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Why is the Grasshopper more popular than the Black Knight?
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Aug 13, 2019 20:09
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Conspiratiorist posted:If you want your supports doing anything then field a Grasshopper. Por que no los dos? Anyway nobody is arguing that a Banshee 3M punchbot is optimal by some  standard, just that it's fun. Hieronymous Alloy posted:Why is the Grasshopper more popular than the Black Knight? All the support weapon hardpoints.
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Aug 13, 2019 20:18
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I mean the Battlemaster and the Banshee are both bad mechs. The Banshee may be slightly better at raw punching but you're still using a suboptimal mech and a bad strategy so you may as well do whatever makes you happy. Also don't discount the mobility offered by 4 JJs. The ability to JJ in, alpha strike and then punch to cool off is exactly what makes the Grasshopper so good. Not having them severely limits your ability to engage on favorable terrain which is very important for melee. In the future the Battlemaster can be salvaged by DHS and endo-steel but the Banshee(minus the 3s) will always be bad.
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Aug 13, 2019 20:46
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sean10mm posted:
ahhh, for punchbots, got it All my small lasers and flamers are on firestarters and a hatchetman. Hrm.
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Aug 13, 2019 20:51
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AtillatheBum posted:I mean the Battlemaster and the Banshee are both bad mechs. The Banshee may be slightly better at raw punching but you're still using a suboptimal mech and a bad strategy so you may as well do whatever makes you happy. Oh, I *love* jump jets on everything but like the Banshee and the Cyclops Z. 8 tons for full JJ is just too much on assault mechs with bad usable tonnage to start with.
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Aug 13, 2019 20:56
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:ahhh, for punchbots, got it No, you don't punch with the Grasshopper - you fire the supports alongside your 7 medium lasers. If the unfortunate enemy survives that, then you *might* opt to punch instead of simply firing again, just to save on heat.
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Aug 13, 2019 20:56
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Conspiratiorist posted:If you want your supports doing anything then field a Grasshopper. You can still mount 6-7 MLs on a BNC-M and do the backstab thing or precision strike on ammo containing section thing in between punches without negatively affecting its ability to be a punchbot. Also, if you punch from the side, you stand a good chance of stripping a torso and/or leg which means that all those support weapons are going to be concentrating toward the CT. I'm with sean10mm on this one. EDIT: also 10% more armor means >100 more points of armor overall, which is probably another alpha and change in bulwark/cover. Organ Fiend fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Aug 13, 2019 |
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Aug 13, 2019 21:02
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I'm actually not on the "JJs on everything" train. Assuming JJs follow tabletop's heat values, 4JJs on a 85-70 tonner cost 4 tons + 12 heat = 8 tons. 3 JJs on a 90+ tonner cost 6 tons + 9 heat = 9 tons. That is not an insignificant amount of tonnage that could be going toward more guns. Unless the role of mech is "backstabber" I'm not really seeing the point. Especially once your pilots get piloting 7.
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Aug 13, 2019 21:06
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JJs only generate heat when activated, and in steps based on the distance of your jump (not the quantity of JJs you have mounted, that only determines your max dist): JJs/Distance/Heat 1 60m 11 2 90m 16 3 120m 21 4 150m 26 5 180m 31
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Aug 13, 2019 21:12
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Setup a Hatchetman Punchbot, hope he works out 
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Aug 14, 2019 01:16
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Conspiratiorist posted:JJs only generate heat when activated, and in steps based on the distance of your jump (not the quantity of JJs you have mounted, that only determines your max dist): So the heat is even higher than in CBT. Obviously, JJs don't generate heat when you don't use them. They still suck up tonnage thats completely wasted if you're not using them. I'm not saying they're worthless. They're a necessity on the GHR backstabber, IMO, and the GHR is way too fragile in the late game to be a punchbot. What I'm saying is that I don't think that they're a "put them on every single mech" piece of equipment. Even on the 85 ton and less mechs.
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Aug 14, 2019 01:24
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Why is the Grasshopper more popular than the Black Knight? I love my dumb full plate robot but it does seem to want to melt itself in any biome hotter than urban. Also Grasshoppers are ubiquitous and I, at least, seem to have trouble finding Black Knight parts.
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Aug 14, 2019 01:38
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And on the first shot, his arm got shot off. The one with the axe. He still punched a Jagermech to death.
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Aug 14, 2019 01:44
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Organ Fiend posted:So the heat is even higher than in CBT. Then you don't seem to understand the tremendous offensive and defensive value of flanking and moving through cover terrain and height differences completely unimpeded. I'll take that over an extra Medium Laser's worth of sustained damage on 65-85 tonners any day, and in the case of the 95 movement mechs, you need 3 to move at a reasonable speed at all.
