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Shipon posted:liberal spotted *woke voice* race is a social construct, except for the genes that make you Hispanic and a democrat
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Nov 17, 2019 08:05
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Serf posted:if the nominee is anyone but bernie i'm writing in gloria la riva this is why people like you constantly lose, and deserve to
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Nov 17, 2019 08:23
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in a two party system the parties eventually adapt to win about half the elections. long term, demographic trends won't ensure dem majority, but it will force the GOP to find a way to court hispanic voters (or at least expand their base beyond chuds and millionaires). disenfranchisement, turning out the base, and general rat-fuckery only gets you so far. but exactly how far is yet to be determined, and they ain't gunna stop until they get whomped hard enough to prove they hit an electoral wall with the current strategy. we need to whomp 'em hard, maybe repeatedly, and the sooner the better
Dixie Cretin Seaman has issued a correction as of 08:46 on Nov 17, 2019 |
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Nov 17, 2019 08:44
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The long term republican plan is to no longer be a democracy
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Nov 17, 2019 09:44
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Ghost Leviathan posted:The long term republican plan is to no longer be a democracy They have been trying really hard to brew up a fascist narrative that will get them the movement they need. It is really dumb luck that fascism came prematurely with Trump. He's a classic demagogue who can rile up the people, but he is too stupid and inconsistent to really point them in a meaningful direction.
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Nov 17, 2019 10:04
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Ghost Leviathan posted:The long term republican plan is to no longer be a democracy It's this. There is no Rubicon they won't cross, because they'll never be called on it by anybody who matters.
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Nov 17, 2019 13:15
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Agronox posted:this is why people like you constantly lose, and deserve to 
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Nov 17, 2019 14:32
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I mean if the candidate you want loses you are losing either way. if you vote for a candidate you don’t want you by definition did not win
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Nov 17, 2019 14:36
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There's a candidate whose judgement and reasoning you agree with, unless they're not the nominee and implore you to vote for someone else?
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Nov 17, 2019 15:15
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Agronox posted:this is why people like you constantly lose, and deserve to member when Hillary lost despite people pragmatically voting for her lmao
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Nov 17, 2019 15:16
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basically yeah that’s pointless team politics. it doesn’t actually accomplish anything
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Nov 17, 2019 15:16
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I've voted for lovely loser Dems my whole life and 99% of the time they still fuckin lose. 1% of the time they win but stab the left in the back Never again. Put Bernie on the ballot or his names going in the write in box libs 420 smoke hostages erryday
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Nov 17, 2019 15:19
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it loving rules that people in these forums still expect us to treat rationality as anything other than an aesthetic, especially when they demand we do poo poo that has a decade worth of case studies showing it doesn't work
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Nov 17, 2019 16:30
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I'd say that this is probably the only election where voting for a shitlib dem is warranted, not because they're the lesser of two evils or anything like that, but because the one thing that we know with perfect certainty about the 2020 election is that Trump will not concede and the republicans will back him all the way. Bernie will fight. The rest of them will write op-eds extolling the virtues of the principled opposition who are chagrined by Trump's behavior even as they reluctantly refuse to remove him. Then they'll roll over and wait for the judgement of the republican Supreme Court. Any non-Bernie candidate who wins the election will absolutely eat poo poo. The more certain their win, the more poo poo they'll eat. America needs to eat that poo poo too.
