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And yet VtM is very clear to mention that the Holocaust happened because all the elders were sleeping that decade and powerless to stop it, and it was absolutely not any lick's fault.
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Aug 19, 2019 05:15
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Shrecknet posted:And yet VtM is very clear to mention that the Holocaust happened because all the elders were sleeping that decade and powerless to stop it, and it was absolutely not any lick's fault. Well. Other than the times it's made it clear that no, the Technocracy and Gustav Breidenstein and the Spectres and the Nephandi were all directly backing it. Despite their attempts at not poking that particular mess, White Wolf was never very good at avoiding it on the whole and the end picture comes out as pretty much a 'well, we don't know how to adress that particular monstrosity, so, uh... Let's just avoid it wherever possible, only some of our writers didn't get the memo' beyond Shoah.
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Aug 19, 2019 05:28
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Blitz7x posted:God i've loving had it with this game. (V5 LA By Night campaign) My anarch Brujah Alleycat feeder left a mortal bleeding out in a nightclub bathroom yet somehow there's always cameras around with CSI enhance enhance enhance technologies in dark club hallways. Essentially the ST has a retaliation grudge against my character. Every mortal I come up against somehow has like fire ammunition for some reason while every other vampire in the coterie gets to lazily feed off their herd being grape fed laying on a dais. Sorry, ranting. My vampire is brought before a tribunal of Barons for masquerade breaching and essentially the ST peeked at my lore sheet, saw I had 1I nt and 1 resolve before making the skillcheck to not loving hit final death a hard 5 difficulty that went to 6 because the ST/barons didnt like my argument to stay alive (I solo'd the first campaign boss and am essentially the best damage dealer in the group) when I told them that they needed me in the upcoming war with the camarilla. The ST then told me my argument was poo poo and used dominate with a whatever fuckuoff huge dice pool to make my character sit down (against my will btw) and had another player character member of the coterie cut my brujahs head off. Im fighting tears at this point as they rob my character of his items and the ST sends me a new character sheet saying "lol maybe play better next time. you really need to quit loving up" over PMs. THEN the only other character in the coterie who stood up for me is killed by a werewolf in the next scene. How convenient I don't think we're getting the whole story here. It sounds like you're angry your actions had consequences?
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Aug 19, 2019 05:34
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actions have consequences, which is why you should kick your st in the fork before you leave
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Aug 19, 2019 05:40
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Loomer posted:The World of Darkness is a setting where the capitol lawn is a giant refugee camp and the Sabbat burned down the goddamn White House. One more dead clubkiddie isn't really going to make waves. Yeah, like, canonically all the governments of the world know everything they need to know about vampires and launched a second inquisition or something.
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Aug 19, 2019 05:48
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Barring aggravating circumstance or willful disregard, typical Masquerade breaches are the sort of thing any Prince worth his widow's peak probably looks forward to. It's the perfect scenario from Vlad's perspective - minor breaches are commonplace (people frenzy, it happens), dealing with it is routine and cheap (the court already has tools in place for this, no extraordinary effort required), and while it is an easy crime to make go away, it is considered by vampire society to be a Very Serious Offense. Resolving the matter reminds everyone why they need a Prince, and there's no reason to kill the offender when you can extract huge favors for them. Why make them pay with their life when you can make them pay for their life instead?
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Aug 19, 2019 05:59
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What really bugs me about this idiotic 'actions have consequences' thing is that, like... the actual action, the real action, was 'a player took part in a game in a way the game absolutely supports, but the ST didn't like' and the consequence was 'the ST was a dick about it rather than talking to the player about expectations.' Like, you guys don't believe there really are vampires and a Masquerade, do you? Because I have some good news: They don't exist, and the consequences of actions are always determined by the Storyteller. They might say 'hey I don't think you can get away with that without being chewed out by the local powers-that-be' but it's on them to make that a good story, because again, Storyteller. "Well I just did the thing I thought would be most likely" is bad storytelling, especially when the most likely thing is clearly also what you the ST want to see happen to gently caress with the player. Actions have consequences, and 'choosing to ignore the entire point of the system and just power trip' has the consequence of 'being a poo poo ST who shouldn't have a group and game.'
