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Paradoxish posted:I mean, cars aren't really treated as "disposable" by most people right now. Most people who buy new cars keep them for 5-6 years. I suspect its actually a fair bit longer now
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Oct 22, 2019 07:58
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On keeping cars a while there was a story recently over here that one of our MPs drives a Bentley from the 30s and that it was destroying the planet. He drives it 1000 miles a year and the newspaper was saying it kicks out so much pollution... then a bit later they said it would take him TWENTY FIVE years of driving a fully electric car to offset the manufacture of it vs just driving the Bentley. Who keeps a car 25 loving years??
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Oct 22, 2019 09:03
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I'm almost to year 14 with my Mazda 3, but I'm finally getting tempted to get a new car. I need more money though.
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Oct 22, 2019 09:21
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Olympic Mathlete posted:Who keeps a car 25 loving years?? Uhhhhhh.... *looks at RX7 bought in 1990* I have no idea.
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Oct 22, 2019 10:28
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I think it's fair to say the people that post in here are very much the statistical outliers and not really representative of the general public in terms of buying cars.
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Oct 22, 2019 12:38
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Very few people keep a daily driver for a long time because even with modern, fairly reliable cars it stops being economical to repair them somewhere in the 200-400k mile range. Which for most is somewhere between 10-20 years. At that point if you’re keeping the car it’s because you have an emotional attachment, like to a 1990 RX-7 - but we are of course the exception rather than the rule.
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Oct 22, 2019 12:39
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CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:Uhhhhhh.... My ex-girlfriend's dad had an FD RX-7 that he rarely drove. KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:At that point if you’re keeping the car it’s because you have an emotional attachment, like to a 1990 RX-7 - but we are of course the exception rather than the rule. I wonder if he still has it, and if he'd sell it to me
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Oct 22, 2019 12:58
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It also really depends on where you live. Keeping a car much past ten years around here means you have to start fighting the red demon and that can become just as expensive as a car payment eventually.
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Oct 22, 2019 13:13
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bull3964 posted:It also really depends on where you live. Keeping a car much past ten years around here means you have to start fighting the red demon and that can become just as expensive as a car payment eventually. also true - which is why most northern cars that are older tend to be garaged and not daily drivers - or at most seasonal daily drivers
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Oct 22, 2019 13:34
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bull3964 posted:It also really depends on where you live. Keeping a car much past ten years around here means you have to start fighting the red demon and that can become just as expensive as a car payment eventually. I feel like this is a bit of an exaggeration. CT drops horrendous amounts of salt on its roads, but there wasn't a spot of rust on my 2005 330Ci when it was totaled last year even though that car was never garaged and driven every winter. Most cars that I've owned have been 10-15 years old and I can't recall rust ever being an issue aside from wheels stuck on hubs and rusty suspension bolts. Not every vehicle is going to turn into a pile of rust just because it's exposed to salt, and definitely not after ten years.
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Oct 22, 2019 14:41
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I know they had to replace the rear subframe of my 2002 WRX after I traded it in due to rust and I had to replace two caliper brackets the last time I did front brakes on it because the bolts welded themselves in there and snapped off even after using a torch to try to loosen. Anecdote to anecdote. There are a lot of other factors in there too like how much the temp swings in the winter to allow corrosion to get started, how badly the roads damage vehicles. Actually, not having it garage kept is better in the winter since it keeps the temperature lower. I will never garage a salt laden vehicle again, it's a recipe for rust
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Oct 22, 2019 14:59
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Lol at fancy boi here with a heated garage
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Oct 22, 2019 15:09
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I wasn't saying it doesn't happen, but it's also not true that owning a vehicle for a decade in the Northeast automatically dumps you into a never ending war against rust. There are tons of 10+ year old cars driving around and most of them aren't hiding major structural rust.
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Oct 22, 2019 15:25
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:Lol at fancy boi here with a heated garage Up, my fancy 1950s garage that shares air with the basement that has horrible insulation.
