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The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > USPOL Fall: Biden the hand that feeds you
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TulliusCicero
Jul 29, 2017

Ague Proof posted:

The House of the Rising Sun? Seriously?

Remember, boomers are in a constant state of nostalgia thinking they are still anti-establishment hippies, when in reality they are the most selfish war mongering generation alive

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 01:49
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# ? Jun 5, 2024 11:12
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Dick Trauma
Nov 30, 2007

God damn it, you've got to be kind.
https://twitter.com/ddale8/status/1184994793002360832

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 01:50
  • Quote
tokyo reject
Jun 12, 2019

when she's tryin to slide into your dm's but you wanna talk about a better america

Otteration posted:

Also apparently "Try to predict tomorrow via a historically and monumentally hosed up 2016 election thirty."

Someone get a phd student to graph "trump administration fucks up more hugely than ever before today" posts vs. "omg all is lost today" posts.

Nobody is saying “omg all is lost today”. I’m saying it wouldn’t hurt to see the Democrats have a plan in the unlikely event of a worst case scenario.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 01:50
  • Quote
Pigbuster
Sep 12, 2010

Fun Shoe

tokyo reject posted:

I freely admit I don’t have the specific answer to that question. That’s why I try to vote for the best reps I can. Because I’m not in congress, a lawyer, or in the military, how would I be able to specifically answer that?

What I *CAN* say though, is to “prepare” better than our reps did for the inevitable emoluments violations, the flagrant cronyism, the open corruptions and literal “what are you gonna do about it” responses, a potential Supreme Court demurring, the Mueller report being defanged by Barr, Kushner openly courting Saudi funding, the list goes on - I mean I’d just like to see Democrats actually loving be prepared in ADVANCE for obviously potential conflicts that can have disastrous outcomes for all of us. Like, why is that so loving offensive?

Trump has cleaned up shop in ways that were unimaginable to most (and obviously Dems in Congress) in 2016. And all we get is verbal outrage, and “yeah but thems rules are the rules even though we’re the only ones who play by them”.

How likely is it we have a nuclear winter? Not very likely, yet there are systems in place in he military for it in the event it happens. Why is it so much to ask that Democrats *for once* act like some unexpected poo poo might happen, and not fumble the ball when it does.

That’s not being “overly negative”, it’s not being “broke brained”, it’s not acting like “all is lost”, it’s called having a loving plan.

But here’s a start, how bout the Dems take some loving advice from Rick Wilson’s tweets and loving do some MESSAGING. You know, the BASIC poo poo. Because all this acting like things aren’t possible only to be consistently proven that they are, in fact possible, is just plain stupid at this point.

Trying to write up a plan for "Trump declares himself prez for life and the government & military actually backs him for some godforsaken reason" is pointless - that scenario means the government has completely fallen apart. The "plan" for that is civil war.


pkay posted:

They seem to line up behind this 'man they hate' at every opportunity...

He's literally their boss. They either follow his orders or they lose/quit their job, something that you may have noticed is happening uncommonly often! If he's voted out he's not their boss anymore.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 01:54
  • Quote
pkay
Jan 4, 2005
"You and your ilk just made me vote downticket R in the midterms."
- a black man (- a magachud)

Old Kentucky Shark posted:

The Ukraine fiasco played out the way it did precisely because Trump doesn’t have an army of diehard loyalist thugs willing to commit treason at his beck and call; instead, he has Rudy Giuliani.

No, this is absolutely not the case. The reason it played out the way it did is because Trump had an army of diehard loyalist thugs willing to commit treason for him. The reason he was exposed is because a CIA op loving snitched his dumbass out.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 01:55
  • Quote
pkay
Jan 4, 2005
"You and your ilk just made me vote downticket R in the midterms."
- a black man (- a magachud)

Pigbuster posted:

Trying to write up a plan for "Trump declares himself prez for life and the government & military actually backs him for some godforsaken reason" is pointless - that scenario means the government has completely fallen apart. The "plan" for that is civil war.


He's literally their boss. They either follow his orders or they lose/quit their job, something that you may have noticed is happening uncommonly often! If he's voted out he's not their boss anymore.

I'm talking about Republican congressional members, chuds and whatnot. Im not talking about a military coup, im talking about him doing the same poo poo that he has been doing his entire presidency. He's not going to go "im prez for life", hes going to do the poo poo they said Obama would do and declare martial law or some such. Claim the election results are invalid and delay,distract and obstruct until he wins.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:00
  • Quote
syntaxrigger
Jul 7, 2011

Actually you owe me 6! But who's countin?

Skex posted:

:words:

... just how weak they and their way of thinking truly is. But they are weak, conservatives are always weak. Because they are ruled by their fear and while that makes them dangerous it's also why they will lose in the end.

