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dogstile posted:This is ideal, actually. Sounds like they know forest battles are boring, unfun poo poo and want us to make choices without just restricting us the way forests do. Yeah, as long as allies block movement, close quarters fights present an interesting challenge, but only sometimes. Too many and you end up contemplating death as everyone blocks everyone elses path and you end up taking an hour on a 12 man fight because only two people can hit each other at once.
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Jan 24, 2020 19:57
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Nice additional QoL thing, a toggle for blocked pathing Their take is definitely a good assessment; more terrain variety but understanding where poo poo falls apart and not overstepping Interested in the new enemies and all that
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Jan 25, 2020 01:09
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Mazz posted:Nice additional QoL thing, a toggle for blocked pathing gently caress. Yes. I’ve wanted this feature badly for a long time now
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Jan 25, 2020 01:25
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 well, that was... a Pyrrhic victory. I thought at least it would end the noble war but it hasn't. Lost one of my best archers in the previous ambush/farm raid thing as well. What do you guys tend to do when your company gets hosed up like this? I need to go through the wounds and see if they're character-ruining, but I clearly need to rebuild a lot. I'm at day 100 and have decent Renown so I get good money from contracts (although this one, with two fights against 18-24 noble knights, only got me 3000!!) - just hobble along as a severely diminished company taking low-risk jobs and taking my time about hiring newer, better bros? I guess it could be a good opportunity to do so and get some good sellswords etc instead of my midgame party, just wondering when people decide it's too much effort and retire to start fresh. Doesn't seem like the game really has a fail state as such.
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Jan 25, 2020 16:30
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Lunchmeat Larry posted:What do you guys tend to do when your company gets hosed up like this? reload.
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Jan 25, 2020 16:53
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Molybdenum posted:reload. This. Also note that most of the money from combat comes from repairing and selling the loot; not the contract rewards once you’ve moved past the early game. Those fights you’ve described could easily represent 10-20k in loot. The missing eye is irrelevant unless it happens to an archer, and brain damage is arguably a buff rather than a penalty but the hosed leg and the hosed lung are career enders. Also, Oswald's swanky armor notwithstanding your guys are worryingly undergeared for the stage of the game you're in and I'd say you've bitten off more than you can chew going after noble companies. The Lord Bude fucked around with this message at 17:29 on Jan 25, 2020 |
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Jan 25, 2020 17:24
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Molybdenum posted:reload.  Next time I get noble war I'll remember to bring more dedicated axe users.The Lord Bude posted:This. Also note that most of the money from combat comes from repairing and selling the loot; not the contract rewards once you’ve moved past the early game. Those fights you’ve described could easily represent 10-20k in loot.
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Jan 25, 2020 17:25
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Lunchmeat Larry posted:this was the best outcome See my edit. Dedicated daggers are a waste, just give all your front liners a dagger to switch to. It's only really worth it on the knights with plate mail or someone wearing a unique, most of your money comes from selling weapons, armor costs too much in tools to repair.
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Jan 25, 2020 17:31
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Dedicated dagger guy isn't a guy you take because it's a good idea but rather because it's hilarious. It's sort of a marginally useful joke role, though I thought it was pretty cool having a dedicated 'assassin' on my team. Would have been better off with lots of other ways to stack damage through armor, though.
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Jan 25, 2020 17:33
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I also think breaking shields is a newbie trap - once you destroy the shields they do more damage. I don't know the levels or stats of your guys; but you don't need to break shields once your guys have good enough attack. Before then use flails, but they don't do much damage and you really need to have moved on from them by the time the crisis comes around. As I mentioned your guys are worryingly undergeared, you really ought to have everyone in top tier weapons by now, not military picks. Maces are good at wrecking armor and relatively cheap, and they fatigue the enemy which reduces the damage incoming to you. Plus stuns for emergencies. Orc Cleavers do shitloads of damage if you have guys with adequate fatigue to use them (>140). Plus they're free. And also this demonstrates why I think people are better off picking undead crisis first. Had you done that, at this stage in the game (assuming vet difficulty) you'd mostly be fighting big hordes of zombies which you ought to be able to do in your sleep; along with ancient auxillaries (easy to kill) and smaller amounts of legionaries and honour guards (still not that hard to kill, and arguably easier than noble armies) The Lord Bude fucked around with this message at 17:41 on Jan 25, 2020 |
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Jan 25, 2020 17:36
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I've never actually regretted having a dedicated dagger user because its really funny. That said its not amazingly effective.