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Nov 17, 2019 16:40
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helping the overton window drift even further to the right to own the centrists
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Nov 17, 2019 16:50
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Epic High Five posted:I've voted for lovely loser Dems my whole life and 99% of the time they still fuckin lose. 1% of the time they win but stab the left in the back this goon knows what's up Slamhound posted:I'd say that this is probably the only election where voting for a shitlib dem is warranted, Meh. I think people honestly said that/could have said that with the same sense of urgency for the last few elections where a Republican was the incumbent. Sure, today's situation is in some ways worse than in prior elections. We know that with hindsight. But at the time, the same sentiment was there: "vote for whomever the (D) nominee is because the situation is oh so dire" (and it was!) TotalLossBrain has issued a correction as of 17:35 on Nov 17, 2019 |
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Nov 17, 2019 17:33
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Dixie Cretin Seaman posted:helping the overton window drift even further to the right to own the centrists this is the last chance for electoral politics in this country. if bernie doesn’t win and a useless democrat gets elected, they will get stuffed out for 4-8 years, the democratic voters will get depressed and stop turning out, and then we’ll get a new trump, but competent and strategic this time. the only thing that happens historically when inequality is this blatant and the population is so immiserated is reform or an uprising, and no other candidate will succeed in reform. it is useless to vote for any other nominee in any practical sense, any tiny gains made through the standard political process will be immediately attacked and damaged by republicans and right wing democrats (see: anything obama did that wasn’t actually a right wing plan, like building child cages). bernie is making a desperate play to have a revolution without bloodshed, and if he fails, then bloodshed is inevitable
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Nov 17, 2019 17:36
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DragQueenofAngmar posted:this is the last chance for electoral politics in this country. if bernie doesn’t win and a useless democrat gets elected, they will get stuffed out for 4-8 years, the democratic voters will get depressed and stop turning out, “if democratic voters choose a centrist candidate who wins the presidency but sucks, democratic voters will get depressed and stop turning out” this makes no sense, more primary voters would realize the futility of centrism and move left
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Nov 17, 2019 17:51
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Dixie Cretin Seaman posted:“if democratic voters choose a centrist candidate who wins the presidency but sucks, democratic voters will get depressed and stop turning out” that's what happened in 2010, 2012, 2014, and 2016
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Nov 17, 2019 18:19
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Dixie Cretin Seaman posted:“if democratic voters choose a centrist candidate who wins the presidency but sucks, democratic voters will get depressed and stop turning out” many, many people already feel the system is broken and that no real positive change is possible because most politicians are corrupt scumbags. bernie is energizing people because he is giving them hope that this time could actually be different, because he is offering an alternative way of making good things happen (mass pressure). if he loses, especially if he has the majority going into the convention but not enough to win outright and the dnc picks someone else, people will feel that electoral politics has no chance of improving things, and will likely either return to numbness or start breaking poo poo. there are only so many times you can go “gee dang well we lost, shucks, come back in 4 years and we’ll do our tepid best to make your life worth living!” before it becomes obvious that it’s a sham.
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Nov 17, 2019 18:23
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TotalLossBrain posted:Meh. I think people honestly said that/could have said that with the same sense of urgency for the last few elections where a Republican was the incumbent.
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Nov 17, 2019 18:25
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Agronox posted:this is why people like you constantly lose, and deserve to Vote abloo bloo bloo no matter who
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Nov 17, 2019 18:27
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if you genuinely believe this is the last election before america goes full fash under GOP control then voting for any plausible alternative to GOP control makes more sense than not voting. if somehow michael bloomberg won the dem primary and chose jeff bezos as his running mate, how could you not vote for him when Actual Fascism is the only alternative? otoh if you think withholding your vote in the general is a way to push the democrats leftward as a long-term movement-building strategy then fine, bernie and i both disagree with the effectiveness of this approach, but at least we're living in the same basic reality
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Nov 17, 2019 18:48
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Dixie Cretin Seaman posted:if you genuinely believe this is the last election before america goes full fash under GOP control then voting for any plausible alternative to GOP control makes more sense than not voting. if somehow michael bloomberg won the dem primary and chose jeff bezos as his running mate, how could you not vote for him when Actual Fascism is the only alternative? bloomberg-bezos is the the full fascist future tho. climate refugees will be worked to death in the amazon fulfillment centers
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Nov 17, 2019 18:53
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Dixie Cretin Seaman posted:if you genuinely believe this is the last election before america goes full fash under GOP control then voting for any plausible alternative to GOP control makes more sense than not voting. if somehow michael bloomberg won the dem primary and chose jeff bezos as his running mate, how could you not vote for him when Actual Fascism is the only alternative? because that’s only a choice between fascism, or fascism-lite then real fascism 8 years later. people are not energized by a message of “take the scraps we deign to give you, because we are gonna give you 30% more scraps than the other guys!” you can say that all those people who will not turn out to vote in that scenario are being foolish, but that’s the political reality that has been born out many times in the past when a worthless dem gets elected. obama had a supermajority, didn’t deliver on his promises, got a massive red wave in response, and now we’re here
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Nov 17, 2019 18:56
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There is also the idea that if anyone but Bernie doesn't get elected then Trump will simply ignore the election results, and because the dem establishment is bought off controlled opposition they won't contest it Bernie would be able to push back and launch a general strike or something People are really underestimating how fragile democracy is in America at this point, where even halfhearted attempts to check the power of the president are declared coup attempts and senior members of the administration are pushing the idea that Trump currently rules through Divine Right Feldegast42 has issued a correction as of 19:10 on Nov 17, 2019 |
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Nov 17, 2019 19:04
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TotalLossBrain posted:
My entire adult life I have heard "sure the Dem sucks but the Republican is too scary to take a chance on someone good". It 100% is brought up every election, and 100% of the time is treated like THIS TIME it's ACTUALLY TRUE not like the last 40 times
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Nov 17, 2019 19:08
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Dixie Cretin Seaman posted:if somehow michael bloomberg won the dem primary and chose jeff bezos as his running mate, how could you not vote for him when Actual Fascism is the only alternative? That's literally as bad as trump, just without the national embarrassment of having a moron president give word salad speeches -- which seems to be the #1 concern of most libs. Like, if you really believe that republicans want Actual Fascism, then do you really think voting in Bloomberg is going to do gently caress all to stop that? It's like trying to stop a train by throwing a cottonball at it.