:words:

This post came off to me as part inspiring and part trying to deep cut PJ through the internet.

While I don't believe that PJ is part of the "downer brigade" as you mention I am willing to believe you focus on her in this post because you see them a part of yourself.

I think the best thing to take away in this post is what I have left in the quote. As much as regressivies would love to control the outcome of people's decisions that is not a power humans are capable of. I believe that a progressive mindset is rooted in vulnerability and inclusiveness rather than fear. It is because of that progressive ideals will win.

This guy can say it better than me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIxs6vFIlNw

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:00
  • Quote
Ague Proof
Jun 5, 2014

they told me
I was everything
https://twitter.com/ddale8/status/1184995740923449347

You plant a baby tree.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:05
  • Quote
FreshCutFries
Sep 15, 2007

Skex posted:

You know, for someone who talks a lot of poo poo about messaging and fighting for what's right, you spend an awful lot of time doing everythign in your power to demotivate people and sap any hope in anything.

I mean seriously I'm sure glad it wasn't defeatists like you and Vital Signs and the other we're doomed the enemy is implacable and unstoppable who were leading the last time we took on the Fascists, or who fought for suffrage or civil rights or unions. Because frankly all of this woe is me everything is horrible and nothing will ever get better crap is the exact loving opposite from being inspiring.

There is always some existential threat hanging over our heads, in the 30s and 40s it was fascism, from the 50s to the 80s is nuclear annihilation and acid rain and smog. There was malaise and racism on a scale that makes this look quaint. Because the racists and bigots weren't some loud vocal minority they where the majority who were running poo poo. there was no left wing media, no pod casts, no discussion forums or twitter or social media for people to organize over, Unless you were in a handful of liberal strongholds around certain universities there were no leftists or at least we learned to be circumspect. You wonder why Elizabeth Warren says that she's a capitalist? Because she came of age in that time.

I'm 49 so I'm not really that old but I remember the early Bush years and 9/11 and how the country collectively lost their mind. I railed about the stolen election when the GOP blatantly robbed Gore of what should have been his victory, I remember the depression when I watched the tower fall and telling my friend "well I guess they're going get their Iraq invasion" I remember the protests and how they got no media attention.

You have resources and weapons I'd have literally killed for at your disposal. high definition recording devices, ways to communicate that bypass the corporate media filters.

I'm so sick and tired of the downer brigade who all enlightened and wise and talk all kinds of poo poo about how we should be fighting doing everything in your power to sap people of any kind of hope or motivation, we're all going to loving die at some point and there will come a day when humanity will be no more when there will be no one around who even remembers us it may be a million or even a billion or possibly tomorrow. That's not a reason to give up. We fight and we struggle until our bodies quit and we hope that we leave the world a little bit better than we found it.

How the gently caress you can look around and see the level of energy building against this assholes, see AOC , Ilhan Omar, Rashida Talib and of these inspiring competent brilliant people rising to the moment and think "we're doomed" is loving beyond me. We're currently having a Democratic primary where two of the top 3 candidates are calling for nationalized single payer healthcare and the moderate is calling for what was viewed as political fantasy in 2008. We have millions of children marching in the streets world wide to agitate for action on climate change. Celebrities no bodies and millions of people energized motivated and fired the gently caress up registering voters talking to people advocating.

Yet you continue to focus only on the negative, you act like because we haven't won already that nothing will ever improve. A friend of mine was telling me the other day about how his father a black man who came of age during the depression recalled WW2, he said there were two years where there was no good news nothing, just losses all while watching the Axis expand their influence. They didn't give up, they put their heads down and prepared and sacrificed and when they were ready they attacked and turned the tide. Just like the activists in the Civil Rights movement didn't give up, like how the laborers who built the Unions didn't give up, the women who wanted the vote, the abolitionists who brought about the end of slavery. All of these people faced impossible odds condemnation, violence oppression, the mechanisms of the state turned against them and a lot of times they lost, they got beat down, but they kept going because they had hope.

That's how this poo poo works, it's how it has always worked, better ideas take time to gain support then there will always be a reaction as the old order tries to reassert itself, but as long as we maintain hope, we keep working and fighting we will prevail. You have to believe that, because that belief is what will give you the strength and motivation to push through the poo poo, to make the sacrifices to weather the losses to do what has to be done to make it true.

Maybe it's just residual conditioning from your upbringing, that because those awful people had so much power over you , you can't see just how weak they and their way of thinking truly is. But they are weak, conservatives are always weak. Because they are ruled by their fear and while that makes them dangerous it's also why they will lose in the end.

I look around the world and I see hope, I see billions of people waking up and saying WTF, I see a scared minority and their desperate attempt to hold back the inevitable.