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Jan 25, 2020 17:41
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dogstile posted:I've never actually regretted having a dedicated dagger user because its really funny. That said its not amazingly effective. I mean sure if it’s day 200 or something but early on when you’re trying to level your guys up as quickly as possible and you have to work to keep everyone fed and paid you don’t want an extra mouth to feed and you don’t want to waste xp on a joke guy.
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Jan 25, 2020 17:53
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Dagger Mastery is amazing against some of the toughest enemies in the game but should never be the only Mastery perk a bro has.Lunchmeat Larry posted:What do you guys tend to do when your company gets hosed up like this? I need to go through the wounds and see if they're character-ruining, but I clearly need to rebuild a lot. I'm at day 100 and have decent Renown so I get good money from contracts (although this one, with two fights against 18-24 noble knights, only got me 3000!!) - just hobble along as a severely diminished company taking low-risk jobs and taking my time about hiring newer, better bros? The Lord Bude posted:And also this demonstrates why I think people are better off picking undead crisis first. Had you done that, at this stage in the game (assuming vet difficulty) you'd mostly be fighting big hordes of zombies which you ought to be able to do in your sleep; along with ancient auxillaries (easy to kill) and smaller amounts of legionaries and honour guards (still not that hard to kill, and arguably easier than noble armies)
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Jan 25, 2020 17:54
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The Lord Bude posted:I also think breaking shields is a newbie trap - once you destroy the shields they do more damage. I don't know the levels or stats of your guys; but you don't need to break shields once your guys have good enough attack. Before then use flails, but they don't do much damage and you really need to have moved on from them by the time the crisis comes around. As I mentioned your guys are worryingly undergeared, you really ought to have everyone in top tier weapons by now, not military picks. Maces are good at wrecking armor and relatively cheap, and they fatigue the enemy which reduces the damage incoming to you. Plus stuns for emergencies. Orc Cleavers do shitloads of damage if you have guys with adequate fatigue to use them (>140). Plus they're free. What kind of battles should I have been looking for to make high profits in midgame? I feel like I did fine up to that point and... should probably have stayed on the outskirts of the crisis after that. I was doing well at raiding orc camps etc but their loot wasn't selling for any great amount - guess I should be repairing weapons before selling them? I came to the same conclusions about the injuries, the lung guy got booted immediately for a new archer who had 68 ranged at level 2, and the leg guy is being used as bait until I can replace him with a new DPS. Thanks for the advice, feel like I shouldn't need it at 50 or so hours in but I'm obviously still getting my head around the endgame 
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Jan 25, 2020 18:03
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One additional benefit for having the undead campaign as a starting crisis; you get a free paladin brother for the duration of the crisis(as long as you have an open spot). The brother can be leveled up to battle forged rank immediately and has decent armor and headgear which you get to keep. It can be a helpful boost to your company's armaments if you are behind. The brother will leave you after the crisis is over, so don't be afraid to put them into dangerous spots.
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Jan 25, 2020 18:09
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dogstile posted:I've never actually regretted having a dedicated dagger user because its really funny. That said its not amazingly effective. One time just for fun I tried doing an entire company that only used daggers. Very funny but not very effective even though sometimes you land like 12 punctures in one turn and just ruin an entire enemy force. More often you miss every single one and then they wreck you.
