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Tiger Millionaire
Jan 25, 2014

He'll eat your kids and fire your parents!
Came back after a break and finally beat a18 with defect and ironclad, but still brick walling with silent on the same ascension, really struggling with her act 1 more than the others.

Anyway game is still good.

E: nvm, beat it, got deadbranch on like floor 10 and went all in on shiv madness

Tiger Millionaire fucked around with this message at 16:08 on May 18, 2020

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Cpt_Obvious
Jun 18, 2007

Has anybody gotten clash to work at high ascension? Every time I think about adding it to the deck, I an reminded that the deck starts with an unremovable curse that makes it nearly impossible to play.

WhiteHowler
Apr 3, 2001

I'M HUGE!

Cpt_Obvious posted:

Has anybody gotten clash to work at high ascension? Every time I think about adding it to the deck, I an reminded that the deck starts with an unremovable curse that makes it nearly impossible to play.

There are just so many cards that mess with Clash.

Aside from curses and anything (enemies or cards) that add status cards, even normal card draw becomes problematic. Shrug It Off and Battle Trance in particular don't play well with it.

Sure, a 0-cost, high-damage attack is great on the surface, but in most situations where I've had Clash (usually due to a transformation; I basically never draft it), it just becomes an extra curse on most draws.

WhiteHowler fucked around with this message at 19:04 on May 18, 2020

Klaus Kinski
Nov 26, 2007
Der Klaus
It's actually not bad in A1 hallways where you can usually just play all skills+clash. The free curse makes it alot worse but it's manageable. If two of the bosses didn't add statuses to your deck it would probably be a decent a1, remove a2 card, but right now it's just a worse anger.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

hey! check this out
Fun Shoe
I've been tempted by Clash on Corruption decks but even then statuses/curses gently caress you up. Doesn't really work with Dead Branch either (powers eventually clog you up), and who wants to give up Branch for Clash?

rchandra
Apr 30, 2013


I think in order to pick Clash on A10+ I need a Blue Candle and to still need more basic damage, it was already marginal below A10.

Zvahl
Oct 14, 2005

научный кот

Cpt_Obvious posted:

Has anybody gotten clash to work at high ascension? Every time I think about adding it to the deck, I an reminded that the deck starts with an unremovable curse that makes it nearly impossible to play.

i'm topping 800 hours and most of it is me failing at a20 and I don't think I've successfully used Clash once, or even looked at it as a card that actually appears, my eyes just kinda go somewhere else instead of taking the worst curse in the game

WhiteHowler
Apr 3, 2001

I'M HUGE!

Zvahl posted:

i'm topping 800 hours and most of it is me failing at a20 and I don't think I've successfully used Clash once, or even looked at it as a card that actually appears, my eyes just kinda go somewhere else instead of taking the worst curse in the game
I think I've gotten even less benefit from Grand Finale, overall.

At least Hello World occasionally draws a useful card.

Insurrectionist
May 21, 2007
The big issue with Clash is you imagine a deck it can go in and it's a super offensive deck with lots of attacks and relics that help you stay alive

And then you realize that the more your deck's gameplan is 'play all your attacks' the less you're able to spend energy on skills anyway and even though you're drawing 1 skill a turn (probably basic defend) instead of 2 - 2.5, you're not emptying your hand of skills anyway

And then you never take Clash again

Hackan Slash
May 31, 2007
Hit it until it's not a problem anymore
Clash is real bad against sentries which is enough for me to never pick it up

Zvahl
Oct 14, 2005

научный кот

WhiteHowler posted:

I think I've gotten even less benefit from Grand Finale, overall.

At least Hello World occasionally draws a useful card.

Hello World is, I guess, at least a power? It's the worst power, sure, but you can usually, like, use it

grand finale is a close second for sure but at least it's usually hanging out around two better cards

Mymla
Aug 12, 2010
Grand finale is such a joke compared to like, omega. Does significantly less in a worse way and is much harder to put into play.

