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wtf drawing power absolutely matters it's the reason why we say el santo is the greatest luchador of all time and why rikidozan is in history textbooks in 3 countries
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Feb 17, 2020 02:51
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The Rock is the best wrestler of all time after Shane/Steph/Vince if you go by $ probably now that the millionaire man has been defrauded
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Feb 17, 2020 03:00
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fatherofmustard posted:What are the most divisive matches of all time? Matches like Kenny vs Moxley from Full Gear that some people loved and some hated. Hogan/Rock was like that at the time but I don't think anyone cares now. The Taker/Foley Hell in a Cell was too with people arguing between it being an all time great match and just two stunts.
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Feb 17, 2020 03:01
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That Ibushi match with the terrible head bump on the apron. Goldberg/Lesnar.
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Feb 17, 2020 03:02
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Hirez posted:The Rock is the best wrestler of all time after Shane/Steph/Vince if you go by $ probably I heard that they fined the Million Dollar Man exactly one million dollars since that was exactly how much money he had. Once he paid that, he's been left with nothing but but exactly one million dollars. 
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Feb 17, 2020 03:03
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Jerusalem posted:I heard that they fined the Million Dollar Man exactly one million dollars since that was exactly how much money he had. Once he paid that, he's been left with nothing but but exactly one million dollars. The reason he might be going to jail is he received 2.3 million from the state through his crooked son, breaking that vow.
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Feb 17, 2020 03:05
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I think his lawyer's defense is going to be that the state actually paid him 3.3 million but it automatically become 1 million, which explains why it appears 2.3 million went missing.
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Feb 17, 2020 03:10
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Lamuella posted:A reign that should have been legendary but ended up being a dogturd was Jericho as the first undisputed champion. Jericho beat The Rock and Stone Cold in the same night. He was the first holder of both belts simultaneously. They had so much potential there for new stories and new matches. They could have handed Jericho the ball and let him run with it. Instead they immediately started booking him as a weak coward. He needed a belt shot, interference, a crooked ref, a low blow, and a rope assist to beat The Rock at the Rumble. His match against Austin at No Way Out played second fiddle to Austin's feud with the NWO. Then he was the fourth most important participant in his feud with Triple H, after Triple H, Stephanie, and Stephanie's dog. At one point the first undisputed WWF champion was cleaning up dog poop on TV for his boss. To add to this story and tie it in to the GOAT talk: The entire point of Jericho's reign was to be a belt pillow for Triple H. The timeline pretty much went: won the belts in December, first title defense was against Rock in January, second defense was in February, and his third was when he lost to Triple H at Wrestlemania that March. From what I remember, Rock and Austin both refused to lose to Triple H, so this was the work-around to prove that Triple H was unquestionably the most powerful form of super saiyan. ("He beat the guy that beat the guys you love TWICE"). Is he the GOAT? Probably not, and I wouldn't make that argument myself. But the fact that Jericho's career wasn't ended by all of this is testament to how amazing Jericho is. I guess my ultimate point is that Triple H is an anthropomorphic garbage bag filled with diapers and Bob Orton's used diabetes needles.
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Feb 17, 2020 03:14
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Aphrodite posted:That Ibushi match with the terrible head bump on the apron. You're going to have to narrow it down
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Feb 17, 2020 08:28
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What Rock vs (?) ppv was it where (i assume in phili) he sang a song about about sticking a feather up a jabroni I've just signed up for a free month of WWE using a prepaid card so it won't renew  and always wanted to see the leadup to it, and a few of the specials on Eddie / First season of Christian & Edge (I skipped wrestling from 2000-2018) Also probably watch all the Royal Rumbles (not whole cards) from 2000+ even though I know who *most* of the winners are, just not of which particular Rumble Already saw the last episode of good WWE with WM30; any other really good PPV's I should watch? (Takeovers not allowed) edit: lol just saw Drew Carey "eliminate" both Hardy's. Al snow?? what the hell why is Steve Blackman (oh Ryan Shamrock  ) allowed to use his sticks in the Rumble; I have no idea who the gently caress is going to win this 2001 rumble I'm watchingedit: lol honkey tonk man vs kane ; thank god im drunk as gently caress Rock @ 13 woo I bet he wins (or loses to HHH in the final 2) Hirez fucked around with this message at 09:33 on Feb 17, 2020 |
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Feb 17, 2020 08:38
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Blaise330 posted:WWE talking about WCW is the most "history is written by history's winners" ever. I heard one Bruce Prichard podcast where he was justifying why he booked DDP to be the stalker of Undertaker's wife instead of doing his old gimmick. He says DDP was never over cause if he was over WCW wouldn't have went out of business. Making him a stalker was a last ditch effort to make him remotely useful to them. Final conclusion: DDP just had no value to a wrestling promotion and WWE did everything that coulda done to make him work.