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Jan 25, 2020 18:51
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Donkringel posted:One additional benefit for having the undead campaign as a starting crisis; you get a free paladin brother for the duration of the crisis(as long as you have an open spot). The brother can be leveled up to battle forged rank immediately and has decent armor and headgear which you get to keep. It can be a helpful boost to your company's armaments if you are behind. The brother will leave you after the crisis is over, so don't be afraid to put them into dangerous spots. This is a relatively uncommon random event and most of the time you'll never see it. Wizard Styles posted:Considering the 150 durability mail most of the melee bros were in any fight against a block of Legionaries could end the same way. I agree that he's undergeared (more the weapons than the armor, 150 mail is fine for 1handers at this point) but he isn't going to fight against a big block of Legionaries in the first crisis on veterant difficulty. Most fights will be mostly zombies and fallen heroes, and when there are ancient dead there will be lots of auxillaries. Worst case scenario is a fight with half a dozen or so of the pikes on the back line, and probably at least some of the front liners are auxillaries not legionaries. Whips can disarm some of the pikes to buy time; but honestly ancient dead crumple really quickly - As I've mentioned before if you move everyone back exactly one hex in the first round, they'll move an extra tile to reach you and they won't have enough AP left to shield wall. You should be able to take most of the front line out before the next round starts. Lunchmeat Larry posted:yeah, I think I was unlucky with my map seed in that there aren't many good armorers around but I'm definitely underequipped even compared to my first full campaign. Think I need to get a better understanding of how to make money either way, though - I was relying on boosting Renown/ambitions ASAP to get high rewards but seems like that was a mistake. The first crisis isn't even remotely the endgame. I like to follow this general progression. 1. Visit every town on the map, doing contracts as you go and looking for recruits. Buy trade goods to sell in cities when you can. Only hire bros that are good enough to be in your endgame company - that way you'll grow your company more slowly, but you won't be wasting xp on guys you aren't going to keep. The difficulty will scale more slowly and your guys will be a higher level vs getting a really big company right away. 2. At some point, you will have a full company, and most of the bros in it will be reasonably well geared - at least 120 armor top and bottom, top tier flails or second best tier maces/swords/axes - if you're lucky top tier maces/swords/axes, especially if you've killed a couple of bandit leaders. You have a comfy cash reserve and can go 3-4 days at least without running out of money. At this point - stop doing any contracts of 2 skull difficulty or less that require you to clear a location (this is because low difficulty contracts overwrite locations that spawned at the beginning of the game, so you might lose the chance to get hold of unique items that spawned at those locations at the start of the game. Start focusing on exploring the map and clearing locations. Bandits and zombies are easy; and at this point you should be able to deal with orcs, as long as its just Orc young and maybe very small numbers of beserkers. Don't try and deal with goblins, or groups of mainly orc warriors until your guys are at level 9-10 and better geared. Zombie camps tend to have decent treasures to sell, orc camps are very profitable with orc weapons. If your guys have high stamina you can also pick up orc cleavers to use for free. This will earn you much more money than doing contracts. Keep working on ambitions - once you have access to noble contacts, patrols are good because you can accept a patrol, quickly move to the first two cities, then clear a few enemy camp locations to rack up the head count. Remember that the further away from civilization you get, the harder camps will be and the higher the chance of unique items. 3. Once the crisis hits, transition to doing contracts related to that.
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Jan 25, 2020 18:52
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vyelkin posted:One time just for fun I tried doing an entire company that only used daggers. Very funny but not very effective even though sometimes you land like 12 punctures in one turn and just ruin an entire enemy force. More often you miss every single one and then they wreck you. The last time I did a dagger master was when the witch's hut was first added in and I wanted someone dedicated to using the obsidian dagger. That guy got promptly dumped when I found out that zombified enemies no longer drop their loot. It's kind of a shame that some of the weapons/abilities that you build specifically for, like lunge fencer or puncture master, just wind up as gimmicks you do for fun and experimentation. They just really don't hold a candle to like your bog standard axe or cleaver duelist. That said, I am definitely going to make a dedicated bomb wizard with the new DLC 
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Jan 25, 2020 19:11
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The Lord Bude posted:This is a relatively uncommon random event and most of the time you'll never see it. Wait really? Huh I've always gotten them on all my playthroughs when I had a spot open. I wonder what the odds were. Ok good looking out, thanks.