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Nov 17, 2019 19:30
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Epic High Five posted:I've voted for lovely loser Dems my whole life and 99% of the time they still fuckin lose. 1% of the time they win but stab the left in the back this is exactly how we ended up with trmp all the bernie bros on my feed refused to vote for anyone else no one will ever be 100% of who you want in office - never ever your perfect candidate will look like poo poo to the other 70% of the population and your main wants will not even register on everyone elses list so instead of taking your ball and just not voting like a pissed off third grader, vote for the person who best matches your wants. in this upcoming election, its either an insane fascist racist shitbag, or someone trying to stop it poo poo, bernie already had a heart attack, he isn't going to be president on that alone
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Nov 17, 2019 19:40
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Philthy posted:this is exactly how we ended up with trmp yes, and Bernie is the only one who isn’t a fascist or useless fascist enabler
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Nov 17, 2019 19:43
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Epic High Five posted:I've voted for lovely loser Dems my whole life and 99% of the time they still fuckin lose. 1% of the time they win but stab the left in the back Literally the same. I'm so loving tired of "pragmatic" dems which are really republican-lite. Never again, i won't vote for anymore corporation felating "good things aren't possible" dems anymore. Run on the republican ticket where you should have been all along. Its Bernie or Bernie.
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Nov 17, 2019 19:45
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Azuth0667 posted:Literally the same. I'm so loving tired of "pragmatic" dems which are really republican-lite. Never again, i won't vote for anymore corporation felating "good things aren't possible" dems anymore. Run on the republican ticket where you should have been all along. Re-electing Trump to own the not-quite-lib-enoughs.
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Nov 17, 2019 19:47
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Philthy posted:this is exactly how we ended up with trmp Bullshit. This idiot talking point has been debunked over and over. Clinton got more votes from Bernie supporters than Obama got from Clinton 08 supporters. Losing a few hardcare Bernie voters isn’t why we got trump. Hillary Clinton as the candidate is a large part of why we got trump.
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Nov 17, 2019 19:47
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I assume everyone in this thread understands the difference between primary voting (vote as far left as possible) and general election voting (anything less than fascist is better than fascist). Right?
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Nov 17, 2019 19:49
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I forgot the mention that the bad Dems I've been voting for to avoid the greater evil that mysteriously always happens anyway also bombard me with ads saying they don't want my vote because socialism is genocide and blah blah blah I dunno if your candidate spends money telling a group of voters to gently caress off and then they don't vote for them, maybe the candidate is the one to blame?
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Nov 17, 2019 19:50
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silvergoose posted:I assume everyone in this thread understands the difference between primary voting (vote as far left as possible) and general election voting (anything less than fascist is better than fascist). what’s the difference if the “less than fascists” are too decorous to do anything to resist the actual fascists other than tsk tsk-ing at them while they take control of the country?
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Nov 17, 2019 19:51
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Philthy posted:this is exactly how we ended up with trmp Too long form for Twitter, gotta be Reddit. Probably r/politics
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Nov 17, 2019 19:51
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Philthy posted:this is exactly how we ended up with trmp gently caress you and your implied obligations.
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Nov 17, 2019 19:52
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silvergoose posted:I assume everyone in this thread understands the difference between primary voting (vote as far left as possible) and general election voting (anything less than fascist is better than fascist). The hostage is toast, sorry, I'm not only committed to voting for Bernie but I won't be voting for anybody to his right for the rest of my life. If Pete or Liz want my vote that's what they're gonna have to do
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Nov 17, 2019 19:53
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Powered Descent posted:Re-electing Trump to own the not-quite-lib-enoughs. if a campaign loses to Trump it's entirely their fault and to say otherwise is to excuse the incompetence of the powerful
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Nov 17, 2019 19:53
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