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Are there people who think Biden will win? I have gone days forgetting that there’s even an election going on.
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Apr 19, 2020 06:40
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^^^ YesGreyjoyBastard posted:
Somfin posted:Which ones do you think won't happen I think it's probable that Biden checks out entirely and just lets other people decide his cabinet appointments, etc. They probably won't be actual Republicans, though their actual politics and actions will be roughly the same as Republicans' so it's not a meaningful difference. The Supreme Court situation is likely similar; we'll get some random centrist that is marginally better on a handful of issues than someone a Republican would appoint. The third and fourth things are definitely 100% going to happen, though. Biden will continue nearly all of Trump's policies (the immigration detention center stuff is just going to be Guantanamo Part 2, though there's a small chance he might let families stay together in cages) and likely has a somewhat higher chance of increasing our military involvement abroad. In my opinion the fact that Biden would likely eliminate the chance of being able to elect a left-wing candidate in 2024 completely outweighs any other benefits he might have relative to Trump (and that's ignoring a variety of other angles that could result in his presidency itself having a worse outcome).
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Apr 19, 2020 06:44
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Given what's going on right now, I don't think anyone can accurately predict what's going to happen in November.
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Apr 19, 2020 08:47
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjF8MAYN-lA this is a pretty good analysis of the race as it currently is through the lens of the movie frost/nixon
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Apr 19, 2020 09:32
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Antifa Turkeesian posted:Are there people who think Biden will win? I have gone days forgetting that there’s even an election going on. He's beating Trump in the polls and we all know how well that song went last time
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Apr 19, 2020 09:47
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Apogee15 posted:This is simply not true at all. I mean it's kinda dumb because Biden doesn't currently have a position in the government, and this will all essentially be over by the time Biden takes office if he wins, so not like he even *could* do anything. But regardless, you only think he has literally no plans or policies because you stick your head in the sand. just look at Biden's record. When you do, ask yourself why maybe people don't really think he is a step in the right direction.
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Apr 19, 2020 10:35
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Tab8715 posted:There is no set number of "elements" that need to be defined to prove corruption. It's either the sheer significance of one or cumulative sum of many. Just because a victim chooses not to complain does not mean they aren't a victim. I think the bigger problem is how the media covers elections. Not only do the crush the campaigns of progressives they also boost and give credibility to republican campaigns.
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Apr 19, 2020 10:40
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ManBoyChef posted:just look at Biden's record. When you do, ask yourself why maybe people don't really think he is a step in the right direction. I've seen his records. It's not great. It's better than the alternative.
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Apr 19, 2020 11:29
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Apogee15 posted:I've seen his records. It's not great. It's better than the alternative. No it's not.
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Apr 19, 2020 11:30
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Apogee15 posted:I've seen his records. It's not great. It's better than the alternative. in what sense?
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Apr 19, 2020 11:42
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ARACHTION posted:But it really was incredible to see just how aggressively hostile the American media was to Bernie. They spent 6 months trying to ignore him by manipulating polling data and then when actual voter results came in, boost premature Bootigieg (I’m not going to look up how to spell his name) victory declarations. Then after Nevada when they went into a ludicrous hysteria so bad that my aggressively centrist colleagues were like “Holy poo poo the media is totally biased against Sanders”. Well... yeah. quote:In 1983, 90% of US media was controlled by 50 companies; as of 2011, 90% was controlled by just 6 companies and in 2017 the number was 5. Billionaires hated Sanders and can make a lot of money via either Warmaker-Joe or Clown-Trump. Under Sanders they might have had to ~shudder~ pay taxes. The entire thing is a too-opaque travesty : quote:There may also be some large-scale owners in an industry that are not the causes of monopoly or oligopoly. iHeartMedia (formerly Clear Channel Communications), especially since the Telecommunications Act of 1996, acquired many radio stations across the United States, and came to own more than 1,200 stations. However, the radio broadcasting industry in the United States and elsewhere can be regarded as oligopolistic regardless of the existence of such a player. Because radio stations are local in reach, each licensing a specific part of spectrum from the FCC in a specific local area, any local market is served by a limited number of stations. In most countries, this system of licensing makes many markets local oligopolies. The similar market structure exists for television broadcasting, cable systems and newspaper industries, all of which are characterized by the existence of large-scale owners. Concentration of ownership is often found in these industries. And the result is this dystopian scifi-worthy info-poison: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWLjYJ4BzvI
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Apr 19, 2020 12:10
