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therattle posted:Starmer is now ahead of Johnson in polling. God forbid we sacrifice some ideological purity for actually winning an election. 20 points ahead you say? Cool, next week's election is finally gonna make Labour a party of government again!
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Jun 28, 2020 16:19
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therattle posted:The Peake interview made an untrue association between Israel and George Floyd’s death, which even Amnesty has said is incorrect. Wrongly associating Israel with an act for which it has absolutely no responsibility is not legitimate criticism of Israel and Zionism. So why make the connection? RLB knew that AS was a sensitive issue and she hasn’t even properly apologised (unlike Peake). I broadly agree with the Freedland article. Stfu
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Jun 28, 2020 16:24
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Jose posted:Stfu I’m sorry I posted something you disagree with, in response to other posters. I’m just still staggered by how much denialism there is of AS as an issue within Labour, despite even the leaked report confirming it. The point about elections being a long time away is sadly a good one. My concern is that by the next GE this government’s appalling (that word isn’t strong enough) handling of Covid will be somewhat forgotten. FWIW, this Johnson government is even worse than I feared. As for Priti Patel, it seems like the primary qualification for Tory Home Secretary is a near-pathological lack of empathy. therattle has issued a correction as of 16:35 on Jun 28, 2020 |
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Jun 28, 2020 16:30
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therattle posted:The Peake interview made an untrue association between Israel and George Floyd’s death, which even Amnesty has said is incorrect. Wrongly associating Israel with an act for which it has absolutely no responsibility is not legitimate criticism of Israel and Zionism. So why make the connection? RLB knew that AS was a sensitive issue and she hasn’t even properly apologised (unlike Peake). I broadly agree with the Freedland article. I too read that article from the New Statesman. To which I will reply with this: https://www.amnestyusa.org/with-whom-are-many-u-s-police-departments-training-with-a-chronic-human-rights-violator-israel/
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Jun 28, 2020 16:46
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Samovar posted:I too read that article from the New Statesman. To which I will reply with this: I didn’t read that article. I didn’t deny that Israelis have trained US police. But they didn’t train the police who killed George Floyd, or teach them that restraint. There is no connection between Israel and George Floyd. So why make one? (And in RLB’s case, then refuse to withdraw it)? What a stupid hill to die on. https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-did-israeli-secret-service-teach-floyd-police-to-kneel-on-neck It’s not like American police need lessons in brutal violent racist tactics.
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Jun 28, 2020 16:53
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Policing is occupation. Robert Peel invented it based on his experiences in Ireland, and modern techniques were and are pioneered and field-tested in the open-air prisons of Gaza and the West Bank.
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Jun 28, 2020 16:57
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Doc Hawkins posted:Policing is occupation. Robert Peel invented it based on his experiences in Ireland, and modern techniques were and are pioneered and field-tested in the open-air prisons of Gaza and the West Bank. Yeah, like I said, I don’t think US police need training in brutal violent tactics. I’m pretty sure they used them in the years before 1967. And I am pretty sure that knee-to-neck was used prior to that too. Why are you so determined to link this to Israel? I actually don’t mind RLB. And poo poo like this is really depressing OhFunny posted:https://twitter.com/ronanburtenshaw/status/1276877047445495809?s=19 As if Covid hadn’t underlined the importance of unions. therattle has issued a correction as of 17:36 on Jun 28, 2020 |
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Jun 28, 2020 17:27
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therattle posted:The Peake interview made an untrue association between Israel and George Floyd’s death, which even Amnesty has said is incorrect. Wrongly associating Israel with an act for which it has absolutely no responsibility is not legitimate criticism of Israel and Zionism. So why make the connection? RLB knew that AS was a sensitive issue and she hasn’t even properly apologised (unlike Peake). I broadly agree with the Freedland article. the point isn't just to win an election, it's to do good things while in power, and starmer isn't gonna do that
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Jun 28, 2020 17:57
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https://twitter.com/FullFact/status/1277285632415596545?s=20quote:Mr Starmer was head of the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) when the decision not to prosecute Savile was made on the grounds of “insufficient evidence”. The allegations against Savile were dealt with by local police and a reviewing lawyer for the CPS.
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Jun 28, 2020 18:20
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therattle posted:I’m sorry I posted something you disagree with, in response to other posters. I’m just still staggered by how much denialism there is of AS as an issue within Labour, despite even the leaked report confirming it. i'm not in denial about it i just want you to stfu
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Jun 28, 2020 18:28
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so now that the options in the UK are batshit crazy conservatives or centrist neolibs, has anyone actually thought about creating a party on the left?