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Aug 19, 2019 06:03
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posters leaping at the opportunity to out themselves as somebody whose games you should avoid
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Aug 19, 2019 06:10
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ogresque posted:posters leaping at the opportunity to out themselves as somebody whose games you should avoid 100% agree. Seems these people just want an indentured dice-referee/yesman more than a Storyteller.
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Aug 19, 2019 06:24
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Sour Diesel posted:100% agree. Seems these people just want an indentured dice-referee/yesman more than a Storyteller. The opposite: I want a storyteller who tells stories. As my group's ST, that's what I try to do.
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Aug 19, 2019 06:40
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(throws dice) jesus gently caress those NUMBERS. that means the drama has to go UP, not DOWN! UGH!
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Aug 19, 2019 06:51
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Aug 19, 2019 07:14
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You can try to talk with yout ST about your perceived grievances and work it out. Talk to the other players and ask their opinion, maybe you are actually at faul and being paranoid/unreasonable. Or if this bothers you that much, stop playing with that group. I know fairly little about V5, but the terms "damage dealer" and "solo'd a campaign boss" in WoD bothers me a bit.
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Aug 19, 2019 10:07
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posting about v5 is a bad idea because it summons oberst and metapod to poo poo up the thread
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Aug 19, 2019 10:51
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Angry Lobster posted:You can try to talk with yout ST about your perceived grievances and work it out. Talk to the other players and ask their opinion, maybe you are actually at faul and being paranoid/unreasonable. Or if this bothers you that much, stop playing with that group. I'm gonna be one of the odd voices out here and say that maybe you should just gently caress with him right back. People like that are honestly hands down the worst to play with and they really don't ever learn their lesson until they get a taste of what it is they've been dishing out to others. Assuming this is a regular game they do then leaving the game is just gonna subject someone else to that nonsense when they come in and expect an enjoyable experience only to get that bullshit instead. I mean, he mentioned that the ST murdered the character of the guy who stood up to how bullshit the situation was next game. So it seems like the ST is just a power tripping nerd that can't handle responsibility. Even if you consider things like "damage dealer" and "solo'd a campaign boss" to be problematic him doing that after almost driving the poster nearly to tears is one hell of a red flag on the part of the ST. I've had a few DM's like that before back in college and high school. One guy prided himself on being all "LOL I DO EVERYTHING POSSIBLE TO TURN THIS INTO A GAME WITH A BULLSHIT FATALITY RATE SIMILAR TO THE TOMB OF HORRORS.  " in a regular DnD meet up we played. We're talking, "a trap every turn designed to just loving wipe the group" levels of bullshit if he didn't get his way. To which some of the players eventually got bored and pissed off with since you can only die to the DM deliberately trying to kill the group/singling out certain characters that have lasted an adventure or two to be murdered for so long before you just kinda check out and want to go play some video games with someone that isn't a colossally  rear end knob.Eventually I just kinda said gently caress it and persuaded him to let me make a character from antagonist books like the Book of Vile Darkness since who the gently caress cares what we're playing as if the character's gonna die in a few weeks anyways. Turns out he didn't know much about how bad you could munchkin DnD if your player is outright an end level boss made out of worms that can possess just about loving anything. Or how broken it is to just play a straight up chaotic evil necromancer that will massacre a village worth of people and send it's reanimated inhabitants at the next bullshit overpowered threat or trap while it's player meanders off to play some Bushido Blade with one of the other players on the nearby PlayStation. All while the DM freaks the gently caress out that his "perfect character killing trap" (his words) was ruined by a horde of zombies loving up everyone's day. If the people in the game are deliberately being jackasses to the point of outright trying to drive you to tears then give them a taste of their own medicine and embrace your inner jackass to the point that they regret their misdeeds. I mean, you don't want to play with someone that's outright trying to make you have a breakdown in the middle of the game, right? So it's no skin off of your back if they get mad and rage at you. At the very least there's the hope that after you leave they'll look back on everything with a bit of of introspection, treating the next player that comes along a bit better. At best, you get to bask in some amazing schadenfreude. Also, maybe find a better group to play with. Barring the guy that stood up and said how hosed that situation was your current group sounds like a bunch of chodes. You can do a lot better than that! Archonex fucked around with this message at 11:47 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 11:10
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juggalo baby coffin posted:posting about v5 is a bad idea because it summons oberst and metapod to poo poo up the thread
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Aug 19, 2019 11:44
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In that case, the best play is not to play.