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Apogee15 posted:I've seen his records. It's not great. It's better than the alternative. Its really not. If you actually dig into the things Biden has actually done they dwarf anything that (criminal, gross, idiot) Trump has managed. The current tragic state of the US was partially crafted by Joe Biden's rage-on to create the escalated War on Drugs (incidentally filling prisons his family made some money on). This lead to what we now experience as the "normal" state of militarized police, and pan-surveillance. Speaking of militarization and the surveillance state, Biden is the one that drafted the document that became The PATRIOT Act. He brags about it if you decide to actually go look. Biden worked to immunize various aspects of finance from law (incidentally making money for his family), and reworking bankruptcy protection to make it more difficult for the poorest to use, and essentially making student loans life-debts. Biden used influence with the Council on Foreign Relations to push the Iraq War under false pretenses. (His family happened to get a 1.5 billion dollar contract out of the war effort.) The current state of "forever war" is something he helped create. Those actually happened. That is not accounting for the damage he has done using his position to speak out against social security and medicare. This is another thing he brags about if you decide to look. Compared to the damage Biden's handlers have done using him as a tool, Trump is a flailing child. Trump is more upsetting to have to listen to, but by comparison will never approach what Biden has done to damage the country. If you would like a brief outline of the things he has done politically that helped his family participate in scam, scandals, and frauds - and never go down with the people they ran them with, this is a long article that runs through some of them: https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2019/08/02/joe-biden-investigation-hunter-brother-hedge-fund-money-2020-campaign-227407 (This behavior stretches back longer than most of us have been alive, this is not just the Ukraine drama.)
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Apr 19, 2020 12:38
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Basically, in this equation you're not even looking at Trump with a D next to his name. You're looking at a smiling, Obama-approved Dick Cheney.
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Apr 19, 2020 12:46
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Prokhor Zakharov posted:He's beating Trump in the polls and we all know how well that song went last time I don't think Biden's chances would be better if Trump were winning in the polls, so this kinda makes it sound like you think Trump is simply unbeatable
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Apr 19, 2020 13:31
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That's not to say that Trump is good or even better. Once you hit a certain level of soul grime they're all the loving same. Which is why people want to sit this one out. Biden can't redeem himself and the people puppeting his pervert corpse around don't want him to. Trump is Trump, responsible for 3.5 9/11s per week at last death rate estimates, and that's somehow not the worst thing he's done. Which one of them accurately represents you as a voter?
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Apr 19, 2020 13:37
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Somfin posted:That's not to say that Trump is good or even better. Once you hit a certain level of soul grime they're all the loving same. There's a lot of room between these two candidates and "accurately represents me as a voter", the country is simply too large to set the bar that high. Bernie Sanders was apparently the "better thing that wasn't possible", but an Obama or Bill Clinton tier candidate wasn't categorically impossible and we couldn't even get that. Flying-PCP fucked around with this message at 13:50 on Apr 19, 2020 |
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Apr 19, 2020 13:46
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There isn't any meaningful room between the two candidates. Neither of them will do what need to be done to stave off climate death and as such will kill billions, and at that point it's pretty loving privileged to insist that there's an actual difference between the two because one of them might appoint a slightly less fashy fascist to the SCOTUS or some poo poo along those lines.
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Apr 19, 2020 13:50
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They both killed the world, one through enforceable laws, the other through normalised nazism and obvious lying.
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Apr 19, 2020 14:09
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Somfin posted:They both killed the world, one through enforceable laws, the other through normalised nazism and obvious lying. Biden has also normalised fascism (Crime Bill, ICE camps), and is a famous liar and fabulist. Once again, I fail to see a meaningful distinction
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Apr 19, 2020 14:28
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Somfin posted:That's not to say that Trump is good or even better. Once you hit a certain level of soul grime they're all the loving same. considering even dem governors are champing at the bit to end quarantine, i doubt biden would/will do what's needed to protect people from coronavirus it seems like the big difference between the dems and the republicans is that the dems have a plan on how to sacrifice the poor to the plague for economic benefit
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Apr 19, 2020 14:34
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The Democrats have their man, let's check in on the state of the general election. Ah, they're currently arguing about which one of them hates Chinese people more. https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1251582266251243525?s=20
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Apr 19, 2020 14:51
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Cerebral Bore posted:There isn't any meaningful room between the two candidates. Neither of them will do what need to be done to stave off climate death and as such will kill billions, and at that point it's pretty loving privileged to insist that there's an actual difference between the two because one of them might appoint a slightly less fashy fascist to the SCOTUS or some poo poo along those lines.