Of course the regressives have thrown away the rules, of course they're resorting to bullying and brute force. They don't have anything else. they're desperate they are afraid, they don't have the numbers, they don't have the ideas and they don't have hope. Stop thinking that perfection is the only progress. perfection is an impossible goal, we just keep working to make things better and eventually someone will look around and go "wow things are pretty sweet."

You know how I know this? Because I'm watching my 11 year old daughter work through her, I mean they're sexuality and while it may seem weird to me because of how I grew up, it's this beautiful amazing thing to see because that just never would have happened when I was a child in the 80s, so as bad things may be now with Trump and the loving Nazis trying their damnedest to turn back the clock I listen to the journey my children are going through and I feel hope. You should too.
* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:07
  • Quote
Ate My Balls Redux
Aug 2, 2018

by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

Skex posted:

You know, for someone who talks a lot of poo poo about messaging and fighting for what's right, you spend an awful lot of time doing everythign in your power to demotivate people and sap any hope in anything.

I mean seriously I'm sure glad it wasn't defeatists like you and Vital Signs and the other we're doomed the enemy is implacable and unstoppable who were leading the last time we took on the Fascists, or who fought for suffrage or civil rights or unions. Because frankly all of this woe is me everything is horrible and nothing will ever get better crap is the exact loving opposite from being inspiring.

There is always some existential threat hanging over our heads, in the 30s and 40s it was fascism, from the 50s to the 80s is nuclear annihilation and acid rain and smog. There was malaise and racism on a scale that makes this look quaint. Because the racists and bigots weren't some loud vocal minority they where the majority who were running poo poo. there was no left wing media, no pod casts, no discussion forums or twitter or social media for people to organize over, Unless you were in a handful of liberal strongholds around certain universities there were no leftists or at least we learned to be circumspect. You wonder why Elizabeth Warren says that she's a capitalist? Because she came of age in that time.

I'm 49 so I'm not really that old but I remember the early Bush years and 9/11 and how the country collectively lost their mind. I railed about the stolen election when the GOP blatantly robbed Gore of what should have been his victory, I remember the depression when I watched the tower fall and telling my friend "well I guess they're going get their Iraq invasion" I remember the protests and how they got no media attention.

You have resources and weapons I'd have literally killed for at your disposal. high definition recording devices, ways to communicate that bypass the corporate media filters.

I'm so sick and tired of the downer brigade who all enlightened and wise and talk all kinds of poo poo about how we should be fighting doing everything in your power to sap people of any kind of hope or motivation, we're all going to loving die at some point and there will come a day when humanity will be no more when there will be no one around who even remembers us it may be a million or even a billion or possibly tomorrow. That's not a reason to give up. We fight and we struggle until our bodies quit and we hope that we leave the world a little bit better than we found it.

How the gently caress you can look around and see the level of energy building against this assholes, see AOC , Ilhan Omar, Rashida Talib and of these inspiring competent brilliant people rising to the moment and think "we're doomed" is loving beyond me. We're currently having a Democratic primary where two of the top 3 candidates are calling for nationalized single payer healthcare and the moderate is calling for what was viewed as political fantasy in 2008. We have millions of children marching in the streets world wide to agitate for action on climate change. Celebrities no bodies and millions of people energized motivated and fired the gently caress up registering voters talking to people advocating.

Yet you continue to focus only on the negative, you act like because we haven't won already that nothing will ever improve. A friend of mine was telling me the other day about how his father a black man who came of age during the depression recalled WW2, he said there were two years where there was no good news nothing, just losses all while watching the Axis expand their influence. They didn't give up, they put their heads down and prepared and sacrificed and when they were ready they attacked and turned the tide. Just like the activists in the Civil Rights movement didn't give up, like how the laborers who built the Unions didn't give up, the women who wanted the vote, the abolitionists who brought about the end of slavery. All of these people faced impossible odds condemnation, violence oppression, the mechanisms of the state turned against them and a lot of times they lost, they got beat down, but they kept going because they had hope.

That's how this poo poo works, it's how it has always worked, better ideas take time to gain support then there will always be a reaction as the old order tries to reassert itself, but as long as we maintain hope, we keep working and fighting we will prevail. You have to believe that, because that belief is what will give you the strength and motivation to push through the poo poo, to make the sacrifices to weather the losses to do what has to be done to make it true.

Maybe it's just residual conditioning from your upbringing, that because those awful people had so much power over you , you can't see just how weak they and their way of thinking truly is. But they are weak, conservatives are always weak. Because they are ruled by their fear and while that makes them dangerous it's also why they will lose in the end.

I look around the world and I see hope, I see billions of people waking up and saying WTF, I see a scared minority and their desperate attempt to hold back the inevitable.

