USPOL Fall: Biden the hand that feeds you

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unwantedplatypus: Sep 6, 2012

I feel like the CRIME is going to be even weirder than we think

# ? Sep 26, 2019 02:47

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# ? Jun 5, 2024 16:12

skylined!: Apr 6, 2012; THE DEM DEFENDER HAS LOGGED ON

https://twitter.com/ProBirdRights/status/1177036893860417536

# ? Sep 26, 2019 02:48

isaboo: Nov 11, 2002; Muay Buok
ขอให้โชคดี

Zwabu posted:

Sorry trying to keep up in a flood of posts - is it verified there is or was a recording of the Ukraine phone call? I've read one or two news items suggesting these calls are no longer recorded and we only have transcripts and notes from other listeners.

Not sure about that but the whistleblower complaint apparently indicates that the call to Ukraine has handled and recorded (whatever that means) in a way that drastically deviated from the norm whatever the norm is.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 02:49

drilldo squirt: Aug 18, 2006; a beautiful, soft meat sack; Clapping Larry

skylined! posted:

https://twitter.com/ProBirdRights/status/1177036893860417536

I believe it.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 02:49

Tatsuta Age: Apr 21, 2005; so good at being in trouble

unwantedplatypus posted:

I feel like the CRIME is going to be even weirder than we think

if its what you say I love it, especially later in summer

# ? Sep 26, 2019 02:53

SpaceCadetBob: Dec 27, 2012

All ive got to add that this poo poo is so crazy that it actually broke my ban on cable news watching, because f5ing this thread just aint enough to keep me sated.

Cant wait till the 9am hearing tomorrow.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 02:53

RandomBlue: Dec 30, 2012; hay guys!; Biscuit Hider

Otteration posted:

Thanks to Barr, the Mueller report was much squashed from the public consciousness. It would be nice to see an official impeachment-soepeona dredging into even just that.

Start the argument with Ukraine, then turn slowly with a quiet, "And by the way, here's some other crimes...." Maybe the dredge will hook into Barr and Pence in the meantime.

Not sure we should care about what "many idiots" believe while the Administration is currently Wiley Coyote.

I only care about what "many idiots" believe in this instance because we need a lot of republicans to vote to remove for this to actually get him out of office and they're not going to do that unless public opinion of their base supports that action.

I still think this is a win for us even if he isn't removed due to how bad this recent poo poo is.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 02:53

RandomBlue: Dec 30, 2012; hay guys!; Biscuit Hider

Zwabu posted:

Sorry trying to keep up in a flood of posts - is it verified there is or was a recording of the Ukraine phone call? I've read one or two news items suggesting these calls are no longer recorded and we only have transcripts and notes from other listeners.

The transcript released by the White House was pretty loving bad anyway: https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/Unclassified09.2019.pdf

# ? Sep 26, 2019 02:55

Otteration: Jan 4, 2014; I CAN'T SAY PRESIDENT DONALD JOHN TRUMP'S NAME BECAUSE HE'S LIKE THAT GUY FROM HARRY POTTER AND I'M AFRAID I'LL SUMMON HIM. DONALD JOHN TRUMP. YOUR FAVORITE PRESIDENT.
OUR 47TH PRESIDENT AFTER THE ONE WHO SHOWERS WITH HIS DAUGHTER DIES; Grimey Drawer

Farchanter posted:

The argument from Democratic leadership was that the surest way to remove Trump from office was to beat him in a fair election— that impeachment will fire up Trump's base like nothing else.

This call to Ukraine shows the folly of that thought: if Trump won't be punished for election interference, then obviously he'll do it again. In fact, he'll do it again so obviously that no one can deny he's doing it.

And the only way to get him to stop is to bring to bear the only punishment the House has that he actually cares about.

That, I think, is why this has mattered when nothing else has. The Ukraine call shows the naivety of waiting until next November.

Yeah, the bottom line may be as simple as enough Representatives from purple districts were hesitant to pursue impeachment for fear of getting voted out until the recent news changed their conscious or the conscious of their electorate. As the pro-impeachment statements started coming in, quite a few of them quoted yelling from their districts, IIRC.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 02:56

SpaceDrake: Dec 22, 2006; I can't avoid filling a game with awful memes, even if I want to. It's in my bones...!

FZeroRacer posted:

Here's my best guess:

Trump, in his Incredibly High Dimensional IQ, did and said something very blatantly illegal and confessed to it. There are multiple witnesses to him doing this incredibly stupid thing, and it's incredibly recent.

One or two of those and you could get away with lying about it. That's what we saw Mitch whenever he was called upon, he would worm his away around offering an answer by making appeals to his 'bad' memory. However if all three are true, then it becomes a lot harder to lie about it if you're reasonably concerned that you'll have to offer testimony. If you do lie about it and someone else doesn't, you're far up poo poo creek because now you've very obviously committed perjury for the sake of defending the dumbest man alive.

