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vincentpricesboner posted:Thats like saying putting another chair up against a door isn't doing anything to help keep a door closed. Voting for the CPC's opposition is in effect, a vote taken away from the cons. I think the fundamental disagreement you and I have is that you're approaching voting as a negative action and I'm approaching it as a positive action. You're seeing it as canceling out someone else's vote or taking away a vote from the Conservatives, whereas I'm seeing it as adding a vote to the party you choose to vote for. So when you see your riding as a two-horse race, you're using your vote as a way to subtract a vote from the Conservatives, whereas I see your action as adding a vote to the Liberals. So from your point of view, voting NDP or turning in a blank ballot or writing "hail Satan" or whatever is something being done instead of subtracting a vote from the Conservatives. Whereas from mine, what you're doing is using your voice to support everything the Liberals do by adding a vote to them, which you could be using to instead support the things other parties do by adding your vote to their runner-up totals. Your approach is essentially "voting is harm reduction" whereas mine is that I cannot in good conscience add my vote to a party that will do massive amounts of harm to our country and our planet, just because their primary opponent will likely do even more harm. Here's an article that I think does a decent job of summarizing why many of us reject the voting-as-harm-reduction idea, especially here in Canada where we actually do have alternative parties to vote for: quote:Is voting really “harm reduction”? You may see voting as harm reduction, but on election night when the votes are counted there's no difference between a Liberal vote cast because the voter was scared of the Conservatives and a Liberal vote cast because the voter was an enthusiastic supporter of pipeline development, arms sales to genocidal dictatorships, blocking billions of dollars of settlement money from being paid out to Indigenous Canadians, and our abominable FPTP voting system. Those two votes both get counted exactly the same, as little +1s telling Justin Trudeau that he can just keep on keeping on because one way or another Canadians will vote for him instead of giving their votes to a party that wants to do better.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 05:14 |
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# ? Jun 10, 2024 05:28 |
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Pinterest Mom posted:It was a pretty substantial change: at the low end of the income distribution, something like ~$1,000/year/child for every year until the kid turns 18. Yeah, $83 a month is not nothing, especially at the poverty line. Like, if nothing else, lunches for the month.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 05:16 |
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Ah yes, weed "legalization", where every single province is posting a loss because nobody but big corporations that donate to the Liberals are allowed to get licenses, where arrests continue at the exact same pace, and actual medical cannabis patients are having their court-defined rights trampled on because they kept the Harper era system on the books 100% unmodified. If you are going to say things like this at least please have half a clue what you are talking about.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 06:32 |
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After trying to their best to keep her away from any media for months and coast by, the CPC finally gives up and lets her go and gives up the riding because you can't paper over her recent homophobic and transphobic ramblings. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/heather-leung-campaign-media-strategy-1.5308429
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 07:03 |
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So she's going to be running on the PPC ticket then? e: loving CBC posted:Controversial positions
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 07:11 |
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quote:Asked if Leung had granted any interviews throughout the campaign, Trost referred to a CTV News story in which the reporter said the campaign manager was in the process of setting up an on-camera interview with the candidate, but was "strong-armed by higher-ups in the party." They knew she was a previous municipal candidate with horrible values on record, but wanted to try and slip her in, and failed.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 07:28 |
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They succeeded though. She’s still going to be on the ballot as a Conservative.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 07:49 |
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Franks Happy Place posted:Ah yes, weed "legalization", where every single province is posting a loss because nobody but big corporations that donate to the Liberals are allowed to get licenses, where arrests continue at the exact same pace, and actual medical cannabis patients are having their court-defined rights trampled on because they kept the Harper era system on the books 100% unmodified. I'd like the receipts on their being the same # of arrests for cannabis use. And tell me more about how the medical system just got worse, I am a medical cannabis patient myself. I know it wasn't perfect, but gently caress if saying keeping it illegal was better.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 13:20 |
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joke's on you idiots, my MP is diane finley and she's gonna win again so i can vote whatever i want without a care in the world. this is what it means to be truly free.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 14:13 |
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Ugh Jagmeets drinking water statements might actually induce me to vote.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 16:30 |