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Feb 17, 2020 09:03
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Coaaab posted:This post made me want to raise a tangential point: which fed had the greatest disparity between good booking and low-quality talent where you'd consider the promotion either generally successful (audience reactions, financials, etc.) or personally successful in your eyes? Heretical opinion: ECW, especially ECW from late 1997 onwards In the hands of most other people, ECW's talent (with a few exceptions who were superb) were generally flawed. However both in the arena and on DVD they were stars. Because they were booked with unbelievable creativity by Paul Heyman who was excellent at hiding people's flaws.
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Feb 17, 2020 09:32
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Lamuella posted:You're going to have to narrow it down It's the Naito match at Dominion last year that caused lots of hand-wringing and Meltzer going "I refuse to rate this"
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Feb 17, 2020 09:44
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forkboy84 posted:It's the Naito match at Dominion last year that caused lots of hand-wringing and Meltzer going "I refuse to rate this" that match whipped rear end and anybody who didn't like it was a loving coward
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Feb 17, 2020 09:50
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fatherofmustard posted:What are the most divisive matches of all time? Matches like Kenny vs Moxley from Full Gear that some people loved and some hated. Okada/SANADA matches seem to divide opinion between MOTYC and worst match ever with not much in between.
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Feb 17, 2020 10:06
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Sandman McMahon posted:McDonalds sells the most cheeseburgers therefore they are the best at making cheeseburgers. I rest my case. damm i could go for some mcd's
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Feb 17, 2020 10:11
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TriffTshngo posted:that match whipped rear end and anybody who didn't like it was a loving coward On a rewatch I very much enjoyed it, but in the moment I just wanted the match to loving end so I could get confirmation that Ibushi hadn't broken his brain doing something dumb like Shibata did. But yeah, pure cowardice
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Feb 17, 2020 11:09
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My 2c on the GOAT talk. In Pro Wrestling it is nearly impossible to say, as there are so many factors. Aside from the already discussed longevity, drawing power, and even match quality there are other considerations. Did they change their character? Did they work both face and heel? Did they have all the longevity/drawing power/quality matches in different places/times/companies? etc. Andbecause it is a "fake" sport, a major one is how were they booked? Coz Hogan drew fucktonnes of cash, but was booked in a way that allowed him to do that. I don't think Hogan ever overcame bad booking. But Jericho has, at times in his career, overcome bad booking to not only get more over, but draw more cash, and aheve good matches etc. (I am not arguing solely Jericho vs Hogan for GOAT, just using the two as examples because they have been talked about.) So with all those variables, and probably others that I haven't thought of, I reckon Jericho deserves to at least be considered in the to 10 of all time.
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Feb 17, 2020 11:56
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fatherofmustard posted:What are the most divisive matches of all time? Matches like Kenny vs Moxley from Full Gear that some people loved and some hated.
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Feb 17, 2020 12:52
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the greatest wrestler of all time is Kazuchika Okada.
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Feb 17, 2020 13:16
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OFFICER LIGER posted:the greatest wrestlers of all time are the AMERICAN MALES AMERICAN MALES AMERICAN MALES AMERICAN MALES AMERICAN MALES AMERICAN MALES AMERICAN MALES
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Feb 17, 2020 13:30
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OFFICER LIGER posted:the greatest wrestler of all time is Kazuchika Okada. By the end of his career I genuinely think there could be a case for this. like, right now I think that Tanahashi has the edge for current New Japan guys simply because of how much better the business is from when he first started taking the weight, but on the basis of match quality Okada is absolutely unassailable. His mediocre matches are better than most good wrestlers' great matches.
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Feb 17, 2020 13:36
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What are the biggest wrestling markets in the world? I assume it goes US, Japan, Canada and Mexico but I don't know for sure.
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Feb 17, 2020 14:20
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I would like to see people who claim Jericho as the GOAT clearly articulate why he's a better pro wrestler than Kobashi, Misawa, inoki, Flair, Bret, Terry Funk, Sammartino, Race, even guys he was contemporaneous with like Rocky and Austin It's just ludicrous imo, he isn't even top 15 or top 20 to me. but I respect the opinion
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Feb 17, 2020 16:55
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ChrisBTY posted:What are the biggest wrestling markets in the world? I assume it goes US, Japan, Canada and Mexico but I don't know for sure. Mexico is much higher than Canada by any metric you can come up with. Attendance wise it'd be US, Mexico, Japan, UK and then probably Canada. By US$ it is US then Japan.
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Feb 17, 2020 17:00
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Low Desert Punk posted:I would like to see people who claim Jericho as the GOAT clearly articulate why he's a better pro wrestler than Kobashi, Misawa, inoki, Flair, Bret, Terry Funk, Sammartino, Race, even guys he was contemporaneous with like Rocky and Austin OK, here goes: 1) there is no objective measure of what "greatest of all time" means 2) i like him more than those guys Hope that helps.