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Oct 22, 2019 15:28
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Olympic Mathlete posted:On keeping cars a while there was a story recently over here that one of our MPs drives a Bentley from the 30s and that it was destroying the planet. He drives it 1000 miles a year and the newspaper was saying it kicks out so much pollution... then a bit later they said it would take him TWENTY FIVE years of driving a fully electric car to offset the manufacture of it vs just driving the Bentley. Who keeps a car 25 loving years?? This calculation is so off because of the very low miles driven. Most EVs can "offset" themselves in 3-7 years depending on the car with "normal" driving. This is a decent breakdown I think https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RhtiPefVzM
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Oct 22, 2019 16:17
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Ultimate Mango posted:I expect the launch of the new Tesla roadster will align with the implosion of consumer credit. We've leased my wife's car the last 7 years, it's worked out pretty well with the low interest rates and high residual values. Things are slowing down a bit (residuals down a couple points, apr up a tad), and we didn't lease a new one at the end of our lease earlier this month. We chose to buy it out at the end of the lease and we'll be keeping it for a while. New cars are getting just stupid expensive outside of your entry level vehicles. I will say the price of a new cheap car has been kept reasonably low. I remember paying like 13.5 for a 2000 Ford Focus right after I turned 19 or so. You can still get into an entry level compact sedan for under 20K which is great. The middle to upper end of the vehicle range though is going nuts. Our 2017 Ford Explorer Sport, which was fully loaded was 52.5 MSRP. A similar Ford Explorer ST is 60K now. F150 XLT's stickering over 50K now (though no one pays MSRP on those), Suburbans and Expeditions going for over 70K in certain trims. It's nuts. I love new cars. I've bought at last count something like 11 or 12 brand new cars in my lifetime (22 years of driving), but I feel like that's pretty much come to an end. Part of it is my feelings about cars changing now I'm getting older, but most of it is just how expensive they're getting. I rather spend my money on other things at this point. For the first time in my life I have no plans at all to buy a new car anytime in foreseeable future. I work from home full time now, so my vehicle sees like 3000 miles a year now. It makes no sense for me to pick up another car payment for something I have to consciously make an effort to drive some weekends. My SHO is in fantastic condition anyway and still puts a smile on my face, so I'm happy to spend previous car payment money on family vacations, or doing stuff around the house instead. Anyway, I think we're going to start seeing a real shift in the next couple of years from people on the every 3-4 year car upgrade cycle, moving towards keeping vehicles much longer. Whether that's driven by the fact you now have to take out a 72 or 84 month loan to afford a new vehicle* and you're upside down on the thing for 5 or 6 years, or people just want to pay off and maintain the car they have, we'll just have to see. I think the insane used car prices we're seeing will finally start falling a bit as well as the market gets flooded with off-lease vehicles in the next couple of years. A couple articles I've read predict 4M cars coming off lease in 2019 and 2020, and the supply should affect pricing a bit. I know in some cases buying a CPO 3 year old off lease car doesn't even make sense compared to new when you factor in incentives. Years ago the delta between a CPO explorer with 35K miles on it and a brand new (with incentives) one was like 2000 dollars. Made no sense to buy the CPO at that price. *I'm generalizing here about how the majority of folks finance vehicles with little to nothing down
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Oct 22, 2019 17:00
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While you can, I suppose.
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Haven’t rust issues gotten better Over the last 20 years ? I remember in the 80s and 90s half the cars in the road and visible rust
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Oct 22, 2019 17:02
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euphronius posted:Haven’t rust issues gotten better Over the last 20 years ? I remember in the 80s and 90s half the cars in the road and visible rust The Last Gen Mazda 3 and gm pickups still have crazy rust issues. It shouldn’t be a problem anymore but it is for cost savings. I haven’t looked under a 2019 but I would bet gm still uses frame wax instead of e-coat
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Oct 22, 2019 17:17
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skipdogg posted:New cars are getting just stupid expensive outside of your entry level vehicles. This is the big problem in all markets. The middle is evaporating so manufacturers are having to choose between competing for an ever smaller group of high income earners, or playing the boom/bust credit cycle with the masses. It gets worse as the Cult of RONA screams that making lower margin products is worse for the shareholders than just closing the plant and selling.
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Oct 22, 2019 17:35
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I never had rust issues with an e46 kept outside in the northeast for 6 years. But boy did I spend a lot on maintenance anyway lol
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Oct 22, 2019 18:38
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The other amazingly wise vehicle choices I see are people buying 5+ year old Land Rovers and then drowning in maintenance "I'll just fix it over the weekend" says guy already working 70 hours a week
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Oct 22, 2019 19:56
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Proud Christian Mom posted:The other amazingly wise vehicle choices I see are people buying 5+ year old Land Rovers and then drowning in maintenance Listen man, I said I live within walking distance of a Land Rover dealer, ok?
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Oct 22, 2019 23:23
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bull3964 posted:I know they had to replace the rear subframe of my 2002 WRX after I traded it in due to rust and I had to replace two caliper brackets the last time I did front brakes on it because the bolts welded themselves in there and snapped off even after using a torch to try to loosen. To be fair there was a recall to replace Subie rear suspension bits of that era because they corroded badly, quickly, in salt states.