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Jan 25, 2020 19:22
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moot the hopple posted:The last time I did a dagger master was when the witch's hut was first added in and I wanted someone dedicated to using the obsidian dagger. That guy got promptly dumped when I found out that zombified enemies no longer drop their loot. I never noticed this, what the gently caress lol
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Jan 25, 2020 20:35
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dogstile posted:I never noticed this, what the gently caress lol They don't technically die so the loot isn't present. It's a rough side effect of the dagger. Worth it still fighting chosen.
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Jan 25, 2020 20:36
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vyelkin posted:One time just for fun I tried doing an entire company that only used daggers. Very funny but not very effective even though sometimes you land like 12 punctures in one turn and just ruin an entire enemy force. More often you miss every single one and then they wreck you. It seems like in vanilla they just didn't have time to think through introducing more interesting playstyles for different weapons. In Legends mod it works great, as the puncture skill is dependent on opponent fatigue level. Always useless against stuff like undead (like it should be) and goes up to 90+% hit chance against really tired human knights late in battle (which is how historically knights got daggered down on the ground). Rad Russian fucked around with this message at 20:48 on Jan 25, 2020 |
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Jan 25, 2020 20:46
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Lunchmeat Larry posted:What kind of battles should I have been looking for to make high profits in midgame? I feel like I did fine up to that point and... should probably have stayed on the outskirts of the crisis after that. I was doing well at raiding orc camps etc but their loot wasn't selling for any great amount - guess I should be repairing weapons before selling them? Wiedergängers/Necromancers don't give you good gear apart from some decent helmets but can have good treasure. Also, they're very easy to fight once you've got some decent armor, a few accurate archers and Recovery on most of your bros. And Fallen Heroes are a good source of armor if you can find them; iirc they're fairly rare on difficulties below Expert. Goblins and Ancient Dead can also have some decent treasure but their gear isn't amazing and even when fights against them go well they can be annoying because Goblins can always just injure 3 bros and Ancient Dead shred armor. But really, so much depends on your map. Barbarian Thralls are easy money because even roaming groups of them carry low value treasure items but you might not want to be in the north anyway if it's all mountain ranges and a few scattered settlements with few useful stores or trading goods. The important part is to just keep fighting. Battle Brothers is a game that can snowball very easily, which can work for or against you. So to get ready for the crisis you just want to take any fight you can win without losses. Ideally you get paid for it but if not you can always sell the loot. Like Lord Bude said, patrol contracts are great, but you can also take a delivery contract and take a detour through the wilderness to see if you can find enemy camps on the way. Taking detours is often a good idea anyway. You can attack huts really early in the game and even if you find something you can't take on at the moment at least you know where it is for later. Also, don't take contracts (or ambitions) that waste too much of your time. A 3 day caravan contract may lead to some fights along the way or it may not. Or you might have to run away from the fight. In that time you could easily find some bandit camp or two and get more out of those. I usually try to reach Professional renown/noble contracts within 30 days, then get to a point where I can just go raiding in the wilderness for days at a time and do the Orc/Goblin/Undead hunt ambitions as quickly as possible. This is again map dependant but is doable between day 40 and 50. And that's just what I keep doing until the crisis hits around day 75. I still take contracts but I get very selective about them. That playstyle requires you to know when you can take what enemies fairly well, so it might not work for you right now. When I started playing like that I had taken a few companies through the first crisis already. But the general approach of taking less contracts and attacking enemy locations the further you get is still going to be useful. Also, I almost never repair items to sell them. It's profitable but having tools to spare is more valuable. The Lord Bude posted:I agree that he's undergeared (more the weapons than the armor, 150 mail is fine for 1handers at this point) but he isn't going to fight against a big block of Legionaries in the first crisis on veterant difficulty. Most fights will be mostly zombies and fallen heroes, and when there are ancient dead there will be lots of auxillaries. Worst case scenario is a fight with half a dozen or so of the pikes on the back line, and probably at least some of the front liners are auxillaries not legionaries. And 150 durability mail is not enough at day 100. By that time, especially with the noble war as the crisis, you usually should have enough money to upgrade even if you didn't manage to find or buy heavier armor. On Expert I try to have every melee bro in 200+ armor when the crisis starts, but there are also more Brigand Leaders and Fallen Heroes to loot it from. Still, Veteran gives you more money, and the 210 durability armor isn't that expensive. quote:The first crisis isn't even remotely the endgame. I like to play on beyond that and at least take down a few Orc Warlords in their camps but the Black Monolith, the big Goblin city and the Kraken are essentially postgame content. There's also not much of interest between the first crisis and those three fights.