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Aug 19, 2019 11:51
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I'm sorry your ST was being a dick! Also, that a bunch of people ITT also decided to be dicks immediately afterwards. For me it's a pretty obvious red flag when an ST makes fun of a player for 'not playing right' that's weird prima donna nonsense.
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Aug 19, 2019 12:55
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Maybe the player was going against the group's way of playing, the right way to approach that is to talk with them about genre spectations and get everyone on the same track. To punish a player in a power-trippy way and mock him for it is the worst way to go about it. GM is an rear end in a top hat, to the shithell with him.
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Aug 19, 2019 13:04
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juggalo baby coffin posted:posting about v5 is a bad idea because it summons oberst and metapod to poo poo up the thread I'm sorry I'm not just going to side with a poster who is clearly not telling the whole story because I'm not an entitled baby who only cares about how my character does rather than the story as a whole develops.
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Aug 19, 2019 13:09
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Metapod posted:I'm sorry I'm not just going to side with a poster who is clearly not telling the whole story because I'm not an entitled baby who only cares about how my character does rather than the story as a whole develops. it doesnt really matter what they did, the ST handled whatever it was in the most lovely manbaby way possible
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Aug 19, 2019 13:14
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juggalo baby coffin posted:it doesnt really matter what they did, the ST handled whatever it was in the most lovely manbaby way possible How do you know though? We don't know what was agreed upon before the campaign started. Like it's very possible everyone agreed that this campaign would be a hard one where everyone is a big mistake or two from death. How do we know that PM wasn't sent in jest but the op is melting so he didnt include the lmao or the st was just meming because someone else said that? The op is melting because he lost a character and melting people don't tend to tell the whole story. STOP BEING A COWARD BLITZ7X AND TELL US HOW MANY TIMES YOU hosed UP
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Aug 19, 2019 13:28
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How do we know that everyone involved isn’t a dog in a lovely diaper, it was never explicitly said
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Aug 19, 2019 13:35
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Metapod posted:How do you know though? We don't know what was agreed upon before the campaign started. Like it's very possible everyone agreed that this campaign would be a hard one where everyone is a big mistake or two from death. How do we know that PM wasn't sent in jest but the op is melting so he didnt include the lmao or the st was just meming because someone else said that? The op is melting because he lost a character and melting people don't tend to tell the whole story. STOP BEING A COWARD BLITZ7X AND TELL US HOW MANY TIMES YOU hosed UP ok so if everything was different from the story we heard then yes, it's someone elses fault plus a character loving up isnt the same as a player loving up
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Aug 19, 2019 13:45
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Blitz7x posted:God i've loving had it with this game. (V5 LA By Night campaign) My anarch Brujah Alleycat feeder left a mortal bleeding out in a nightclub bathroom yet somehow there's always cameras around with CSI enhance enhance enhance technologies in dark club hallways. Essentially the ST has a retaliation grudge against my character. Every mortal I come up against somehow has like fire ammunition for some reason while every other vampire in the coterie gets to lazily feed off their herd being grape fed laying on a dais. Sorry, ranting. My vampire is brought before a tribunal of Barons for masquerade breaching and essentially the ST peeked at my lore sheet, saw I had 1I nt and 1 resolve before making the skillcheck to not loving hit final death a hard 5 difficulty that went to 6 because the ST/barons didnt like my argument to stay alive (I solo'd the first campaign boss and am essentially the best damage dealer in the group) when I told them that they needed me in the upcoming war with the camarilla. The ST then told me my argument was poo poo and used dominate with a whatever fuckuoff huge dice pool to make my character sit down (against my will btw) and had another player character member of the coterie cut my brujahs head off. Im fighting tears at this point as they rob my character of his items and the ST sends me a new character sheet saying "lol maybe play better next time. you really need to quit loving up" over PMs. THEN the only other character in the coterie who stood up for me is killed by a werewolf in the next scene. How convenient I'm sorry your storyteller is an rear end, and I'm sorry you've been dogpiled by Oberst and Metapod. juggalo baby coffin posted:ok so if everything was different from the story we heard then yes, it's someone elses fault Don't you see, you have to be an enlightened god-king to run V5, and there's a correct way to run V5, no one would ever run V5 in the incorrect way. Thus any issues are the fault of the players and never the game or the storyteller. V5 is perfect, and Oberst is it's prophet.