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Aug 14, 2019 17:14
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Conspiratiorist posted:Then you don't seem to understand the tremendous offensive and defensive value of flanking and moving through cover terrain and height differences completely unimpeded. I'll take that over an extra Medium Laser's worth of sustained damage on 65-85 tonners any day, and in the case of the 95 movement mechs, you need 3 to move at a reasonable speed at all. You are being more than a bit disingenuous here. You can't talk about sustained fire and then ignore the heat of the JJs. If we're talking about comparable sustainability, then 4 JJs (4 tons 21 heat) is comparable to 2xML, 2xHS (4 tons, 26-6=20 heat). In the late game, thats 70 damage, and some extra HS for something else. A SRM6 with 1 ton of ammo is 4 tons and only 12 heat. If you have HS to drop, SRM10 + 1 ammo is 6 tons and 20 + 6 (drop 2 HS)=26 heat. Thats 120 damage in the late game. If you take heat into account, and have HS to dump, 4 tons and 26 heat removed from your build is enough to turn an AC5 into an AC20. These are not insignificant amounts of damage. If we're ignoring heat (i.e. you're not jumping all the time, you're also not shooting all the time), then those 4 tons become 4 MLs, 8 SRMs, 6 support weapons and change, etc. As for not understanding flanking, moving through terrain, etc. Yeah sure. I didn't know about this just like I didn't know that JJs didn't produce heat unless you activate them until you told me. Don't be an rear end. Once you pass the mid game (around the time you get heavies), and you have your first real LRM boat, your pilots all have tac 6 and some have tac 9, and you should start getting upgraded weapons, there are plenty of ways to get concentrated damage on targets without JJ flanking: -LRM knockdowns to called shots -Precision strikes on ammo containing torsos (esp. HCT, SHD, TDR, JM6-S, AWS-T, etc) -Precision strikes on head with tac9 pilots -Sprinting with piloting 7 pilots to flank/rear (set up power plays with initiative manipulation) -Maneuvering with vigilance to not be restrained to cover and to set up power plays And for the record, I do use JJ flankers, like the GHR. Its just I use other mechs/strategies too, and they also work. But you must all know this, so I'm wondering why you're ignoring it. My suspicion is that you have a playstyle that works for you and are incapable or unwilling to consider others that work just as well. Given that you're arguing in such obviously bad faith, I'm thinking its the later rather than the former. Organ Fiend fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Aug 15, 2019 |
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Aug 15, 2019 00:07
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Started playing through this last weekend and enjoying it but the difficulty spike after the moon argo rescue mission is a bit more than I expected. Went from max 1 skull missions to min 2.5 skull in about two financial reports. Went from doing fine to injured pilots and damage. I went back to a pre-argo save to see if I can get better gear and level up pilots but past day 300 I haven't seen a single LRM20 in salvage or for sale. Nothing other than an occasional medium mech to fight or salvage stinks. Plus it seems every mission requires travel between killing the bankroll. Would I be better off doing career if I don't care about the story and just want to play with mechs? I have base game, no expansions.
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Aug 15, 2019 00:13
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Organ Fiend posted:You can't talk about sustained fire and then ignore the heat of the JJs. If we're talking about comparable sustainability, then 4 JJs (4 tons 26 heat) is comparable to 2xML, 2xHS (4 tons, 26-6=20 heat). In the late game, thats 70 damage, and some extra HS for something else. A SRM6 with 1 ton of ammo is 4 tons and only 12 heat. If you have HS to drop, SRM10 + 1 ammo is 6 tons and 20 + 6 (drop 2 HS)=26 heat. Thats 120 damage in the late game. If you take heat into account, and have HS to dump, 4 tons and 26 heat removed from your build is enough to turn an AC5 into an AC20. These are not insignificant amounts of damage. If we're ignoring heat (i.e. you're not jumping all the time, you're also not shooting all the time), then those 4 tons become 4 MLs, 8 SRMs, 6 support weapons and change, etc. Are you using mods? These numbers are pretty off vanilla.
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Aug 15, 2019 00:37
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Are SRM10s even in vanilla?
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Aug 15, 2019 00:39
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Lazyhound posted:Are SRM10s even in vanilla? No they are not, but it might be a typo of LRM10s.
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Aug 15, 2019 00:41
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Alot of people just combine the missile numbers. 4 srm6s = srm24, my 2xlrm20 2x lrm15 stalker is an lrm70 stalker etc
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Aug 15, 2019 00:44
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McGavin posted:Are you using mods? These numbers are pretty off vanilla. I am, but nothing that touches MLs, SRMs, or AC20s. The JJ heat numbers are from Conspiratiorist's post. Yeah, those heat numbers are way off of a direct translation of TT, but I could totally see the devs modifying heat.
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Aug 15, 2019 00:53
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Lazyhound posted:Are SRM10s even in vanilla? SRM10 = any combination of SRMs that equal 10 missiles. Last I checked (I could be wrong), every 2 SRMs cost you 1 ton and 4 heat.
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Aug 15, 2019 00:55
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Organ Fiend posted:SRM10 = any combination of SRMs that equal 10 missiles. Last I checked (I could be wrong), every 2 SRMs cost you 1 ton and 4 heat. Yep, they are all perfectly balanced for weight and heat, so there is no harm in adding in a SRM2 to an existing rack of SRM4s/6s if that's all that fits.
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Aug 15, 2019 00:57
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Career mode without DLC is poo poo, and with DLC is basically how you should play the game all the time.
