughing. it's a front and back of the same mascot...
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Aug 2, 2019 22:13
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ShaneMacGowansTeeth posted:At one end of the mascot spectrum we get There's no ring.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:18
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radmonger posted:It’s kind of funny seeing this thread interweave entirely correct mockery of anarchocapitalism with full-throated defence of it when it comes to the web, and media in general. Or you can pick one that is state funded and also often entirely wrong, like RT. Or you can pick one that happens to be mostly right about matters that can be empirically proven, but through selectivity be entirely wrong about other things, like the BBC. I'm not convinced that the web as media is any more anarcho-capitalist than going back to the 19th century and saying to the anarchist there "ha, bet you paid for those hand printing presses, gotya!" The people who control which flyers stay up and which get torn down the most might be capitalist as hell, but that doesn't make the act of flyering a capitalist one.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:21
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Sam Seder is a pro follow, especially for his hilarious debates with libertarians https://youtu.be/dlN9plBx6Ho
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Aug 2, 2019 22:37
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https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/aug/02/labour-boris-johnson-progressive-pact-greens-lib-dems Lmao Paul Mason is losing his mind.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:40
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Coohoolin posted:Sam Seder is a pro follow, especially for his hilarious debates with libertarians "John Connor from Los Angeles California" lol
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Aug 2, 2019 22:41
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OwlFancier posted:lol no it isn't. Television didn't arrive in South Africa until the mid-70s, and only under the provision that the only legal broadcaster be state controlled. So all news that was fed into homes through the television was through the SABC, and all news that was fed into the SABC was through the white minority government. What that did was provide a consensus, you could be fairly sure that anyone who watched the news got the same news as you, which would allow for discussion reasonably sure that you were occupying the same political universe as the person you were discussing with. You could talk about the police cracking down on a riot and be liberal (the police were too harsh) or conservative (the police were too lenient), but you'd be 99% sure that you wouldn't be talking with someone completely off table saying "the rioters were aliens" or "it wasn't a riot, it was a peaceful demonstration and police murdered a hundred people." Unfortunately one of these two was true. Thus is the central advantage and disadvantage of state media. A thousand sources blooming has destroyed that for worse and for better. Junior G-man posted:https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/aug/02/labour-boris-johnson-progressive-pact-greens-lib-dems
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Aug 2, 2019 22:42
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One LibDem favoured stronghold voting Libdem and he wants to have a GroKo with everyone but SNP. Brilliant Paul, just brilliant.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:45
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I agree that the role of the state is to maintain the state and thus occupying the political space with its preferred brand of information is an important element of the state, but I object to characterising that as "up to date political information" as it is highly misleading.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:49
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I think Paul thinks that big alliances are always better no matter how nonsensical they are - NATO, EU, etc.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:50
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OwlFancier posted:I agree that the role of the state is to maintain the state and thus occupying the political space with its preferred brand of information is an important element of the state, but I object to characterising that as "up to date political information" as it is highly misleading.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:51
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Since it seems labour aren't likely to win a majority a coalition seems like a good idea, since otherwise the LDs will just go into coaliyion with the cons The issue is thinking the LDs are progressives or allies of labour. Greens are alright tho and SNP are pretty ok
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Aug 2, 2019 22:55
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https://twitter.com/MadeleinaKay/status/1155087564879081473 I take it back can we Brexit today please?
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Aug 2, 2019 22:56
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#EUsupergirl and NotRacistWolf are a deep cover pro-Brexit org
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Aug 2, 2019 22:59
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Guavanaut posted:#EUsupergirl To be fair, I got mad respect for her hustle
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Aug 2, 2019 23:01
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Guavanaut posted:#EUsupergirl and NotRacistWolf are a deep cover pro-Brexit org Don't forget the Breunion Boys!
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Aug 2, 2019 23:02
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Rarity posted:To be fair, I got mad respect for her hustle Still not as good as belle delphine  None of us will ever achieve as much as belle delphine.