Of course the regressives have thrown away the rules, of course they're resorting to bullying and brute force. They don't have anything else. they're desperate they are afraid, they don't have the numbers, they don't have the ideas and they don't have hope. Stop thinking that perfection is the only progress. perfection is an impossible goal, we just keep working to make things better and eventually someone will look around and go "wow things are pretty sweet."

You know how I know this? Because I'm watching my 11 year old daughter work through her, I mean they're sexuality and while it may seem weird to me because of how I grew up, it's this beautiful amazing thing to see because that just never would have happened when I was a child in the 80s, so as bad things may be now with Trump and the loving Nazis trying their damnedest to turn back the clock I listen to the journey my children are going through and I feel hope. You should too.

Counterpoint: We are on an insanely short clock re: Climate Change, to a level beyond the urgency of any other crisis in human history, and incrementalism won't save us.

Our response to Climate Change must be perfection and it must be quick.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:09
  • Quote
Prester Jane
Nov 4, 2008

by Hand Knit

Skex posted:

You know, for someone who talks a lot of poo poo about messaging and fighting for what's right, you spend an awful lot of time doing everythign in your power to demotivate people and sap any hope in anything.

I mean seriously I'm sure glad it wasn't defeatists like you and Vital Signs and the other we're doomed the enemy is implacable and unstoppable who were leading the last time we took on the Fascists, or who fought for suffrage or civil rights or unions. Because frankly all of this woe is me everything is horrible and nothing will ever get better crap is the exact loving opposite from being inspiring.

There is always some existential threat hanging over our heads, in the 30s and 40s it was fascism, from the 50s to the 80s is nuclear annihilation and acid rain and smog. There was malaise and racism on a scale that makes this look quaint. Because the racists and bigots weren't some loud vocal minority they where the majority who were running poo poo. there was no left wing media, no pod casts, no discussion forums or twitter or social media for people to organize over, Unless you were in a handful of liberal strongholds around certain universities there were no leftists or at least we learned to be circumspect. You wonder why Elizabeth Warren says that she's a capitalist? Because she came of age in that time.

I'm 49 so I'm not really that old but I remember the early Bush years and 9/11 and how the country collectively lost their mind. I railed about the stolen election when the GOP blatantly robbed Gore of what should have been his victory, I remember the depression when I watched the tower fall and telling my friend "well I guess they're going get their Iraq invasion" I remember the protests and how they got no media attention.

You have resources and weapons I'd have literally killed for at your disposal. high definition recording devices, ways to communicate that bypass the corporate media filters.

I'm so sick and tired of the downer brigade who all enlightened and wise and talk all kinds of poo poo about how we should be fighting doing everything in your power to sap people of any kind of hope or motivation, we're all going to loving die at some point and there will come a day when humanity will be no more when there will be no one around who even remembers us it may be a million or even a billion or possibly tomorrow. That's not a reason to give up. We fight and we struggle until our bodies quit and we hope that we leave the world a little bit better than we found it.

How the gently caress you can look around and see the level of energy building against this assholes, see AOC , Ilhan Omar, Rashida Talib and of these inspiring competent brilliant people rising to the moment and think "we're doomed" is loving beyond me. We're currently having a Democratic primary where two of the top 3 candidates are calling for nationalized single payer healthcare and the moderate is calling for what was viewed as political fantasy in 2008. We have millions of children marching in the streets world wide to agitate for action on climate change. Celebrities no bodies and millions of people energized motivated and fired the gently caress up registering voters talking to people advocating.

Yet you continue to focus only on the negative, you act like because we haven't won already that nothing will ever improve. A friend of mine was telling me the other day about how his father a black man who came of age during the depression recalled WW2, he said there were two years where there was no good news nothing, just losses all while watching the Axis expand their influence. They didn't give up, they put their heads down and prepared and sacrificed and when they were ready they attacked and turned the tide. Just like the activists in the Civil Rights movement didn't give up, like how the laborers who built the Unions didn't give up, the women who wanted the vote, the abolitionists who brought about the end of slavery. All of these people faced impossible odds condemnation, violence oppression, the mechanisms of the state turned against them and a lot of times they lost, they got beat down, but they kept going because they had hope.

That's how this poo poo works, it's how it has always worked, better ideas take time to gain support then there will always be a reaction as the old order tries to reassert itself, but as long as we maintain hope, we keep working and fighting we will prevail. You have to believe that, because that belief is what will give you the strength and motivation to push through the poo poo, to make the sacrifices to weather the losses to do what has to be done to make it true.

Maybe it's just residual conditioning from your upbringing, that because those awful people had so much power over you , you can't see just how weak they and their way of thinking truly is. But they are weak, conservatives are always weak. Because they are ruled by their fear and while that makes them dangerous it's also why they will lose in the end.

I look around the world and I see hope, I see billions of people waking up and saying WTF, I see a scared minority and their desperate attempt to hold back the inevitable.

