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Well, that and it's heavily implied and discussed to be more repression than anything.
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Mar 8, 2020 12:56
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Mr. Lobe posted:yeah, I can't think of any other games where you're an amnesiac because your character was such a fuckup that they drank themselves into brain damage That's not what happened at all. Harrier strategically drank himself to memory loss before a difficult case so he could more efficiently solve it by having a contrasting fresh-eyes view compared to his partner, and it worked as intended. Obviously. 
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Mar 8, 2020 12:58
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GlyphGryph posted:There's a lot of video games that do it, period. The Witcher, KOTOR, Cave Story, Geneforge, just off the top of my head. Like half the final fantasy games. A bunch more jrpgs in general. Also New Vegas, probably. At least on your first playthrough.
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Mar 8, 2020 13:09
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Megazver posted:Also New Vegas, probably. At least on your first playthrough. New Vegas is kind of ambiguous about that, especially since the player character's past does come up in the story and can be defined by some dialogue options. They could be amnesiac or just not up to date on current events.
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Mar 8, 2020 13:26
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It's been awhile since I played New Vegas, but I didn't think the Courier was amnesiac, just stuck in an unfamiliar place, tracking an unknown enemy, trying to recover an unknown package, for reasons that are at first unclear. Basically all the ingredients of an amnesia story but without actually losing your self-identity.
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Mar 8, 2020 13:45
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It's set up so that they could be, especially what with the head trauma.
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Mar 8, 2020 14:07
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Oh yeah, I forgot, but there’s a movie that features a character who gets into a car crash, wants to become a superstar, and has an identity crisis who ALSO has amnesia... *Inland Empire*. Edit: whoops I mixed up Mulholland Drive and Inland Empire, I’m dumb. They should have named that skill Mulholland Drive. Although Inland Empire is probably more appropriate and batshit crazy, tbf.. but Mulholland Drive is all about the dream-like quality, and also has the character I described above. imhotep fucked around with this message at 15:12 on Mar 8, 2020 |
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Mar 8, 2020 15:08
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The Courier isn't an amnesiac, he's concussed. 
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Mar 8, 2020 15:23
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Southpaugh posted:Read back your own posts here dude. I'm not going to watch the video - I'd prefer if you used your words on the forum to share ideas. I guess you're mostly taking umbrage with the notion that I was willing to punish the cryptofascist guy over stealing military grade body armor from a crime scene corpse (a crime!) - as I mentioned before my Harry didn't have the stats to even pursue that conversation path so I don't have full context.
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Mar 8, 2020 16:07
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itry posted:The Courier isn't an amnesiac, he's concussed. The funny thing is that one of the DLCs has a significant plot element to one of the indisputably canon things about the Courier- that they were shot in the head There's also some pretty funny dialogue (though sadly not quite enough) where you can bring up that you were shot in the head and buried and survived
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Mar 8, 2020 16:31
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itry posted:The Courier isn't an amnesiac, he's concussed. more like TBI. there was a bullet in those brainmeats
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Mar 8, 2020 17:05
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Pewdiepie posted:I'm not going to watch the video - I'd prefer if you used your words on the forum to share ideas. I guess you're mostly taking umbrage with the notion that I was willing to punish the cryptofascist guy over stealing military grade body armor from a crime scene corpse (a crime!) - as I mentioned before my Harry didn't have the stats to even pursue that conversation path so I don't have full context. I'm not gonna waste my time tbh. Edit: Because you are misunderstanding basically everything I'm posting - thats why I'm not gonna waste my time, because its a waste of time. Go read a book about policing or CSPAM or whatever. Not doing your homework for you. Southpaugh fucked around with this message at 17:52 on Mar 8, 2020 |
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Mar 8, 2020 17:50
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Southpaugh posted:I'm not gonna waste my time tbh. Explaining your ideas clearly isn't someone else's job.