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Aug 2, 2019 23:04
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There's reasons not to deal with the Lib Dems, but there's absolutely no reason labour shouldn't be making a pact with the Greens or at least try to negotiate one. I doubt the Lib Dems would even make a pact with labour that didn't give them everything on a platter though - liberials dislike socialism more than Fascism, and Jo Swindon is similar. Putting the effort in would be useful on the doorstep to convert wavering left-wing remainers thought.
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Aug 2, 2019 23:07
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Rarity posted:https://twitter.com/MadeleinaKay/status/1155087564879081473 this is giving me intense douche chills
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Aug 2, 2019 23:07
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I would like to see labour co-opt the actual good bits of the greens but I dunno entirely how amenable the whole party would be given that it's arguably more than a little high tory in the "wants to live in a green village forever (by keeping all the paups out)" fashion.
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Aug 2, 2019 23:08
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Let's make a deal with the greens and bend over backwards to join up with one parliamentary vote from Brighton Pavillion. Look I love the greens and if I could choose any party to win it'd be them, but I don't see how this is a fair deal for Labour.
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Aug 2, 2019 23:09
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That too, not sure how much the greens could contribute electorally though their assistance on the ground would be helpful.
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Aug 2, 2019 23:10
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The Greens are also veering more and more liberal as all the socialists have been abandoning them for Labour
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Aug 2, 2019 23:10
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The point is sweeping up the 2-3% of the vote they gather in most constituencies - in marginal seats those votes can be the difference between taking the seat or not, I'd reckon such a pact would be worth 10ish seats, worth giving the greens a extra one or two. How many of their voters follow central party policy is a different matter, but it also helps burnish labours green credentials with the young (along with the green industrial revolution stuff of course)
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Aug 2, 2019 23:14
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As I said though I'm not really sure if that would be the case? I doubt the greens would agree not to stand candidates and even fewer of their on the ground activists would help out I think. And I EXTREMELY doubt that many seats would actually vote green rather than labour... And labour would be highly unlikely to go for that arrangement of not standing either. A formal pact between two really quite different parties both in scale and goals is just... a lot of effort that I don't think would give that many returns.
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Aug 2, 2019 23:17
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Hey I don't have access to a computer and can't edit this on my phone. Will you add me? Topics include philosophy (ethics and political specifically), anarchism, antisemitism, Israel/Palestine. Availability is ever day after 4pm and all day weekends. You can fill in the rest 
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Aug 2, 2019 23:26
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OwlFancier posted:I would like to see labour co-opt the actual good bits of the greens but I dunno entirely how amenable the whole party would be given that it's arguably more than a little high tory in the "wants to live in a green village forever (by keeping all the paups out)" fashion. My mother's Green and I think she's fairly typical of Greens round here. She'll go tory rather than labour. She has never voted labour in her life. I rather suspect she has voted tory on a number of occasions and lib dem a couple of times. She felt sorry for Theresa May and admires 'strong women' (as in Thatcher). She did get somewhat sparkly eyed seeing Emily Thornberry in action at PMQs one time and as I was round hers at the time, asked me who she was.
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Aug 2, 2019 23:42
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Miftan posted:Hey I don't have access to a computer and can't edit this on my phone. Will you add me? Topics include philosophy (ethics and political specifically), anarchism, antisemitism, Israel/Palestine. Availability is ever day after 4pm and all day weekends. You can fill in the rest  
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Aug 3, 2019 00:09
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I'm just glad he's come around on the important issues
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Aug 3, 2019 00:18
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Just loving lol at this amateur hour bullshit, your ukmt.xls doesn't even have a dedicated chocolate_orange_prefs column
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Aug 3, 2019 00:19
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christ I think I just died
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Aug 3, 2019 00:20
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Rarity posted:https://twitter.com/MadeleinaKay/status/1155087564879081473 this entire song is about hating someone the grift is powerful indeed
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Aug 3, 2019 00:41
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Bardeh posted:I also like the people screeching about how it'll make us go bankrupt, as if taxing the ultra-wealthy is just completely impossible and unacceptable. The standard (idiot) response to that is usually "then they'll all just leave the country"
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