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More and more signs popping up in Renfrew. We've got three conservative candidates running: an independent "Alternative Conservative", the PPC fash, and Cheryl Gallant. Apparently our NDP candidate is supposed to be pretty sharp, but I've not seen or heard anything from her, so this is gonna be a depressing vote.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 16:32 |
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for Robert falcon ouellette (USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 16:33 |
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crazy eyes mustafa posted:for Robert falcon ouellette I think he barged into one of my university classes to tell us all to go vote for him. It’s been a while though and I may be misremembering. Vote for uh, Leah Gazan.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 16:48 |
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crazy eyes mustafa posted:for Robert falcon ouellette gently caress I hope not, Leah Gazan is one of the best NDP candidates running
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 16:49 |
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littleorv posted:I think he barged into one of my university classes to tell us all to go vote for him. It’s been a while though and I may be misremembering. He did the same thing at the Bon festival over at the Japanese cultural center a couple weeks ago. I hope Leah Gazan grinds him into the dirt.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:01 |
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The nominally center left party holding leftist votes hostage against the right is peak succ
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:12 |
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Salean posted:The nominally center left party holding leftist votes hostage against the right is peak succ I always think about how the Ontario Liberals kamikazed themselves to take out the ndp and elect Doug Ford.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:15 |
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Salean posted:The nominally center left party holding leftist votes hostage against the right is peak succ It's pretty telling when the most compelling argument for voting Liberal is 'they're not Andrew Scheer'
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:26 |
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littleorv posted:I always think about how the Ontario Liberals kamikazed themselves to take out the ndp and elect Doug Ford. Yeah Horwath had it locked up then bam. She'll get it next time though.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:28 |
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A Typical Goon posted:It's pretty telling when the most compelling argument for voting Liberal is 'they're not Andrew Scheer' Hmm, I thought I read somewhere that 300k kids out of poverty ain't nothing?
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:29 |
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vincentpricesboner posted:I'd like the receipts on their being the same # of arrests for cannabis use. And tell me more about how the medical system just got worse, I am a medical cannabis patient myself. They continue to arrest people for selling weed and they won't expunge more than a fraction of a fraction of prior cannabis convictions sooooo...? And since you won't say it: I work in the cannabis industry full time as a licensing consultant and aside from my personal business which is doing super awesome because of this insane bulkshit, nearly every single other person, whether a cannabis user or not, has been negatively affected by the absolutely stupid way they have rolled this out. The Liberals were warned this would be an economic tsunami, they ignored the warning, and now tens of thousands of marginalized people across rural Canada (especially BC) are losing their livelihood, all so Trudeau could pretend to actually keep an election promise for a change. gently caress that noise in the ear. Franks Happy Place fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Oct 6, 2019 |
# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:33 |
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Franks Happy Place posted:They continue to arrest people for selling weed and they won't expunge more than a fraction of a fraction of prior cannabis convictions sooooo...? Maybe if people talked more about Trudeau's dead criminal brother it might get him to change his mind? Because his dead brother committed what were crimes at the time, after all.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:34 |
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littleorv posted:I always think about how the Ontario Liberals kamikazed themselves to take out the ndp and elect Doug Ford. From time to time, I think about things that didn't happen, too, but they don't provide a lot of information for political discussions.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:35 |
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Franks Happy Place posted:They continue to arrest people for selling weed and they won't expunge more than a fraction of a fraction of prior cannabis convictions sooooo...? You should do an ask/tell or effortpost in this thread about it. Is your business working in the rec field or medical? I'm curious to know more "inside baseball" stuff about legal weed.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:43 |
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eXXon posted:Hmm, I thought I read somewhere that 300k kids out of poverty ain't nothing? Yet somehow "not Scheer" is still more compelling.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:46 |
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tagesschau posted:From time to time, I think about things that didn't happen, too, but they don't provide a lot of information for political discussions. Umm once it became apparent that the Ontario liberals weren't able to win the leader of the Ontario libs begged and pleaded with its own voter base to strategically vote conservative to keep the NDP from winning.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:48 |
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eXXon posted:Hmm, I thought I read somewhere that 300k kids out of poverty ain't nothing? He had 4 years and an ironclad majority and that's all he's done?