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Mar 8, 2020 18:25
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Arrhythmia posted:Explaining your ideas clearly isn't someone else's job. It isn't anyones job nobody's paying them LMAO
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Mar 8, 2020 20:32
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actually i've internalised a thought that gives me réal each time i post unsuccessfully im fuckin rich
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Mar 8, 2020 20:33
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Inexplicable Humblebrag posted:actually i've internalised a thought that gives me réal each time i post unsuccessfully Thought: Truly Something Awful Temporary Research Bonus: -2 Empathy Nicodemus Dumps fucked around with this message at 20:43 on Mar 8, 2020 |
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Mar 8, 2020 20:41
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Just replaying the game and the phone call to the police department to report your badge missing is still hilarious. Somehow they managed to work out my gun was missing too even though I flawlessly described its plasma venting system.
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Mar 8, 2020 21:52
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having the whole precinct laugh at you over the radio is maybe the moment I realised maybe clicking on every single dialogue option maybe wasn't necessarily a good idea
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Mar 8, 2020 22:23
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If you had that conversation with a low Esprit de Corps, I recommend doing it again with a high Psyche Harry. It's actually pretty heartwarming. Kinda.
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Mar 8, 2020 22:33
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popewiles posted:Thought: Truly Something Awful +2 rhetoric
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Mar 8, 2020 23:25
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Mar 9, 2020 00:34
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Just finished the game. Enjoyed overall but felt the ending was a little disappointing, it honestly took me by surprise that everything wrapped up so abruptly. I'm wondering how much effect your choices actually have on the overall plot, and there are a few loose ends that I am a bit fuzzy on. I went to the island and you pretty much just find the guy who proceeds to confess to everything in a very anticlimactic way. The Phasmid encounter was cool, but I was hoping for something a little more dramatic to happen with the holdout guy than for him to just suddenly get dementia once you got everything out of him. Ruby shooting a weird psionic pain beam at you and then running away was a bit baffling, I didn't really get to figure out her deal at all. I didn't arrest Klaasje and her story is also totally unresolved. I didn't ever figure out what the gently caress the "Pale" is beyond some kind of lovecraftian bermuda tirangle in the middle of the ocean maybe? The massive penalty to the logic check for not knowing made it so I couldn't figure out the deal with the anomaly in the church either. I played as a heavy Psych/Motor character invested big in the persuasion / intuition / people skills. It seems like the major reason to do a subsequent playthrough is to explore a different personality for Harry and do a different skill build?
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Mar 9, 2020 01:17
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you basically missed all 75% of all pertinent information in the game
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Mar 9, 2020 01:18
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Scoss posted:Just finished the game. Enjoyed overall but felt the ending was a little disappointing, it honestly took me by surprise that everything wrapped up so abruptly. I'm wondering how much effect your choices actually have on the overall plot, and there are a few loose ends that I am a bit fuzzy on. Either I never got to reading it or did and it didn't sink in but the world is not a sphere but disjointed landmasses connected by "the pale" ( of which the hole in the church is a new, slowly-growing patch The ending reminded me a lot of Broken Age in its abruptness
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Mar 9, 2020 01:21
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Oxxidation posted:you basically missed all 75% of all pertinent information in the game Other than not choosing to arrest, where did I miss things?
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Mar 9, 2020 01:29
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Scoss posted:Just finished the game. Enjoyed overall but felt the ending was a little disappointing, it honestly took me by surprise that everything wrapped up so abruptly. I'm wondering how much effect your choices actually have on the overall plot, and there are a few loose ends that I am a bit fuzzy on. That feeling of not knowing something you should it's called... Jamais Vu. Perhaps once you think about it more it'll be easier to talk about it. But yeah. The end feels a bit odd. It landed for me because the game as a whole was kind of a mood piece. Ask yourself what is really important. Also if your partner says "Hey, you look in bad shape, want to take a nap?" I would suggest doing so. Replays are basically to have a different gang of voices chipping in about everything yeah. Rushing to talk to Lena about reality, then Joyce so you can get Jamais Vu and 15th Indotribe helps with money and xp a bit.