In the cases of Trump firing Comey or the Trump Tower meeting, they were able to muddy the waters enough that he could get away with it. I think the fact that they're not already trying to do so is indicative that they have no clue how to spin this thing.

My wild comedy-slash-hell-nightmare theory is that, after the call we know of, or a similar one, Trump then placed a call or contact of some sort to Putin or other government officials of the Russian Federation, stating that he was putting some pressure on Ukraine to help him with domestic politics, and if Zelensky doesn't play ball... well, the US will indeed stop military aid, and pledges not to intervene if something "happens" between Russia and Ukraine (or, given how dumb he is, just outright says "if you invade").

That'd be it - a President of the Party of Reagan, contacting the successor state to our longest-term antagonist, agreeing to sell one of the states the collapse of the Soviet Union created up the river if said smaller state didn't give Trump what he wanted. There would be no possible defense. Only the hardest core white supremacist fascists would still support him. The cognitive dissonance simply wouldn't hold up for most other folks. His whole administration would become poison.

And he'd come out and say he did it right after the intelligence officer testified to the House.

Granted, a significant part of me doesn't want this scenario to be true, because the wider geopolitical implications and ramifications would be terrifying. But my gut tells me it's this, or something of similar scope - something so damning concerning his international contacts that no amount of spin or justification can align it with what the party claims to be, both since Reagan and since Trump took office.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 02:58

isaboo: Nov 11, 2002; Muay Buok
ขอให้โชคดี

A guest on Chris Hayes' show (harvard law prof, can't remember his name) made a pretty succinct point that I think should be pushed further-

Regardless of the no quid pro quo argument the CHUDS keep using, the attempt itself undermines our right to self govern. Framing it that way and stating it outright is pretty powerful I think.

Btw, have any MSM outlets said anything about the IRS whistleblower? I haven't seen anything about it on CNN or MSNBC

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:00

Laterite: Mar 14, 2007; It's Gutfest '89; Grimey Drawer

Meanwhile, in The Cruelty Is The Point^TM:

https://twitter.com/MollyJongFast/status/1176809557970116611

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:00

Doctor Butts: May 21, 2002

I wonder what the final straw was for whatever toadie blew the whistle.

Imagine if Comey or Mueller had a quarter of the stones. Nah. gently caress that. Comey and Mueller are complicit.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:03

PIZZA.BAT: Nov 12, 2016

Shimrra Jamaane posted:

The silence from Republicans who�ve seen the report is deafening. I can�t be the only one to notice right?

Right after this story dropped someone said to give it three days for the Republicans to get their ducks in a row. I'm giving it until Friday for them to come out with a unified deflection of some sort. If we don't have anything by Monday then that will be really telling.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:05

ewiley: Jul 9, 2003; More trash for the trash fire

Doctor Butts posted:

I wonder what the final straw was for whatever toadie blew the whistle.

Imagine if Comey or Mueller had a quarter of the stones. Nah. gently caress that. Comey and Mueller are complicit.

I think it's appropriate that Trump gets done-in by an intel officer after that awful speech he gave on his second day in office at CIA headquarters (cue Greenwald breathlessly jumping in and getting mad about the IC)

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:06

Wistful of Dollars: Aug 25, 2009

ewiley posted:

I think it's appropriate that Trump gets done-in by an intel officer after that awful speech he gave on his second day in office at CIA headquarters (cue Greenwald breathlessly jumping in and getting mad about the IC)

Now that you mention it GG has been amazingly silent today.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:09

Otteration: Jan 4, 2014; I CAN'T SAY PRESIDENT DONALD JOHN TRUMP'S NAME BECAUSE HE'S LIKE THAT GUY FROM HARRY POTTER AND I'M AFRAID I'LL SUMMON HIM. DONALD JOHN TRUMP. YOUR FAVORITE PRESIDENT.
OUR 47TH PRESIDENT AFTER THE ONE WHO SHOWERS WITH HIS DAUGHTER DIES; Grimey Drawer

RandomBlue posted:

I only care about what "many idiots" believe in this instance because we need a lot of republicans to vote to remove for this to actually get him out of office and they're not going to do that unless public opinion of their base supports that action.

I still think this is a win for us even if he isn't removed due to how bad this recent poo poo is.

I think we should go into this impeachment realizing for now that the Senate Republicans are not going to vote to convict. Might as well dig up some poo poo in the mean time that can improve our country in the future and maybe hope the bad guys might turn in the end for the bonus.