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Jun 28, 2020 18:30
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If AS is such a big issue for Labour why does Rachel Reeves still have a front bench job and why hasn't the editor of the Independent been sacked for publishing that article
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Jun 28, 2020 18:31
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oliwan posted:so now that the options in the UK are batshit crazy conservatives or centrist neolibs, has anyone actually thought about creating a party on the left? Welcome to FPTP hellworld
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Jun 28, 2020 18:32
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therattle posted:Yeah, like I said, I don’t think US police need training in brutal violent tactics. I’m pretty sure they used them in the years before 1967. And I am pretty sure that knee-to-neck was used prior to that too. Why are you so determined to link this to Israel? The struggle is singular. Why are you so determined to divide it?
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Jun 28, 2020 18:37
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oliwan posted:so now that the options in the UK are batshit crazy conservatives or centrist neolibs, has anyone actually thought about creating a party on the left? The green party exists and will never be in a position to do anything thanks to fptp. I've basically given up on campaigning on any issues except electoral reform. To throw my oar in about RLB, she was a complete dumbass if she didn't realise the consequences of her actions. For all his faults Starmer cannot on one hand criticise the Tories for refusing to remove racist party members and then turn around and do the same thing, however slight the offense. He already knows the media will be against him as it is without this own party sticking the knife in. Edit: to clarify I'm not saying RLB is racist, she just shared a dumb article and should have known better. The Tory party, however, is stuffed with them.
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Jun 28, 2020 18:45
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oliwan posted:so now that the options in the UK are batshit crazy conservatives or centrist neolibs, has anyone actually thought about creating a party on the left? There's no time for electoralism now, it's all about ingratiating yourself with a power bloc for the collapse. Edit: The article wasn't anti-semitic.
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Jun 28, 2020 18:50
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If you think the article RLB was worth sacking her over you've basically admitted any leftist can be sacked for any reason and you'll be able to justify it. Again, its clearly a factional issue since Rachel Reeves still has a shadow cabinet job. In any case it just shows that Starmer is not interested in party unity with the left and the left needs to decide what to do about it.
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Jun 28, 2020 18:54
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Dravs posted:The green party exists and will never be in a position to do anything thanks to fptp. Wholly agree. I also think that Reeves should have been sacked or should have at least immediately apologised about Astor. It’s a clear double standard. Doc Hawkins posted:The struggle is singular. Why are you so determined to divide it? therattle has issued a correction as of 19:41 on Jun 28, 2020 |
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Jun 28, 2020 19:00
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oliwan posted:so now that the options in the UK are batshit crazy conservatives or centrist neolibs, has anyone actually thought about creating a party on the left? George Galloway has started a new party that captures the spirit of the times by being leftwing but also hating gays and wearing flat caps
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Jun 28, 2020 19:15
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Its not about racism though, its purely about antisemitism because that's all the press cares about. Otherwise Wes Streeting, Jess Phillips and Peter Mandleson would be getting seriously investigated for anti-black racism, not to mention the sitting MPs and councillors who openly despise travellers Note he Tories are smelling blood in the water over this and Priti Patel and other Asian/black Tories are asserting that any criticism of them is racist knowing that the Labour leadership will likely be unwilling to take up that fight
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Jun 28, 2020 19:16
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therattle posted:Yeah, like I said, I don’t think US police need training in brutal violent tactics. I’m pretty sure they used them in the years before 1967. And I am pretty sure that knee-to-neck was used prior to that too. Why are you so determined to link this to Israel? This is a really good twitter thread about why Peakes claim is antisemitic, probably unknowingly: https://twitter.com/YairWallach/status/1276252148259487749?s=20
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Jun 28, 2020 19:59
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https://twitter.com/AScribbledEagle/status/1277316721523806208?s=20
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Jun 28, 2020 20:04
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https://twitter.com/AaronBastani/status/1276295569426862080?s=20
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Jun 28, 2020 20:05
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OrthoTrot posted:This is a really good twitter thread about why Peakes claim is antisemitic, probably unknowingly: I’m sure it’s unknowingly. It usually is. And when it’s pointed out, some people recognise it and apologise, and others double down (often complaining that they aren’t allowed to criticise Israel). Nandy is calling for sanctions over annexation. Annexation is wholly wrong morally, legally and pragmatically. I am not entirely sure about sanctions (haven’t done enough reading) but her call is certainly not AS.
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Jun 28, 2020 20:06
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DTI
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Jun 28, 2020 20:08
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Nonsense posted:DTI DTI?
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Jun 28, 2020 20:16
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therattle posted:DTI? Destruction to Israel.