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Mar 9, 2020 01:35
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The deserter's purpose is not to wrap up the murder case. The entire purpose of the ending sequence is to see whether you can overcome the dream and move on; the alternative being that you wind up like the Deserter you find: a broken, bitter, resentful shell of a man who cant let go of the past. e: I feel many people are disappointed by the ending because they think this is a detective game first. Its not, the murder is secondary. Its a game about a character who just happens to be investigating a murder. Thats why the events surrounding the murder cannot be changed no matter what you do, but you can change Harry in the process with how you deal with the events and people during the investigation. TommyGun85 fucked around with this message at 03:17 on Mar 9, 2020 |
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Mar 9, 2020 03:12
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I came away thinking that the game is about you creating who Hobocop is. It's like a very long character generator. Also it's a real testiment to the games writing that what happens with Klassje can be argued both ways and both are completely logical and make sense.
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Mar 9, 2020 05:34
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There's also that whole thing with Harry's ex being represented as Dolores Dei, which directly leads into the end of the game and Dolores/the ex/Harry/The Deserter are all symbolic of the same or similar things. And the phasmid basically spells that out for you.
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Mar 9, 2020 10:15
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Imhotep posted:There's also that whole thing with Harry's ex being represented as Dolores Dei, which directly leads into the end of the game and Dolores/the ex/Harry/The Deserter are all symbolic of the same or similar things. And the phasmid basically spells that out for you. I must be particularly stupid because I'm not sure what connection you're talking about. Can you spell it out for me?
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Mar 9, 2020 10:45
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Mulva posted:If the city itself is compromised, what the gently caress are you even fighting for? Shivers isn't the city, it's your perception/feel of the city. It's as fallible as all the other blips and boops. Inexplicable Humblebrag posted:actually i've internalised a thought that gives me réal each time i post unsuccessfully Every post in the world is some sort of success.
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Mar 9, 2020 11:36
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danbo posted:Shivers isn't the city, it's your perception/feel of the city. No it's literally the city talking to you. The actual honest to goodness Genius loci. It is the only skill, the only one, that is never compromised. Not even Volition can say that.
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Mar 9, 2020 11:54
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that's true of the allcaps, surely, but the descriptive text is all you. otherwise espirit de corps would be equally untouchable I might be wrong but I feel like it's the magical realism skill - the stuff it tells you isn't real-true, c.f. the square bullets, but it is true-true
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Mar 9, 2020 12:02
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Mulva posted:No it's literally the city talking to you. The actual honest to goodness Genius loci. It is the only skill, the only one, that is never compromised. Not even Volition can say that. That's only supposed to be a handful of the actual shivers checks and even then who knows if it's real or all in Harry's head
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Mar 9, 2020 12:03
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Mulva posted:No it's literally the city talking to you. The actual honest to goodness Genius loci. It is the only skill, the only one, that is never compromised. Not even Volition can say that. Any piece of information, regardless of source, has to pass through your character's mangled head. And may therefore be compromised.
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Mar 9, 2020 12:04
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Does Inland Empire ever lie to you? It's very obtuse with it's information but I think it always tells you the truth?
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Mar 9, 2020 12:06
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Speaking of the ending, I came across a piece examining it through the lens of (postmodern) detective fiction and capitalist realism. It's fairly interesting. It was probably linked somewhere in this thread already, but in case it wasn't: A Spectre is Haunting Martinaise — Detective Fiction and Disco Elysium’s Disappointing Ending (medium.com) Jack Trades posted:Does Inland Empire ever lie to you? It's very obtuse with it's information but I think it always tells you the truth? There's no indication that it ever lies to you. It gives you a glimpse into other detectives'/cops' world as they see it.
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Mar 9, 2020 12:19
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Inland Empire gives you a time limit to solve the case and it's a lie.