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Jan 26, 2020 00:41
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Wizard Styles posted:Brigands, Barbarians and Orcs all give you treasure items and at least some valuable gear you can sell even if you don't need it yourself. On veteran most camps with larger quantities of zombies will start to have several fallen heroes by day 40-50. You rarely see more than half a dozen. Ancient dead weapons still sell for decent amounts, but less than Orc weapons which are really lucrative; but I need to point out once again that they are the only source of warscythes; and you want one for every pole guy in your party asap. I probably wouldn’t fight 24+ noble soldiers on my own in the first crisis (although it’s doable if you have lots of good archers) but I’d happily do it in the second crisis or later.
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Jan 26, 2020 01:35
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Well I somehow corrupted my Lone Wolf save at day ~750  Guess that means it's time to find a new seed and try peasant militia again.
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Jan 27, 2020 01:28
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Mazz posted:Well I somehow corrupted my Lone Wolf save at day ~750 I'm playing peasant militia using HLDPITXGEW right now and it's pretty good. I think about 6 of your starting peasants are late game keepers; the map layout is ok, but I had no trouble finding 4 archers and 2 tossers; and I've never had such a good run of named items in any game ever. Another one I've seen but not played is JUSTONEPLZ - you start with one guy that's sergeant material; 2 great archers (capable of hitting >90 ratk) and 2 decent archers (one will hit 87 ratk, one will only get to 81; but has iron lungs) Edit: correction, the seed with great archers is justoneplz - you need to use all lowercase. The Lord Bude fucked around with this message at 05:09 on Jan 28, 2020 |
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Jan 27, 2020 02:46
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i feel like the best seeds aren't the ones with amazing starter bros, they're the ones with good trade routes (and a conveniently lopsided noble war layout)
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Jan 27, 2020 03:01
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GreyjoyBastard posted:i feel like the best seeds aren't the ones with amazing starter bros, they're the ones with good trade routes (and a conveniently lopsided noble war layout) The militia origin is different, though. With that origin you aren't even guaranteed usable bros. You should fire about half of them anyway and the ones you keep are probably going to be good enough for the time being. But having a few among those that you can actually keep around permanently is nice.
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Jan 27, 2020 04:13
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I found a named Fencing sword with -3 fatigue to skills and better than usual damage; but I think I ultimately need to just sell it. My company is full, I really don't want to fire anyone, and the one time I tried building a fencer it just ended up super underwhelming.
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Jan 27, 2020 05:48
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Yeah I went full Lunge concept also a few playthroughs ago and it wasn't very good. The problem is that any initiative build doesn't get you much. Even throwing in Dodge to make further use of initiative for some defense as well as attack isn't too hot; I mean, stacking defense is always good but it's still temporary, and if you are going DPS build and things heat up, it means one of your precious perks isn't giving you full effect, oftentimes at moments when you need it the most. I found my fencer was good in the first couple of rounds but then would gas out. And he was never as good as just a plain orc weapon duelist, who are way more consistent. I thought he would be good as a flanker who could dart in and out and take out key targets, but the reality is that Lunge's movement isn't that efficient for that goal and you get outnumbered too quickly in game where it's just simpler to hack your way through. But I also never found a unique fencing sword so maybe there's one out there that makes the numbers work.
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Jan 27, 2020 06:04
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Battle Bros super quick how to get your bros geared up guide: 1. Get good enough to fight brigand raiders through doing whatever 2. Fight as many brigand raiders as possible to get pikes, flails, and decent helmets (and maybe the odd armour from a dagger party or lucky drop or idiot without a helmet) 3. Don't waste money on hiring expensive bros early on, just mass hire and fire farmers, brawlers, etc looking for good talents and traits. Don't buy weapons. 4. Use all the money you have from selling brigand loot and not getting splurged on bros to buy 210+ armours (and matching helmets if you're lacking there too). A 210 armour makes your bro nearly invincible until way later in the game and you can feasibly start getting them very early, say day 20.