MJeff
Jun 2, 2011

THE LIAR

Mymla posted:

Grand finale is such a joke compared to like, omega. Does significantly less in a worse way and is much harder to put into play.

And Omega isnt even, like, very good. :lol: Imagine being a total joke compared to one of the three Watcher rares that makes you go "ehhhh maybe not"

ugusername
Jul 5, 2013
Grand Finale is fine if you have some combination of WLP, Acrobatics and Backflips which you already want. With filtering already in place opportunity cost is not that severe and easily defeating occasional hallway fight is very good the higher you go. And it's a legit autopick in a Runic Pyramid deck or with a couple of Calculated Gambles.

Also it's unfair to compare anyone rares to Watchers. Like come on. Although I truly believe that Finale is better than Alpha.

Zvahl
Oct 14, 2005

научный кот

MJeff posted:

And Omega isnt even, like, very good. :lol: Imagine being a total joke compared to one of the three Watcher rares that makes you go "ehhhh maybe not"

alpha absolutely rules and i've won a lot of games with it but it mostly feels like it fills a very specific slot of act 1 boss drop if your act 1 has been garbage for offense

i usually won't take it much past then or even if I've come across a tantrum and something else to use with it in act 1 but it can be your sole offense most of the way to the heart and win things easily

Gyshall
Feb 24, 2009

Had a couple of drinks.
Saw a couple of things.
Double Omni into beta/alpha owns

rchandra
Apr 30, 2013


Gyshall posted:

Double Omni into beta/alpha owns

Did this change? Last time I tried Omniscience -> Omniscience -> Beta I couldn't then pick Omega. Tried to report it as a bug, people asserted it was desired behaviour but I couldn't follow the consistency with say Echo Form Hologram recovering Hologram.

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

rchandra posted:

Did this change? Last time I tried Omniscience -> Omniscience -> Beta I couldn't then pick Omega. Tried to report it as a bug, people asserted it was desired behaviour but I couldn't follow the consistency with say Echo Form Hologram recovering Hologram.

Nested Omnis trigger simultaneously - you pick both targets before either one resolves. This is different from Echo Form, which casts the spell again after the first resolution. If you could Echo Form Omniscience then you could Omni Beta followed by Omega.

Gyshall
Feb 24, 2009

Had a couple of drinks.
Saw a couple of things.
Yeah sorry - meant to say that creating more than one Omega owns.

ThermosAquaticus
Nov 9, 2013
Omniscience -> omniscience -> beta -> omniscience -> omega is a valid line though - the cards get played in order so you have to pick both targets of the 2nd omniscience before they are actually played.

Color Printer
May 9, 2011

You get used to it. I don't
even see the code. All I see
is Ipecac, Scapular, Polyphemus...


If that's how that works, then can the second Omniscience in an Omni->Omni chain pick the same card twice?

quidditch it and quit it
Oct 11, 2012


This is melting my brain

Color Printer
May 9, 2011

You get used to it. I don't
even see the code. All I see
is Ipecac, Scapular, Polyphemus...


trading your gold for a rare relic at the beginning and getting fossilized helix as watcher is loving bonkers :stare:

MJeff
Jun 2, 2011

THE LIAR

Color Printer posted:

trading your gold for a rare relic at the beginning and getting fossilized helix as watcher is loving bonkers :stare:

Helix lets Watcher overextend so much, it's the loving best.

Color Printer
May 9, 2011

You get used to it. I don't
even see the code. All I see
is Ipecac, Scapular, Polyphemus...


Unfortunately I got loving wrecked by the ooze triplets in act 3 :(

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

Color Printer posted:

If that's how that works, then can the second Omniscience in an Omni->Omni chain pick the same card twice?

No; Omniscience removes the card before playing it for exactly this reason.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

hey! check this out
Fun Shoe

Color Printer posted:

Unfortunately I got loving wrecked by the ooze triplets in act 3 :(

Yeah, those guys suck. Act 3 hallway fights are the one spot where Watcher seems to run into problems. Anyone else, well, if you muscle past the Act 2 boss you'll probably breeze through Act 3 hallways.