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Oct 22, 2019 23:48
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The recall was with the front lower control arms.
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Oct 23, 2019 01:48
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Powershift you should sue: https://jalopnik.com/were-really-doing-this-huh-1839290802
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Oct 23, 2019 21:47
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Russian Bear posted:Powershift you should sue: https://jalopnik.com/were-really-doing-this-huh-1839290802 KozmoNaut posted:It looks like a cartoon villain's car. david_a posted:ROAD HOG driven by BARON OINKMEISTER
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Oct 23, 2019 23:23
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Is there a list of vehicles that do rust proofing really well? Particularly family haulers (SUV’s and wagons) Every car I’ve ever driven has succumbed to Michigan rust problems. I literally used to sweep up a pile of rusty chunks from around our Jimmy every weekend. Bumper pieces, fender pieces, random chunks of chassis, etc. Now my suburban has rust on pretty much every body panel. Our Saab 9-7x has a crumbling hood and rust spots starting everywhere else. It would be nice to have a vehicle that doesn’t look like it lives in Michigan.
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Oct 23, 2019 23:47
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Something made in Michigan, maybe?
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Oct 23, 2019 23:52
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Russian Bear posted:Powershift you should sue: https://jalopnik.com/were-really-doing-this-huh-1839290802 That's actually really close to bimmerpost's original  mine shop of it was more audi  It's still haaaaaaaah
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Oct 24, 2019 00:01
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BMWs are just like all the rest of 'em now - everyone is doing big honker grilles now
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Oct 24, 2019 00:43
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Modus Man posted:Is there a list of vehicles that do rust proofing really well? Particularly family haulers (SUV’s and wagons) Every car I’ve ever driven has succumbed to Michigan rust problems. I literally used to sweep up a pile of rusty chunks from around our Jimmy every weekend. Bumper pieces, fender pieces, random chunks of chassis, etc. Now my suburban has rust on pretty much every body panel. Our Saab 9-7x has a crumbling hood and rust spots starting everywhere else. It would be nice to have a vehicle that doesn’t look like it lives in Michigan. Rust proofing isn't going to be good on anything as long as our roads are a hellscape of projectiles that put chips in anything that's not titanium.
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Oct 24, 2019 01:19
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euphronius posted:Haven’t rust issues gotten better Over the last 20 years ? I remember in the 80s and 90s half the cars in the road and visible rust 
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Oct 24, 2019 02:28
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Modus Man posted:Is there a list of vehicles that do rust proofing really well? Particularly family haulers (SUV’s and wagons) Every car I’ve ever driven has succumbed to Michigan rust problems. I literally used to sweep up a pile of rusty chunks from around our Jimmy every weekend. Bumper pieces, fender pieces, random chunks of chassis, etc. Now my suburban has rust on pretty much every body panel. Our Saab 9-7x has a crumbling hood and rust spots starting everywhere else. It would be nice to have a vehicle that doesn’t look like it lives in Michigan. Audi, Hyundai, Kia, and Toyota seem to appear on most lists of rust-resistant makes. It's rather variable, though, depending on specific circumstances. Every car ever made will rust to pieces, given the chance. Keeping the car washed in the winter (particularly the underside) will help a lot with any car.
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Oct 24, 2019 02:32
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Russian Bear posted:Powershift you should sue: https://jalopnik.com/were-really-doing-this-huh-1839290802 Needs to sue Ford, too. https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/24/20930394/ford-mustang-electric-suv-mach-e-reveal-date Also, it's electric.
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Oct 24, 2019 21:52
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KillHour posted:Needs to sue Ford, too. My approximation  non-disco version: 
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Oct 24, 2019 22:32
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Back roof is definitely a little higher.
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Oct 24, 2019 23:02
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KillHour posted:Back roof is definitely a little higher. Mustang back roof is so low it’s probably hard to warp it up without it looking like dog poo poo.
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Oct 24, 2019 23:07
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Cocoa Crispies posted:Mustang back roof is so low it’s probably hard to warp it up without it looking like dog poo poo. Yeah, i can't figure it out at this point. I'll probably try again with a better image 
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Oct 24, 2019 23:23
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Powershift posted:Yeah, i can't figure it out at this point. I'll probably try again with a better image
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Oct 24, 2019 23:38
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Not using real file names just bit me oh well.  
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Oct 24, 2019 23:41
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