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Jan 27, 2020 11:22
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It's easier now the retreat buttons been changed, but the advice of going for huts early kinda sucked if you weren't savescumming early, because occasionally you'd walk into 8 zombies and 2 ghosts on day 4. It's partially why I always take the archer start now. Not being able to scout those out (hell, i'd even take "spend some time waiting so you can see inside and get rough numbers" as a mechanic) really hurts in a game where you take one lovely fight and its game over.
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Jan 27, 2020 12:04
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Huts are scouted by default. Ruins can be a problem, though, especially if they're in elevated terrain and you don't know if there are Brigand Marksmen or Goblins in there. I don't take those on until my frontline is armored up enough to not immediately get injured or poisoned.
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Jan 27, 2020 18:46
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Is it just huts that are fine by default? I was kinda using huts as a "all ruins are really risky" but i didn't quite realise i could always see what was in a hut.
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Jan 27, 2020 18:57
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Only ruined castles aren't scouted by default. And special locations like the Witch's Hut and Black Monolith, but those are always the same.
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Jan 27, 2020 19:13
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I didn't realize taking location missions started overwriting places that spawned at the beginning of the game. That makes so much sense and explains why I had so much trouble finding named items a while back.
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Jan 27, 2020 19:31
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Dreylad posted:I didn't realize taking location missions started overwriting places that spawned at the beginning of the game. That makes so much sense and explains why I had so much trouble finding named items a while back. But yeah, if you only ever attack locations as part of a contract you just straight up won't get any named items from battles unless an enemy spawns with one or it's a 3 skull contract. If possible, I also always check for rumors before taking a contract sending me to a location that can theoretically spawn a named item. Not all can; huts, graveyards and necromancer hideouts don't (but tombs do iirc).
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Jan 27, 2020 20:15
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Just had the most miserable barbarian run I've ever experienced. Every settlement in the non-hostile kingdom is a keep except for 4 isolated small trade hubs, but they were at least 2-3 days from each other. Every mission given has literally been an escort or courier mission, but because of the vast distance between the trade hubs, I make no money on them. Because of all the keeps, and there are vast armies that roam the countryside, there no bandits or monsters to fight. Day 60 has rolled around and everyone is still still level 1, with the exception of the barbarians who are lvl 4, and best armor and weapons I have is the barbarians' starting gear. Anymore got a good seed I can use? 
Back Hack fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Jan 27, 2020 |
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Jan 27, 2020 20:37
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Back Hack posted:Just had the most miserable barbarian run I've ever experienced. Every settlement in the non-hostile kingdom is a keep except for 4 isolated small trade hubs, but they were at least 2-3 days from each other. Every mission given has literally been an escort or courier mission, but because of the vast distance between the trade hubs, I make no money on them. Because of all the keeps, and there are vast armies that roam the countryside, there no bandits or monsters to fight. Day 60 has rolled around and everyone is still still level 1, with the exception of the barbarians who are lvl 4, and best armor and weapons I have is the barbarians' starting gear. Probably any other seed compared to that one
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Jan 27, 2020 20:58
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Back Hack posted:Just had the most miserable barbarian run I've ever experienced. Every settlement in the non-hostile kingdom is a keep except for 4 isolated small trade hubs, but they were at least 2-3 days from each other. Every mission given has literally been an escort or courier mission, but because of the vast distance between the trade hubs, I make no money on them. Because of all the keeps, and there are vast armies that roam the countryside, there no bandits or monsters to fight. Day 60 has rolled around and everyone is still still level 1, with the exception of the barbarians who are lvl 4, and best armor and weapons I have is the barbarians' starting gear. EUDGGTYFVM is a great raiders seed. 10 southern cities, plenty of plains and bandits. Only downside is no hunters cabins in the south.
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Jan 27, 2020 21:04
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