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Aug 19, 2019 13:54
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Independently of who's at fault, if you are not having a good time playing with this group and the issue can't be solved in a reasonable manner, walk away. Everything else usually involves a lot of pointless petty drama.
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Aug 19, 2019 13:58
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v5 could be an alright system for all I know but it seems to have attracted the worst of the worst of the vampire audience. the camarilla are in-canon adversarial fun police, and 9 times out of 10 just get used as a stick to beat the players with for doing anything other than standing around in nightclubs brooding and plotting. metapod and oberst should check out Lamentations of the Flame Princess, it's tailored for their preferred GMing style
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Aug 19, 2019 14:00
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Angry Lobster posted:Independently of who's at fault, if you are not having a good time playing with this group and the issue can't be solved in a reasonable manner, walk away. Everything else usually involves a lot of pointless petty drama. Yeah, even my "try loving with them!" idea involves walking away at the end. Outside of pointing out how loving awful they're behaving there's no point in playing with a GM that can't even co-exist with his players. ZearothK posted:Maybe the player was going against the group's way of playing, the right way to approach that is to talk with them about genre spectations and get everyone on the same track. To punish a player in a power-trippy way and mock him for it is the worst way to go about it. GM is an rear end in a top hat, to the shithell with him. This, pretty much. You don't owe a lovely GM anything for playing in his game. If, at the end of the day he's being a piece of poo poo and you don't like it tell him to piss off and find a better group. Or just leave him hanging. Whatever works for you is what's best in this sort of situation. juggalo baby coffin posted:v5 could be an alright system for all I know but it seems to have attracted the worst of the worst of the vampire audience. the camarilla are in-canon adversarial fun police, and 9 times out of 10 just get used as a stick to beat the players with for doing anything other than standing around in nightclubs brooding and plotting. If I had to guess, that's because Swedracula and his fashie friends spent quite a bit of time advertising to the sort of person that has a complex when it comes to controlling others and having things their way. Even back in the early days of development that LARP they hosted had advertising and rules that were rapey as gently caress and outside of the more serious LARP elements basically catered to causing trouble for people that wanted nothing to do with that sort of crowd. Archonex fucked around with this message at 14:16 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 14:08
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Presumably this ST is the same one that made the dude bark and howl all his lines like a dog because "That's what Gangrel are like lol":Blitz7x posted:I guess I'm just a little frustrated because my DM is pretty conservative and literal when reading the source books and plays a haughty Malkavian prince who makes me bark and howl most of my lines because "if you wanna play a mangy dog you need to act the part". It's fine for the most part, but it gets pretty difficult to convey high concepts to the rest of my coterie and after a three or four hour session my throat is kinda raw Blitz7x posted:I'm a pretty new roleplayer (only played a little 13th age before this) so I'm not trying to rock the boat. I'm also new to the WoD universe and gangrel seemed like a vampire druid with sickass clawns and my character reflects that he doesn't know a whole bunch about the Camarilla society on his character sheet as flaws (to mask my irl ones). So yeah, maybe the ST really is Pussy Cartel fucked around with this message at 14:21 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 14:19
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Pussy Cartel posted:Presumably this ST is the same one that made the dude bark and howl all his lines like a dog because "That's what Gangrel are like lol": And yet this doesn't escape the fact that he sounds like a lovely GM.