Cpt_Obvious
Jun 18, 2007

Straight White Shark posted:

Yeah, those guys suck. Act 3 hallway fights are the one spot where Watcher seems to run into problems. Anyone else, well, if you muscle past the Act 2 boss you'll probably breeze through Act 3 hallways.

I think that's because Watcher has such an advantage early game that it is very easy to not build your deck efficiently in Act 3. Like, you may just power through Act 2 on nothing but raw single target damage, but then find yourself without any significant blocking in Act 3 and just kind of die.

MJeff
Jun 2, 2011

THE LIAR
I find the general arc with Silent is you're hanging on by the skin of your loving teeth in act 1, then by act 3 you're just laughing from behind absurd amounts of block (with Wraith as a backup) while you whittle your enemies down.

metachronos
Sep 11, 2001

When I roll, baby I roll DEEP
What are some good ways to juice my score for ranking higher on the daily climb? My highest so far is 44th.

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

metachronos posted:

What are some good ways to juice my score for ranking higher on the daily climb? My highest so far is 44th.

Just hit as many elites as you can. Every elite you kill is 25 points and another 50 if you perfect it, so taking an extra elite in each act is a potential 225 points. That's bigger than any other bonus you can gain apart from Beyond Perfect.

metachronos
Sep 11, 2001

When I roll, baby I roll DEEP

Jedit posted:

Just hit as many elites as you can. Every elite you kill is 25 points and another 50 if you perfect it, so taking an extra elite in each act is a potential 225 points. That's bigger than any other bonus you can gain apart from Beyond Perfect.

That's my usual goal. I didn't realize you got such huge points for getting a perfect. Thanks!

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

metachronos posted:

That's my usual goal. I didn't realize you got such huge points for getting a perfect. Thanks!

I may be misremembering, it might only be 25 for a perfect elite. It's still significant though.

Zvahl
Oct 14, 2005

научный кот
aside from perfecting the elites and bosses, max hp is an easy gimme for points on ironclad but is usually not impossible on the other dudes

highlander is generally workable too, but only really for points, it encourages a slim deck and is more rewarding than the other points option which is aiming for 50 card decks and lol

kemikalkadet
Sep 16, 2012

:woof:
I usually try to get Curses! for having 5 curses in the deck and the one for having no rares... Pauper? Some mods let you rack up collectors bonuses too for having 4 of the same card.

Zvahl
Oct 14, 2005

научный кот

kemikalkadet posted:

I usually try to get Curses! for having 5 curses in the deck and the one for having no rares... Pauper? Some mods let you rack up collectors bonuses too for having 4 of the same card.

pretty sure the 4 copy collection bonus is in the base game, you get a bonus for each different set, I recall getting it at least a few times and I haven't used any mods

kemikalkadet
Sep 16, 2012

:woof:

Zvahl posted:

pretty sure the 4 copy collection bonus is in the base game, you get a bonus for each different set, I recall getting it at least a few times and I haven't used any mods

Mods as in modifiers. There's 3 in every daily run.

SuperKlaus
Oct 20, 2005


Fun Shoe
I have joined the less than 7% of players who've killed Heart with all "core" classes with an A5 kill by All For One Defect. Though it took me a while to get to this point I'm still amazed at how few players have these achievements.

No Wave
Sep 18, 2005

HA! HA! NICE! WHAT A TOOL!
More people beat A10 than beat the heart with I/S/D. I think A10 is much harder than an A1 heart clear so it just shows me that a lot of people don't really care for the heart or just skip classes they're not into.

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Kyrosiris
May 24, 2006

You try to be happy when everyone is summoning you everywhere to "be their friend".



No Wave posted:

or just skip classes they're not into.

This is me. I have I/D/W heart kills but gently caress playing Silent.

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