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Aug 15, 2019 02:45
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Organ Fiend posted:Given that you're arguing in such obviously bad faith Oh gently caress off
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Aug 15, 2019 05:07
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sean10mm posted:Career mode without DLC is poo poo, and with DLC is basically how you should play the game all the time. Hmm maybe I'll look at getting the season pass then
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Aug 15, 2019 08:59
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I found the early campaign a bit hard until I pushed through to the mission where you get an assault mech. Also make sure you’re using cover and stacking evasion charges. e: vvv whoops, duh Lazyhound fucked around with this message at 05:06 on Aug 16, 2019 |
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Aug 16, 2019 04:07
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That's campaign. Career is sandbox mode.
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Aug 16, 2019 04:36
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I can't imagine playing without flashpoints. Just played the all-Urbie mission 
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Aug 16, 2019 05:03
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Is there a must have list of mods? I'm just getting into career mode and picked up the season pass. The super-fast move is a god send, holy poo poo was the game slow before.
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Aug 19, 2019 12:35
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Yooper posted:Is there a must have list of mods? I'm just getting into career mode and picked up the season pass. The super-fast move is a god send, holy poo poo was the game slow before. Fast moves was always in the game
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Aug 19, 2019 12:42
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Jobbo_Fett posted:Fast moves was always in the game Really? I remember having to mod a text file with movement speeds and wait times and such. Without it the game was so damned slow.
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Aug 19, 2019 13:25
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Yooper posted:Really? I remember having to mod a text file with movement speeds and wait times and such. Without it the game was so damned slow. I definitely remember using the spacebar to speed things up, and I'm fairly certain it was always a thing in the options menu, but regardless its definitely a great feature 
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Aug 19, 2019 13:29
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Jobbo_Fett posted:I definitely remember using the spacebar to speed things up, and I'm fairly certain it was always a thing in the options menu, but regardless its definitely a great feature Absolutely! Do they intend to do Steam workshop integration at some point?
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Aug 19, 2019 13:45
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Jobbo_Fett posted:I definitely remember using the spacebar to speed things up, and I'm fairly certain it was always a thing in the options menu, but regardless its definitely a great feature The devs patched it in a month or so after release. I think the mod had already come out in that time, and the mod might still speed some other things up that the base game won't.
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Aug 19, 2019 16:45
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Yooper posted:Is there a must have list of mods? I'm just getting into career mode and picked up the season pass. ModTek: required for other mods https://github.com/BattletechModders/ModTek/releases Flashpoint Adjustmets: Edits the spawn weight of lower difficulty FPs to give them great chances of spawning first. In Stock, all FPs have the same odds, except Alliance FPs. https://github.com/BattletechModders/Flashpoint-Spawn-Adjustments/releases MechSpin: lets you spin your mechs in the mechbay! https://github.com/Mpstark/MechSpin/releases NavigationComputer: lets you plot travel courses https://github.com/BattletechModders/NavigationComputer/releases PilotHealthPopup: little popup shows remaining/max HP whenever a pilot takes injuries https://github.com/BattletechModders/PilotHealthPopup/releases SkipIntro: automatically skips the intro cutscene and splashes https://github.com/BattletechModders/SkipIntro/releases ColorLOSMod: lets you change the color of firing line visual obstruction indicators, for better clarity https://www.nexusmods.com/battletech/mods/135?tab=files cFixes: whole lot of minor changes (fixes typos, small value errors) but also most notably properly gives NPCs the passives they should have for their skill levels, increasing difficulty slightly. https://github.com/BattletechModders/cFixes BetterHeadlights: better headlights https://www.nexusmods.com/battletech/mods/457 This is basically all vanilla QoL improvements.
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Aug 19, 2019 18:04
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binge crotching posted:Yep, they are all perfectly balanced for weight and heat, so there is no harm in adding in a SRM2 to an existing rack of SRM4s/6s if that's all that fits. All other things being equal I think it's even probably best to stick to SRM2s as much as possible (and upgrade to 4/6s as weight, hardpoints and/or available ++'s dictate). That way you can better control heat by squeezing out juuuust enough missiles to not overheat (or only as many as you need to Kill The Thing); and if you get shot up too much you merely lose one of your many missileguns instead of your one big'un. I got no notion why LRMs don't work the same. Come to think of it I should just mod them to, it's just a txt file edit right ?
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Aug 19, 2019 18:10
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Conspiratiorist posted:ModTek: required for other mods Thanks dude! That's OP-worthy there. I also totally read that as "meatspin" and not "mechspin".
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Aug 19, 2019 18:29
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There's also Real Hit Chance: https://www.nexusmods.com/battletech/mods/90 Creator never updated it to work with more recent versions of ModTek, but the manual fix is easy: a good dude in the comments section posted:1) In your Mods directory, create a folder called AA.BT.RealHitChance
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Aug 19, 2019 19:43
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Also Skip Travel Cutscenes. E: I wish there were more camo patterns and could change the camo on the 732b. Never seen a mod like that.
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Aug 19, 2019 20:18
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