Of course the regressives have thrown away the rules, of course they're resorting to bullying and brute force. They don't have anything else. they're desperate they are afraid, they don't have the numbers, they don't have the ideas and they don't have hope. Stop thinking that perfection is the only progress. perfection is an impossible goal, we just keep working to make things better and eventually someone will look around and go "wow things are pretty sweet."

You know how I know this? Because I'm watching my 11 year old daughter work through her, I mean they're sexuality and while it may seem weird to me because of how I grew up, it's this beautiful amazing thing to see because that just never would have happened when I was a child in the 80s, so as bad things may be now with Trump and the loving Nazis trying their damnedest to turn back the clock I listen to the journey my children are going through and I feel hope. You should too.


This entire post is an incredible waste of energy, because I'm not part of the "we're doomed" crowd. I'm just harshly critical of the present Democratic Leadership and fervently believed that if we rely on them then we probably are doomed. I believe that we the people can rise up and resolve these problems, but only if we take the responsibility upon ourselves and stop relying upon leadership that has clearly failed.

Your entire approach here is a bad faith implication that I think we're doomed, when I've been practically preaching "embrace hope as an act of defiance" since the night Trump was elected. I get it that you think that the world is over and all hope is lost if we can't rely upon your bureaucratic heroes to save the day- and all I can really tell you is that you're going to have to learn to think outside the box on this one.

Prester Jane fucked around with this message at 02:20 on Oct 18, 2019

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:11
  • Quote
FreshCutFries
Sep 15, 2007

Ate My Balls Redux posted:

Counterpoint: We are on an insanely short clock re: Climate Change, to a level beyond the urgency of any other crisis in human history, and incrementalism won't save us.

Our response to Climate Change must be perfection and it must be quick.

I have a suspicion there exists one of those dreaded middle-ground things between incrementalism and nihilism.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:13
  • Quote
Otteration
Jan 4, 2014

I CAN'T SAY PRESIDENT DONALD JOHN TRUMP'S NAME BECAUSE HE'S LIKE THAT GUY FROM HARRY POTTER AND I'M AFRAID I'LL SUMMON HIM. DONALD JOHN TRUMP. YOUR FAVORITE PRESIDENT.
OUR 47TH PRESIDENT AFTER THE ONE WHO SHOWERS WITH HIS DAUGHTER DIES
Grimey Drawer

tokyo reject posted:

Nobody is saying “omg all is lost today”. I’m saying it wouldn’t hurt to see the Democrats have a plan in the unlikely event of a worst case scenario.

Sorry, didn't pick you out personally, but can't see how the the Democrats can possibly form a plan in the midst of the orange poo poo streak's constant chaos. "This administration cannot possibly gently caress up more than they did yesterday," say pundits. The Democrats are plodding along, getting poo poo done. Quicker than last time (Nixon) as it turns out. It may not satisfy our need to STOP THIS poo poo NOW!, but then again we are apparently not telling them loudly enough to hurry things up. As if that is a needed thing (I'm happy for them to take a bit of time and find all of the loving crimes and prosecute them fully, thank you very much). :)

I may have missed it, but what currently is the "worst case scenario"?

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:13
  • Quote
Ate My Balls Redux
Aug 2, 2018

by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

FreshCutFries posted:

I have a suspicion there exists one of those dreaded middle-ground things between incrementalism and nihilism.

Not on Climate Change there doesn't.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:14
  • Quote
pkay
Jan 4, 2005
"You and your ilk just made me vote downticket R in the midterms."
- a black man (- a magachud)

Ate My Balls Redux posted:

Counterpoint: We are on an insanely short clock re: Climate Change, to a level beyond the urgency of any other crisis in human history, and incrementalism won't save us.

Our response to Climate Change must be perfection and it must be quick.

Gonna need fusion imo.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:14
  • Quote
Charlz Guybon
Nov 16, 2010

TulliusCicero posted:

Mulvaney might be actually more stupid than Guiliani

...how

At least Guiliani has the excuse that he had a traumatic brain injury.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:15
  • Quote
FreshCutFries
Sep 15, 2007

Ate My Balls Redux posted:

Not on Climate Change there doesn't.

I'm saying that having the capacity for hope doesn't mean you won't get things done.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:16
  • Quote
Otteration
Jan 4, 2014

I CAN'T SAY PRESIDENT DONALD JOHN TRUMP'S NAME BECAUSE HE'S LIKE THAT GUY FROM HARRY POTTER AND I'M AFRAID I'LL SUMMON HIM. DONALD JOHN TRUMP. YOUR FAVORITE PRESIDENT.
OUR 47TH PRESIDENT AFTER THE ONE WHO SHOWERS WITH HIS DAUGHTER DIES
Grimey Drawer

Ague Proof posted:

The House of the Rising Sun? Seriously?