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Mar 9, 2020 12:29
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itry posted:If you had that conversation with a low Esprit de Corps, I recommend doing it again with a high Psyche Harry.
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Mar 9, 2020 13:45
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Jack Trades posted:I must be particularly stupid because I'm not sure what connection you're talking about. Can you spell it out for me? I don't know why I spoiler tagged one word specifically, but still spoiled a lot, but I think that's one of the cooler reveals in the game, so I like to put spoiler tags there just in case, but yeah, obvious end game spoilers. I was more pointing out that that scene has significance and isn't anticlimactic, like the post further up the page seemed to think, but I was exaggerating and shouldn't have said 'spells it out', rather, but I do think it establishes parallels between these beings, communism and isn't anti-climactic at all, and I think lays out a few ideas, some clear and others that are ambiguous in a way that I love (and I think the reason why a lot of journalists had trouble with the whole 'but it doesn't present a *solution*, thing, which I think is dumb regardless, but I think this scene has enough that you can take from it, although it's still probably not what those journalists wanted). But I think those connections and the conversations you have on the island are fundamental to the game's themes The phasmid has been on the island for quite a while, like the deserter, and lived through a couple of revolutions, but as it describes to you when asking Harry what it's like to be him, and like, bleeding, and then describes how it experiences sensory input in a fundamentally different and more primal way that's about survival first and foremost. Also it basically says it's lived through several forms of government, two(?) revolutions, but still wasn't discovered until like, I think 52 or 51, by a detective, and that's also the same year our protagonist starts to lose his poo poo and alienate everyone around him. The phasmid is something no one except for like 2 people believe in, and I guess you do as well, and is considered a joke when it's brought up, like, Kim isn't even amused by it when it's first mentioned which sparks your fascination with them, and up until the end of the game it weirdly seems like it's one of the things you're into that he's more annoyed by by, until near the end of the game when you're still doing stuff like checking the traps, Kim has seen enough from you that he's pretty much accepted that you must have some Inland Empire type 6th sense and that there's always some chance that some dumb thing you're dead set on doing for no reason could lead to a breakthrough. But anyways, I went off on a tangent, but I meant to say, that in that way the phasmid is like the spirit of communism, or the idea that it could flourish again, and I felt like it paralleled how everyone, aside from the few who are considered weirdos have basically given up hope for another revolution or communism ever succeeding. It also tells you that humans have basically hosed everything up and also the pale showed up when humans did, there's a good line about how the birds and the plants also agree that humans are going to destroy the Earth. I was going to keep this mostly about what happens at the end that supports my argument, but I'll just say that I think that this is basically the 'answer' that games journos didn't want, but got, and that is, that because of neoliberalism, neocons, moralism, etc. the pale has shown up, and it will be the downfall of humanity/Earth. Also, there's a spot of pale growing in the church with the stained glass painting of Dolores Dei, and I forget exactly how it's represented, but basically your ex appears to you in the dream as Dolores Dei, I guess presumably because you don't remember what she looks like, but she's the most beloved Innocence in history, but also in hindsight it's now pretty clear that she was actually a fascist and a horribly violent, imperialist military leader. The phasmid tells you to forget about her and not look back, which I think also means don't look back on moralism, etc. and like the phasmid, gently caress what people say, if you truly believe that Mazovian socio-economics is the only system of government that will help places like Revachol and lift it from the moralist status quo that's widely accepted despite the obvious squalor that everyone except for like 3 characters live in, then don't look back, because it's as absurd as choosing not to believe in the phasmid, even though admitting you did prior to witnessing it with Kim and getting evidence that it exists would make people laugh at you. I mean, I don't know, this is one of those games where the ending is so great because all of these connections are sort of just there in my head and when I try to actually explain it I end up forgetting things, or like, I didn't talk about the deserter and what happens to him as people have already gone on at length about it, but hopefully if any of that makes sense then you can also see how the deserter's life after the revolution also relates to this, and what happens to him right before you take him in.
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Mar 9, 2020 13:59
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