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Apr 19, 2020 14:54
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Timeless Appeal posted:if we can get the senate
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Apr 19, 2020 14:58
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Gripweed posted:The Democrats have their man, let's check in on the state of the general election. Ah, they're currently arguing about which one of them hates Chinese people more. https://mobile.twitter.com/randygdub/status/796229362643152896?lang=en
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Apr 19, 2020 15:06
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Timeless Appeal posted:It's not a matter of privilege to support Title I funding, increasing teacher pay, eliminating private prisons, increasing investment in nuclear power, expanding healthcare, nulling all past pot convictions, expanding internet access to rural areas, and increasing the minimum wage. Biden is slimy as gently caress and I am obviously suspicious of a Biden white house directly spearheading any of the poo poo I'm citing outside of education. But it's all stuff that might be able to pass if we can get the senate as opposed to having no chance. It's a matter of massive privilege to argue that poor people need to vote for their own suffering and death just because one party pretends to support good things. Hell, you basically even admit that Biden isn't going to do any of this anyway yet the argument still goes that other people have some moral duty to unconditionally support what amounts to an aesthetic change pleasing to well-off PMC types. Also Biden is a massive electoral liability and is going to lose and potentially drag other dems down with him, hth.
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Apr 19, 2020 15:11
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Biden is going to reach across the aisle to the racist voters. He needs something he can offer them.
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Apr 19, 2020 15:17
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If you like the burning cross on your lawn, you can keep it
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Apr 19, 2020 15:37
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Rad Russian posted:Biden is going to reach across the aisle to the racist voters. He needs something he can offer them. He does say he loves working with them
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Apr 19, 2020 15:41
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Sorry for the shitpost but I can’t even believe how loving idiotic this thread has gotten, Jesus Christ. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Apr 19, 2020 15:46
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Ytlaya posted:The Supreme Court situation is likely similar; we'll get some random centrist that is marginally better on a handful of issues than someone a Republican would appoint. The cases that matter the most, in the sense that if decided by the conservative majority, they continue ossify the status quo in the Republicans' favor, are voting rights cases. Those are always decided on ideological lines and the Republican-appointed justices always vote on the side of enabling more voter suppression, enabling more redistricting on thinly veiled racial lines and most recently, being part of a last ditch (failed) effort to save the GOP's hold on the Wisconsin Supreme Court. This is where a Justice Garland would've made a difference.
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Apr 19, 2020 15:50
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Cerebral Bore posted:Also Biden is a massive electoral liability and is going to lose and potentially drag other dems down with him, hth. And the response to this is not explaining how Bernie's plans would have made this better because I loving know. I banked for him and I've gotten involved locally on progressive initiatives. I wish we had Bernie or Warren or even Castro on the ticket, but they're not. And right now I'm not telling anyone how to vote. I'm explaining that I cannot in good consciousness not vote for the person who I believe is going to give the best shot for my kids and I find it obnoxious for that to be described as a privileged position.
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Apr 19, 2020 16:03
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Rad Russian posted:Biden is going to reach across the aisle to the racist voters. He needs something he can offer them. Hillary Clinton had Lena Dunham as her celebrity surrogate, Biden is gonna get Mark Wahlberg.
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Apr 19, 2020 16:03
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You didn't get a Justice Garland and you will never get even a Justice Garland because the Republicans are never going to let any Dem president appoint any Justice anyway, unless we're talking about some fascist chudge. So that argument is completely moot. Also, once again, Joe Biden went out of his way to get Clarence Thomas on the court. In summary, the "but what about the SCOTUS" argument is extremely loving dumb and you'd have to be a complete ignoramus or a blind fanboy to still use it unironically. Timeless Appeal posted:Yeah man. Motherfucker sucks. But as someone who has spent my life teaching in low income areas and has literally spent weekends taking the books that rich people throw on the curb to fill my classroom library, and is spending money out of pocket right now to let my kids have access to high quality digital learning platforms, it seems insane to be told that I am being "privileged" because I see a difference between the President who wants to triple the money my kids receive and increase my pay so I don't have to make the choice between staying a teacher or having my own kids but going into admin. Sorry to break it to you, but Biden isn't going to give you poo poo.