I hope the orange poo poo smear survives the whole thing, with gobs of convictions attached to his name, and lives for some extra NY points too. Rikers is lovely this time of year, I hear.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:09

Mr Ice Cream Glove: Apr 22, 2007

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:09

Dapper_Swindler: Feb 14, 2012; Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Rex-Goliath posted:

Right after this story dropped someone said to give it three days for the Republicans to get their ducks in a row. I'm giving it until Friday for them to come out with a unified deflection of some sort. If we don't have anything by Monday then that will be really telling.

yeah. i think the issue is its very simple and open case of corruption and crimes and its tied directly to him plus a bunch of other poo poo. its basicaly the war equvilant of open bayonet charge across a flat part of no mans land with dozens of machine guns on the other side. i think they might gently caress him.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:10

RandomBlue: Dec 30, 2012; hay guys!; Biscuit Hider

Otteration posted:

I think we should go into this impeachment realizing for now that the Senate Republicans are not going to vote to convict. Might as well dig up some poo poo in the mean time that can improve our country in the future and maybe hope the bad guys might turn in the end for the bonus.

I hope the orange poo poo smear survives the whole thing, with gobs of convictions attached to his name, and lives for some extra NY points too. Rikers is lovely this time of year, I hear.

Yeah, I'm expecting him not to be removed but I've got a little hope. I think this hurts his 2020 chances regardless.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:12

Sundae: Dec 1, 2005

RandomBlue posted:

Yeah, I'm expecting him not to be removed but I've got a little hope. I think this hurts his 2020 chances regardless.

I'm hoping for stroking out on the toilet with his last tweet being PRESIDENTIAL HARASSMENT, but you do you. :v:

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:14

Lord Hydronium: Sep 25, 2007; Non, je ne regrette rien

Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:

Ew, the skin mask is slipping.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:15

Shimrra Jamaane: Aug 10, 2007; Obscure to all except those well-versed in Yuuzhan Vong lore.

https://twitter.com/ShibleyTelhami/status/1177038912751120384

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:15

Ogmius815: Aug 25, 2005; centrism is a hell of a drug

Wistful of Dollars posted:

Now that you mention it GG has been amazingly silent today.

The dude hates democrats more than he hates Trump. Today was good for democrats, so he was unhappy.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:16

Ogmius815: Aug 25, 2005; centrism is a hell of a drug

Shimrra Jamaane posted:

https://twitter.com/ShibleyTelhami/status/1177038912751120384

I�m so upset that this complaint isn�t public.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:17

Kaal: May 22, 2002; through thousands of posts in D&D over a decade, I now believe I know what I'm talking about. if I post forcefully and confidently, I can convince others that is true. no one sees through my facade.

The Republicans have already openly stated that they will not convict Donald regardless of how illegal his actions are, so the Democrats will simply need to rake him and his fellow GOP conspirators over the coals in the public eye. Moscow Mitch is going to try to wrap this up as quickly as possible, because the reality is that the longer these inquiries go on the more illegal activities they're going to uncover, and the worse it will look when the Republicans ignore it all for their own benefit.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:19

marshmonkey: Dec 5, 2003; I was sick of looking
at your stupid avatar
so
have a cool cat instead.; Switchblade Switcharoo

https://twitter.com/michaelcrowley/status/1177038787148468225?s=21

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:19

ewiley: Jul 9, 2003; More trash for the trash fire

Ogmius815 posted:

I�m so upset that this complaint isn�t public.

To be fair, it probably has something like "our mole Slavov in the Ukrainian government, corroborated some conversation about X" in it which really needs to not be released.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:19

nine-gear crow: Aug 10, 2013

Ogmius815 posted:

I�m so upset that this complaint isn�t public.

Same. Everyone who's seen the report has come away from it looking like they just stared into the reactor core at Chernobyl, it's apparently that hosed up.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:19

TyrantWD: Nov 6, 2010; Ignore my doomerism, I don't think better things are possible

Rex-Goliath posted:

Right after this story dropped someone said to give it three days for the Republicans to get their ducks in a row. I'm giving it until Friday for them to come out with a unified deflection of some sort. If we don't have anything by Monday then that will be really telling.

I�m expecting them to try and sweep this under the rug and never mention it again. They will just go on about the American public don�t care about this Ukraine stuff and are focused on the economy, and pretend like they have no clue why the Democrats are trying to impeach Trump. �The Dummycrats are trying to impeach the president for simply having a phone call with the Ukrainian president! I ate a pierogi for lunch yesterday, are they going to try and impeach me too?!�

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:19

skylined!: Apr 6, 2012; THE DEM DEFENDER HAS LOGGED ON

Ogmius815 posted:

I�m so upset that this complaint isn�t public.