The right's inability to listen to the lyrics of "Born in the USA" ad infinitum cause they drank their first beer when the song was on or whatever.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:17
  • Quote
Otteration
Jan 4, 2014

I CAN'T SAY PRESIDENT DONALD JOHN TRUMP'S NAME BECAUSE HE'S LIKE THAT GUY FROM HARRY POTTER AND I'M AFRAID I'LL SUMMON HIM. DONALD JOHN TRUMP. YOUR FAVORITE PRESIDENT.
OUR 47TH PRESIDENT AFTER THE ONE WHO SHOWERS WITH HIS DAUGHTER DIES
Grimey Drawer

Charlz Guybon posted:

At least Guiliani has the excuse that he had a traumatic brain injury.

I guess that means trump is free and clear too. :(

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:23
  • Quote
syntaxrigger
Jul 7, 2011

Actually you owe me 6! But who's countin?

Prester Jane posted:

This entire post is an incredible waste of energy, because I'm not part of the "we're doomed" crowd. I'm just harshly critical of the present Democratic Leadership and fervently believed that if we rely on them then we probably are doomed. I believe that we the people can rise up and resolve these problems, but only if we take the responsibility upon ourselves and stop relying upon leadership that has clearly failed.

Your entire approach here is a bad faith implication that I think we're doomed, when I've been practically preaching "embrace hope as an act of defiance" since the night Trump was elected. I get it that you think that the world is over and all hope is lost if we can't rely upon your bureaucratic heroes to save the day- and all I can really tell you is that you're going to have to learn to think outside the box on this one.

No matter how often I see it, it still amazes me how folks so easily misinterpret you while being totally willing to lay so much poo poo at your feet.

e typos

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:23
  • Quote
The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007

pkay posted:

Gonna need fusion imo.

That's thirty years away. We don't have thirty years.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:29
  • Quote
Retro42
Jun 27, 2011


 Perfectly normal.

https://twitter.com/ddale8/status/1185004301195849728?s=21

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:31
  • Quote
pacerhimself
Dec 30, 2008

by Fluffdaddy

Retro42 posted:

Perfectly normal.

https://twitter.com/ddale8/status/1185004301195849728?s=21

This seems like it would be kind of boring if he just says the same stupid poo poo over and over again.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:31
  • Quote
Dammerung
Oct 17, 2008

"Dang, that's hot."

Skex posted:

You know, for someone who talks a lot of poo poo about messaging and fighting for what's right, you spend an awful lot of time doing everythign in your power to demotivate people and sap any hope in anything.

I think we might perceive what PJ is saying differently. What I'm getting from their posts isn't defeatism at all, but rather concerns about complacency developing alongside fear for how things likely will develop and what might be necessary to move forward.

Skex posted:

I mean seriously I'm sure glad it wasn't defeatists like you and Vital Signs and the other we're doomed the enemy is implacable and unstoppable who were leading the last time we took on the Fascists, or who fought for suffrage or civil rights or unions. Because frankly all of this woe is me everything is horrible and nothing will ever get better crap is the exact loving opposite from being inspiring.

The post you quoted wasn't an example of this defeatism you're talking about. I really am sorry, I'm currently focusing on other things and not paying as much attention to the thread as I used to, so I'm not sure if something's changed, but it kind of seems like you're attacking an argument that nobody is making. Just to cover my bases, disagreeing with you is also not tantamount to defeatism.

Skex posted:

There is always some existential threat hanging over our heads, in the 30s and 40s it was fascism, from the 50s to the 80s is nuclear annihilation and acid rain and smog. There was malaise and racism on a scale that makes this look quaint. Because the racists and bigots weren't some loud vocal minority they where the majority who were running poo poo.
there was no left wing media, no pod casts, no discussion forums or twitter or social media for people to organize over, Unless you were in a handful of liberal strongholds around certain universities there were no leftists or at least we learned to be circumspect. You wonder why Elizabeth Warren says that she's a capitalist? Because she came of age in that time.

Donald Trump is currently the president of the United States. Racists and bigots currently are "running poo poo", in that they have an enormous amount of influence via the powers wielded by the executive branch. You're absolutely right that the situation has changed, but that doesn't mean that the problems you're discussing have vanished.

Skex posted:

I'm 49 so I'm not really that old but I remember the early Bush years and 9/11 and how the country collectively lost their mind. I railed about the stolen election when the GOP blatantly robbed Gore of what should have been his victory, I remember the depression when I watched the tower fall and telling my friend "well I guess they're going get their Iraq invasion" I remember the protests and how they got no media attention.

You have resources and weapons I'd have literally killed for at your disposal. high definition recording devices, ways to communicate that bypass the corporate media filters.

What would you have done with them at the time, and what are you doing with them now? I'm not trying to castigate you and your passion, I'm just curious.