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Feb 17, 2020 17:46
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Low Desert Punk posted:I would like to see people who claim Jericho as the GOAT clearly articulate why he's a better pro wrestler than Kobashi, Misawa, inoki, Flair, Bret, Terry Funk, Sammartino, Race, even guys he was contemporaneous with like Rocky and Austin He has entertained me for 20 years in a way that no one else has managed to and keeps reinventing himself every time he starts getting stale.
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Feb 17, 2020 17:54
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I feel like Jericho could have been a legit contender for GOAT status if WWE had allowed him to be a top star. Like as great as Jericho's AEW work is, we could have gotten 20 years worth of it, with even better wrestling, if WWE had given Jericho the same kind of push they gave Triple H.
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Feb 17, 2020 17:55
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OFFICER LIGER posted:the greatest wrestler of all time is Charlie Haas.
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Feb 17, 2020 17:56
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Low Desert Punk posted:I would like to see people who claim Jericho as the GOAT clearly articulate why he's a better pro wrestler than Kobashi, Misawa, inoki, Flair, Bret, Terry Funk, Sammartino, Race, even guys he was contemporaneous with like Rocky and Austin He's been able to keep himself fresh far longer than Rock or Austin, adapting to the times and promotions he finds himself in. I don't think in ring he's ever surpassed the best Bret matches, but as a character he's been far more consistently interesting. The comparison to Flair is a hard one, my instinct is that he's been better about developing new talent around him and staying exciting in his later years whereas later Flair became a schtick more than a character. Funk might actually be the perfect comparison, they're both excellent about giving their opponents opportunity to look great. I don't think in the ring he's on the level of Misawa or Kobashi, and in terms of influence he can't touch Inoki, but I think there's a top 20 case.
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Feb 17, 2020 17:59
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I Before E posted:He's been able to keep himself fresh far longer than Rock or Austin Eh, it's not like either of those guys was getting stale by the time they left.
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Feb 17, 2020 18:01
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Can anyone list out Jericho's Fozzy hiatuses?
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Feb 17, 2020 18:17
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I don't know about GOAT but I think a big point in Jericho's favour is that he's been able to succeed despite poor booking and mismanagement using his own creativity and charisma. Like, in WCW most things were clearly left up to him because no one backstage cared about the cruiserweights, but I can still fondly recall such things as the 1,004 holds promo, the letter from Ted Turner ("But... but... what about Canada?  "), Bore-Us Malenko, wrecking Dave Penzer's tux, the Goldberg parody entrance, the Library of Congress visit, etc. I know he was being "Terry Taylor pushed" as far as the cruiserweights were concerned, but given how we probably weren't supposed to care much about them as a whole it's pretty incredible that I can still recall all those things more than twenty years later.There are lots of WWE examples with him too, I mean, he managed to survive breaking Chyna's fingers like a comic book supervillain, playing second fiddle to Triple H's dog, and various skits involving rear end cream and getting to see Mae Young naked (but not really).
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Feb 17, 2020 18:41
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one of the greatest Jericho in WCW moments which no-one ever seems to remember is the time they had a cruiserweight battle royal and he did the ring announcing just him ripping into all the luchadors one by one was hilarious
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Feb 17, 2020 18:59
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Julio Cruz posted:one of the greatest Jericho in WCW moments which no-one ever seems to remember is the time they had a cruiserweight battle royal and he did the ring announcing  that and what subsequently happened afterward was the essence of what made wcw jericho so great
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Feb 17, 2020 19:08
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Coaaab posted:
yeah I was mostly going off the fact that it was left out of the previous post detailing his greatest WCW achievements
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Feb 17, 2020 19:12
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Jericho has had some bad or boring parts of his career that have been forgotten too. From 2013-2016 he had a lot of really boring feuds when he was in, against Wyatt or Ambrose and others. There was also his return in 2007 when he did that awful ME WANT TITLE SHOT material before he turned heel and really reinvented himself. He's been mostly great, but there have been long stretches where he was on hiatus or just doing sporadic kind of boring feuds.
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Feb 17, 2020 19:12
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MassRafTer posted:Jericho has had some bad or boring parts of his career that have been forgotten too. From 2013-2016 he had a lot of really boring feuds when he was in, against Wyatt or Ambrose and others. the ambrose feud really shows how tough it is to evaluate good players on bad teams in wrestling compared to many shoot sports. ambrose asylum is one of my personal least favorite matches in history and was one of the major factor in why i stopped watching the monthly major shows. i’m still hyped for the aew title match between the same two guys now that they’re four years older tho and and i’m confident they’ll deliver
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Feb 17, 2020 19:19
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Coaaab posted:This post made me want to raise a tangential point: which fed had the greatest disparity between good booking and low-quality talent where you'd consider the promotion either generally successful (audience reactions, financials, etc.) or personally successful in your eyes? WWE in 1998
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Feb 17, 2020 20:29
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The state should make DiBiase dribble a basketball, if he's successful he can keep the money.
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Feb 17, 2020 20:48
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