It�ll be given to the entirety of congress in a week or two and the leaks will be massive.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:20

RandomBlue: Dec 30, 2012; hay guys!; Biscuit Hider

Sundae posted:

I'm hoping for stroking out on the toilet with his last tweet being PRESIDENTIAL HARASSMENT, but you do you.

Well yeah, obviously.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:21

Dr. Red Ranger: Nov 9, 2011; Nap Ghost

Shimrra Jamaane posted:

https://twitter.com/ShibleyTelhami/status/1177038912751120384

Well, uh, when does the public get to know?

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:22

Kaal: May 22, 2002; through thousands of posts in D&D over a decade, I now believe I know what I'm talking about. if I post forcefully and confidently, I can convince others that is true. no one sees through my facade.

skylined! posted:

It�ll be given to the entirety of congress in a week or two and the leaks will be massive.

I hope so. It's fairly clear that the initial stage of each of Trump's scandals has the most opportunity for making an impression on the public.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:22

Dick Trauma: Nov 30, 2007; God damn it, you've got to be kind.

https://twitter.com/PeteMundo/status/1177017700968751110

https://twitter.com/HNSeal2/status/1177040240739061762

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:22

Otteration: Jan 4, 2014; I CAN'T SAY PRESIDENT DONALD JOHN TRUMP'S NAME BECAUSE HE'S LIKE THAT GUY FROM HARRY POTTER AND I'M AFRAID I'LL SUMMON HIM. DONALD JOHN TRUMP. YOUR FAVORITE PRESIDENT.
OUR 47TH PRESIDENT AFTER THE ONE WHO SHOWERS WITH HIS DAUGHTER DIES; Grimey Drawer

RandomBlue posted:

Yeah, I'm expecting him not to be removed but I've got a little hope. I think this hurts his 2020 chances regardless.

Pretty sure that right now his 2020 chances look like burnt toast shoved into the disposal with a loud, "gently caress, how did I do that?!"

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:22

Otteration: Jan 4, 2014; I CAN'T SAY PRESIDENT DONALD JOHN TRUMP'S NAME BECAUSE HE'S LIKE THAT GUY FROM HARRY POTTER AND I'M AFRAID I'LL SUMMON HIM. DONALD JOHN TRUMP. YOUR FAVORITE PRESIDENT.
OUR 47TH PRESIDENT AFTER THE ONE WHO SHOWERS WITH HIS DAUGHTER DIES; Grimey Drawer

Ogmius815 posted:

I�m so upset that this complaint isn�t public.

It will be.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:23

Data Graham: Dec 28, 2009; 📈📊🍪😋

SpaceDrake posted:

The thing is, I feel like this relates to what other goons were talking about w/r/t Mueller; the investigation for Mueller took for-e-ver, banged on the same points over and over, summarizing it took ages and new developments required following the convoluted thing from the start, et cetera.The Nixon hearings were the same way in that they took ages to fully unravel and there was all the fighting over getting the tapes, chasing down corroboration, etc. Even Billy C's thing was annoying because it got so raunchy and relied a lot on "what did he say or not say".

But here? While I doubt we can keep this pace up for too much longer, it definitely seems like we haven't nearly heard everything yet, and so long as there's at least one spicy new revelation a week for a while, The Donny Trump Show is going to become the hottest hour of TV in town for everybody. Seeing the Democrats actually do poo poo is going to energize both ends of the base significantly and generate goodwill that more stuff will happen if the Dems win it all in 2020, so it's a grand slam for them and there's no reason not to do it. And Trump's always been good at drawing in crowds, but with his dementia clearly progressing by the day and no way to actually rein him in, it's not actually doing to do the Republicans who are just career cowards and hitched their saddle to fascism for an easy ride any good when the horse goes totally wild.

I don't disagree with any of this, but it does make me kinda mad to think that Trump has been right all along by making it all about Ratings

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:24

Tibalt: May 14, 2017; What, drawn, and talk of peace! I hate the word, As I hate hell, all Montagues, and thee

All the reporting I've read so far say that the other committees investigating other crimes are going to keep on trucking, but a consensus may be forming around sending articles of impeachment narrowly focused on Ukraine.

There's nothing stopping the House from submitting additional articles of impeachment, but I feel like it's going to be a one- time thing. While putting Trump on trial multiple times going into the election would be hilarious, I think it would be counterproductive for removing him and other Republicans from office.

But shooting your shot so soon has the potential for letting impeachment fade from public consciousness before it can affect the Senate races.

Hrm.

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:26

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# ? Jun 5, 2024 16:12

CommieGIR: Aug 22, 2006; The blue glow is a feature, not a bug; Pillbug

https://twitter.com/LarryNoble_DC/status/1176980507667652608?s=09

# ? Sep 26, 2019 03:26

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > USPOL Fall: Biden the hand that feeds you

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