Skex posted:

I'm so sick and tired of the downer brigade who all enlightened and wise and talk all kinds of poo poo about how we should be fighting doing everything in your power to sap people of any kind of hope or motivation, we're all going to loving die at some point and there will come a day when humanity will be no more when there will be no one around who even remembers us it may be a million or even a billion or possibly tomorrow. That's not a reason to give up. We fight and we struggle until our bodies quit and we hope that we leave the world a little bit better than we found it.

Who here is seriously arguing that we should give up and die? Some people might vent at times and say things to get them off their chest (much like I think you're doing with your post), but I don't think anybody's spending a significant amount of time and energy arguing that we should all lay down and die.

Skex posted:

How the gently caress you can look around and see the level of energy building against this assholes, see AOC , Ilhan Omar, Rashida Talib and of these inspiring competent brilliant people rising to the moment and think "we're doomed" is loving beyond me. We're currently having a Democratic primary where two of the top 3 candidates are calling for nationalized single payer healthcare and the moderate is calling for what was viewed as political fantasy in 2008. We have millions of children marching in the streets world wide to agitate for action on climate change. Celebrities no bodies and millions of people energized motivated and fired the gently caress up registering voters talking to people advocating.

I don't think anybody here is arguing that those are negatives or reasons to believe that we are doomed.

Skex posted:

Yet you continue to focus only on the negative, you act like because we haven't won already that nothing will ever improve.

The "inspiring competent brilliant people rising to the moment" you discussed were, by themselves, unable to end the government shutdown. This is a bit difficult for me to discuss, because you're arguing against a position that I'm not sure anybody here holds, but I would argue that realizing those people need our help is simply acknowledging the world as it is.

Skex posted:

A friend of mine was telling me the other day about how his father a black man who came of age during the depression recalled WW2, he said there were two years where there was no good news nothing, just losses all while watching the Axis expand their influence. They didn't give up, they put their heads down and prepared and sacrificed and when they were ready they attacked and turned the tide. Just like the activists in the Civil Rights movement didn't give up, like how the laborers who built the Unions didn't give up, the women who wanted the vote, the abolitionists who brought about the end of slavery. All of these people faced impossible odds condemnation, violence oppression, the mechanisms of the state turned against them and a lot of times they lost, they got beat down, but they kept going because they had hope.

This is legitimately inspirational!

Skex posted:

That's how this poo poo works, it's how it has always worked, better ideas take time to gain support then there will always be a reaction as the old order tries to reassert itself, but as long as we maintain hope, we keep working and fighting we will prevail. You have to believe that, because that belief is what will give you the strength and motivation to push through the poo poo, to make the sacrifices to weather the losses to do what has to be done to make it true.

Exactly, we keep working and fighting. We're not always going to agree on everything. Fights might occur between us. I think that, if you and I were to have a conversation about politics in real life, we might end up yelling at each other. But that doesn't mean that either of us has given up or embraced oblivion.

Skex posted:

Maybe it's just residual conditioning from your upbringing, that because those awful people had so much power over you , you can't see just how weak they and their way of thinking truly is. But they are weak, conservatives are always weak. Because they are ruled by their fear and while that makes them dangerous it's also why they will lose in the end.

I don't want to speculate about anybody's upbringing. But I agree with everything else you say here!

Skex posted:

I look around the world and I see hope, I see billions of people waking up and saying WTF, I see a scared minority and their desperate attempt to hold back the inevitable.

And here!

Skex posted:

Of course the regressives have thrown away the rules, of course they're resorting to bullying and brute force. They don't have anything else. they're desperate they are afraid, they don't have the numbers, they don't have the ideas and they don't have hope. Stop thinking that perfection is the only progress. perfection is an impossible goal, we just keep working to make things better and eventually someone will look around and go "wow things are pretty sweet."

And sort of here! I'm going to fight for everything I can get, because that is my birthright. Castigating my pursuit of it, and attempting to curtail it, is likewise your birthright. The good news is, either way, the world becomes a better place. So why not have a friendly competition for who can make things best?

Skex posted:

You know how I know this? Because I'm watching my 11 year old daughter work through her, I mean they're sexuality and while it may seem weird to me because of how I grew up, it's this beautiful amazing thing to see because that just never would have happened when I was a child in the 80s, so as bad things may be now with Trump and the loving Nazis trying their damnedest to turn back the clock I listen to the journey my children are going through and I feel hope. You should too.

Keep fighting to keep the world a safe place for them! We'll be doing the same too, and if one of us is most successful in 10 years, we'll owe them a soda of their choosing. There's no better time to start like the present, right?