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Aug 19, 2019 14:26
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Lol I dont fully believe the tale of someone who has to clarify that dominate was used against his will and boasts that he was the sole reason a boss was defeated therefore I'm a psychopath who wants to torture other players.
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Aug 19, 2019 14:26
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Metapod posted:Lol I dont fully believe the tale of someone who has to clarify that dominate was used against his will and boasts that he was the sole reason a boss was defeated therefore I'm a psychopath who wants to torture other players. This post makes no sense. In collaborative storytelling you for sure as hell are supposed to ask before you take away control of someone else's character. So the 'clarification' makes sense. And if the Gangrel is the only combat focused character then an extrapolation that they are the only reason the party survived a fight against another combat focused character is a valid one. The "issue" for you and Oberst is that you seem to view V5 as a game where you're supposed to play a Vampire in a specific way and if you don't play that way then you're doing it wrong at best, or a psychopath at worst.
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Aug 19, 2019 14:31
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THE CHARACTER THAT DIED WASN'T EVEN A GANGREL IT WAS A BRUJAH HOLY gently caress. I used to think that Oklahoma public schools were poo poo but clearly they teach critical reading better than most of the country (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Aug 19, 2019 14:35
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vampire...sucks lol
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Aug 19, 2019 14:35
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Metapod posted:THE CHARACTER THAT DIED WASN'T EVEN A GANGREL IT WAS A BRUJAH HOLY gently caress. I used to think that Oklahoma public schools were poo poo but clearly they teach critical reading better than most of the country They're still acting like colossal shitheads. Do you have anything to add outside of trying to dodge around dealing with the fundamental point of everyone's claims? Or are you just gonna keep on trying to excuse the lovely behavior of some tabletop gamers alongside nitpicking a single post and making an rear end of yourself? Archonex fucked around with this message at 14:42 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 14:39
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Metapod posted:THE CHARACTER THAT DIED WASN'T EVEN A GANGREL IT WAS A BRUJAH HOLY gently caress. I used to think that Oklahoma public schools were poo poo but clearly they teach critical reading better than most of the country you should evolve into butterfree and fly the gently caress out of this thread
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Aug 19, 2019 14:43
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Yes we should take everything someone who is mad and wants to be coddled says as 100% truth and agree that the st is a monster instead of trying to get more context. There is no chance at all the emotional goon could be making the story to make himself look better. Impossible really
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Aug 19, 2019 14:48
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Metapod posted:Yes we should take everything someone who is mad and wants to be coddled says as 100% truth and agree that the st is a monster instead of trying to get more context. There is no chance at all the emotional goon could be making the story to make himself look better. Impossible really Are we ignoring this ST's history of being a power-tripping rear end in a top hat in other situations, or are you really just this committed to your weird V5 ST supremacy gimmick
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Aug 19, 2019 14:51
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Pussy Cartel posted:Are we ignoring this ST's history of being a power-tripping rear end in a top hat in other situations, or are you really just this committed to your weird V5 ST supremacy gimmick How do we know that is the same dm? The first one is a weirdo for making him bark but thats for a gangrel not for the brujah that died.
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Aug 19, 2019 14:54
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why does it matter? if the 'emotional goon' is exaggerating for dramatic effect who loving cares?
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Aug 19, 2019 14:59
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