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Apr 19, 2020 16:07
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Cerebral Bore posted:Also, once again, Joe Biden went out of his way to get Clarence Thomas on the court. We all know Biden behaved shamefully in that hearing but I still don’t think it’s ok to say things like this without mentioning that Biden voted nay on Thomas. And since the aforementioned shameful behavior demonstrated that Biden didn’t care about Thomas’s sexual harassment, we can say that he probably did it because he thought Thomas was a right wing extremist, and he thought that was bad.
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Apr 19, 2020 16:14
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Timeless Appeal posted:Yeah man. Motherfucker sucks. But as someone who has spent my life teaching in low income areas and has literally spent weekends taking the books that rich people throw on the curb to fill my classroom library, and is spending money out of pocket right now to let my kids have access to high quality digital learning platforms, it seems insane to be told that I am being "privileged" because I see a difference between the President who wants to triple the money my kids receive and increase my pay so I don't have to make the choice between staying a teacher or having my own kids but going into admin. OK. What happens if you vote, he wins, and then he turns around and fucks you? Keep in mind that Obama’s administration was ground-zero for charter schools, which seem to act like a neoliberal version of vouchers that GWB got harangued for except the vouchers are not exclusively for private or religious schools. I’d like to say I understand your hope and passion for a better tomorrow. I’m very positive in my day-to-day life due to having been really down before. However, I’m also cynical about more systemic/big picture stuff. Post-Obama, I’m not gonna trust Biden to do the right thing. I guess what I’m asking is if at any point, the calculus changes, and you say “gently caress the DNC.” Or if you would continue to pull the lever? Im not trying to ask who would you vote for or anything like that. Just if there’s ever a bridge too far that changes your view on the efficacy or intentions of the DNC. Boywhiz88 fucked around with this message at 16:21 on Apr 19, 2020 |
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Apr 19, 2020 16:17
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Mellow Seas posted:We all know Biden behaved shamefully in that hearing but I still don’t think it’s ok to say things like this without mentioning that Biden voted nay on Thomas. Why’s everyone mad at Karl Rove for implying John McCain had a black child out of wedlock to voters in a southern state primary? He may have voted for McCain!
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Apr 19, 2020 16:19
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Every case in favor of Joe Biden requires you to not only ignore his long history of legislative evil but also his serial lying and plagiarizing Scoff at people for it all you want but he’s spent his whole career giving ample reason not to trust him and that’s on him misadventurous fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Apr 19, 2020 |
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Apr 19, 2020 16:21
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Ytlaya posted:
This sums it up pretty well I think. As I said many pages ago, I'd consider voting for Biden if I thought he would take the country in a positive direction. I don't. I doubt he'd take it in a negative direction as quickly as Trump with a second term, but even that would be debatable and depend upon his appointments and mental status in office. At this point, the entire structure of the country's government needs to be reexamined, not just propped up by the lesser of two evils.
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Apr 19, 2020 16:24
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poo poo has completely gone of the rails here because even though Biden did some good things as a Senator, and even though the Obama administration did some good things, and even though the campaign says some good things... anything anyone says Biden will do well is simply met with a “NUH UH”, and nobody can prove that wrong because the future is unknowable. It also means people like me, who don’t even like Biden, and think he will be “almost not bad” at best as President, and are completely baffled by his selection, and hope he steps down or even dies before the election, can be dismissed because we’re “Biden lovers”. And we’re so insane that we can’t even see the obvious truth that Biden is exactly as the same as Dick Cheney. It’s really hard to have any kind of discussion under these conditions. It would be fun to have “how bad is Joe Biden” conversations but we’re stuck with “is there a single solitary good thing about Joe Biden” discussions and they’re circular and boring and frustrating.
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Apr 19, 2020 16:35
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Mellow Seas posted:poo poo has completely gone of the rails here because even though Biden did some good things as a Senator, and even though the Obama administration did some good things This should be as easy to document as the decades of destructive (and essentially, literally, anti-American) activity Biden engaged in for the betterment of his family and his corporate backers.
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Apr 19, 2020 16:38
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