In all seriousness, Skex, I do agree with a lot of the things you say. But I also think that you are working unnecessarily hard to make posters in here your enemy, and I don't think that's fair or necessary. It's not fair to consider disagreements over issues to equate to embracing nihilism and despair. That cannot and will not help us achieve anything significant moving forward. We're all in this together, even if we don't always see eye to eye!

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:32
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ImpAtom
May 24, 2007

 Jesus Christ, can we just go back in time and prevent email from being created so I don't have to hear about Hillary Clinton's loving emails ever again

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:33
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Jaxyon
Mar 7, 2016
I’m just saying I would like to see a man beat a woman in a cage. Just to be sure.

The Lone Badger posted:

That's thirty years away. We don't have thirty years.

It was 30 years away 30 years ago. It's going to be continually 30 years away until we solve some of the fundamental issues with it.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:33
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RandomBlue
Dec 30, 2012

hay guys!


Biscuit Hider
https://twitter.com/awzurcher/status/1184864114310553613

:votegop:

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:36
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haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal

RandomBlue posted:

https://twitter.com/awzurcher/status/1184864114310553613

:votegop:

Behind him, an eagle falls out of a tree and dies.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:37
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Otteration
Jan 4, 2014

I CAN'T SAY PRESIDENT DONALD JOHN TRUMP'S NAME BECAUSE HE'S LIKE THAT GUY FROM HARRY POTTER AND I'M AFRAID I'LL SUMMON HIM. DONALD JOHN TRUMP. YOUR FAVORITE PRESIDENT.
OUR 47TH PRESIDENT AFTER THE ONE WHO SHOWERS WITH HIS DAUGHTER DIES
Grimey Drawer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXsqNRdFzC8

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:38
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Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:

RandomBlue posted:

https://twitter.com/awzurcher/status/1184864114310553613

:votegop:

The economy is great except for the economy.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:39
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Ringo Star Get
Sep 18, 2006

JUST FUCKING TAKE OFF ALREADY, SHIT

pacerhimself posted:

This seems like it would be kind of boring if he just says the same stupid poo poo over and over again.

Tons of people go to concerts to hear their bands play their favorite songs. Trump supporters want to hear Wet Daddy shriek his hits.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:40
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Doctor Spaceman
Jul 6, 2010

"Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."
https://twitter.com/ddale8/status/1185005846855634944

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:40
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LeeMajors
Jan 20, 2005

I've gotta stop fantasizing about Lee Majors...
Ah, one more!

haveblue posted:

Behind him, an eagle falls out of a tree and dies.

That was a suicide.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:42
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Gatts
Jan 2, 2001

Goodnight Moon

Nap Ghost

Kurieg posted:

The economy is great except for the economy.

So he'll vote for the type of people that put him in a bad spot because....?

Own the libs?

I mean hell I live in Ohio, maybe I should walk outside and ask him or something but I'm brown so I'm concerned I may be shot.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:42
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ImpAtom
May 24, 2007

Doctor Spaceman posted:

https://twitter.com/ddale8/status/1185005846855634944

PEOPLE ARE DEAD YOU loving poo poo.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:43
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RandomBlue
Dec 30, 2012

hay guys!


Biscuit Hider

Kurieg posted:

The economy is great except for the economy.

"I'm overworked and underpaid, this economy is amazing! Thank you Lord Jesus Trump!"

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:44
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Google Butt
Oct 4, 2005

Xenology is an unnatural mixture of science fiction and formal logic. At its core is a flawed assumption...

that an alien race would be psychologically human.

 Thread title "Trump says sir a lot, then begins railing about Hillary Clinton's emails."

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:45
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1glitch0
Sep 4, 2018

I DON'T GIVE A CRAP WHAT SHE BELIEVES THE HARRY POTTER BOOKS CHANGED MY LIFE #HUFFLEPUFF

Violator posted:

Nah, Steiner brought the tiger out on camera and it almost bit Mysterio backstage.

lol my bad. I forgot the tiger was used. Watching it was the equivalent of watching our current government. So much dumb I can't keep it all straight in my head.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:46
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Zesty
Jan 17, 2012

The Great Twist

Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:

Jesus this playlist at the rally

https://mobile.twitter.com/robcrilly/status/1184979048721768448

... it's Classic Rock because the guy who managed it was probably in his 50s or 60s?

Well, Jesus loving Christ.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:47
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Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Jun 5, 2024 11:12
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Fritz Coldcockin
Nov 7, 2005

Dick Trauma posted:

https://twitter.com/ddale8/status/1184994793002360832

This is the mantra he repeats to himself as he hugs his knees in a corner of his darkened bedroom and rocks back and forth.

Zesty posted:

... it's Classic Rock because the guy who managed it was probably in his 50s or 60s?

Well, Jesus loving Christ.

Not ONE of those artists would give him permission, I guaran-fuckin-tee you.

* # ? Oct 18, 2019 02:51
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