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:50 |
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Reality Sinner posted:He had 4 years and an ironclad majority and that's all he's done? He bought a pipeline too
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 17:55 |
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 18:06 |
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The economic success of this pipeline has allowed us to lift 300k kids from poverty. All hail pipeline.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 18:12 |
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crazy eyes mustafa posted:for Robert falcon ouellette
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 18:21 |
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Reality Sinner posted:He had 4 years and an ironclad majority and that's all he's done? They commissioned a long report about national pharmacare and promised to spend some money on an unspecified plan sometime in the next 4 years. Also, your question seems to imply that the Liberals actually wanted to accomplish more, which only a small fraction of their caucus is interested in. Reality Sinner posted:The economic success of this pipeline has allowed us to lift 300k kids from poverty. All hail pipeline. Sounds like we need a pipeline to dump our poverty into somewhere remote where no white people live.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 18:21 |
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tagesschau posted:From time to time, I think about things that didn't happen, too, but they don't provide a lot of information for political discussions. I don't know if it was a intentional but the OLP sure did a lot of stupid poo poo to go from 56 seats to losing official party status and remember Libs>Fascists>Socialists. However you could also argue it's what led to the largest NDP surge since Rae Days crippled them. vyelkin posted:You may see voting as harm reduction, but on election night when the votes are counted there's no difference between a Liberal vote cast because the voter was scared of the Conservatives and a Liberal vote cast because the voter was an enthusiastic supporter of pipeline development, arms sales to genocidal dictatorships, blocking billions of dollars of settlement money from being paid out to Indigenous Canadians, and our abominable FPTP voting system. Those two votes both get counted exactly the same, as little +1s telling Justin Trudeau that he can just keep on keeping on because one way or another Canadians will vote for him instead of giving their votes to a party that wants to do better. Well put but I need more convincing. If you choose not to place a harm reduction vote my understanding is that it's with the assumption it will lead to greater change down the line. Is there an element of accelerationism in this? Do you think a Scheer government will lead to some great surge from the left that will bring forth a new golden age of socialism? If so sign me up! However I feel like unless we get a complete and utter collapse of the LPC or a charismatic NDP leader on the level of Layton there's little chance of this happening. What if I'm in a riding that has never gone to a party other than the LPC or CPC and I'm confident there is no chance of that changing in the next few election cycles? I understand change happens gradually and if everyone operates under this assumption nothing will change but... I don't have answer to that. I just want to feel less bad if Scheer wins, reduce the harm if you will. Levin fucked around with this message at 18:38 on Oct 6, 2019 |
# ? Oct 6, 2019 18:35 |
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EvilJoven posted:Umm once it became apparent that the Ontario liberals weren't able to win the leader of the Ontario libs begged and pleaded with its own voter base to strategically vote conservative to keep the NDP from winning. Again, this is a thing that didn't happen. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/wynne-liberals-ontario-election-minority-government-1.4689222 CBC posted:An emotional Kathleen Wynne [...] encouraged voters to elect Liberal candidates to prevent the NDP or PCs from securing a majority. The Liberals' share of the vote came did not move at all from where they were polling when Wynne made this statement; there was no massive defection from the Liberals to the Tories. The Conservatives outperformed their polling numbers, and the NDP underperformed. This was almost certainly due to turnout; it's a common pattern that right-of-center voters are more reliable. tagesschau fucked around with this message at 18:47 on Oct 6, 2019 |
# ? Oct 6, 2019 18:44 |
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This is dumb as hell, but Lowtax’s spine isn’t gonna fix itself: I’m gonna that the Bloq Quebecois will end up with more seats than the NDP.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 23:11 |
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Adam Van Koeverden over Lisa Raitt
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 23:27 |
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Risky Bisquick posted:Adam Van Koeverden over Lisa Raitt I had no idea this former Olympic hero was running. He sounds like the perfect Liberal! quote:People always ask me “why are you running, what do you believe in?”... Wikipedia, with no source posted:He has said that "Both the Left Wing and the Right Wing have good ideas". Well, best of luck against Raitt, especially if that quote is fictional. But a great campaign slogan would be 'Not left, not right, but Canada '.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 23:45 |
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The phrasing is wrong but "I believe politics could use a little sportsmanship. I trained with my competitors because we had the same goals, and winning was easier when we joined forces. I joined the party in the middle because I genuinely want to work with everyone. There are good ideas on both sides of the political spectrum, and as a Liberal, I think I’m well positioned to collaborate." is a real quote.
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# ? Oct 6, 2019 23:46 |
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Sounds about right for a person who acts like playing sports is a meaningful part of a resume.
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# ? Oct 7, 2019 00:20 |
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# ? Jun 10, 2024 05:28 |
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Pinterest Mom posted:The phrasing is wrong but Yeah buddy, you don't have to tell us you're down to collaborate if you're a Lib.
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# ? Oct 7, 2019 00:29 |