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Jun 28, 2020 20:20
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Nonsense posted:Destruction to Israel. I looked it up. It’s not Dept of Trade and Industry or Debt to Interest ratio. In this context it’s apparently Death to Israel, which I suspect you know but we’re too cowardly to actually write when asked. Why is that?
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Jun 28, 2020 20:25
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therattle posted:I looked it up. It’s not Dept of Trade and Industry or Debt to Interest ratio. In this context it’s apparently Death to Israel, which I suspect you know but we’re too cowardly to actually write when asked. Why is that? Because it is a criminal settler state bent on the genocide of the Palestinians, and plenty of Israeli's oppose this terrorism perpetrated on their fellow citizens.
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Jun 28, 2020 20:27
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oliwan posted:I hate this fucker so much same
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Jun 28, 2020 20:27
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therattle posted:I looked it up. It’s not Dept of Trade and Industry or Debt to Interest ratio. In this context it’s apparently Death to Israel, which I suspect you know but we’re too cowardly to actually write when asked. Why is that? death to israel
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Jun 28, 2020 20:28
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hello my name is therattle and i love colonial states and want to kiss them on the lips
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Jun 28, 2020 20:34
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Nonsense posted:Because it is a criminal settler state bent on the genocide of the Palestinians, and plenty of Israeli's oppose this terrorism perpetrated on their fellow citizens. I'm actually not sure anyone's disagreeing with that. The guy in the twitter thread I quoted uses pretty much exactly the same language.
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Jun 28, 2020 21:23
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Nonsense posted:Because it is a criminal settler state bent on the genocide of the Palestinians, and plenty of Israeli's oppose this terrorism perpetrated on their fellow citizens. Yes, I oppose it too. I believe in Israel's right to exist, but I cannot stand the current government, hate Netanyahu, and think annexation is deeply wrong. I am sure that everyone here gets equally worked up about Saudi Arabia (my personal fave), Sri Lanka, Brazil, Russia, Syria, etc, right? I see people writing "Death to Saudi Arabia!" all the time. And Australia too, for that matter. Continuity RCP posted:hello my name is therattle and i love colonial states and want to kiss them on the lips Believe it or not I don't really value the opinion of someone who believes a spectacularly discredited ideology. Let me guess, it just hasn't been implemented properly yet? (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 28, 2020 21:33
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members of the british ruling class are about the least likely people to bother investigating pedophiles, for obvious reasons
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Jun 28, 2020 21:41
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therattle posted:Yes, I oppose it too. I believe in Israel's right to exist, but I cannot stand the current government, hate Netanyahu, and think annexation is deeply wrong. I am sure that everyone here gets equally worked up about Saudi Arabia (my personal fave), Sri Lanka, Brazil, Russia, Syria, etc, right? I see people writing "Death to Saudi Arabia!" all the time. And Australia too, for that matter. Friend, the objective science of Leninism-Frank Furedi Thought has been tested and found to be correct
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Jun 28, 2020 21:49
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therattle posted:Yes, I oppose it too. I believe in Israel's right to exist, but I cannot stand the current government, hate Netanyahu, and think annexation is deeply wrong. I am sure that everyone here gets equally worked up about Saudi Arabia (my personal fave), Sri Lanka, Brazil, Russia, Syria, etc, right? I see people writing "Death to Saudi Arabia!" all the time. And Australia too, for that matter. lol my dude the examples of people with correct takes on genocide and apartheid being whatabouted into irrelevance as a discursive tactic not to talk about genocide or apartheid was just a few posts behind you, itd be real funny if that were to be the exact argument you chose to break into this particular discussion
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Jun 28, 2020 22:08
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Dravs posted:To throw my oar in about RLB, she was a complete dumbass if she didn't realise the consequences of her actions. Have you seen the article? I don't disagree that it was dumb, but it mentions Israel exactly once at the end of an eye-glazing paragraph which has nothing to do with the rest of its text. It would be lovely if people could curate their social media feeds to contain no lovely journalism, but I'm not sure how you'd get anywhere as a UK politician like that. If you think RLB wasn't getting purged the second Starmer found the barest excuse, or that she could maintain an indefinite social media presence without giving him one, you're still an optimist.
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Jun 28, 2020 22:13
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Jose posted:death to israel Really?
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Jun 28, 2020 22:18
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therattle posted:Yes, I oppose it too. I believe in Israel's right to exist, but I cannot stand the current government, hate Netanyahu, and think annexation is deeply wrong. I am sure that everyone here gets equally worked up about Saudi Arabia (my personal fave), Sri Lanka, Brazil, Russia, Syria, etc, right? I see people writing "Death to Saudi Arabia!" all the time. And Australia too, for that matter. you sound like a really thick rear end in a top hat op, please gently caress off
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Jun 28, 2020 22:18
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